BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by ClaretAndJew » Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:48 pm

I actually do want us to spend 200 million on one player and pay him 300k a week.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by MACCA » Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:57 pm

ClaretMov wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:47 pm
We aren't asking the club to spend 40 million on a player or to pay someone 120k a week, but what most of us want for the club to do is to bring in players that are first team player's and not bench warmers, something we haven't done for three years, even when we qualified for Europe we didn't improve the starting xl, this team has picked itself since the summer of 2017.
We dont buy players first 11 ready, who was the last player that came in started and nailed down a starting position as their own?

SD doesnt rotate, players usually only get a chance through injury, and even then sometimes they're then dropped again regardless of performance.

The reason none seem to be first 11 quality is that they've gone backwards since signing, whether thsts attitude, lack of game time, who's infront of them, or not impressed enough when given their brief chance.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by TsarBomba » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:02 pm

For those that have signed up to The Athletic, and if you haven’t already, then you should read their article- ‘What Really Happens In The Transfer Window’.

It’s ******* obscene.

Double dealing, families demanding payment because they drove little Jimmy to football practice for years, players expecting clubs to step in and pay for their divorce bills. Houses. Cars. The list is endless.

Yeah, football is grubby business, I get it. But I’d hate for us to stoop to this level, or jump in bed with Jorge Mendes.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Long Time Lurker » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:04 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:44 pm
You’ve clearly made your mind up that Rigg isn’t performing? On that basis of what?

You’re evidencing our struggles over last 2 and a bit windows, and attributing that solely to Rigg. We all know it’s been an issue for a lot longer.
I think our recruitment pror to the arrival of Rigg was okay, nothing spectacular, but we were definitely getting by. It was dropping off in terms of general effectiveness, but we recognised that and made a move to put us on an upward curve.

Putting aside the impact Rigg has had on other clubs, let us simply address what seems to be our new approach to this window. Namely, the active intention to do nothing other than react. It is only recently that we have started hearing about how impossibly difficult it is to do any business in the Winter window. That coincided with the arrival of Rigg.

In contrast we can look at what we did in previous Winter windows, which you suggest has been an issue for us.

18/19

Peter Crouch ( Free Transfer )

17/18

Aaron Lennon

Georges Kevin N'kouodu ( Loan )

16/17

Robbie Brady
Ashley Westwood

Joey Barton ( No Club )
Harry Flowers ( Youth )

15/16

James Tarkowski

Lloyd Dyer ( No Club )
Paul Robinson ( No Club )
George Green ( Youth )

14/15

Michael Keane

Fredrik Ulvestad ( No Club )

13/14

Ashley Barnes

Chris Baird ( No Club )
Micah Evans ( Youth )

As far as I can see we have done some really good business in the Winter windows and the transfer that haven't really worked out have been the relatively low cost ones. Looking at those signings I think we have regressed in the last two Winter windows and what we did in the Summer was woefully inadequate.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:15 pm

So woeful we are sat on 30 points in January?? I take it you don’t work because you’ve made a full time occupation of over dissecting gossip and tittle tattle 90%+ of which has no truth in it whatsoever.

I think they’ll be a couple of things drop, in and out before the end of the week. Until we officially hear from the club I wouldn’t advise getting too stressed about it.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by TsarBomba » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:23 pm

Long Time Lurker wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:04 pm
Namely, the active intention to do nothing other than react. It is only recently that we have started hearing about how impossibly difficult it is to do any business in the Winter window. That coincided with the arrival of Rigg.
January windows are now increasingly difficult for everyone. That’s a fact. I don’t think our overly cautious approach is too different to a lot of clubs now. There is an obvious trend of trying to loan players instead of buying.

There is clearly less business being done this year, and there isn’t the domino effect anymore that triggers a landslide of moves.

Clubs are holding onto players, because they know it will be difficult to replace them, and it’s drying up the market.

Not unless you throw an obscene amount of money at a player/club/agent are you going to be successful in January anymore.

That’s the reality for everyone, not just Burnley.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by summitclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:50 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:23 pm
January windows are now increasingly difficult for everyone. That’s a fact. I don’t think our overly cautious approach is too different to a lot of clubs now. There is an obvious trend of trying to loan players instead of buying.

There is clearly less business being done this year, and there isn’t the domino effect anymore that triggers a landslide of moves.

Clubs are holding onto players, because they know it will be difficult to replace them, and it’s drying up the market.

Not unless you throw an obscene amount of money at a player/club/agent are you going to be successful in January anymore.

That’s the reality for everyone, not just Burnley.
Even more reason to have sorted cm last summer or the summer before

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by agreenwood » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:53 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:23 pm
January windows are now increasingly difficult for everyone. That’s a fact. I don’t think our overly cautious approach is too different to a lot of clubs now. There is an obvious trend of trying to loan players instead of buying.

There is clearly less business being done this year, and there isn’t the domino effect anymore that triggers a landslide of moves.

Clubs are holding onto players, because they know it will be difficult to replace them, and it’s drying up the market.

Not unless you throw an obscene amount of money at a player/club/agent are you going to be successful in January anymore.

That’s the reality for everyone, not just Burnley.
To be fair, club officials bill every window as difficult.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Tall Paul » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:54 pm

Long Time Lurker wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:04 pm
I think our recruitment pror to the arrival of Rigg was okay, nothing spectacular, but we were definitely getting by. It was dropping off in terms of general effectiveness, but we recognised that and made a move to put us on an upward curve.

Putting aside the impact Rigg has had on other clubs, let us simply address what seems to be our new approach to this window. Namely, the active intention to do nothing other than react. It is only recently that we have started hearing about how impossibly difficult it is to do any business in the Winter window. That coincided with the arrival of Rigg.

In contrast we can look at what we did in previous Winter windows, which you suggest has been an issue for us.

18/19

Peter Crouch ( Free Transfer )

17/18

Aaron Lennon

Georges Kevin N'kouodu ( Loan )

16/17

Robbie Brady
Ashley Westwood

Joey Barton ( No Club )
Harry Flowers ( Youth )

15/16

James Tarkowski

Lloyd Dyer ( No Club )
Paul Robinson ( No Club )
George Green ( Youth )

14/15

Michael Keane

Fredrik Ulvestad ( No Club )

13/14

Ashley Barnes

Chris Baird ( No Club )
Micah Evans ( Youth )

As far as I can see we have done some really good business in the Winter windows and the transfer that haven't really worked out have been the relatively low cost ones. Looking at those signings I think we have regressed in the last two Winter windows and what we did in the Summer was woefully inadequate.
It was easier for us to buy players to improve the squad when the squad wasn't as good as it is now. Who'd have thought?
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by TsarBomba » Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:57 pm

summitclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:50 pm
Even more reason to have sorted cm last summer or the summer before
You could argue we did with the arrival DD.

Had he been successful, that loan may have been extended or made permanent.

Instead, we’ve been left in the lurch.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by summitclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:08 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 1:57 pm
You could argue we did with the arrival DD.

Had he been successful, that loan may have been extended or made permanent.

Instead, we’ve been left in the lurch.
You could but as always its outcomes that matter and we have not cracked it again. I really hope the issue with the Philips was his wage demands and not a few million in the fee. I get the former as we have a wage structure.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by IanMcL » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:20 pm

mdd2 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:41 pm
"And remember Wigan?
Won the FA cup and got relegated, dont want to be them either".

Well that can't happen to us this season, well the first bit at least
It can to Aston Villa, albeit League Cup.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:42 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:41 am
I know, you need to explain this to Rob. I was just showing how his example doesn't work and that there really is no benefit or advantage to a team offering a penny more than the £7m release clause fee to Bristol City
That wouldn't apply if say for example 2 teams are going head to head, toe to toe vying for the same players signature & offering the identical sum of money, then a further incentive would be applicable, I'm not implying this is the case with the Bristol City player.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by jojomk1 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:50 pm

MACCA wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:57 pm
We dont buy players first 11 ready, who was the last player that came in started and nailed down a starting position as their own?

SD doesnt rotate, players usually only get a chance through injury, and even then sometimes they're then dropped again regardless of performance.

The reason none seem to be first 11 quality is that they've gone backwards since signing, whether thsts attitude, lack of game time, who's infront of them, or not impressed enough when given their brief chance.
Not exactly a ringing endorsement of SD's "proactive" approach to signings ;)

SD has final say in which players we go for - no issue with that as he, eventually picks the side into which they have to blend

Garlick then takes over the reigns in terms of negotiations (I presume wages, length of contract as well as transfer fee). You could therefore understand if there is some frustration on MG's part when he gets 'big" deals over the line, eg Gibson and Vydra (players who Dyche would have initially agreed to), but sees little or no return on this substantial outlay. Maybe this, in some way, explains the alleged protracted dealings with Bristol City for Brownhill

The position of Rigg is intriguing. Interviewed by both Garlick and Dyche, he will have had parameters set down to him by both as far as recruitment is concerned. MG's will be based mainly on financials whilst SD will be stressing quality and physical attributes.

If those two agenda's don't line up whose side does Rigg sit on.

Or, should he, and his team, make sure they find the right people at the right price - there are some out there (the Kosovan guy being an example as bought by Fenerbache for £2m and now asking £25m less than 12 months later )

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Vegas Claret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:01 pm

we all know what will happen, we'll get the usual "January is a difficult window" and then hear the same line in summer. At some point, whenever they choose that to be, they will have to buy some players whatever division we end up in.

We all know what happened last time we went down when we all screamed that we needed an extra midfielder in the January window - we didn't sign one and Marney got injured in the very next game away at Villa
Last edited by Vegas Claret on Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:06 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:42 pm

That wouldn't apply if say for example 2 teams are going head to head, toe to toe vying for the same players signature & offering the identical sum of money, then a further incentive would be applicable, I'm not implying this is the case with the Bristol City player.
You've absolutely lost me and I've no idea what you're disagreeing with me about but my point is that where there are multiple teams competing for a player the price will not be pushed up beyond that of what the release clause is set at.

Offering Bristol City more than £7m is absolutely pointless, has no benefit and is actually counterproductive

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:21 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:06 pm
You've absolutely lost me and I've no idea what you're disagreeing with me about but my point is that where there are multiple teams competing for a player the price will not be pushed up beyond that of what the release clause is set at.

Offering Bristol City more than £7m is absolutely pointless, has no benefit and is actually counterproductive
I'm not disagreeing, but you are demonstrating a naivety within the concept of how the transfer market functions, a release clause when triggered is simply a prelude upon the first stage of embarking upon negotiations, an admission you are willing to meet the figure set (similar to a eBay reserve limit) & the price can easily sky north & often does when multiple interest is apparent.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by SGr » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:23 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:01 pm
we all know what will happen, we'll get the usual "January is a difficult window" and then hear the same line in summer. At some point, whenever they choose that to be, they will have to buy some players whatever division we end up in.

We all know what happened last time we went down when we all screamed that we needed an extra midfielder in the January window - we didn't sign one and Marney got injured in the very next game away at Villa
Was just thinking about the Marney incident actually. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t rate Cork at all these day but he is still an undesputed starter. I’m sure if he gets injured that £3m or whatever it was that we’ve saved by not paying the asking price will be worth it...

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by jojomk1 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:31 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:06 pm
You've absolutely lost me and I've no idea what you're disagreeing with me about but my point is that where there are multiple teams competing for a player the price will not be pushed up beyond that of what the release clause is set at.

Offering Bristol City more than £7m is absolutely pointless, has no benefit and is actually counterproductive
Just to add to this

Possible scenario - Villa, Norwich and Bournemouth all interested in Brownhill to help them avoid relegation (where they will lose many millions if down to the Championship the following season)

They all know they can get him for £7m in the summer, but for one or other that could be too late

Are you really suggesting that none should pay more to get the deal done (avoid relegation and reap the financial rewards of another season in the Prem - those additional rewards being far beyond the extra few mill to get the deal done)

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by FactualFrank » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:33 pm

The agent of Vedat Muriqi...

“Muriqi has a four-year contract agreement with Fenerbahce, we are of course delighted that some of the top clubs in Europe are interested in Muriqi and scouting him.

“But we are not considering a transfer in January there is a zero percent chance he leaves.

https://www.lancs.live/sport/football/t ... i-17652580

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:36 pm

jojomk1 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:31 pm
Just to add to this

Possible scenario - Villa, Norwich and Bournemouth all interested in Brownhill to help them avoid relegation (where they will lose many millions if down to the Championship the following season)

They all know they can get him for £7m in the summer, but for one or other that could be too late

Are you really suggesting that none should pay more to get the deal done (avoid relegation and reap the financial rewards of another season in the Prem - those additional rewards being far beyond the extra few mill to get the deal done)
To simplify what I was trying to explain to DA if multiple teams trigger the SAME release clause for the SAME player it becomes a auction, obviously the player then as to work out who he can agree favourable terms with.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by MACCA » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:36 pm

jojomk1 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:50 pm
Not exactly a ringing endorsement of SD's "proactive" approach to signings ;)

SD has final say in which players we go for - no issue with that as he, eventually picks the side into which they have to blend

Garlick then takes over the reigns in terms of negotiations (I presume wages, length of contract as well as transfer fee). You could therefore understand if there is some frustration on MG's part when he gets 'big" deals over the line, eg Gibson and Vydra (players who Dyche would have initially agreed to), but sees little or no return on this substantial outlay. Maybe this, in some way, explains the alleged protracted dealings with Bristol City for Brownhill

The position of Rigg is intriguing. Interviewed by both Garlick and Dyche, he will have had parameters set down to him by both as far as recruitment is concerned. MG's will be based mainly on financials whilst SD will be stressing quality and physical attributes.
That's the way we work, we try and get the conveyor belt working, like Heaton - Pope , Ward - Taylor and Keane - Tarky etc

That method is fine when the player waiting in the wings is, young, cheap, stepping up league/wages wise and unproven at the level in question.
They learn the ropes, the player infron leaves/injured and they step in.

The issue starts when we try it with already established pros, ones hitting their peak, and have cost a big fee like Vydra and Gibson.

They wont wait around for a chance as long, they want to be playing and we can't afford for them to go backwards and write of the fees/wages.

You could argue ( theres been zero proof ) they add depth to the squad, but at what cost?
Do they add depth?
Are they capable of filling in?

However by improving the starting 11, you automatically improve the team and squad at the same time.
You then can afford to allow the out going player to sit and bide his time, go backwards or take a hit on their fees/wages as you've moved forwards.

It's no secret we've not improved the starting 11 for 3, 4 maybe more windows, and its probably been 4 seasons since a signed player has been first team ready, been given an instant chance, and has gone into the team and got a run of games.

That's not how SD works it seems, however that could be down to not getting the players he wants in , meaning 3rd, 4th or 5th option isnt good enough.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:41 pm

jojomk1 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:31 pm
Just to add to this

Possible scenario - Villa, Norwich and Bournemouth all interested in Brownhill to help them avoid relegation (where they will lose many millions if down to the Championship the following season)

They all know they can get him for £7m in the summer, but for one or other that could be too late

Are you really suggesting that none should pay more to get the deal done (avoid relegation and reap the financial rewards of another season in the Prem - those additional rewards being far beyond the extra few mill to get the deal done)
No not at all. I think it is well worth paying an extra few million this window if we can secure him now for both the reasons of what he can add this season and to stop the risk of other teams coming in for him in the summer who can out bid us in terms of wages.

What I was arguing is that once it gets to summer the price will not go beyond £7m regardless of how many clubs are in for him. All clubs will offer £7m and the bidding war will be about the signing on fee and wages offered to the player. A poster suggested they could be a bidding war in the summer that will mean the price goes up to £10m anyhow but that wont happen

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Reckoner » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:42 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:36 pm
To simplify what I was trying to explain to DA if multiple teams trigger the SAME release clause for the SAME player it becomes a auction, obviously the player then as to work out who he can agree favourable terms with.
No it doesn't. It becomes a choice for the player between any clubs that have agreed to pay the contractually agreed amount in the structure allowed - the club has no say once the clause value is met. You are talking rubbish.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by claretdj » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:45 pm

We need a new right back, new central mid, new right winger MINIMUM in the next 2 days, so pull your fingers out dyche n co!

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:46 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:21 pm
I'm not disagreeing, but you are demonstrating a naivety within the concept of how the transfer market functions, a release clause when triggered is simply a prelude upon the first stage of embarking upon negotiations, an admission you are willing to meet the figure set (similar to a eBay reserve limit) & the price can easily sky north & often does when multiple interest is apparent.
Nope the price will not sky north as you put it cos once you've met the release clause fee thats the negotiations completed with the club. All further negotiations and bidding wars will be around the wages and overall package offered to the player and not impact the £7m fee one iota.

I cant believe ive had this conversation about 5 or 6 times now as the point seems pretty basic

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Tall Paul » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:46 pm

MACCA wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:36 pm
It's no secret we've not improved the starting 11 for 3, 4 maybe more windows, and its probably been 4 seasons since a signed player has been first team ready, been given an instant chance, and has gone into the team and got a run of games.

That's not how SD works it seems, however that could be down to not getting the players he wants in , meaning 3rd, 4th or 5th option isnt good enough.
Or it could be because if a player is good enough to improve our starting 11, their transfer fee and/or wages are outside our budget.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:52 pm

Reckoner wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:42 pm
No it doesn't. It becomes a choice for the player between any clubs that have agreed to pay the contractually agreed amount in the structure allowed - the club has no say once the clause value is met. You are talking rubbish.
Ultimately the player is then forced to pick from say x or y or z, (eg 3 clubs to simplify again) the club is obliged to inform the player which clubs have trigged the release clause, are you trying to imply this information is standard practice to conceal? If any club is more than willing to pay a premium (more than the others) it’s standard practice then to offset the departure on more favourable terms, golden handshake call it what you want, & chances are he’ll go to that club, stands to logical reason if a club is willing to pay a premium it’s pole position for an enhanced contract.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Taffy on the wing » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:52 pm

All is Dross!

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Vegas Claret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:53 pm

claretdj wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:45 pm
We need a new right back, new central mid, new right winger MINIMUM in the next 2 days, so pull your fingers out dyche n co!
we've needed them for the last 2-3 years (maybe not a right back to be fair to Lowton). Zero chance of us signing 3 players

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Sleeping Cat » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:57 pm

FactualFrank wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:33 pm
The agent of Vedat Muriqi...

“Muriqi has a four-year contract agreement with Fenerbahce, we are of course delighted that some of the top clubs in Europe are interested in Muriqi and scouting him.

“But we are not considering a transfer in January there is a zero percent chance he leaves.

https://www.lancs.live/sport/football/t ... i-17652580

A player no one in the premier league had heard before are now aware of him because his agent (probably) pulled a few clubs out of a hat and leaked a story about them looking at this client. Parent club ask what's going on, he issues statement saying player V happy there and they are happy too. Agent's mission complete.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by FactualFrank » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:58 pm

Sleeping Cat wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:57 pm
A player no one in the premier league had heard before are now aware of him because his agent (probably) pulled a few clubs out of a hat and leaked a story about them looking at this client. Parent club ask what's going on, he issues statement saying player V happy there and they are happy too. Agent's mission complete.
Quite probable.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:59 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:46 pm
Nope the price will not sky north as you put it cos once you've met the release clause fee thats the negotiations completed with the club. All further negotiations and bidding wars will be around the wages and overall package offered to the player and not impact the £7m fee one iota.

I cant believe ive had this conversation about 5 or 6 times now as the point seems pretty basic
It won’t, that’s a separate issue regarding once the release clause as been triggered, you seem wedded to the notion that it’s solely inclusive to 1 club & 1 fixed price & that’s the notion you need in my view to divorce yourself from. It’s common sense that the highest bidder will be favourable to secure the signature without the RC limit forget the RC that’s already been smashed, he’s off for the medical :lol:

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:04 pm

claretdj wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:45 pm
We need a new right back, new central mid, new right winger MINIMUM in the next 2 days, so pull your fingers out dyche n co!
In this window;

1) we won’t sign a rb when we currently employ two. One or both will leave in the summer and a new one/two signed.

2) won’t signed a new right winger until one leaves and JBG is now ready to return (hopefully for rest of season).

3) Brownhill/ Allen could well be in the summer too.

What happens if we don’t sign anyone? The squad we have is more than capable of the 6-10 points from 14 games. This season so far we are averaging 1.25 points per game. No reason apart from bed wetting and panicking unnecessarily that this shouldn’t be achieved.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Reckoner » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:05 pm

You can keep trying you'd probably just be better off admitting you got it wrong. Don't worry about it there's lots of nonsense written on here.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Sleeping Cat » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:06 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:59 pm
It won’t, that’s a separate issue regarding once the release clause as been triggered, you seem wedded to the notion that it’s solely inclusive to 1 club & 1 fixed price & that’s the notion you need in my view to divorce yourself from. It’s common sense that the highest bidder will be favourable to secure the signature without the RC limit forget the RC that’s already been smashed, he’s off for the medical :lol:
Sorry Jakubclaret, a release clause is contractual. If someone meet it, the player is free to discuss terms with that club. if two clubs meet the release clause then it's down to the player to decide who he prefers by the contract on the table.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by claretandy » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:06 pm

MACCA wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:36 pm
That's the way we work, we try and get the conveyor belt working, like Heaton - Pope , Ward - Taylor and Keane - Tarky etc

That method is fine when the player waiting in the wings is, young, cheap, stepping up league/wages wise and unproven at the level in question.
They learn the ropes, the player infron leaves/injured and they step in.

The issue starts when we try it with already established pros, ones hitting their peak, and have cost a big fee like Vydra and Gibson.

They wont wait around for a chance as long, they want to be playing and we can't afford for them to go backwards and write of the fees/wages.

You could argue ( theres been zero proof ) they add depth to the squad, but at what cost?
Do they add depth?
Are they capable of filling in?

Wood was probably the last one.

However by improving the starting 11, you automatically improve the team and squad at the same time.
You then can afford to allow the out going player to sit and bide his time, go backwards or take a hit on their fees/wages as you've moved forwards.

It's no secret we've not improved the starting 11 for 3, 4 maybe more windows, and its probably been 4 seasons since a signed player has been first team ready, been given an instant chance, and has gone into the team and got a run of games.

That's not how SD works it seems, however that could be down to not getting the players he wants in , meaning 3rd, 4th or 5th option isnt good enough.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:06 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:59 pm
It won’t, that’s a separate issue regarding once the release clause as been triggered, you seem wedded to the notion that it’s solely inclusive to 1 club & 1 fixed price & that’s the notion you need in my view to divorce yourself from. It’s common sense that the highest bidder will be favourable to secure the signature without the RC limit forget the RC that’s already been smashed, he’s off for the medical :lol:
So you are the chairman of club A and you have a budget of £10m to spend on a player from Club Z. I am chairman of club B and also have a budget of £10m to spend on the same player. I have offered club Z £7m and I have offered the player £3m.

Please tell me how you are going to get the player to sign for your club by offering Club Z more than £7m.

I thought you just used to be absolutely clueless and unable to understand an argument when it came to Brexit but fair play you seem to be clueless in all areas.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Jakubclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:14 pm

Reckoner wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:05 pm
You can keep trying you'd probably just be better off admitting you got it wrong. Don't worry about it there's lots of nonsense written on here.
I work in buying & selling & maximising profit, I’ll let DA explain the difference between a trade off & a merchant undergoing 3 people buying say, a standard size tin of Heinz chicken soup & 1 person offering £1 & the 2nd person offering £2 & the 3rd person offering £3, in DAs mindset the £1 offering would clinch the purchase, isn’t much difference in the transfer market when you scratch the surface the principles remain the same, cheerio :roll:
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:16 pm

:lol:

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Tall Paul » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:16 pm

lol Jakub

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by TsarBomba » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:23 pm

Holtyclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:04 pm
In this window;

1) we won’t sign a rb when we currently employ two. One or both will leave in the summer and a new one/two signed.

2) won’t signed a new right winger until one leaves and JBG is now ready to return (hopefully for rest of season).

3) Brownhill/ Allen could well be in the summer too.

What happens if we don’t sign anyone? The squad we have is more than capable of the 6-10 points from 14 games. This season so far we are averaging 1.25 points per game. No reason apart from bed wetting and panicking unnecessarily that this shouldn’t be achieved.
Yep.

We’re thin in places, we know we are, but it makes no sense to panic buy now, and get our pants pulled down in the process.

We’ve a lot of deadwood to cut, and a big rebuild to manage in the summer, including question marks over the future of Hendrick and Brady.

If we get through til Friday as we are, then fine, I can live with it. I’d rather us concentrate on targets for the summer.

We can lose one of Vydra or Wells, but I won’t be impressed if we lose Gibson without cover.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Reckoner » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:24 pm

Its like explaining climate change to a rabbit
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by arise_sir_charge » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:27 pm

Jakub is having a mare on this thread.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:29 pm

:) Spot on Tsar

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by ClaretAndJew » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:33 pm

I love when people compare physical products to the signing and nuances of signing players with various intricacies written into their contracts.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by summitclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:34 pm

Holtyclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:04 pm
In this window;

1) we won’t sign a rb when we currently employ two. One or both will leave in the summer and a new one/two signed.

2) won’t signed a new right winger until one leaves and JBG is now ready to return (hopefully for rest of season).

3) Brownhill/ Allen could well be in the summer too.

What happens if we don’t sign anyone? The squad we have is more than capable of the 6-10 points from 14 games. This season so far we are averaging 1.25 points per game. No reason apart from bed wetting and panicking unnecessarily that this shouldn’t be achieved.
40 pts may not be enough this time. Complacency or over optimistic?

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by FactualFrank » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:35 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:14 pm
I work in buying & selling & maximising profit, I’ll let DA explain the difference between a trade off & a merchant undergoing 3 people buying say, a standard size tin of Heinz chicken soup & 1 person offering £1 & the 2nd person offering £2 & the 3rd person offering £3, in DAs mindset the £1 offering would clinch the purchase, isn’t much difference in the transfer market when you scratch the surface the principles remain the same, cheerio :roll:
How much is the chicken soup? If it's £1, then the person offering £1 could clinch the purchase - just depends which shopping trolley the tin of chicken soup would rather jump in to.
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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:37 pm

summitclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:34 pm
40 pts may not be enough this time. Complacency or over optimistic?
I have us to finish with 44-48 points, personally I think 40 will be plenty.

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Re: BFC TRANSFER NEWS Jan 2020(MUST CONTAIN LINK)

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:52 pm

Long Time Lurker wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:16 pm
Nope, not until he puts in a performance worthy of his job title and salary.

After his departure from Fulham, and prior to joining us, he spent two years loitering on the periphery of football at the SRi. We plucked him from impending football obscurity. In a sense he is the Danny Drinkwater of football recruitment. To be fair to Drinkwater though, at least he has a good season or two on his record. Given his career performance to date, I genuinely can't understand why we hired Rigg to fill such an important and influential position.

First Window - do nothing / react to an unexpected offer to buy Vokes / sign Crouch

Second Window - Sell Heaton / buy Jay ( previous target ) / buy Pieters / buy BPF / loan Drinkwater

Third Window - do nothing / react to expected offers to buy Wells

Has he impressed you so far ?

Please forgive me for wanting what is best for our club and being wary of a bloke who has wasted mega millions on poor transfers over the course of his career. If it wasn't for their rich owners QPR and Fulham would have gone to the wall in response to his transfer strategies, even Man City couldn't countenance his poor results to expenditure ratio.

The supporters of QPR and Fulham didn't put his contribution under the microscope and expose it to a critical evaluation until it was far to late. We don't have the luxury of a rich owner ( not that having one seems to make much difference to Rigg other than the level of spending he advocates ) so getting a positive productive performance from our recruitment team is hugely important. Irrespective of their individual qualities, they can't hope to do that with poor leadership and calamitous strategic decision making to the fore.

Looking at the last three windows ( although this one isn't over yet ) we were doing better before Rigg arrived. Which is a poor state of affairs, because we were simply doing okay at that point in time.

When Rigg steps up to the plate and starts performing I will happily step off my soap box and stop questioning why we are trusting him with our scouting / recruitment and paying him what is undoubtedly a big wage.

Personally, I think after a full year of working beside him ( and learning what he does and how he goes about things ) the people around him could probably get along perfectly well without him. At least until we can hire a proven performer to head up our recruitment.
Be funny if he signed someone from one of your tombola lists

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