NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

This Forum is the main messageboard to discuss all things Claret and Blue and beyond
tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:45 am

Tough challenge for an inexperienced England side,the Kiwi's have lost just 1 of their last 15 home tests.

England: Rory Burns, Dom Sibley, Joe Denly, Joe Root (capt), Ben Stokes, Ollie Pope, Jos Buttler (wk), Sam Curran, Jofra Archer, Jack Leach, Stuart Broad.

New Zealand: Tom Latham, Jeet Raval, Kane Williamson (capt), Ross Taylor, Henry Nicholls, BJ Watling (wk), Colin de Grandhomme, Mitchell Santner, Tim Southee, Neil Wagner, Trent Boult.

Sibley and Pope deserve their chance,hopefully both can nail down their places for the long-term.

Big test for Chris Silverwood it's important he gets off to a winning start,New Zealand are a solid outfit,and hardened test cricketers and they won't roll over.

Dark Cloud
Posts: 6586
Joined: Sun Jan 24, 2016 9:03 am
Been Liked: 1981 times
Has Liked: 3299 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Dark Cloud » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:52 am

Opportunities there for some people to stake a claim.

JarrowClaret
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:04 pm
Been Liked: 341 times
Has Liked: 194 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by JarrowClaret » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:00 am

I still don’t understand how Ben Foakes isn’t in the Squad I would be much happier seeing his name down at 7 or 8 and one of Butler or Barstow in as a Batsman at 5 or 6 how that is achievable I don’t know though.

Firthy
Posts: 4966
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:04 am
Been Liked: 1607 times
Has Liked: 275 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Firthy » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:03 am

JarrowClaret wrote:I still don’t understand how Ben Foakes isn’t in the Squad I would be much happier seeing his name down at 7 or 8 and one of Butler or Barstow in as a Batsman at 5 or 6 how that is achievable I don’t know though.
You just write their names on the team sheet :shock: :lol:

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:10 am

If you wanted Foakes in and Jos promoted up the order then Pope would miss out or Sam Curran,i think Buttler/Bairstow as a front-line batsman at 5/6 makes the batting line-up thin,and if Sam Curran misses out the bowling could be stretched if NZ bat long,Foakes is unlucky but you can't leave Jos out he's just scored a ton in the warm-up gane.

JarrowClaret
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:04 pm
Been Liked: 341 times
Has Liked: 194 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by JarrowClaret » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:27 am

Could pope be a longer term solution to the number 3 issue he won’t stay at 6 forever I guess although I am aware he doesn’t bat 3 for Surrey at the moment.

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:35 am

JarrowClaret wrote:Could pope be a longer term solution to the number 3 issue he won’t stay at 6 forever I guess although I am aware he doesn’t bat 3 for Surrey at the moment.
He could be,Denly's done well but he's 33,and in all probability won't be around for the next Ashes series,which according to Root is his priority.

Burns,Sibley and Pope are all young enough to play test cricket for a decade if they can establish themselves.

JarrowClaret
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:04 pm
Been Liked: 341 times
Has Liked: 194 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by JarrowClaret » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:49 am

Not forgetting Zac Crawley as well but I know KP has compared Pope to Ian Bell and I wondered if he could maybe move further up the order in the medium to long term.

ClaretTony
Posts: 67438
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:07 pm
Been Liked: 32242 times
Has Liked: 5255 times
Location: Burnley
Contact:

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:05 pm

JarrowClaret wrote:Not forgetting Zac Crawley as well but I know KP has compared Pope to Ian Bell and I wondered if he could maybe move further up the order in the medium to long term.
Another Ian Bell would be a good start

Buxtonclaret
Posts: 16622
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:05 am
Been Liked: 3750 times
Has Liked: 7522 times
Location: Derbyshire

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Buxtonclaret » Wed Nov 20, 2019 12:09 pm

Whoever bat's where, first and foremost, I'm just hoping they actually realise Test cricket is a different game to slog, hook and bash.
Hopefully, the top order will hang around ling enough to prove they do.

TheFamilyCat
Posts: 10846
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:56 pm
Been Liked: 5522 times
Has Liked: 208 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by TheFamilyCat » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:44 pm

JarrowClaret wrote:Not forgetting Zac Crawley as well but I know KP has compared Pope to Ian Bell and I wondered if he could maybe move further up the order in the medium to long term.
It's not unusual for a new batsmen to be picked to bat at 6 then moved up the order as they establish themselves. Bell himself, and I think Michael Clarke, batted at 6 in the 2005 Ashes series.

claretonthecoast1882
Posts: 10088
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2018 1:59 pm
Been Liked: 4161 times
Has Liked: 57 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 1:45 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Another Ian Bell would be a good start

Ian bell would have been a good start this summer after some of the shockers

LeadBelly
Posts: 4178
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:07 am
Been Liked: 1002 times
Has Liked: 2044 times
Location: North Hampshire

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by LeadBelly » Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:04 pm

NZ definitely favourites in my eyes (and for the bookies).
Bowling may well hold up OK but the batting at the top end is unproven. I'll start watching tonight and probably make it until lunchtime but it'll have to be a good game to keep me from bed longer than that.
Weather forecast at the venue looks great for the duration so there should be a result.

jrgbfc
Posts: 8423
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:30 pm
Been Liked: 2098 times
Has Liked: 336 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by jrgbfc » Wed Nov 20, 2019 2:07 pm

Tbh I think they would like to move Denly on and go with one of the younger lads like Crawley, but the runs he got at the end of the summer against the Aussies has done just enough to keep his place for now.
I'm glad Bairstow has finally been dropped though. On the face of it very much looks like it was Bayliss who insisted on picking him. Still think Foakes has been very unlucky.

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:58 pm

LeadBelly wrote:NZ definitely favourites in my eyes (and for the bookies).
Bowling may well hold up OK but the batting at the top end is unproven. I'll start watching tonight and probably make it until lunchtime but it'll have to be a good game to keep me from bed longer than that.
Weather forecast at the venue looks great for the duration so there should be a result.
Yes i'd make NZ favourites they're strong at home,and :?: marks remain over England's batting.

The pitches are usually placid over there,so if England can't bat long periods and score hundreds in NZ,then heaven help them when they experience SA and the quick bouncy tracks.

Local cricketer
Posts: 2347
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 5:46 pm
Been Liked: 412 times
Has Liked: 87 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Local cricketer » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:28 pm

England 57-5 by midnight

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:31 pm

Local cricketer wrote:England 57-5 by midnight
That would be an improvement from last time when we managed 58 all out :lol:

Bosscat
Posts: 25372
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:51 am
Been Liked: 8432 times
Has Liked: 18099 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Bosscat » Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:44 pm

Local cricketer wrote:England 57-5 by midnight
Wont mind that as we win the toss and decide to bowl

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Wed Nov 20, 2019 7:05 pm

Looking forward to it.

NZ have two special players in Trent Boult and Kane Williamson.
Backed up by a great team ethic within the rest.

Foulthrow
Posts: 2283
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:48 am
Been Liked: 699 times
Has Liked: 1518 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Foulthrow » Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:14 pm

NZ currently ranked 2nd in the world and could go top if they do well this winter with matches against India and Australia coming up.

This will be a tough test for an inconsistent England team.

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:39 pm

England win toss & bat,right decision you'd think,but England have to justify Joe's call,if they can't score runs batting first on this surface then they don't deserve to be playing test cricket.

Tricky Trevor
Posts: 8328
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:06 pm
Been Liked: 2439 times
Has Liked: 1979 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Tricky Trevor » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:11 pm

Just hoping this Pope doesn’t get a clean sheet.
Just seen the two line-ups and the age and cap differential was enormous. They are seasoned internationals, we are building a side.

ClaretTony
Posts: 67438
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:07 pm
Been Liked: 32242 times
Has Liked: 5255 times
Location: Burnley
Contact:

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:16 pm

Steady start so far

jrgbfc
Posts: 8423
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:30 pm
Been Liked: 2098 times
Has Liked: 336 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by jrgbfc » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:23 pm

Pitch looks absolutely dead. Runs there for the taking for the batsmen.

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:23 pm

Every test ground should have a grass banking.

Tricky Trevor
Posts: 8328
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:06 pm
Been Liked: 2439 times
Has Liked: 1979 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Tricky Trevor » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:28 pm

Burns might have got away with one there. No appeal but mark on bat is so minor it might not have been given anyway.

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:41 pm

Scorings slow but that doesn't matter,it's about getting through the new ball,and then cashing in later in the day.

As you'd expect NZ are keeping it tight and giving little away.

19-0 after 9 overs steady as she goes.

jdrobbo
Posts: 9210
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 8:01 pm
Been Liked: 4801 times
Has Liked: 944 times
Location: Leeds

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by jdrobbo » Wed Nov 20, 2019 10:49 pm

Will be interesting to see how this side play out the first test

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:04 pm

A lot of movement about so far this morning, even if only medium paced.
Should get easier with the kookaburra ball.

ClaretTony
Posts: 67438
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:07 pm
Been Liked: 32242 times
Has Liked: 5255 times
Location: Burnley
Contact:

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:12 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:Every test ground should have a grass banking.
Nice ground. Pleasant place to sit and watch cricket.

ClaretTony
Posts: 67438
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:07 pm
Been Liked: 32242 times
Has Liked: 5255 times
Location: Burnley
Contact:

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:37 pm

First wicket gone - Sibley for 22

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:41 pm

Sibley's technique doesn't look up to facing the swinging ball too often.
Lack of footwork to play on the the offside.

Looked decent off his pads though, but you soon get worked out at this level.

ClaretTony
Posts: 67438
Joined: Thu Dec 24, 2015 3:07 pm
Been Liked: 32242 times
Has Liked: 5255 times
Location: Burnley
Contact:

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:48 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:Sibley's technique doesn't look up to facing the swinging ball too often.
Lack of footwork to play on the the offside.

Looked decent off his pads though, but you soon get worked out at this level.
And they worked him out but it was his first test innings

Holtyclaret
Posts: 1120
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:35 pm
Been Liked: 342 times
Has Liked: 1559 times
Location: Wantage

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:52 pm

My mum lives 5 minutes from the ground, really special place is mount maunganui. Come on England!

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:08 am

61-1 at lunch,Burns well set to go big 35*Denly 4*,England's session but attritional test cricket.

The Enclosure
Posts: 4486
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:29 am
Been Liked: 990 times
Has Liked: 3266 times
Location: Burnley

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by The Enclosure » Thu Nov 21, 2019 5:25 am

241-4. Stokes 67 no pope18 no
Close of play

clansman
Posts: 918
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2016 1:18 pm
Been Liked: 322 times
Has Liked: 89 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by clansman » Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:17 am

Presume that a little bit of sporting trivia history was made this week. Presumably the first time a Pope was capped for England in the same week at both football and cricket!

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:31 am

ClaretTony wrote:Nice ground. Pleasant place to sit and watch cricket.
They even let the crowd play cricket on the outfield in the lunch break, which is brilliant to see.

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:02 am

Solid 1st day from England,1st session on day 2 is vital,on this deck 400 is a mininum requirement,my one criticism is Burns & Denly got in but didn't capitalise on their starts,Stokes is coming to the fore again and young Pope looks good,Buttler & Sam Curran still in the hutch so power to add.

When England come to bowl they need to heed the NZ approach,and play a waiting game while keeping it tight.
These 2 users liked this post: LeadBelly Herts Clarets

LeadBelly
Posts: 4178
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:07 am
Been Liked: 1002 times
Has Liked: 2044 times
Location: North Hampshire

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by LeadBelly » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:29 am

Agreed. The spadework has been sound but it could all go wrong in the first session of day 2 if we loose 2-3 wickets. Best to play fairly cautiously first session and then try to be a bit more dominant after that.
It'd be a failure to get below 350 from here and 400+ should be on the cards. (I just checked & Bet365 are making 420 the par score from here (and Stokes' par score as 102))

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:37 am

LeadBelly wrote:Agreed. The spadework has been sound but it could all go wrong in the first session of day 2 if we loose 2-3 wickets. Best to play fairly cautiously first session and then try to be a bit more dominant after that.
It'd be a failure to get below 350 from here and 400+ should be on the cards. (I just checked & Bet365 are making 420 the par score from here (and Stokes' par score as 102))
This is how a proper top-order bats in test cricket,the pitch looks good and the middle order should be able to take advantage.

If England amass 400+ then scoreboard pressure comes into play,and NZ have to bat 4th,which could bring Leach into the game on days 4 and 5.

Buxtonclaret
Posts: 16622
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 9:05 am
Been Liked: 3750 times
Has Liked: 7522 times
Location: Derbyshire

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Buxtonclaret » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:52 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:They even let the crowd play cricket on the outfield in the lunch break, which is brilliant to see.
It was very much like going back in time and seeing a cricket match in the 60s/70s over here in England. :)
This user liked this post: Quickenthetempo

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:59 am

tiger76 wrote:Solid 1st day from England,1st session on day 2 is vital,on this deck 400 is a mininum requirement,my one criticism is Burns & Denly got in but didn't capitalise on their starts,Stokes is coming to the fore again and young Pope looks good,Buttler & Sam Curran still in the hutch so power to add.

When England come to bowl they need to heed the NZ approach,and play a waiting game while keeping it tight.
You have high standards if Denly getting 74 is only classed as getting a start.

Quickenthetempo
Posts: 17930
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:35 am
Been Liked: 3845 times
Has Liked: 2066 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Quickenthetempo » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:02 pm

Buxtonclaret wrote:It was very much like going back in time and seeing a cricket match in the 60s/70s over here in England. :)
The best part of the day when I watch my local side Padiham play, is the kids charging on to play at the tea break. Great to watch.

They're not easily budged when the players come back on either haha. The field belongs to them in their eyes.
This user liked this post: Buxtonclaret

Local cricketer
Posts: 2347
Joined: Mon May 13, 2019 5:46 pm
Been Liked: 412 times
Has Liked: 87 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Local cricketer » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:31 pm

Proper days cricket. Great ground, attritinal cricket just how it should be

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:49 pm

277-5 Stokes gone for 91 to a brilliant catch,Pope overturned an LBW decision early on,important partnership now Pope and Buttler,don't want to let this good position slip.

Vino blanco
Posts: 5345
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:42 pm
Been Liked: 1898 times
Has Liked: 1965 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Vino blanco » Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:59 pm

Pope gone as well from a very loose shot to a ball wide of off stump. Sam Curran just gone to a revised lbw first ball delivery. Mini collapse!!

tiger76
Posts: 25697
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 9:43 pm
Been Liked: 4644 times
Has Liked: 9849 times
Location: Glasgow

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by tiger76 » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:03 pm

286-7 Pope gone 29,poor shot TBH,and Sam Curran out for a golden duck,2 in 2 balls for Southee,England in danger of throwing yesterday's hard work away. :roll:

Vino blanco
Posts: 5345
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:42 pm
Been Liked: 1898 times
Has Liked: 1965 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Vino blanco » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:03 pm

Hat trick ball.... Leg bye for four.

Vino blanco
Posts: 5345
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:42 pm
Been Liked: 1898 times
Has Liked: 1965 times

Re: NZ vs England (1st test) 10 PM GMT

Post by Vino blanco » Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:07 pm

Archer gone for four, Buttler could be left stranded.

Post Reply