General Election Is On

[Rick_Muller]

Boris crashed and burned there IMO

[AndyClaret]

[Lord Beamish]

Aww! Diddums, Andy.

[martin_p]

Didn’t see it, but from the reaction on here maybe the Tories in the audience were too embarrassed to speak!

[Devils_Advocate]

[quote="AndyClaret"][/quote]
Dry your eyes mate

[jrgbfc]

Bloody Tory snowflakes whingeing about the make up of the studio audience.

[Paul Waine]

Enjoy your lunch. Hope your afternoon is better than the car-crash of a morning you’ve had on here.

Hi Greenmile, I mis-read your post from earlier today. Wow, based on comments re "4 Leaders QT" where a few of them have been credited with "car crashes" I feel honoured that you've awarded me the same accolade. Thank you. My pleasure!

[Lowbankclaret]

No matter the question time.

The Labour vote has car crashed in Burnley.

There seems to be a reluctance to come to terms with this fact.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

How many dollies dig Corbyn get ?

Has Corbyn cut these services?

[Spijed]

No matter the question time.

The Labour vote has car crashed in Burnley.

There seems to be a reluctance to come to terms with this fact.

Lowbank:

https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/co ... es/burnley" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Granny WeatherWax]

Lowbank:

https://www.oddschecker.com/politics/co ... es/burnley" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Shame the same site has a torie majority as overwhelming favourite. Scary times.

[Paul Waine]

4 Leaders QT - great tv. Well done, Fiona, hosting a 2 hour tv session. That has got to be some hard work.

My views: Jofra Archer and Jimmy Anderson (when fit) would have been proud of the opening bowling. I congratulate the BBC on opening aggressively with all 4.
1) JC - he wasn't expecting those bouncers. JC is used to speaking at campaigns, where everyone is on his side. "Oh, Jerememey Corrrebyyyynnn." I was surprised that JC was asked about Bolivia. I felt JC would have preferred he wasn't. We now know he will be "neutral" if he get's the chance for a (Brexit) second referendum. And the "early years" is possibly/probably first 2 years of JC gov't before IndyRef2.
2) Nicola Sturgeon - obviously experienced, but we don't vote SNP unless we live in Scotland, so Nicola is just a "visiting dignitary." No chance of winning, so nothing to lose. Nicola knows this, so less pressure.
3) Jo Swinson - tough, really tough. "Why did you claim you could be next PM?" And Jo knows that she can't be - so, nothing more than "I'm liberal."
4) Boris Johnson - he's got his 8 years as London mayor to be his claim to leadership and delivery. Of course, many want to argue against this. The guy with the Russian dossier should have dropped it after his second attempt - nothing to be gained from continuing his heckle - and Boris was happy to let him continue to heckle.

I'll let others draw their own conclusion.

[Burnley Ace]

You don’t think someone earning £50-80k is well off?

That’s a different threshold than someone earning £45k. £80k in London is not well off, it’s nice but it’s not enough that you aren’t careful

[Greenmile]

Hi Greenmile, I mis-read your post from earlier today. Wow, based on comments re "4 Leaders QT" where a few of them have been credited with "car crashes" I feel honoured that you've awarded me the same accolade. Thank you. My pleasure!

You’re welcome.

I see you’re so proud that you carried on with the same approach this evening.

[dsr]

I liked Boris's answer to this

Johnson on Waspi women
The questioner on trust was actually coming from the perspective of one of the Waspi women - a group deeply upset about pension age changes.

They want those changes reversed and compensation offered.

"I do sympathise deeply with the Waspi women... but it is very expensive to come up with the solution you want," Boris Johnson replies.

"I cannot promise I can magic up that money for you - it is not possible to satisfy all the demands of the Waspi women."

It's a lot more tolerant than my answer would have been. I know exactly why they want men to retire at an older age than women even though women live longer than men. But a politician wouldn't dare give that answer!

[Lancasterclaret]

Great format btw

But all four came across really badly

Which is good to see, but doesn't help shift the idea that we've got some pretty poor politicians in charge at the moment

[Lancasterclaret]

Let me amend it for you, Lancs.

Or here is a novel idea.

Just admit you said something daft

[CrosspoolClarets]

The most fascinating part of QT for me was Swinson getting near silence to most answers and groans to others. She was totally destroyed. This was 1 mile away from the massive Lib Dem stronghold of Sheffield Hallam, Clegg’s former seat, briefly occupied by the odious Jared O Mara.

Hallam is 65% Remain, but I am starting to wonder if Johnson can take it. If he does, he will win a landslide. One thing’s for sure, he is certain of one vote in Hallam, mine.

[Lancasterclaret]

The most fascinating part of QT for me was Swinson getting near silence to most answers and groans to others. She was totally destroyed. This was 1 mile away from the massive Lib Dem stronghold of Sheffield Hallam, Clegg’s former seat, briefly occupied by the odious Jared O Mara.

Hallam is 65% Remain, but I am starting to wonder if Johnson can take it. If he does, he will win a landslide. One thing’s for sure, he is certain of one vote in Hallam, mine.

Swinson answered the questions

Pretty novel I thought.

Might catch on.

[Mala591]

We are now in a unique situation ( democratic populism? ) where the average British voter is more 'politically intelligent' than the politicians and their political advisors.

It's the Westminster bubble on steroids.

Most surreal.

[Lancasterclaret]

We are now in a unique situation ( democratic populism? ) where the average British voter is more 'politically intelligent' than the politicians and their political advisors.

It's the Westminster bubble on steroids.

Most surreal.

No way you've got that from the level of debate on here!

[Devils_Advocate]

Lib-Dems now considering legal action against the BBC for allowing Jo Swinson to take part in tonight's debate.

[tiger76]

The most fascinating part of QT for me was Swinson getting near silence to most answers and groans to others. She was totally destroyed. This was 1 mile away from the massive Lib Dem stronghold of Sheffield Hallam, Clegg’s former seat, briefly occupied by the odious Jared O Mara.

Hallam is 65% Remain, but I am starting to wonder if Johnson can take it. If he does, he will win a landslide. One thing’s for sure, he is certain of one vote in Hallam, mine.

If the Tories take Hallam i'll be gobsmacked,they are starting from 3rd,and surprisingly in this election both the BP and UKIP are contesting the seat.

Added to that it's a student heavy electorate,and the Lib Dems have been campaigning strongly,as they rightly note O'Mara's antics haven't done Labour any favours here,in fact this is one of the few seats in which an outright revoke strategy could pay dividends for Swinson,her problem is there isn't more than about 20/25 seats with similar demographics.

[Rick_Muller]

Swinson answered the questions

Pretty novel I thought.

Might catch on.

Don’t tell me you’re truly that blinkered Lancaster... I really wanted Jo Swinson to succeed, but she failed miserably tonight.

[tiger76]

Lib-Dems now considering legal action against the BBC for allowing Jo Swinson to take part in tonight's debate.

That made me

[Paul Waine]

Or here is a novel idea.

Just admit you said something daft

Or, maybe I just posted something you don't agree with, but that's ok.

[Paul Waine]

Swinson answered the questions

Pretty novel I thought.

Might catch on.

Well, yes, Jo Swinson answered all the questions - like a teenager called in to the headmistress's office to explain why she'd not done her homework. Or, to give it a football angle: like Pochettino called in to explain the start to the season by Levy.

Swinson came across the least experienced of the 4 - which, of course, she is. But, she also showed that she already knows that she's losing badly - through the policy choices she's made. That's the realities, I'm afraid.

Who do you think will be leading LibDems this time next year?

[Paul Waine]

If the Tories take Hallam i'll be gobsmacked,they are starting from 3rd,and surprisingly in this election both the BP and UKIP are contesting the seat.

Added to that it's a student heavy electorate,and the Lib Dems have been campaigning strongly,as they rightly note O'Mara's antics haven't done Labour any favours here,in fact this is one of the few seats in which an outright revoke strategy could pay dividends for Swinson,her problem is there isn't more than about 20/25 seats with similar demographics.

Based on 4 Ls QT, it doesn't look like LibDems will be getting many student votes. Swinson was asked about student loans and 6% interest rates. Given the "student tax" approach that LibDems wanted - including no repayments if you don't earn enough - the 6% interest rate is more likely one of LDs "bright ideas" than it is their coalition partners. Just my hunch, of course.

[Cubanclaret]

The most fascinating part of QT for me was Swinson getting near silence to most answers and groans to others. She was totally destroyed. This was 1 mile away from the massive Lib Dem stronghold of Sheffield Hallam, Clegg’s former seat, briefly occupied by the odious Jared O Mara.

Hallam is 65% Remain, but I am starting to wonder if Johnson can take it. If he does, he will win a landslide. One thing’s for sure, he is certain of one vote in Hallam, mine.

The reason that QT was good was because it was in Sheffield, a city full of genuine, hard working and sincere people without too many random interventions from attention seekers. The audience was the winner rather than any of the politicians, although I thought Sturgeon was easily the most comfortable in her skin. Your passionate pro Tory stance Crosspool will always be unfathomable to me knowing the great guy I know you to be, but at least I know there’s one Tory in the Uk who has some compassion - I’m yet to see that trait in ANY current Tory MP, let me know if you can point me to one. I think it’s the worst set I’ve seen in my lifetime (for balance, it’s also the worst labour front bench).

[CrosspoolClarets]

If the Tories take Hallam i'll be gobsmacked,they are starting from 3rd,and surprisingly in this election both the BP and UKIP are contesting the seat.

Added to that it's a student heavy electorate,and the Lib Dems have been campaigning strongly,as they rightly note O'Mara's antics haven't done Labour any favours here,in fact this is one of the few seats in which an outright revoke strategy could pay dividends for Swinson,her problem is there isn't more than about 20/25 seats with similar demographics.

I agree, though I know the Tory candidate who is a lifelong local businessman who supports many local charities and public sector bodies. He is a very clever, articulate and decent guy (but lost to O’Mara in 2017 which shows you the mentality of many voters).

Ultimately though, Hallam is one of the most wealthy and educated constituencies in the country. It is not hard to imagine them feeling Corbyn is a danger and stopping him is far more important than reversing Brexit (which many also want).

While Swinson bombed though, the main problem tonight for her was that the audience was clearly biased in favour of Labour and the SNP. Swinson and Johnson hardly got a clap as they walked on, if the audience was balanced they would have. Having supporters clapping you makes a big difference to the “feel” of these things. I suspect that in hindsight the two performed credibly under enemy fire and didn't suffer the calamity that Theresa May did in 2017. The polls won’t change much I predict.

[CrosspoolClarets]

The reason that QT was good was because it was in Sheffield, a city full of genuine, hard working and sincere people without too many random interventions from attention seekers. The audience was the winner rather than any of the politicians, although I thought Sturgeon was easily the most comfortable in her skin. Your passionate pro Tory stance Crosspool will always be unfathomable to me knowing the great guy I know you to be, but at least I know there’s one Tory in the Uk who has some compassion - I’m yet to see that trait in ANY current Tory MP, let me know if you can point me to one. I think it’s the worst set I’ve seen in my lifetime (for balance, it’s also the worst labour front bench).

You haven’t read many of my posts good sir, I am only voting Tory (for the second time in six elections) to get Brexit delivered and to keep Corbyn out of Number 10 - and possibly because I believe he will fund the north quite significantly as a one off.

My politics sit more naturally with the SDP, centre left economically (working people focus) and centre right socially (family and community focus). I posted the link to their New Declaration (aka manifesto) last night.

p.s. compassionate Tory MPs - picking those who I have had at least a 10 minute one to one conversation with this year, I would say Steve Baker (great guy), Ben Bradley and, yes, Boris Johnson (the conversation was before he became PM). I’m not easily hoodwinked and I do believe those three all care deeply about poorer people (cannot confirm if they have it as their HIGHEST priority, I’m not a complete mindreader).

[wickdkewlclaret]

If anyone can vote Tory after watching that, there is no helping you.

Oh.. and **** your Brexit.

[AndyClaret]

"Actress" from hard left propaganda film, I Daniel Blake allowed in Question Time audience.

[Greenmile]

“Hard left propaganda film”

[JohnMcGreal]

I thought both Swinson and Johnson came across terribly for pretty much the same reason. They (and their parties) have both been in government over the course of the last decade, and they have no answers or explanations for why the country is currently in the absolute state it's in. They're both tainted by their own records and there's no getting away from it.

Corbyn's Labour on the other hand have been out of office for a long time now, and are offering something genuinely different and refreshing, and the Lib Dems and Tories can't match it. If people are fed up with the status quo and want change, he's offering it. Maybe a lot of people will vote for that.

[Lancasterclaret]

Don’t tell me you’re truly that blinkered Lancaster... I really wanted Jo Swinson to succeed, but she failed miserably tonight.

Not at all

All four leaders have big issues that they can't really reconcile, and all four failed miserably to answer them adequately.

But she attempted to answer the questions, which is a plus.

[Lancasterclaret]

Or, maybe I just posted something you don't agree with, but that's ok.

Nope

It was rubbish, which is why you got jumped on.

[Lancasterclaret]

Well, yes, Jo Swinson answered all the questions - like a teenager called in to the headmistress's office to explain why she'd not done her homework. Or, to give it a football angle: like Pochettino called in to explain the start to the season by Levy.

Swinson came across the least experienced of the 4 - which, of course, she is. But, she also showed that she already knows that she's losing badly - through the policy choices she's made. That's the realities, I'm afraid.

Who do you think will be leading LibDems this time next year?

Almost like you don't understand how Lib Dem policy is decided Paul.

But that can't be right can it?

[Lancasterclaret]

I agree, though I know the Tory candidate who is a lifelong local businessman who supports many local charities and public sector bodies. He is a very clever, articulate and decent guy (but lost to O’Mara in 2017 which shows you the mentality of many voters).

Ultimately though, Hallam is one of the most wealthy and educated constituencies in the country. It is not hard to imagine them feeling Corbyn is a danger and stopping him is far more important than reversing Brexit (which many also want).

While Swinson bombed though, the main problem tonight for her was that the audience was clearly biased in favour of Labour and the SNP. Swinson and Johnson hardly got a clap as they walked on, if the audience was balanced they would have. Having supporters clapping you makes a big difference to the “feel” of these things. I suspect that in hindsight the two performed credibly under enemy fire and didn't suffer the calamity that Theresa May did in 2017. The polls won’t change much I predict.

It's in Sheffield, that well known SNP stronghold

[Spijed]

You haven’t read many of my posts good sir, I am only voting Tory (for the second time in six elections) to get Brexit delivered and to keep Corbyn out of Number 10 - and possibly because I believe he will fund the north quite significantly as a one off.

My politics sit more naturally with the SDP, centre left economically (working people focus) and centre right socially (family and community focus). I posted the link to their New Declaration (aka manifesto) last night.

p.s. compassionate Tory MPs - picking those who I have had at least a 10 minute one to one conversation with this year, I would say Steve Baker (great guy), Ben Bradley and, yes, Boris Johnson (the conversation was before he became PM). I’m not easily hoodwinked and I do believe those three all care deeply about poorer people (cannot confirm if they have it as their HIGHEST priority, I’m not a complete mindreader).

How many years do you really think it will take to negotiate our departure from the EU?

Burnley have more chance of winning the Premier league than Boris Johnson has of sporting out a trade agreement with the EU

[Lancasterclaret]

Turns out the audience was stacked as per Houses of Parliament.

So a grand total of 2 Lib Dems in the room.

So vast majority of audience is Lab or Con.

[Heathclaret]

Boris Johnson caring deeply about poor people is, probably, the funniest thing I’ve read for a long time.

Not easily hoodwinked? Does he have to walk around wearing an “IDGAF about the poor” t- shirt for you to see the real Tory hiding inside?

[Lancasterclaret]

It was excellent btw because it showed the leaders and the audience honed in on their weaknesses.

Sturgeon - independence ahead of anything else, with a Conservative esq cavalier attitude to what happens afterwards

Corbyn - desperate not to be asked about Brexit, so he was and came across as exactly how he didn't want to (ie trying to come across as neutral and you can't be neutral on this)

Swinson - no doubt revoking Article 50 outright is divisive and it showed, and the coalition is hard to justify

Johnson - racism and trust

Course, you could argue that we could really do with a positive type debate, but we saw those sorts of things at the various manifesto launches.

[Paul Waine]

Nope

It was rubbish, which is why you got jumped on.

To borrow quotes from a couple of people we saw on tv last night:

"That doesn't make you bad."

"I have a different opinion and that doesn't make me bad."

[Paul Waine]

Almost like you don't understand how Lib Dem policy is decided Paul.

But that can't be right can it?

Nope, not a clue how LibDems end up where they are.

I've a feeling Jo Swinson is thinking pretty much the same this morning.

[Lancasterclaret]

To borrow quotes from a couple of people we saw on tv last night:

"That doesn't make you bad."

"I have a different opinion and that doesn't make me bad."

It was rubbish.

Four or five posters instantly laughed in your face.

You want to pretend its because we are all lefties and we automatically attack anything that isn't lefty, that is 100% up to you.

[Lancasterclaret]

Nope, not a clue how LibDems end up where they are.

I've a feeling Jo Swinson is thinking pretty much the same this morning.

And Johnson did well?

And Sturgeon did well?

And Corbyn did well?

[Lancasterclaret]

Worth mentioning again

- Leaving the UK with a deal that leads to a hard brexit is divisive

- having a policy where we renegotiate another deal and have another referendum is divisive

- having another referendum with remain not on the ballot paper is divisive

- having another referendum with remain on the ballot paper is divisive

- revoking article 50 is divisive

Whichever brand of politics you follow, then any result will be divisive.

No one has even attempted to explain now you heal the divisions in the country, which suggests to me that no one really is interested.

For me, if its going to be divisive anyway, then we might as well do the way that at least safeguards the economy and doesn't mean that we treat millions of people who live and work here as 2nd class people.

[AndrewJB]

I quite like the idea of a green investment bank, their policies on council house building, trying to abolish the needs for food banks and trying to rid our streets of the homeless. Believe in Nationalising the railway’s.

Against privatisation of the utilities, Royal Mail as I feel they will become inefficient and not turn out to be the income producers that Labour are budgeting for. I am against raising the dividend tax rate from 7.5% to 20% as I feel it will affect small businesses. I am against raising Corporation tax rates as in the highly mobile business environment there is a danger companies will change domicility and we could end up losing Revenue.

Whilst I admire the policy of freezing the state pension at 66 I am realistic to know that given that the ratio of working people to pensioners is lowering each year it is not sustainable.

On a general note given the scale of borrowing needed the fear is that if the market’s went against us our debt interest payments could rise to such a level that cuts would have to be made that would affect the poorest in society.

Thanks for the response.

Royal Mail was state owned just a few years ago and made a profit, so I’m not worried that these organisations will end up as bloated bureaucracies just through nationalisation. In fact I see the nationalisations as enabling wider business. Without ripoff utilities, business will see expenses fall. With improved train service they’ll see employees arrive on time. And with better internet connections, business opportunities will open up. If the internet had been privatised and pay as you click from the beginning, there would be no Google now.

The right wing press make much of the cost, though I think they’re more concerned with their owners being taxed more, but once the money is raised it doesn’t just disappear. It circulated through the economy. Better that money is spent on welfare and travels through the economy than it goes straight into an offshore bank account and sits there.

[Paul Waine]

It was rubbish.

Four or five posters instantly laughed in your face.

You want to pretend its because we are all lefties and we automatically attack anything that isn't lefty, that is 100% up to you.

and you want to play the "bad boy" - that's fine.

What is this "laughed in your face" stuff? Where has all this social media angst come from?

Are you at Watford today, Lancs?