Greta Thunberg

[Taffy on the wing]

No, did you not read anything that I have wrote?

I haven't denied that there is a problem or that climate change exists. I have said there is no way to fix the problem through our current technology. That's very different.

If you'd bothered to watch the talk, you'd see that it's conducted by Michael Shellenberger, co-founder of Breakthrough Institute, dedicated to solving the climate crisis, former Time Heroes of the Environment winner, former Greenbook award winner.

This is the classic mark of the eco-warrior. Somebody suggests something other than what they think, so they resort to counterproductive name calling and refuse to engage in actual debate, because when it boils down to it, they have no idea what they're talking about.

Why? Because the reality is that we can't do anything, and that's scarier than some little girl screaming about the environment on our TVs.

So your answer to this is to do nothing?.........To suggest that we can't improve things by taking action now, flies in the face of everything i've read on the subject & i've read quite a lot.

[bob-the-scutter]

You are pathetic!......You ignore the work of Thousands of Climate Scientists, who's predictions and rigorous work for the last 40 yrs are coming to fruition, even faster than predicted, and you sweep it all away with a Ted talk. Did you Google climate denier and post the first thing that popped up? Stick your 'facts'.

Take 90 minutes out of your life and learn the real truth behind the man made climate change hoax!
https://youtu.be/1FdItN4mr7Q

[UpTheClaretsFCBK]

So your answer to this is to do nothing?.........To suggest that we can't improve things by taking action now, flies in the face of everything i've read on the subject & i've read quite a lot.

No, not do nothing. But don't hinder ordinary people by making them panic about a situation they can't control.

It's down to science and research to get us out of this mess.

Not to mention the issue of China, who are planning to build 300 new coal power stations over the next decade.

The only thing we can do in the meantime is switch completely to Nuclear power.

[ecc]

"A pity she doesn't tour Russia or the Southern Hemisphere places that are having a major impact on the planet."

Would Putin agree to her touring his country? He puts journalists/writers/film directors in prison cells if he doesn't like what they write/say.

[LoveCurryPies]

No, not do nothing. But don't hinder ordinary people by making them panic about a situation they can't control.

It's down to science and research to get us out of this mess.

Not to mention the issue of China, who are planning to build 300 new coal power stations over the next decade.

The only thing we can do in the meantime is switch completely to Nuclear power.

Sorry, this is just wrong.

We can start with our own lives. Take a look at how we use the Earth’s resources and how we might waste energy.

Drive the most fuel efficient car, or walk or cycle, or use public transport.

Make our homes energy efficient. Or if moving home buy one.

Turn off lights and electric items when not in use.

So many other things we can do.

And then businesses and the Country can make changes. When ever done that we can start lecturing other countries.

[UpTheClaretsFCBK]

Sorry, this is just wrong.

We can start with our own lives. Take a look at how we use the Earth’s resources and how we might waste energy.

Drive the most fuel efficient car, or walk or cycle, or use public transport.

Make our homes energy efficient. Or if moving home buy one.

Turn off lights and electric items when not in use.

So many other things we can do.

And then businesses and the Country can make changes. When ever done that we can start lecturing other countries.

I don't agree. That's not how the world works. Human beings are selfish by nature. If our hopes are stacked on people "changing their lives for the better" then we are done.

The only thing that can solve the climate crisis is technology and innovation.

[HieronymousBoschHobs]

Take 90 minutes out of your life and learn the real truth behind the man made climate change hoax!
https://youtu.be/1FdItN4mr7Q

Do you know why that video has a link to a Wikipedia article about Global Warming and begins with an 'ad' featuring Neil deGrasse Tyson?

It's because social media companies have increasingly come under fire for hosting pernicious content which either distorts or disregards truth. In this case, the film disputes the claims of Al Gore's An Inconvenient Truth by 'exposing' the fact that there are a range of views within climate science about what is happening to the planet at present. However, it's fairly clear, especially given your comment, that the intent here is not to inform viewers about the nuances of the scientific process but instead to fuel conspiracy theories.

Scientists do not agree about everything - if they did, science would rarely progress. However, they do work on shared assumptions. No physicist denies the existence of gravity, but they may disagree about what, at the most technical level, gravity really is. Likewise, no climate scientist denies that man made climate change is a real phenomenon, but they may disagree about what the effects will be, how quickly it is likely to happen, the exact processes involved and so on. There is, though, no hoax, no conspiracy: the climate crisis is on and we are already seeing its effects. Sadly, I think the world could be naught but ash and some folk would still be so stubborn that they would not change their view.

[AndrewJB]

I don't agree. That's not how the world works. Human beings are selfish by nature. If our hopes are stacked on people "changing their lives for the better" then we are done.

The only thing that can solve the climate crisis is technology and innovation.

The only thing we have to change this is governments. If we just relied on technology and research we would never have taken the measures we did to deal with the ozone hole at the poles.

[UpTheClaretsFCBK]

The only thing we have to change this is governments. If we just relied on technology and research we would never have taken the measures we did to deal with the ozone hole at the poles.

There is absolutely no chance in a million years that enough people's attitude will change to make any kind of dent on the climate crisis. There's nothing governments can do aside from plowing money into innovation.

Nuclear Fusion at it's current trajectory should be a reality by 2025, with the UK planning to harness energy from that method by 2040 and advances in lab grown meats will ease the food crisis. China's 'artificial sun' project should be up and running by next year, also. It's not that nothing is being done, it's whether we can do it quickly enough. It's time to totally ditch traditional renewables, they are a waste of time and funding, they will never be able to solve the climate crisis.

There's no point in them throwing a load of red tape everywhere to reduce emissions, it's merely the average person that will feel the strain of that, as prices skyrocket in line with the extra cost of running at better environmental standards.

[LoveCurryPies]

I don't agree. That's not how the world works. Human beings are selfish by nature. If our hopes are stacked on people "changing their lives for the better" then we are done.

The only thing that can solve the climate crisis is technology and innovation.

I’m not saying it is just one thing. I agree technology and innovation is a major part of a solution. However, we can make immediate changes in our personal lives. I have and millions are doing.

It really is a case of everyone has to make changes.

[UpTheClaretsFCBK]

I’m not saying it is just one thing. I agree technology and innovation is a major part of a solution. However, we can make immediate changes in our personal lives. I have and millions are doing.

It really is a case of everyone has to make changes.

But everyone won't. That's the point. It will take everyone to make the difference and realistically thats never going to happen.

Hope and pray we invent the means to save us all is the most we can do.

[LoveCurryPies]

But everyone won't. That's the point. It will take everyone to make the difference and realistically thats never going to happen.

Hope and pray we invent the means to save us all is the most we can do.

Who said everyone would?

Millions of people are starting to look at the effect of their lifestyles and making changes.

So your argument is “if everyone isn’t going to take part, no point bothering”. And if people think like you?

Young people becoming aware of what is happening is huge. They know how to research this and can shape their own futures. Some of them might become the scientists who bring about the innovations you call for.

[Taffy on the wing]

Who said everyone would?

Millions of people are starting to look at the effect of their lifestyles and making changes.

So your argument is “if everyone isn’t going to take part, no point bothering”. And if people think like you?

Young people becoming aware of what is happening is huge. They know how to research this and can shape their own futures. Some of them might become the scientists who bring about the innovations you call for.

Thank you for your optimism!... Although it will no doubt be shot down by FCBK any minute........He's watched a TED talk don't you know!
OF COURSE IF MANY MILLIONS OF PEOPLE CHANGE THEIR WAYS IT WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE.....IT WILL STRETCH OUT THE TIME BEFORE DOOMSDAY HITS!

[LoveCurryPies]

Thank you for your optimism!... Although it will no doubt be shot down by FCBK any minute........He's watched a TED talk don't you know!
OF COURSE IF MANY MILLIONS OF PEOPLE CHANGE THEIR WAYS IT WILL MAKE A DIFFERENCE.....IT WILL STRETCH OUT THE TIME BEFORE DOOMSDAY HITS!

How can ordinary people call for Governments and Countries to make changes if they do not make changes themselves?

The positive thought is we can make changes immediately. Yes, our individual change is minuscule, however if millions of people make immediate changes it will make a difference.

However, I’m not optimistic about climate change. The rate of ice melting has been underestimated. Sea levels will rise. Maybe more importantly, the Gulf Stream has become unpredictable and may collapse. We’ve also seen recent reports that the amount of oxygen in water is rapidly decreasing.

But the thing that terrifies me, is an extra 2 billion people by the end of the century....all in need of feeding (on 5% less land) and wanting power for their homes and employment.

The population increase is a result of people living longer not larger families.

Humans really have been disastrous for the planet. An estimated 1 million species are predicted to become extinct in the next 20 years.

How can this beautiful planet survive?

I’ve come to quite a depressing conclusion....only a virus that wipes out the entire human population might slow and eventually halt climate change. Or maybe we’ve done too much damage and even that scenario won’t work.

[jrgbfc]

Given some of our current world leaders I'm not overly optimistic. It will take New York or Miami to be underwater before an idiot like Trump takes climate change seriously.
Although it looks like the Aussies are starting to wake up to it. When the residents of a city like Sydney are having their day to day lives seriously disrupted it might bring about change.

[AndrewJB]

There is absolutely no chance in a million years that enough people's attitude will change to make any kind of dent on the climate crisis. There's nothing governments can do aside from plowing money into innovation.

Nuclear Fusion at it's current trajectory should be a reality by 2025, with the UK planning to harness energy from that method by 2040 and advances in lab grown meats will ease the food crisis. China's 'artificial sun' project should be up and running by next year, also. It's not that nothing is being done, it's whether we can do it quickly enough. It's time to totally ditch traditional renewables, they are a waste of time and funding, they will never be able to solve the climate crisis.

There's no point in them throwing a load of red tape everywhere to reduce emissions, it's merely the average person that will feel the strain of that, as prices skyrocket in line with the extra cost of running at better environmental standards.

I agree that people making consumer choices will never fix this, but I think you underestimate the power of government to drive change. Not by throwing up a little red tape (it’s too late for that), but spelling out what a clear and present danger we’re looking at (including the consequences), and driving a plan forward.

When the ozone layer holes were discovered in the ‘80s, and CFCs blamed for it, the world moved quickly to ban them. Nowadays a billionaire funded thinktank would contest the science, while their newspapers would carry headlines like “enviro-fascists want to take your Nan’s fridge!” - and nothing would get done.

[Blackrod]

Seems that she has Asbergers which I have read makes people obsessive about something. There was an article today stating that she avoided school and had eating issues. Clearly not your average kid.

[agreenwood]

Seems that she has Asbergers which I have read makes people obsessive about something. There was an article today stating that she avoided school and had eating issues. Clearly not your average kid.

Average folk don’t tend to have much of an impact on the world.

Good luck to her.

[dsr]

Seems that she has Asbergers which I have read makes people obsessive about something. There was an article today stating that she avoided school and had eating issues. Clearly not your average kid.

I think we already knew she wasn't your "average kid" because the average kid doesn't make world news wherever she goes.

And I don't think Asperger's syndrome causes anything; syndromes don't. What a syndrome does is put a label onto people who don't fit the one-size-fits-all definition of normality. Broadly speaking, anyone who is obsessive, anti-social, happy to do their own thing when everyone they know thinks they're odd for doing it, lacks empathy, doesn't like crowds - any or all of those things can be signs of autism/Asperger's syndrome.

It's called an "autism spectrum" because there is no dividing line between normal children and Aspergers children. One expert may look at a child and think it is perhaps a bit introverted and independent-minded but is nonetheless normal; another expert may go beyond that and think that the child is not normal and deserves the label "Aspergers". There are of course nice biddable "normal" children who would never be considered Aspergers children, and conversely there are some whose behaviour is so "non-normal" as to deserve/require a label to make it obvious they mustn't be treated like you or I; but in between there is this spectrum where labelling is pretty random depending a large extent on point of view.

[dsr]

It seems odd that the Today programme are flying a presenter to Sweden to interview her. Doesn't she have Skype?

[evensteadiereddie]

I know. Perhaps the interviewer could have flapped her arms up and down and flown there like normal people. She wears shoes too , apparently.
Tsk.
Anyway, it's all crap - those doggies at Rishton have been rescued and that's all that really matters.

[Blackrod]

It seems odd that the Today programme are flying a presenter to Sweden to interview her. Doesn't she have Skype?

If she has such strong principles and concerns surely she should object to this. They could sail there and reschedule for the week after.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

If she has such strong principles and concerns surely she should object to this. They could sail there and reschedule for the week after.

She is objecting to it, that's what she's all about.

What she isn't all about is becoming some sort of unrealistic dictator who demands that people have to travel on certain kinds of transport to come and interview her.

If you are so obsessed with finding tiny hypocrysies then you are in great danger of missing the bigger picture.

Also, if you don't like her, just ignore her, there's no ambiguity to her message, neither is there a downside to trying to be a little more self-aware when it comes to climate change.

After global warming and whatever in the 80's I also didn't really believe it but at least the facts behind plastic packaging being dumped into the air and sea and causing contamination is clear.

You don't have to make massive adjustments to your lifestyle to become more part of the solution rather than part of the problem, just do your bit and then you don't have to wait until some beloved Conservative figure prints it on the side of bus, thus making it obviously true.

[Blackrod]

The environment is everybody’s problem and everyone is aware of it - not just certain political parties or people of a certain political persuasion.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

The environment is everybody’s problem and everyone is aware of it - not just certain political parties or people of a certain political persuasion.

With or without Greta Thunberg the planet is either going through or about to enter a cataclysmic climate change period which will negatively affect us all.

Do something or don't do something but don't make Greta Thunberg the reason for the choices you make.

You can see again the hypocrisy exposed in the arguments on here, "China and India aren't doing anything so I won't" + "Greta Thunberg IS doing something which doesn't fit my narrative/agenda/meet my approval so I won't."

The older generation don't seem to care about these things as much as the young but that doesn't matter, they don't send middle-aged people and pensioners to fight wars either.

the tide is turning which is all that matters, just look at the amount of companies releasing electric cars this year such as Mini and VW, they wouldn't be doing it if there wasn't a carbon free future on the horizon.

[Bordeauxclaret]

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

In the communal parking below my building there are a few people now who have electric cars and they look absolutely awesome.
They are plugged in and charging like something from a cool sci-fi film and those people will never have to go and queue in a garage and buy petrol again, heaven. You'd never again be funding BP and Shell and the real companies causing the problem.
So there you go, squish plastic bottles down as small as you can before you put them in the bin and buy an electric car when you can afford one and I reckon you've done your bit.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

[bob-the-scutter]

Remember when students were educated instead of groomed?
Its a doomsday death cult that terrorises children and will just continue to change the date of the apocalypse every 10 years. It`s evil that our children are being used (abused) as climate change propagander. According to gormless Al Gore the arctic should have completely melted 10 years ago and polar bears gone extinct. Strange then, that there are more polar bears now and the arctic ice sheet is just the same than when he "predicted" these catastrophies.

And this is why they have a mentally ill child explaining things instead of a qualified scientist talking to you about climate change. If they get their way then we will be on the way to extinction. Severn Cullis-Suzuki, 13 year old Canadian child spoke in 1992 at the UN conference almost exactly the same idiotic and misinformed claptrap and what has happened since?
NOTHING!

97% of scientists agree?.................really?
https://youtu.be/ewJ6TI8ccAw

[Squarepusher]

I don't get it. What does anyone stand to gain from perpetuating this massive hoax that you're describing?

[dsr]

Remember when students were educated instead of groomed?
Its a doomsday death cult that terrorises children and will just continue to change the date of the apocalypse every 10 years. It`s evil that our children are being used (abused) as climate change propagander. According to gormless Al Gore the arctic should have completely melted 10 years ago and polar bears gone extinct. Strange then, that there are more polar bears now and the arctic ice sheet is just the same than when he "predicted" these catastrophies.

And this is why they have a mentally ill child explaining things instead of a qualified scientist talking to you about climate change. If they get their way then we will be on the way to extinction. Severn Cullis-Suzuki, 13 year old Canadian child spoke in 1992 at the UN conference almost exactly the same idiotic and misinformed claptrap and what has happened since?
NOTHING!

97% of scientists agree?.................really?
https://youtu.be/ewJ6TI8ccAw

Asperger's syndrome isn't mental illness, if that's what you're getting at.

[evensteadiereddie]

He's got his finger on the pulse, oldscutterbob, hasn't he ?
Not bonkers at all.

[AlargeClaret]

God I hope she doesn’t follow Gwyneth into the candle business ...

[Bosscat]

God I hope she doesn’t follow Gwyneth into the candle business ...

[dougcollins]

deleted

[bob-the-scutter]

Asperger's syndrome isn't mental illness, if that's what you're getting at.

It's a neurodevelopmental disorder.

[tim_noone]

It's a neurodevelopmental disorder.

Googles wonderful... could I order my usual Nuits st George..... waiter!

[dsr]

It's a neurodevelopmental disorder.

Even then there is an argument to say that there are many people diagnosed with this so-called disorder when there is nothing wrong with them. They just don't fit into a compartmentalised view of some people's ideas of what it is to be human.

I don't see how anyone can look at Greta Thunberg - whether you agree with her or not - and say that she is in some way mentally ill, mentally disordered, or otherwise not "right".

[Spike]

at her age we all had something to do that was a much more important cause than she bangs on about.

We were all Clarets, all went to school more than she obviously does , but still champion our cause to this day

KTF! UTC!

[JohnMac]

Over use of packaging for just about everything such as food, clothing, electronics, drinks has changed for the worse. Much of this is aligned with people in silly jobs created for and by the recent generations to justify those without a 'proper degree'.

Every change of buyer or technical manager at Supermarket head offices led to a review of specifications and packaging when I worked in the Fruit industry. Changes were regular as it was just a CV exercise for many as they came and went whilst thinking they were inventing the wheel. 'Whilst head buyer at M&S I was single handedly responsible for the innovative label, wrapping, boxing and delivery of a product that was actually the same without all of that shite'

Most things come with a mass of literature nobody bothers reading because it's deemed neccessary to brief people to the 'nth degree' about how to do simple things.

Us oldies know how to cook, wash our clothes, self medicate and wipe our arse without reading a 20 page dossier written by a 21 year old

[bob-the-scutter]

Googles wonderful... could I order my usual Nuits st George..... waiter!

******* Tim no one!

[tim_noone]

******* Tim no one!

Correct...

[BennyD]

Even then there is an argument to say that there are many people diagnosed with this so-called disorder when there is nothing wrong with them. They just don't fit into a compartmentalised view of some people's ideas of what it is to be human.

I don't see how anyone can look at Greta Thunberg - whether you agree with her or not - and say that she is in some way mentally ill, mentally disordered, or otherwise not "right".

Personally I don’t see how anyone can look at Greta Thunberg and say that she is not, in some way, mentally ill, mentally disordered or otherwise not ‘right’.

[Rileybobs]

Personally I don’t see how anyone can look at Greta Thunberg and say that she is not, in some way, mentally ill, mentally disordered or otherwise not ‘right’.

Interesting. Can you usually tell whether someone is mentally ill by their appearance?

[BennyD]

Quite often, can’t you?

[fidelcastro]

As someone who has Asperger syndrome, I think she's an inspiration.

[Rileybobs]

Quite often, can’t you?

How would I know if a person had a mental illness?

[ClaretAndJew]

How in the **** do people "look" mentally ill? It's not like there's a specific physiological symptom where you look at someone and can say "ah yes this person has paranoid schizophrenia".

What a weird, blinkered view on mental health.

[DCWat]

I think we all know that BennyD is referring to those with significant mental impairment, often visually detectable but very different to a mental illness.

[thatdberight]

I think we all know that BennyD is referring to those with significant mental impairment, often visually detectable but very different to a mental illness.

I presumed he meant her overall demeanour, rather than just a causal glance. Thunberg does appear odd - but given she's only a kid and speaking in her second language, I think it's a bit much to read a lot into that. In any case, concentrating overly on the messenger seems a bit beside the point in this debate.