Ben Gibson

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:32 am

The least cost effective transfer last season.

Surprised Vydra isn't on the list.

https://www.burnleyexpress.net/sport/fo ... 1-10084113" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Puts into perspective how expensive an insurance policy Gibson has been. Shame as I felt he could have taken us to the next level when we did sign him.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:35 am

Had we signed someone not as good and for less money then suffered injuries we would be hearing why did we sign someone so cheap typical Burnley not spending enough

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:38 am

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Had we signed someone not as good and for less money then suffered injuries we would be hearing why did we sign someone so cheap typical Burnley not spending enough

Absolutely. So a more sensible approach was needed that was somewhere in the middle.

For a club who constantly says how hard the market is and how frugal we have to be, as a backup player we would have been better looking at an experienced head on a free. Terry was available at the time. This summer it was Cahill (who has been excellent at Palace). And we know how much of an effect that sort of player has for teams like us. Look at Barton. And even the likes of Paul Robinson had a big impact.

When we are short in the first team (right back, centre mid, right mid) its poor that we spend so much on subs!

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:42 am

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Had we signed someone not as good and for less money then suffered injuries we would be hearing why did we sign someone so cheap typical Burnley not spending enough

I thought Long was that insurance policy ?

Longsidelenny · Post by **Longsidelenny** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:42 am

When I’ve seen Gibson playing for Middlesbrough looked quality when he gets dyche fit he will be a real asset to us keep smiling utc

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:43 am

BOYSIE31 wrote:I thought Long was that insurance policy ?

Don't get the point you are making

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:44 am

Its a while ago now so I'm not exactly sure about timings but was Gibson not signed when Ben Mee was refusing to sign a new contract ?
If that was the case can you imagine the meltdown on this board if Mee would have left or run his contract down and we didn't have a quality replacement waiting in the wings.
Cahill was rumoured to be asking for £100k a week btw and as much as I think he would have been good for us he has not played as well as I expected for Palace this season and he is not going to get any better at his age.

Its definitely a case of "damned if you do and damned if you don't" with our fans when it comes to transfers.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:51 am

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Don't get the point you are making

Ha you know damn well about my point

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:53 am

BOYSIE31 wrote:Ha you know damn well about my point

I don't, that is why I said what I did. Are you saying we have the cheaper not as good version in Long ? If so then surely we had to sign someone better.

You could just explain what you meant, remember very few if any are on your wavelength

Winstonswhite · Post by **Winstonswhite** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:56 am

You need to have back up for every position that is able to come in and do just as well- and when given the chance keep his place. Gibson is just that and at 15 million, very good value.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:57 am

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:I don't, that is why I said what I did. Are you saying we have the cheaper not as good version in Long ? If so then surely we had to sign someone better.

You could just explain what you meant, remember very few if any are on your wavelength

No need to spend and could have gone elswhere - he has started 1 game in the league in a season and a half - by the way i think he is a quality player who should now be given a chance - if its not this saturday then its never going to happen and im not talking about covering for injuries either.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:01 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:No need to spend and could have gone elswhere - he has started 1 game in the league in a season and a half - by the way i think he is a quality player who should now be given a chance - if its not this saturday then its never going to happen and im not talking about covering for injuries either.

So someone who has moaned a lot about lack of cover in midfield wanted to go into a season with 3 centre halfs ?

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:02 pm

TVC15 wrote:Its a while ago now so I'm not exactly sure about timings but was Gibson not signed when Ben Mee was refusing to sign a new contract ?

Ben Mee was never refusing to sign a contract

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:04 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:So someone who has moaned a lot about lack of cover in midfield wanted to go into a season with 3 centre halfs ?

We had Dunne as well

Texanclaret16 · Post by **Texanclaret16** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:08 pm

Only way Gibson starts this weekend is if we change formation or there is an injury to mee or tarks. It’s a shame for him that our two most consistent players IMO have been in front of him.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:11 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:We had Dunne as well

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:12 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Ben Mee was never refusing to sign a contract

Ok - was he not negotiating his contract ?
I thought there was a genuine risk that he might leave - it would seem a logical reason for spending £15m on Gibson that the club thought there may be a risk that Mee would not sign or that Tarks could be sold if a big offer came in.

Fair enough if not - most of us are only guessing at this stuff !

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:12 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:

Why funny ? spending 15 million on a 4 th or 5 th centre half certainly isnt.

For a club who has to spend wisely is madness.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:14 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:Why funny ? spending 15 million on a 4 th or 5 th centre half certainly isnt

You have Gibson behind Long & Dunne ? Stupid thing is you are actually serious too

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:14 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:Why funny ? spending 15 million on a 4 th or 5 th centre half certainly isnt

Its a good job we didn't then - our 4th and 5th centre halfs were both free transfers.
Does that make you feel better ?

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:15 pm

Winstonswhite wrote:You need to have back up for every position that is able to come in and do just as well- and when given the chance keep his place. Gibson is just that and at 15 million, very good value.

very good value is very debatable given game time.

15m on Gibson?

We were linked with but unwilling to pay for Hakim Ziyech around that time who went to Ajax for £10m.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:17 pm

Ziyech went to Ajax two years before we signed Gibson.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:18 pm

TVC15 wrote:Its a while ago now so I'm not exactly sure about timings but was Gibson not signed when Ben Mee was refusing to sign a new contract ?
If that was the case can you imagine the meltdown on this board if Mee would have left or run his contract down and we didn't have a quality replacement waiting in the wings.
Cahill was rumoured to be asking for £100k a week btw and as much as I think he would have been good for us he has not played as well as I expected for Palace this season and he is not going to get any better at his age.

Its definitely a case of "damned if you do and damned if you don't" with our fans when it comes to transfers.

Cahill and Terry would obviously be the top end of such a market. However even Terry was 'only' on 70k a week.

£3.5m for a season.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:19 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:very good value is very debatable given game time.

15m on Gibson?

We were linked with but unwilling to pay for Hakim Ziyech around that time who went to Ajax for £10m.

We were willing to pay it for Ziyech but he chose Ajax, didn't Garlick even come out at the time and say so

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:20 pm

Tall Paul wrote:Ziyech went to Ajax two years before we signed Gibson.

Fair point. Thought it was the year prior.

But point remains. There are bargains out there that would be far better calculated risks.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:21 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:very good value is very debatable given game time.

15m on Gibson?

We were linked with but unwilling to pay for Hakim Ziyech around that time who went to Ajax for £10m.

And what a signing he would have been eh

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:23 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:You have Gibson behind Long & Dunne ? Stupid thing is you are actually serious too

No but was the last through the door - its obvious if i said black was black some people on here would say no white.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:24 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:No but was the last through the door - its obvious if i said black was black some people on here would say no white.

Reading this reply I now get why you are so confused by things.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:29 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:No but was the last through the door - its obvious if i said black was black some people on here would say no white.

That's hilarious.
When Juventus signed Ronaldo do you think he had to train with the 3rd team because he was "last through the door" ?

Do you really think people would pull you up on your posts if you didn't post so much ridiculous crap ?

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:30 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:Reading this reply I now get why you are so confused by things.

Your a strange fellow at times - why cant you just say that sometimes my wonderful club with my wonderful manager have got things wrong

The excuses are already airing for january

https://www.lancs.live/sport/football/t ... y-17209430" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:36 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:Your a strange fellow at times - why cant you just say that sometimes my wonderful club with my wonderful manager have got things wrong

The excuses are already airing for january

https://www.lancs.live/sport/football/t ... y-17209430" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

More than happy to say when something is wrong. As for being strange have you read the article you have linked ( you will have as this kind of site is aimed at people like you) what excuse is he airing and what is he excusing ?

Just slow down and before pressing enter read some of the dross you put on here

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:41 pm

Confirmation (if needed) that Boysie is a full blown melon head.

blake's wand · Post by **blake's wand** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:43 pm

I think Mee and Tarks have actually been pretty poor the last few weeks - if this continues for another week, Gibson should really get a chance

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:47 pm

blake's wand wrote:I think Mee and Tarks have actually been pretty poor the last few weeks - if this continues for another week, Gibson should really get a chance

sssshhh you cant say that on here

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:49 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:More than happy to say when something is wrong. As for being strange have you read the article you have linked ( you will have as this kind of site is aimed at people like you) what excuse is he airing and what is he excusing ?

Just slow down and before pressing enter read some of the dross you put on here

Can you read ??? its the same dribble rolled out before any transfer window and then again at the end but dont let that put you off.

jedi_master · Post by **jedi_master** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 12:57 pm

At the time the signing made sense - nobody on here was anything but chuffed we signed him.

Reality is he has two of the best centre backs Burnley have had in the last 30-40 years in front of him, and he is not as good as them. I personally think it's unprecedented that we have managed to keep Mee and Tarkowksi (especially) as long as we have, and the fact they have both signed new contracts since we signed Gibson shows they aren't imminently going. Indeed, Mee (Gibson's real competition as both left footed) is now 30 and will probably see out his best days with us.

Gibson is nearing 27 and you would imagine is thoroughly naffed off at Burnley. My big concern is that this is the 2nd year of his contract and he is nowhere near our first 11. We cannot allow someone who cost so much to sit nosediving in value for too long, and certainly cannot let him see out his deal here and leave for free (as, let's be honest, it would be madness to think he would sign a new contract with us).

I would be happy to sell him next summer in the circumstances, in fact, I think it would be prudent to do so. What I find strange is people calling him a 'bad signing', he clearly was a great option for us that summer and one the club was applauded for sorting at the time. Sometimes signings don't work out but the club wasn't wrong to sign him in the first place. Similar to Robbie Brady, we all thought "What a signing" that January - is it the clubs fault it hasn't gone as we hoped?

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:00 pm

jedi_master wrote:At the time the signing made sense - nobody on here was anything but chuffed we signed him.

Reality is he has two of the best centre backs Burnley have had in the last 30-40 years in front of him, and he is not as good as them. I personally think it's unprecedented that we have managed to keep Mee and Tarkowksi (especially) as long as we have, and the fact they have both signed new contracts since we signed Gibson shows they aren't imminently going. Indeed, Mee (Gibson's real competition as both left footed) is now 30 and will probably see out his best days with us.

Gibson is nearing 27 and you would imagine is thoroughly naffed off at Burnley. My big concern is that this is the 2nd year of his contract and he is nowhere near our first 11. We cannot allow someone who cost so much to sit nosediving in value for too long, and certainly cannot let him see out his deal here and leave for free (as, let's be honest, it would be madness to think he would sign a new contract with us).

I would be happy to sell him next summer in the circumstances, in fact, I think it would be prudent to do so. What I find strange is people calling him a 'bad signing', he clearly was a great option for us that summer and one the club was applauded for sorting at the time. Sometimes signings don't work out but the club wasn't wrong to sign him in the first place. Similar to Robbie Brady, we all thought "What a signing" that January - is it the clubs fault it hasn't gone as we hoped?

Great post that

Cleveleys_claret · Post by **Cleveleys_claret** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:03 pm

Not a problem with either Mee or Tarks who I think are both good at what they do. But I do think that Gibson should still be getting 10 plus games a season to freshen up the defence. Be it through a drop in form or just to rotate things and give us a different dimension.

Our problem lies in the lack of rotation. It is a policy which has kept us up for a while so cant knock Dyche for it. Its just not what I would do as these signing like Gibson and Vydra lose all their value and when called upon arent 100% with the system. I am not saying rotate every week...just use the squad a little more

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:06 pm

Exactly this Jedi

Damned if you do and damned if you don’t.
Who would have know that some transfers don’t work out eh ?!!
We would never have signed Arfield, Jones, Heaton, Barnes and even the likes of McNeil as a young lad (and many more players) if they were all as good as they ended up at Burnley....in the same way some people who you sign where you are paying decent money end up not turning out as you planned.
That’s the way it goes for every club and it’s simply a case of hoping / or trying to make sure that you have more good transfers than bad. If you have a season when everything goes wrong with injuries, suspensions and transfer signings then you are probably going to get relegated...and that’s what has happened to many clubs who thought they were either too good to go down or who like Stoke and West Brom thought they were cementing a place in the league.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:07 pm

jedi_master wrote:At the time the signing made sense - nobody on here was anything but chuffed we signed him.

Reality is he has two of the best centre backs Burnley have had in the last 30-40 years in front of him, and he is not as good as them. I personally think it's unprecedented that we have managed to keep Mee and Tarkowksi (especially) as long as we have, and the fact they have both signed new contracts since we signed Gibson shows they aren't imminently going. Indeed, Mee (Gibson's real competition as both left footed) is now 30 and will probably see out his best days with us.

Gibson is nearing 27 and you would imagine is thoroughly naffed off at Burnley. My big concern is that this is the 2nd year of his contract and he is nowhere near our first 11. We cannot allow someone who cost so much to sit nosediving in value for too long, and certainly cannot let him see out his deal here and leave for free (as, let's be honest, it would be madness to think he would sign a new contract with us).

I would be happy to sell him next summer in the circumstances, in fact, I think it would be prudent to do so. What I find strange is people calling him a 'bad signing', he clearly was a great option for us that summer and one the club was applauded for sorting at the time. Sometimes signings don't work out but the club wasn't wrong to sign him in the first place. Similar to Robbie Brady, we all thought "What a signing" that January - is it the clubs fault it hasn't gone as we hoped?

You know you are allowed to change the team now and then ??

We have conceded quite a few goals this season and the 2 you name have made quite a few errors leading to those goals so why not give Gibson a chance ?

Is it that our manager is too stubborn ???

Cleveleys_claret · Post by **Cleveleys_claret** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:10 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Ben Mee was never refusing to sign a contract

I see you put this on every time this is debated. Were you in the negotiations? No matter how much you know about the club there is no way that you can 100% state such a thing. There is no way on gods green earth that we would spend 15m on a 3rd choice centre half unless there was a little doubt in the back of the minds of the manager and board that Mee may not sign.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:11 pm

TVC15 wrote:Its a while ago now so I'm not exactly sure about timings but was Gibson not signed when Ben Mee was refusing to sign a new contract ?
If that was the case can you imagine the meltdown on this board if Mee would have left or run his contract down and we didn't have a quality replacement waiting in the wings.
Cahill was rumoured to be asking for £100k a week btw and as much as I think he would have been good for us he has not played as well as I expected for Palace this season and he is not going to get any better at his age.

Its definitely a case of "damned if you do and damned if you don't" with our fans when it comes to transfers.

I think you are right about the timing of the Gibson signing. I remain utterly convinced this was a Mee replacement signing, but he ended up signing on again. Someone will be along in a minute to state that Mee wasn’t going anywhere... but I’d be surprised if anyone really swallows that.
With the way our transfer policy has been, to spend what we did on cover when Long has proved himself at the very least adequate, was just a bit daft to me. We are Burnley, we DO NOT spend double figures millions for bench warmers, we barely spend that on first team players, and that’s why I think the way I do about this signing.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:15 pm

bobinho wrote:I think you are right about the timing of the Gibson signing. I remain utterly convinced this was a Mee replacement signing, but he ended up signing on again. Someone will be along in a minute to state that Mee wasn’t going anywhere... but I’d be surprised if anyone really swallows that.
With the way our transfer policy has been, to spend what we did on cover when Long has proved himself at the very least adequate, was just a bit daft to me. We are Burnley, we DO NOT spend double figures millions for bench warmers, we barely spend that on first team players, and that’s why I think the way I do about this signing.

Try and get that into claretonthecoasts head

But i bet they both signed around the same time

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:15 pm

Cleveleys_claret wrote:I see you put this on every time this is debated. Were you in the negotiations? No matter how much you know about the club there is no way that you can 100% state such a thing. There is no way on gods green earth that we would spend 15m on a 3rd choice centre half unless there was a little doubt in the back of the minds of the manager and board that Mee may not sign.

He puts it there because it is true. Just because it doesn't fit with an agenda doesn't make it not true.

jrgbfc · Post by **jrgbfc** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:15 pm

TVC15 wrote:Its a while ago now so I'm not exactly sure about timings but was Gibson not signed when Ben Mee was refusing to sign a new contract ?
If that was the case can you imagine the meltdown on this board if Mee would have left or run his contract down and we didn't have a quality replacement waiting in the wings.
Cahill was rumoured to be asking for £100k a week btw and as much as I think he would have been good for us he has not played as well as I expected for Palace this season and he is not going to get any better at his age.

Its definitely a case of "damned if you do and damned if you don't" with our fans when it comes to transfers.

That seemed to be the case but its denied by plenty on here.

Cleveleys_claret · Post by **Cleveleys_claret** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:18 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:He puts it there because it is true. Just because it doesn't fit with an agenda doesn't make it not true.

There is no agenda. Just unless CT is his agent how does he know what has/hasnt been discussed in a contract meeting. Anybody can come out of a meeting like that and tell someone what they want to hear but there is no way to prove/disprove what was said.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:20 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:He puts it there because it is true. Just because it doesn't fit with an agenda doesn't make it not true.

Tbf it’s semantics
If you are “negotiating” a new contract for as long as Ben Mee was then it’s pretty likely that at some point Mee was refusing what we were putting in front of him.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:21 pm

Cleveleys_claret wrote:There is no agenda. Just unless CT is his agent how does he know what has/hasnt been discussed in a contract meeting. Anybody can come out of a meeting like that and tell someone what they want to hear but there is no way to prove/disprove what was said.

There are other people out there who knew all along what was going on with Ben, if someone wants to still believe that he was stalling or wanting to move on that is their choice, they are wrong but also entitled to be wrong.

claretonthecoast1882 · Post by **claretonthecoast1882** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:22 pm

TVC15 wrote:Tbf it’s semantics
If you are “negotiating” a new contract for as long as Ben Mee was then it’s pretty likely that at some point Mee was refusing what we were putting in front of him.

It was done some time before being announced

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Nov 07, 2019 1:25 pm

[quote="claretonthecoast1882"]It was done some time before being announced[/quote

You seem to know a lot about it.
Care to enlighten us all.
Are you saying that this was all done quickly and amicably ? We made him a contract offer and he accepted it straight away with no push back ?
And then we chose to announce it a lot later ?
And we bought a £15m centre back after he had signed or before ?