Imploding Turtle wrote:You're allowed to start a family at 16 so how can anyone justify arguing against giving 16 year olds the right to vote? It's hilarious seeing people try.

In July, debating increasing the age for lottery scratch-cards, Labour Deputy Leader, Tom Watson said, " There is no need for further evidence, to gamble you should be an adult - so the minimum age for all gambling products should be 18 " ...

There are protections for 16-17 year olds in place, ie: can only marry with their parents consent, it's illegal to have sexual relations with someone that age if you may be in a position of authority or trust, people of that age are not permitted to appear in pornography etc. You have to be 17 to drive a car, 18 to purchase alcohol or tobacco, drive a bus or form a legally binding contract on your own account.

The age of 18 is the correct age to be able to vote, and Labour's pressing of this issue is for their own perceived political advantage, and nothing else. They're uttering " weasel words " ......

Jakubclaret wrote:Does that also apply to 1 student with 2 identities, you can easily change your surname online legally by deed poll & use that new name elsewhere, basically transfer the new name onto your driving licence ect, whilst using the old name as well. I know I've done it not for fraudently purposes, may I add.

Oh for **** sake.

Yes, we have millions of students in the country all with multiple IDs just to get an extra vote each Flush with cash, as students famously are, to spend money on deed poll name-changes.

RingoMcCartney wrote:Ringo's Christmas wish list-

The following MPs to be turfed out by their constituents-

1 Dominic Grieve

2 Anna Soubrey

3 Yvette Cooper

4 Owen Smith

5 Sarah Wollaston


Any of the above will do. More to come.

Nigel Evans, please please please.

Jakubclaret wrote:Does that also apply to 1 student with 2 identities, you can easily change your surname online legally by deed poll & use that new name elsewhere, basically transfer the new name onto your driving licence ect, whilst using the old name as well. I know I've done it not for fraudently purposes, may I add.

Well I guess you could but you would still be 1 person ...so it would be illegal.

Without googling it, how many allegations of voter fraud do you guys think there were in 2017?

Imploding Turtle wrote:Oh for **** sake.

Yes, we have millions of students in the country all with multiple IDs just to get an extra vote each Flush with cash, as students famously are, to spend money on deed poll name-changes.

Yes, it cost me about £20 & I think their were cheaper sites it's not a great financial outlay & it took about 5 mins, 48hrs later I got the paperwork through the post & got it countersigned by a witness, I was amazed it was that easy.

Imploding Turtle wrote:Without googling it, how many allegations of voter fraud do you guys think there were in 2017?

None if its not detected & the appetite to investigate it doesn't exist.

Jakubclaret wrote:I'm too busy looking out of window wondering if it's going to rain to create a considered constructive response.

Not a matter of forming a constructive response... Edward Heath took us into the Common Market. I think you mean Margaret Thatcher... after the miners had led Heath a merry dance, it was Thatcher who determined to smash the miners in retaliation (and because the government was broke for most of the seventies).

Bainsyclaret wrote:Well I guess you could but you would still be 1 person ...so it would be illegal.

Questioning the legality isn't in doubt, I'm just saying it's very easy to create 2 identities & use each separately if you was that way inclined.

Jakubclaret wrote:Questioning the legality isn't in doubt, I'm just saying it's very easy to create 2 identities & use each separately if you was that way inclined.

You're talking to people who seem to forget that teenagers have been using fake ID's, or someone else's, for years to enable them to get booze etc.
The fact that teenagers are already willing to commit fraud to get what they want is lost on them.

Lowbankclaret wrote:Stewart Scott is the Brexit PPC for Burnley.

Life long claret, goes home and away.

Is that all you've got when you go door-knocking? "Vote for him, he's a Burnley fan".

Pimlico_Claret wrote:Nigel Evans, please please please.

Nigel Evans has his feet well and truly under the table in the Ribble Valley... he’s been useless as an MP since time immemorial. Offered nothing when I needed help while living in Read, even the letter offering absolutely nothing was written and signed by a secretary on his behalf.... just not interested. But safe as houses there, sadly.

elwaclaret wrote:Not a matter of forming a constructive response... Edward Heath took us into the Common Market. I think you mean Margaret Thatcher... after the miners had led Heath a merry dance, it was Thatcher who determined to smash the miners in retaliation (and because the government was broke for most of the seventies).

He doesn't do history or facts.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:You're talking to people who seem to forget that teenagers have been using fake ID's, or someone else's, for years to enable them to get booze etc.
The fact that teenagers are already willing to commit fraud to get what they want is lost on them.

I’ve heard some of them even have fake twitter accounts.

Rick_Muller wrote:If individuals are able to work and contribute, and as mentioned above are able to serve in the armed forces at 16 then they are entitled to have a say in how our country is run. Stop being a belmtard by suggesting postal votes from birth

So where do we draw the line??

It’s been 18 for a long time.

Surely if they are old enough to vote they are old enough to drink in alcohol in pubs.

They should also be removed from parental control, currently 18.

As we all know Young people are more likely to vote Labour and to vote remain.

My own daughter (17) would vote remain, and she does not know why when asked. Bless her.


I am happy to support reducing the voting age to 16 as long as all other barriers to adulthood are removed at the same time.

elwaclaret wrote:Not a matter of forming a constructive response... Edward Heath took us into the Common Market. I think you mean Margaret Thatcher... after the miners had led Heath a merry dance, it was Thatcher who determined to smash the miners in retaliation (and because the government was broke for most of the seventies).

The strike of 1974 I was referring to.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Scargill" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Jakubclaret wrote:None if its not detected & the appetite to investigate it doesn't exist.

If there are no allegations then what is there to investigate?

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:You're talking to people who seem to forget that teenagers have been using fake ID's, or someone else's, for years to enable them to get booze etc.
The fact that teenagers are already willing to commit fraud to get what they want is lost on them.

Very true Sidney etc.

Everyone knows it's a slippery slope etc.

One moment you're borrowing your mate's ID to get into a club etc, the next you're committing voter fraud just like all your mates etc.

I know that was the road I ended up going down etc.

I'm sure many others on here too have a similar story etc.

Imploding Turtle wrote:If there are no allegations then what is there to investigate?

Exactly

Jakubclaret wrote:Questioning the legality isn't in doubt, I'm just saying it's very easy to create 2 identities & use each separately if you was that way inclined.

You might be able to open a bank account with one of them. Somewhere.

Jakubclaret wrote:Exactly

You're making my argument for me, you do know that right?

Imploding Turtle wrote:We have another general election, i guess. That seems to be the logic of those who argue against a referendum, that it will lead to repeat after repeat.

Remember, we're only allowed to change our mind on which MP to vote for. We're not allowed to change our mind on Brexit, because that would be undemocratic. Or something. I forget how the dumb ***** justify their dumbfuckery.

Exactly, Nobody is able to tell us. What a whole sorry mess

Jakubclaret wrote:The strike of 1974 I was referring to.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Scargill" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He had plenty of trouble with Scargill, but it was Scargill that showed him to be a bit of wet lettuce. The miners battered Heath, Thatcher battered the unions.

TheFamilyCat wrote:Is that all you've got when you go door-knocking? "Vote for him, he's a Burnley fan".

I think he'll also be telling them that if they don't have a purple and yellow sign on the doorpost the EU will kill their firstborn.

It's definitely true, I saw it on the internet.

TheFamilyCat wrote:Is that all you've got when you go door-knocking? "Vote for him, he's a Burnley fan".

As an ex Labour door knocker.

It will be a much easier sell to be fair.

Selling a terrorist supporting anti army Marxist is going to be difficult on the doorstep.

Just glad I don’t have to even try.

Imploding Turtle wrote:You're making my argument for me, you do know that right?

I know it's very possible that a student could vote more than once if he/she changed identities using the method I've described, I'm not saying they will or are, I'm just saying they could.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:You're talking to people who seem to forget that teenagers have been using fake ID's, or someone else's, for years to enable them to get booze etc.
The fact that teenagers are already willing to commit fraud to get what they want is lost on them.

You don’t need I.D. To register to vote.

Lowbankclaret wrote:As an ex Labour door knocker.

It will be a much easier sell to be fair.

Selling a terrorist supporting anti army Marxist is going to be difficult on the doorstep.

Just glad I don’t have to even try.

I'd ask to see his season ticket to be honest as I wouldn't believe you.

ksrclaret wrote:Very true Sidney etc.

Everyone knows it's a slippery slope etc.

One moment you're borrowing your mate's ID to get into a club etc, the next you're committing voter fraud just like all your mates etc.

I know that was the road I ended up going down etc.

I'm sure many others on here too have a similar story etc.

Or opening bank accounts and committing other acts of financial fraud because we all know that's a thing

It's a good job fraud isn't already prevalent in our society.

We don't want foreign governments to influence our elections but we don't check that people voting are entitled to do so.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:Or opening bank accounts and committing other acts of financial fraud because we all know that's a thing

It's a good job fraud isn't already prevalent in our society.

We don't want foreign governments to influence our elections but we don't check that people voting are entitled to do so.

Since when is opening a bank account an act of financial fraud?

martin_p wrote:It’s not Jo Swinson’s ‘family business’ though is it. It’s an international organisation that her husband works for that won’t lose its funding just because the uk leaves the EU.

Mr Hames is the acting executive director of Transparency IntUK. According to its accounts on its own website, in 2018 Mr Hames’ company received £3,463,555 from the European Commission. Does Mrs Swinson have a vested interest in remaining in the EU?

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Lib Dem Leaders’ husband in massive EU cash payout storm

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Swinson fails to declare family company was given 3.5m euro by the European Union

https://nyebevannews.co.uk/swinson-fail ... ean-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'll let other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not.

Lowbankclaret wrote:You don’t need I.D. To register to vote.

Yeah I know that, but j also don't know the mechanism for when someone registers to vote.

I'd hope that when someone registers it's checked against official records like HMRC, births, deaths, UC etc to make sure that person exists.

ksrclaret wrote:Since when is opening a bank account an act of financial fraud?

You've got to be taking the ****?

Are you that naive about financial fraud?

RingoMcCartney wrote:Mr Hames is the acting executive director of Transparency IntUK. According to its accounts on its own website, in 2018 Mr Hames’ company received £3,463,555 from the European Commission. Does Mrs Swinson have a vested interest in remaining in the EU?

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Lib Dem Leaders’ husband in massive EU cash payout storm

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Swinson fails to declare family company was given 3.5m euro by the European Union

https://nyebevannews.co.uk/swinson-fail ... ean-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'll let other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not.

That's very kind of you, Ringo.

One problem I've spotted, though. Earlier on the thread you told us her family business had received it - "FACT"

So I don't think you are letting other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not

I think you're lying about that. And if you're lying about that, what else have you been lying about?

RingoMcCartney wrote:Mr Hames is the acting executive director of Transparency IntUK. According to its accounts on its own website, in 2018 Mr Hames’ company received £3,463,555 from the European Commission. Does Mrs Swinson have a vested interest in remaining in the EU?

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Lib Dem Leaders’ husband in massive EU cash payout storm

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Swinson fails to declare family company was given 3.5m euro by the European Union

https://nyebevannews.co.uk/swinson-fail ... ean-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'll let other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not.

Probably best that you do let other posters decide for themselves.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:Yeah I know that, but j also don't know the mechanism for when someone registers to vote.

I'd hope that when someone registers it's checked against official records like HMRC, births, deaths, UC etc to make sure that person exists.

Think you need to google .

Homeless voting form.

ksrclaret wrote:That's very kind of you, Ringo.

One problem I've spotted, though. Earlier on the thread you told us her family business had received it - "FACT"

So I don't think you are letting other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not

I think you're lying about that. And if you're lying about that, what else have you been lying about?

When he reads from sources that may be ever-so-slightly bias it's no wonder he struggles to find the truth is it?

RingoMcCartney wrote:Mr Hames is the acting executive director of Transparency IntUK. According to its accounts on its own website, in 2018 Mr Hames’ company received £3,463,555 from the European Commission. Does Mrs Swinson have a vested interest in remaining in the EU?

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Lib Dem Leaders’ husband in massive EU cash payout storm

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Swinson fails to declare family company was given 3.5m euro by the European Union

https://nyebevannews.co.uk/swinson-fail ... ean-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'll let other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not.

Those are the most credible sources of news you could find?

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:You've got to be taking the ****?

Are you that naive about financial fraud?

I suppose I must be naive. Teenagers are so cunning and evil but you never think of them being able to open up bank accounts. You could have knocked me down with a feather.

My specialty is voter fraud you see, I'm a reformed voter fraudster now though, I travel around the country talking to young people trying to steer them away from the dark path I found myself on.

I think it's working because the numbers of people committing voter fraud at the last election were ridiculously low.

TheFamilyCat wrote:Probably best that you do let other posters decide for themselves.

To be fair Nye Bevan has a reputation for opening the lid... think the Swanson story is extremely relevant.

ksrclaret wrote:I suppose I must be naive. Teenagers are so cunning and evil but you never think of them being able to open up bank accounts. You could have knocked me down with a feather.

My specialty is voter fraud you see, I'm a reformed voter fraudster now though, I travel around the country talking to young people trying to steer them away from the dark path I found myself on.

I think it's working because the numbers of people committing voter fraud at the last election were ridiculously low.

Good to know you're keeping yourself busy and honest

ksrclaret wrote:I suppose I must be naive. Teenagers are so cunning and evil but you never think of them being able to open up bank accounts. You could have knocked me down with a feather.

My specialty is voter fraud you see, I'm a reformed voter fraudster now though, I travel around the country talking to young people trying to steer them away from the dark path I found myself on.

I think it's working because the numbers of people committing voter fraud at the last election were ridiculously low.

It’s probably not even detected strangely enough when things aren’t detected it’s not a issue as people are unaware, doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen,it just means we don’t know for sure how big a problem it really is or if it is a problem.

The whip has been restored to 10 of the Tory rebels.

AndyClaret wrote:The whip has been restored to 10 of the Tory rebels.

AndyClaret wrote:The whip has been restored to 10 of the Tory rebels.

The flagellation party!

elwaclaret wrote:To be fair Nye Bevan has a reputation for opening the lid... think the Swanson story is extremely relevant.

I think it's relevant enough to be on the public domain. It's the claim that it is her "family business" which I struggle with.

elwaclaret wrote:Nigel Evans has his feet well and truly under the table in the Ribble Valley... he’s been useless as an MP since time immemorial. Offered nothing when I needed help while living in Read, even the letter offering absolutely nothing was written and signed by a secretary on his behalf.... just not interested. But safe as houses there, sadly.

I wrote to him recently and to be fair he responded in person and advised that he would be raising the issue with the PM. I guess I'll never know if he did or not....

ksrclaret wrote:That's very kind of you, Ringo.

One problem I've spotted, though. Earlier on the thread you told us her family business had received it - "FACT"

So I don't think you are letting other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not

I think you're lying about that. And if you're lying about that, what else have you been lying about?

Not sure Ringo got it correct.

It was 4 million euros paid to her husbands business.

Jo Swinson has offered no denial to this .

Chip Harrison wrote:Whats with "BoJo". Are you 14. Yet another post where working people want brexit, want the Tories in, and hope the only party on the side of the working people gets nowhere.
I can't wait to see this board when we leave with a crap deal, the Cabinet have all made millions put of brexit, and we have no medicines, food shortages and a government that will leave the working class to sort themselves out.

"BoJo". FFS!

Well, I lived in London during his 1st tenure as Mayor and he was roundly known ( by friend or foe ) as “BoJo”. As for your hysterical “ no medicines and food shortages” now that is 6th form common room rhetoric at its finest . I voted to remain ,though Boris’s /May’s “ supersoft” Brexit deal is actually so benign as to give a fairly decent economic view down the line .

RingoMcCartney wrote:Mr Hames is the acting executive director of Transparency IntUK. According to its accounts on its own website, in 2018 Mr Hames’ company received £3,463,555 from the European Commission. Does Mrs Swinson have a vested interest in remaining in the EU?

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Lib Dem Leaders’ husband in massive EU cash payout storm

https://unitynewsnetwork.co.uk/lib-dems-leader/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Swinson fails to declare family company was given 3.5m euro by the European Union

https://nyebevannews.co.uk/swinson-fail ... ean-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I'll let other posters decide whether jo swinsons family business received 3.5 million quid or not.

It’s not Jo Swinson’s family business.