General Election Is On

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wickdkewlclaret
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by wickdkewlclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:07 am

There’s some serious momentum behind Labour now, with record people registering to vote and ready to take to the polls.

Bring it on.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:10 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Hang on a sec Rick

No doubt this has been inflated by the right wing press, but at the same time the problem are real and there is no longer any doubt that its ingrained in a chunk of Labour support.

But it one way, pretending its a right wing Tory conspiracy (hello Labour activists on twitter!) in the face of all the evidence isn't helping at all.

Labour itself have done a lot recently to counter act this, but its too little and I fear its too late.
Of course it's been inflated by the right wing press, what else are they going to do when they're gifted an opportunity such as this.

Why is is too little or too late? They have acted, and as far as I can see they have always acted but because it's not in a specific way to appease the Jewish community (which quite frankly they're fighting a losing battle on that one) they're going to be wrong.

Please can I ask how the Tories have addressed the open racism of their leader (picaninnie watermelon smiles; lettterboxes etc)? or is he just someone who used language colourfully and is terribly misunderstood?

I want fair debate, and ignoring actual evidence in favour of rhetoric is what frustrates me about all of this.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:12 am

Rick_Muller wrote:Of course it's been inflated by the right wing press, what else are they going to do when they're gifted an opportunity such as this.

Why is is too little or too late? They have acted, and as far as I can see they have always acted but because it's not in a specific way to appease the Jewish community (which quite frankly they're fighting a losing battle on that one) they're going to be wrong.

Please can I ask how the Tories have addressed the open racism of their leader (picaninnie watermelon smiles; lettterboxes etc)? or is he just someone who used language colourfully and isterribly misunderstood?

I want fair debate, and ignoring actual evidence in favour of rhetoric is what frustrates me about all of this.
Why have you gone straight for the whataboutery?

Thats how Labour have been defending themselves on this, and thats why its spiralled out of control.

It was never going to be easy when you started seeing multiple videos and posts from a whole range of Labour activists (from minor to major) doing it but I'm 100% sure Labour could have handled it better.

(the conservatives are full of nasty little racists too, but Labour didn't used to be, and that is the issue)

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:14 am

I mean, how come Labour can't be doing better against a party whose record and policy claims can be summed up by this genius on twitter

"To be fair, 40 fictitious hospitals staffed by 19,000 fictitious nurses is the kind of political offer we've come to expect from the government that delivered 200,000 fictitious starter homes"

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by timshorts » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:18 am

Volvoclaret wrote:Real question re Inheritance Tax. If you house worth say £300K and take out equity release of £176K, do you avoid the tax?
The equity release package is deducted from your gross estate for inheritance tax purposes.

However, that won't necessarily help you that much, as initially, it just means that the £176K is going to appear somewhere else on your IHT400 - just in a different form.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:19 am

And here we have the problem

https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status ... 3347380224" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:20 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Why have you gone straight for the whataboutery?
because its relevant mate. I have seen the Labour Party taking actual action over the Antisemitism issue, albeit "too little too late" for you and others, but I have seen nothing from the Tories in relation to anti-Islamic hatred or their leader using actual racist words. One party is taking actual action, the other party is pointing fingers and totally ignoring the hypocrisy of what they are doing but are getting the support of the press (not just the right wing press). Dare I question why, or would I be labelled anti-Semitic if I did?

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by AndrewJB » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:20 am

Rick_Muller wrote:Of course it's been inflated by the right wing press, what else are they going to do when they're gifted an opportunity such as this.

Why is is too little or too late? They have acted, and as far as I can see they have always acted but because it's not in a specific way to appease the Jewish community (which quite frankly they're fighting a losing battle on that one) they're going to be wrong.

Please can I ask how the Tories have addressed the open racism of their leader (picaninnie watermelon smiles; lettterboxes etc)? or is he just someone who used language colourfully and is terribly misunderstood?

I want fair debate, and ignoring actual evidence in favour of rhetoric is what frustrates me about all of this.
Johnson has refused to apologise for the words he used - which are in print - and has taken little action against accusations of racism within his party. Corbyn has apologised for actions he’s taken that could be construed as supporting anti Semitism (such as commenting on the mural). There is no question on who is the better man.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:22 am

wickdkewlclaret wrote:There’s some serious momentum behind Labour now, with record people registering to vote and ready to take to the polls.

Bring it on.
You could argue having momentum behind them is the reason why they are in the mess they are.

Can currently get 12/1 on Labour winning, how much would you advise putting on them with this new momentum ?

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:25 am

Rick_Muller wrote:because its relevant mate. I have seen the Labour Party taking actual action over the Antisemitism issue, albeit "too little too late" for you and others, but I have seen nothing from the Tories in relation to anti-Islamic hatred or their leader using actual racist words. One party is taking actual action, the other party is pointing fingers and totally ignoring the hypocrisy of what they are doing but are getting the support of the press (not just the right wing press). Dare I question why, or would I be labelled anti-Semitic if I did?
But I'm not disputed the Conservatives are a nasty party led by a racist. I dislike Johnson intensely because he's living proof that you can say what you want and still get to the highest office in the land.

I know why Jewish Labour supporters are terrified of a Corbyn government, and telling me that the Conservatives are worse doesn't solve that.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by RMutt » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:28 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:And here we have the problem

https://twitter.com/DavidHenigUK/status ... 3347380224" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
In other words, turn yourself into a watered down Tory party with the support of Murdoch and you might stand a chance. Remember Blair was Thatcher's lasting achievement.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:33 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:But I'm not disputed the Conservatives are a nasty party led by a racist. I dislike Johnson intensely because he's living proof that you can say what you want and still get to the highest office in the land.
agreed
Lancasterclaret wrote:I know why Jewish Labour supporters are terrified of a Corbyn government, and telling me that the Conservatives are worse doesn't solve that.
Why is that? is it actually evidence based or right wing press rhetoric based? I'm not saying the Tories are worse or better, but I am highlighting that they are also wrong. I don't understand why the press are not running Tory racism with the same enthusiasm as they are for the Labour antisemitism and no one can explain this. Is it any wonder why there are conspiracy theorists out there...?

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:36 am

kick out the tories.jpg
kick out the tories.jpg (114.19 KiB) Viewed 2147 times
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:54 am

RMutt wrote:In other words, turn yourself into a watered down Tory party with the support of Murdoch and you might stand a chance. Remember Blair was Thatcher's lasting achievement.
Take out the word "Blair" from the quote and its 100% inarguable.

I'm not even close to being a Blairite, or a Brownite or whateverite but the current Labour front bench don't come close to challenging the Conservative front bench.

Considering the Conservative front bench is made up of people like Patel and Raab that is a shocking state of affairs.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Dy1geo » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:54 am

When a mural appeared on an East End wall depicting “Jewish Bankers” Corbyn defended it on the grounds of free Speech and then said he regretted his comments without actually apologising.

Richard Burgon said “Zionism is the enemy of the peace” and that now he regrets saying those comments without apologising.

Johnson said “ absolutely ridiculous that people should choose to go around looking like letter boxes” he defended it by saying people should read “the whole article” but the fact remains he said it and didn’t need to. He apologised for the picaninnies quote

In my opinion all three politicians are not fit for office
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:56 am

Rick_Muller wrote:agreed


Why is that? is it actually evidence based or right wing press rhetoric based? I'm not saying the Tories are worse or better, but I am highlighting that they are also wrong. I don't understand why the press are not running Tory racism with the same enthusiasm as they are for the Labour antisemitism and no one can explain this. Is it any wonder why there are conspiracy theorists out there...?
I'm not Jewish Rick

But they are **** scared of him and (more importantly) those who follow him.

You'll have to ask them why, because I'm not Jewish and don't have any experience of what minorities worry about.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:58 am

Under the Torys there will be at least 3 million more EU immigrants in the U.K. next year according to new figures

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by AlargeClaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:04 am

Dy1geo wrote:When a mural appeared on an East End wall depicting “Jewish Bankers” Corbyn defended it on the grounds of free Speech and then said he regretted his comments without actually apologising.

Richard Burgon said “Zionism is the enemy of the peace” and that now he regrets saying those comments without apologising.

Johnson said “ absolutely ridiculous that people should choose to go around looking like letter boxes” he defended it by saying people should read “the whole article” but the fact remains he said it and didn’t need to. He apologised for the picaninnies quote

In my opinion all three politicians are not fit for office
The Boris “ letterbox” comments were in an article supporting the right to wear hijab ( and saying they look ridiculous which they do) The “ piccaninnies” quote was a highly satirical article about the Queen and the old commonwealth countries performing the same old shtick for her maj ( gawd bless er)

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by RMutt » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:07 am

Dy1geo wrote:When a mural appeared on an East End wall depicting “Jewish Bankers” Corbyn defended it on the grounds of free Speech and then said he regretted his comments without actually apologising.

Richard Burgon said “Zionism is the enemy of the peace” and that now he regrets saying those comments without apologising.

Johnson said “ absolutely ridiculous that people should choose to go around looking like letter boxes” he defended it by saying people should read “the whole article” but the fact remains he said it and didn’t need to. He apologised for the picaninnies quote

In my opinion all three politicians are not fit for office
Mmmmm....but let me guess, if you had to pick one, it would be Johnson.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:12 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:I'm not Jewish Rick

But they are **** scared of him and (more importantly) those who follow him.

You'll have to ask them why, because I'm not Jewish and don't have any experience of what minorities worry about.
fair enough, so you cant actually tell me why they are worried about Jeremy Corbyn being Prime Minister even though the Labour party have taken actual measures to eliminate antisemitism.

For fear of whataboutery, as a member of a minority group (disabled) I am seriously worried if Boris Johnson gets a majority government and I can highlight real issues relating to why I am worried and I don't need to rely upon right wing press rhetoric and propaganda to support my issues.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:15 am

Rick_Muller wrote:fair enough, so you cant actually tell me why they are worried about Jeremy Corbyn being Prime Minister even though the Labour party have taken actual measures to eliminate antisemitism.

For fear of whataboutery, as a member of a minority group (disabled) I am seriously worried if Boris Johnson gets a majority government and I can highlight real issues relating to why I am worried and I don't need to rely upon right wing press rhetoric and propaganda to support my issues.
Hang on a sec

You need to find out why the Jews are worried Rick, with the greatest respect in the world, rather than telling me in five posts why the Conservatives are bad (which I agree with)
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by aggi » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:18 am

timshorts wrote:The equity release package is deducted from your gross estate for inheritance tax purposes.

However, that won't necessarily help you that much, as initially, it just means that the £176K is going to appear somewhere else on your IHT400 - just in a different form.
You'd have to gift it to someone and then not die for 7 years.

Or just spend it.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by FactualFrank » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:24 am

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Andrew Neil obliteration of Nicola Sturgeon on BBC1 Andrew Neil Show tonight is well worth watching on Iplayer.
To be fair, he's destroyed every party that have been on, big time.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:25 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Hang on a sec

You need to find out why the Jews are worried Rick, with the greatest respect in the world, rather than telling me in five posts why the Conservatives are bad (which I agree with)
I have researched the issue and yes, there is evidence of antisemitism in a small minority of the Labour party, which has been addressed by the leadership of the party. I have also noted numerous articles and propaganda from many main stream news outlets that keep banging the antisemitic drum against the Labour party. Now the question is, and I don't expect you to answer it - How many of the actual Jewish community believe there is antisemitism in the Labour party because they have experienced antisemitism from a member of the Labour party, and how many have only read that the labour party are antisemitic in the press?

you do understand how propaganda works don't you...? especially in the modern "social media" world?
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Spijed » Tue Nov 26, 2019 9:59 am

Harry Dunn's parents blocked from meeting Dominic Raab:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Erasmus » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:00 am

'Zionism is the enemy of peace' is not a racist remark. It is a political assessment that has some merit to it in light of Israeli policies of territorial expansion, ethnic cleansing and land seizure. These latter comments are also not racist.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Dy1geo » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:06 am

RMutt wrote:Mmmmm....but let me guess, if you had to pick one, it would be Johnson.
I would pick Blair before any of the them but unfortunately he is not “Labour” enough for the current membership.

Of the current Labour group Keir Starmer stands out and Rachel Reeves is very good economist who would be a good Chancellor. If they had that pairing I would vote for them over the Tories if they had as I suspect a more centre left proposition.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by tiger76 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:21 am

CrosspoolClarets wrote:Andrew Neil obliteration of Nicola Sturgeon on BBC1 Andrew Neil Show tonight is well worth watching on Iplayer.

He demonstrates why the EU would not let Scotland in if we leave, and her previous promises mean Scotland could not gain independence if we remain. He then went on to spend 43 seconds wrecking her NHS legacy, a long list of failures.
Quite why Nicola Sturgeon is fronting up the SNP'S UK election campaign baffles me,yes she's the party leader and FM of Scotland,but she's not standing as a Westminster candidate,grillo makes mincemeat of all his guests,but it's good that Sturgeon's fantasies of an independent Scotland simply walking back into the EU were exposed,for a start Scotland has a budget deficit that would break EU rules,i notice NS doesn't give a specific timescale regarding Scotland becoming an EU member,she just states it would happen relatively quickly.

The telling aspect is that even if the UK decides to remain in the EU,Sturgeon will still demand a 2nd independence referendum,the women is obsessed.

Corbyn is up before grillo tonight,let's hope he's questioned over anti-semitism amongst other things.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:22 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:
(the conservatives are full of nasty little racists too, but Labour didn't used to be, and that is the issue)


It's not hard to imagine that a few agents of the media could easily promote the scenario you describe Lancs.

I probably know 60 or 70 Labour Party members personally. I'd be honestly amazed if a single one entertained the nasty racist views you mention. So I think for you to suggest the Labour Party is ""full"" of racists suggests you hadnt thought through your remark or you've fallen for the Tory line. I hope and believe its the former as I dont really have you in the ""hard of thinking "" bracket.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by tiger76 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:32 am

Dy1geo wrote:I would pick Blair before any of the them but unfortunately he is not “Labour” enough for the current membership.

Of the current Labour group Keir Starmer stands out and Rachel Reeves is very good economist who would be a good Chancellor. If they had that pairing I would vote for them over the Tories if they had as I suspect a more centre left proposition.
If Labour have any sense after their mauling in December,they'll elect Keir Starmer and try and take a more centrist approach,i would definitely consider casting a vote for that concept,but given the grip momentum has on the NEC and the wider party,i'm not holding out any hopes.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:38 am

and here's Boris wanting to stay in the EU... https://www.facebook.com/conservatoffs/ ... 793584951/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Cryssys » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:42 am

Is there no low that the Tories and their media lackeys will not stoop to in their efforts to see Boris elected? Politics is a messy business and I wasn't expecting a clean fight but the behaviour of the Tories should be a cause for concern from anyone who is interested in truth and democracy.

With regard to the Tory campaign to date we've had:

1. Doctored Keir Starmer video
2. Fake labour manifesto
3. Fake fact check account

They have become the party of fake news and should be ashamed of themselves.

To date the Labour Party has conducted a clean campaign and published a detailed manifesto with costings. The Conservatives on the other hand have resorted to the most underhand and dishonest campaign we have ever witnessed and have published a manifesto that is so vague and lacking in substance that Paul John the head of the IFS said this about it:

"If a single Budget had contained all these tax and spending proposals we would have been calling it modest. As a blueprint for five years in government the lack of significant policy action is remarkable."

And don't even get me started on the Daily Mail.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:54 am

Cryssys wrote:Is there no low that the Tories and their media lackeys will not stoop to in their efforts to see Boris elected? Politics is a messy business and I wasn't expecting a clean fight but the behaviour of the Tories should be a cause for concern from anyone who is interested in truth and democracy.

With regard to the Tory campaign to date we've had:

1. Doctored Keir Starmer video
2. Fake labour manifesto
3. Fake fact check account

They have become the party of fake news and should be ashamed of themselves.

To date the Labour Party has conducted a clean campaign and published a detailed manifesto with costings. The Conservatives on the other hand have resorted to the most underhand and dishonest campaign we have ever witnessed and have published a manifesto that is so vague and lacking in substance that Paul John the head of the IFS said this about it:

"If a single Budget had contained all these tax and spending proposals we would have been calling it modest. As a blueprint for five years in government the lack of significant policy action is remarkable."

And don't even get me started on the Daily Mail.

What we have is a Trump style ""playing chess with pigeons"" approach....just ignore the truth and any form of reality...just feed the plebs a pile of horsemuck and they will buy it...they dont care..the proles will be more influenced by a pic of Jezza not singing the national anthem loud enough, or not wearing the right colour of poppy, than any detailed costing of proposed nhs investment. ..the tories have far more idea about manipulating the empty-heads than Labour could ever dream of, and they totally control the information supply.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Spijed » Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:31 am

Electoral Reform Society

Verified account

@electoralreform
Follow Follow @electoralreform
More
NEW: There have been a massive 2.8m applications to #RegisterToVote since the election was called.

That's over a million more than the comparable pre-deadline period during the last election, which saw 1.7m applications

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by AndyClaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 11:44 am

Spijed wrote:Electoral Reform Society

Verified account

@electoralreform
Follow Follow @electoralreform
More
NEW: There have been a massive 2.8m applications to #RegisterToVote since the election was called.

That's over a million more than the comparable pre-deadline period during the last election, which saw 1.7m applications
The vast majority will be people who are already registered.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by dermotdermot » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:07 pm

Heathclaret wrote:You are too smart to do that Lancaster, where as I agree that the Labour Party is not what we would like it to be, voting for Johnson and his cronies and whet they stand for is unthinkable. I’m no fan of Corbyn and his bunch, but the other lot are worse. Plus Johnson is probably the most dishonest politician I’ve ever listened to, and that’s saying something.
I’m sorry but, no matter how bad you think they are, Corbyn is worse. No one would be as bad as him. Even Adolf Hitler would be better.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Lowbankclaret » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:14 pm

jrgbfc wrote:There was massive investment and improvement in things like schools, the NHS and SureStart centre's. Which the Tories have managed to virtually destroy after 9 years in power.
In 1992 PFI was introduced to allow private funding of public works.
This led to a lot of new buildings schools etc.
Our very own Thomas Whittam college was built using PFI.
It now going to be closed crippled by PFI payments.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:30 pm

dermotdermot wrote:I’m sorry but, no matter how bad you think they are, Corbyn is worse. No one would be as bad as him. Even Adolf Hitler would be better.
wow...

aggi
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by aggi » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:37 pm

If it be your will wrote:Scanning the internet, it looks like all the metro systems (Madrid, Paris, Berlin, Rome, Seville, Prague...) have completely escaped the Commission's attention - unlike 'overground' railways, none of which have escaped scrutiny. The Commission are even moaning about Estonia, with only 900km of operational railways operating on a different gauge!

Other than London (400km), the others seem to be in the sub-250km region, and a lot are sub-100km. Perhaps they are all considered too small for '4th Railway Package' treatment.

The purchase of trains and major works are still subject to Public Procurement Rules and State Aid Rules, though.

Looking here (2014) http://www.europarl.europa.eu/EPRS/EPRS ... -FINAL.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and here https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... 2013PC0028" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; (note - scanned only) there seems to be a proposal to exempt any system with less than 300,000 service-miles (not 'passenger miles'), i.e. how far all the trains travel in total. London Underground, with 1.3 billion 'passenger-miles' must be way above that limit, though.

All in all, my best guess is the Commission have been too busy tackling the overground networks in France, Denmark, Ireland, Spain, Norway etc to have got round to taking on the larger Metro systems yet. London Underground, you'd imagine, would be their first port of call when they do.
Cheers. I find this stuff intriguing. The internet has many conflicting views on what is and isn't possible. Briefly looking at the 4th railway package I can't find anything that specifically forbids nationalisation but it would only work if your nationalised service was the most competitive (you'd still have to put things out to tender). Is that your view as well or are there extra impediments I've missed?

TFL is interesting. Your 400km figure is only the underground, I think it's about 800km including the various trains they run but obviously that doesn't make much difference compared to the revenue it generates and the passengers that it carries. I can't see that they're just relying on the fact that the EU hasn't noticed though. If you look at the various policy documents, future plans, etc there's no mention at all of the EU, 4th railway package, etc as a threat to the operation or the future expansion plans. I imagine there must be some carve out but I've no idea what it is.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:42 pm

dermotdermot wrote:I’m sorry but, no matter how bad you think they are, Corbyn is worse. No one would be as bad as him. Even Adolf Hitler would be better.

pigeons..chess

no further questions m'lud.
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If it be your will
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by If it be your will » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:56 pm

aggi wrote:Cheers. I find this stuff intriguing. The internet has many conflicting views on what is and isn't possible. Briefly looking at the 4th railway package I can't find anything that specifically forbids nationalisation but it would only work if your nationalised service was the most competitive (you'd still have to put things out to tender). Is that your view as well or are there extra impediments I've missed?

TFL is interesting. Your 400km figure is only the underground, I think it's about 800km including the various trains they run but obviously that doesn't make much difference compared to the revenue it generates and the passengers that it carries. I can't see that they're just relying on the fact that the EU hasn't noticed though. If you look at the various policy documents, future plans, etc there's no mention at all of the EU, 4th railway package, etc as a threat to the operation or the future expansion plans. I imagine there must be some carve out but I've no idea what it is.
That's pretty much it, yes. The enterprises under state ownership would have to behave exactly as if they were not under state ownership, and win the contracts on a level playing field in fair competition with the private sector, and therefore with the same motivations. Thus removing the point of being under state ownership in the first place. In my view, the natural monopolies need to be run as monopolies to make them work properly, fairly, efficiently and with a wider social purpose. The EU definitely does not allow this.

I too, do not have a good answer as to why all the metro systems in the EU seem to have escaped the same rules that are being ruthlessly applied to 'overground' networks.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by TheFamilyCat » Tue Nov 26, 2019 1:06 pm

Slightly off-topic question re registering and eligibility to vote.

I've just checked the electoral roll and while on it searched for myself but I didn't appear at my current address, nor did my wife. We've voted previously while we've been there and received our cards telling us that our postal voting forms are on the way.

Any reason why we're not on the roll?

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by AndrewJB » Tue Nov 26, 2019 1:54 pm

Rick_Muller wrote:I have researched the issue and yes, there is evidence of antisemitism in a small minority of the Labour party, which has been addressed by the leadership of the party. I have also noted numerous articles and propaganda from many main stream news outlets that keep banging the antisemitic drum against the Labour party. Now the question is, and I don't expect you to answer it - How many of the actual Jewish community believe there is antisemitism in the Labour party because they have experienced antisemitism from a member of the Labour party, and how many have only read that the labour party are antisemitic in the press?

you do understand how propaganda works don't you...? especially in the modern "social media" world?
My partner is friends with a number of Jewish people through her work. I’ve seen three of them argue over this issue, with one taking Corbyn’s side. I can’t say the other two sounded well informed, as they had a lot of incorrect information.

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by KateR » Tue Nov 26, 2019 1:54 pm

Greenmile wrote:AND LABOUR DID NOT CAUSE THE GLOBAL FINANCIAL CRISIS.

It happened under their watch though, which seems to matter to you for some reason. Just like austerity happened under the Tories’ watch. You can’t have it both ways.

So you and your little gang continue to refuse to read what I was saying, you continue to push your agenda regardless of what people here point out, you twist and turn to your own ends, unfortunately like a lot of things in the world people don't agree with you, you need to try and understand that.

I am well aware Labour did not cause the financial crisis but you and your merry band continue to blame the Tories for the financial crisis outcome which we can all agree was called austerity, my posts were in regard to this and the fact that Tories did not cause it. It happened under Labour and I believe you did not doubt it as you have not contradicted that point, Labour made decisions and provided bail outs, Labour left the coffers empty, I will say again for the umpteenth time, I do not believe Tories did everything right, I do not believe the Tories are the best thing since sliced bread.

The issue I do have is the manifesto by Labour in its entirety, it is in my humble opinion not workable, has no basis in reality, of course anyone can borrow anything for as long as they want but regardless you have to pay things back plus interest, at the end I believe, forecast, anticipate, etc. that the common working class people will end up paying for it.

You need to tell me still from your little band, how good did the last 3 Labour Governments do, how long were they in power and what was the outcome, with a view to " if they were so good to the everyday working man and the poor why were they not in power time after time".
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by CrosspoolClarets » Tue Nov 26, 2019 1:59 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:In 1992 PFI was introduced to allow private funding of public works.
This led to a lot of new buildings schools etc.
Our very own Thomas Whittam college was built using PFI.
It now going to be closed crippled by PFI payments.
Don’t forget the man in line to be Labour Health Secretary, Jon Ashworth, was one of the big brain’s behind it, advising Gordon Brown in the Treasury,

Those of us who have spent years trying to balance hospital’s books due to the PFI burden remember it well.
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Re: General Election Is On

Post by CrosspoolClarets » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:17 pm

I agree with posters who say Labour has momentum and could come through.

They are cleverly deflecting the anti semite issue onto the Tories and claiming Islamophobia.

Johnson’s letter box article was clearly badly worded despite my sympathy with the general headlines, which were:

The Burka is oppressive and ridiculous.
Denmark should NOT ban it despite this.

Those statements are fine (the bulk of his article and the intention behind his whole piece). But he has a love of simile and referencing bank robbers and letterboxes was unnecessarily offensive. The piccaninnie line was different as it was 17 years ago and using casual slurs like golliwogs and piccaninnies is viewed differently now to how it was then, I’m not going to slaughter him for using the term piccaninnie when he was in effect a young comedic writer.

But yes, it is leading to Corbyn having a chance at number 10, even though I suspect it is really the Tories doing a safe Dyche and defending when 1-0 instead of cracking on. It works for Dyche - will it work for Johnson?

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by martin_p » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:23 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:The piccaninnie line was different as it was 17 years ago and using casual slurs like golliwogs and piccaninnies is viewed differently now to how it was then, I’m not going to slaughter him for using the term piccaninnie when he was in effect a young comedic writer.
Give over, 17 years ago was 2002 not the 1970s! And young writer? He was 38!!

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:27 pm

I find it interesting to see how some posters resort to plain animosity when they have no other opinion to use

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Dy1geo » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:38 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:I agree with posters who say Labour has momentum and could come through.

They are cleverly deflecting the anti semite issue onto the Tories and claiming Islamophobia.

Johnson’s letter box article was clearly badly worded despite my sympathy with the general headlines, which were:

The Burka is oppressive and ridiculous.
Denmark should NOT ban it despite this.

Those statements are fine (the bulk of his article and the intention behind his whole piece). But he has a love of simile and referencing bank robbers and letterboxes was unnecessarily offensive. The piccaninnie line was different as it was 17 years ago and using casual slurs like golliwogs and piccaninnies is viewed differently now to how it was then, I’m not going to slaughter him for using the term piccaninnie when he was in effect a young comedic writer.

But yes, it is leading to Corbyn having a chance at number 10, even though I suspect it is really the Tories doing a safe Dyche and defending when 1-0 instead of cracking on. It works for Dyche - will it work for Johnson?
Whilst Labour are gaining somemomentum in the polls the big difference between 2019 and 2017 is that the Lib Dem’s after the election was called went from around 10% to 8% whereas they are polling higher now in mid teens. Also two weeks from the election Labour were around 33% on average to the Tories around 46% and Labour gained at the expense of the Tories In last two weeks. This time I see the Tory vote as more solid so can’t see it falling to lower that 42-43% and in normal times Labour need to be around 37% to prevent a Tory majority. However this is not normal times and in my opinion we will see a lot more “freak” results than 2017 when Labour won Canterbury and the Tories won Mansfield

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Re: General Election Is On

Post by Spijed » Tue Nov 26, 2019 2:39 pm

Dy1geo wrote:Whilst Labour are gaining some momentum in the polls the big difference between 2019 and 2017 is that the Lib Dem’s after the election was called went from around 10% to 8% whereas they are polling higher now in mid teens. Also two were around 33% on average to the Tories around 46% and Labour gained at the expense of the Tories In last two weeks. This time I see the Tory vote as more solid so can’t see it falling to lower that 42-43% and in normal times Labour need to be around 37% to prevent a Tory majority. However this is not normal times and in my opinion we will see a lot more “freak” results than 2017 when Labour won Canterbury and the Tories won Mansfield
Apparently the first big constituency MRP poll is tomorrow night by Yougov.

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