Covid-19

[RingoMcCartney]

When you stop being racist (probably never) I’ll stop calling you a racist.
That’s the best I can do.
Hopefully one day I’ll get the chance to say it to your face as it will be especially pertinent

Crystal ?

Clear as.

You Stay safe now. (Behind your keyboard)

[martin_p]

I think those expecting any significant relaxation of the current measures are going to be disappointed. Until there is some sort of vaccine or treatment normal life will not return. As it stands, for example, I’ll be surprised if I get on another football match in 2020.

[TVC15]

Clear as.

You Stay safe now. (Behind your keyboard)

Where as you are where exactly ?
Racist crying hypocrite - and yes still behind your keyboard

Stay racist...I know you will

[tim_noone]

I think those expecting any significant relaxation of the current measures are going to be disappointed. Until there is some sort of vaccine or treatment normal life will not return. As it stands, for example, I’ll be surprised if I get on another football match in 2020.

It's one big mess.

[evensteadiereddie]

I think those expecting any significant relaxation of the current measures are going to be disappointed. Until there is some sort of vaccine or treatment normal life will not return. As it stands, for example, I’ll be surprised if I get on another football match in 2020.

Lives or livelihood ?
The potential meltdown of the economy will determine when any relaxation of the restrictions can be considered. The government aren't stupid - if a significant number of jobs and businesses continue to go, they will blink. If anybody is to face ruin or difficulty, it's going to be the people who lent their votes to the Tories. There'll come a time when public opinion will be perceived to have turned against them somewhat.
Not yet, maybe, but I think the clock's ticking.

[randomclaret2]

I suspect people who lent their votes to all parties or to none will face ruin and difficulty in equal measure

[evensteadiereddie]

It would be a first !

[FactualFrank]

Coronavirus: Social restrictions 'to remain for rest of year'

The UK will have to live with some disruptive social measures for at least the rest of the year, the government's chief medical adviser has said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52389285

The above won't come as a surprise, but it's just a reminder that it's unlikely we'll be back to near normality before 2021.

[paulatky]

Coronavirus: Social restrictions 'to remain for rest of year'

The UK will have to live with some disruptive social measures for at least the rest of the year, the government's chief medical adviser has said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52389285

The above won't come as a surprise, but it's just a reminder that it's unlikely we'll be back to near normality before 2021.

That shouldnt come as a surprise to anyone who has been paying proper attention throughout.

The bigger question is why the game’s authorities and individual clubs wont admit it.

[TheFamilyCat]

That shouldnt come as a surprise to anyone who has been paying proper attention throughout.

The bigger question is why the game’s authorities and individual clubs wont admit it.

Why are you connecting that report specifically to football?

[Grumps]

That shouldnt come as a surprise to anyone who has been paying proper attention throughout.

The bigger question is why the game’s authorities and individual clubs wont admit it.

Are you sure you're posting from the right account?
I have to admit it takes some nerve to return after how you were outed the other week.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Coronavirus: Social restrictions 'to remain for rest of year'

The UK will have to live with some disruptive social measures for at least the rest of the year, the government's chief medical adviser has said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-52389285

The above won't come as a surprise, but it's just a reminder that it's unlikely we'll be back to near normality before 2021.

Reading the usual childish carry on between the usuals in the exchanges last night you could be fooled into thinking it was all over. Hopefully action can be taken once the posts are viewed.

Some parts of the lockdown will have to be eased in the near future but it is a tough balance which parts

[Lowbankclaret]

The reasons given for the lockdown were to slow the rate that the virus was spreading and to protect the NHS.
As things stand, with talk of the peak having been reached and reports that the 'new hospitals' are being under-used, why would there not be some relaxation?

I think the public would be entitled to ask that question

In most countries the modellers have I think got it about correct. In the UK they were saying somewhere between 250,000 and 500,000 deaths if we did nothing.
By implementing lockdown our Gov said it was to try to keep the deaths below 20,000 and if they did it would be a good result.
Even ignoring the arguments about how death rates are counted , our death rate is going to go over the 20,000. I said well over a week ago our death rate would be between 20k and 40k, unfortunately that upper rate is looking like it may be under the final death toll.

On the peak, lockdown has done here what it has done in other countries, it’s turned it into a plateau. I was concerned our lockdown light would not achieve it fast enough but it appears it has been successful. What other countries have waited for is the death rate being under or around the 400 deaths per day. The issue then is it’s going to climb back up, yes within what the NHS can cope with, but what’s the ongoing balance of deaths per day against economic impact the public will accept.

It difficult to say if the modellers got it correct but it’s looks pretty close, you cannot conclude that the rates of deaths would have been correct , however you can imply it would have been in the right ball park.

So the big question is how do we relax lockdown, without then suffering a 100,000 deaths for example.

What is a little concerning from yesterday and I think needs to be understood before we can do anything was the weekly death rate graph from yesterday.

3482F1C4-8E74-499D-BF6D-723FA19F3E6F.jpeg (355.47 KiB) Viewed 2020 times

[paulatky]

Are you sure you're posting from the right account?
I have to admit it takes some nerve to return after how you were outed the other week.

How do you mean. I mistakenly used my wife’s account after she had logged in first thing in the morning.

That doesnt alter the validity of what I think.

Interesting that the government has now admitted that social distancing restictions will be in place until at least 2021. Wonder who has said that many times before.

By the way do you think the number of deaths may have peaked yet or do you think nobody knows

[TheFamilyCat]

How do you mean. I mistakenly used my wife’s account after she had logged in first thing in the morning.

Well that clears that up then.

[paulatky]

Lowbank what does your graph show ?
What is the scale at the bottom.
It’s frightening how high the real UK death toll is already.
Thought to be over 30,000 now with care homes,hospices, community and lag in reporting hospital deaths taken into account

[Grumps]

How do you mean. I mistakenly used my wife’s account after she had logged in first thing in the morning.

That doesnt alter the validity of what I think.

Interesting that the government has now admitted that social distancing restictions will be in place until at least 2021. Wonder who has said that many times before.

By the way do you think the number of deaths may have peaked yet or do you think nobody knows

[Bangers&Mash]

There seems to be a big misunderstanding here - and fuelled by the press wanting a headline.

Lockdown and social distancing will not be in place until 2021. But SOME measures will remain until 2021.

It doesnt sell clicks if your website has the headline "10% of lockdown to remain".

I wouldn't be surprised if this season and next is behind closed doors, and dont expect to get to a gig any time soon. But you can look forward to seeing family and friends again if you dont get too close. And you'll be able to shop and walk again without feeling like a criminal.

[Lowbankclaret]

I think those expecting any significant relaxation of the current measures are going to be disappointed. Until there is some sort of vaccine or treatment normal life will not return. As it stands, for example, I’ll be surprised if I get on another football match in 2020.

I did say when the lock down was extended that it would continue for another 5-6 weeks , however the data has plateaued faster than the data was suggesting it would.

Therefore the downward phase is also likely to be sooner and I now think some tiny steps will be done on removal of lockdown.

No idea what they might be, but I do think there will be some relaxations in a couple of weeks.

They will be led by the data, let’s hope we see that data get below 400 deaths a day to enable that to happen.

[Elizabeth]

Let me suggest a potential relaxation that I think could be made safely with good planning while safeguarding the social distancing.
Open up the golf courses and tennis courts so that golfers could play in twos and tennis restricted to singles.

[Lowbankclaret]

Lowbank what does your graph show ?
What is the scale at the bottom.
It’s frightening how high the real UK death toll is already.
Thought to be over 30,000 now with care homes,hospices, community and lag in reporting hospital deaths taken into account

It weekly death registrations, simply that. No distinction of why death occurred. I think they said all the dots on each week were the deaths from 1970 something to 2019.
So along the bottom you have 52 weeks and around 40 -50 years worth of dots, number of people per week that died.

Hope that make sense.

What they said was there have only been two weeks worse in that 40 odd years. One was a very bad year for flu, I forget what the other one was.

I am not making any claims what it means , as I don’t know but it appeared on several formats, so I then thought it was credible.

This was where I saw it first.

94AC421B-C021-4DDB-AFE9-1F986614A5C4.png (313.29 KiB) Viewed 1936 times

[jrgbfc]

Let me suggest a potential relaxation that I think could be made safely with good planning while safeguarding the social distancing.
Open up the golf courses and tennis courts so that golfers could play in twos and tennis restricted to singles.

There's no reason why places like B and Q and garden centres can't be open already, easy to keep your distance from people in places like that.

[Elizabeth]

Already you can see a picture where little steps could make this lockdown much easier to manage for some people

[Grumps]

Let me suggest a potential relaxation that I think could be made safely with good planning while safeguarding the social distancing.
Open up the golf courses and tennis courts so that golfers could play in twos and tennis restricted to singles.

It depends who the two golfers are
But I cannot see a reason if one person wanted to do a round on their own why they shouldn't be allowed to.

[paulatky]

Already you can see a picture where little steps could make this lockdown much easier to manage for some people

But public gatherings are a long way off and a lot of families will not be prepared to take the risk of being together like before. Being able to wave through the window or chat from the end of the drive is no comparison ti being able to cuddle your grandchildren or sit down to Christmas lunch together.

[Elizabeth]

I think the way forward is to embrace ideas and look for ways to make it happen.

[FactualFrank]

Regarding golf courses, you could easily have a 4-ball and keep a distance of 2 metres. There's never a need to be near each other as even if you both hit the ball to the same spot, the one furthest back normally goes first anyway.

[dsr]

But public gatherings are a long way off and a lot of families will not be prepared to take the risk of being together like before. Being able to wave through the window or chat from the end of the drive is no comparison ti being able to cuddle your grandchildren or sit down to Christmas lunch together.

That's not relevant to whether they should be allowed to. If the law changes to allow grandparents to cuddle their grandchildren before they die, and some people choose not to take advantage, that needn't stop the rest of them from carrying on.

[NottsClaret]

But public gatherings are a long way off and a lot of families will not be prepared to take the risk of being together like before. Being able to wave through the window or chat from the end of the drive is no comparison ti being able to cuddle your grandchildren or sit down to Christmas lunch together.

That's fine, each family and individual can weigh up that risk. If anyone who feels vulnerable wants to remain isolated then they'd be free to do so - and supported - for as long as they felt it was required.

But the blanket ban on everything is particularly clumsy and now becoming very damaging. Whitty said last night, it's getting to a point where you need to look at the balance. Look at the vast numbers of cancer diagnosis going unchecked at the moment, the knock on deaths will eventually reach a point where they outstrip the Covid19 fatalities.

[Elizabeth]

Of course they are Paul and while that is where we want to be we all realise that the sacrifices we all all making will have to continue. This is about slowly getting back to normality.
My dad is in his nineties, I haven't see him for weeks. I can no longer make him hot meals. We really are all in this together. We have to try and be positive that we will see and care for our loved ones again

[Devils_Advocate]

Opening golf courses, Tennis Courts, DIY stores and Garden Centres is great but I think the real challenge and what will be much more important is how they manage to ease the lockdown for those at the bottom of society living on big housing estates with a real lack of disposible income

Id love to be able to go and have a game of golf but its not a struggle for me at home where I have all the mod cons, can drive to supermarkets if and when I want and buy everything I need, live by lovely woodland areas to walk in and have a peaceful communal garden area to relax in

At the moment we look at this very much through an ageist lens but this is and will even more become about socio economic status and poverty

If the country starts to open up nicely to the comfortable and well off and the poor are left locked in their concrete jungles then thats when we could really see social unrest and people just refusing to follow the lockdown rules

Its a tough one and im not suggesting keeping things closed for the fear of upsetting those who haven't got access but the govt need to keep this in mind and find a way they can offer a release to those who are likely have it the toughest

[Zlatan]

A relaxation in lockdown should be accompanied with an enforcement of wearing face masks IMO. It is an altruistic approach. If we are forced to wear a face mask in public, whilst our individual protection is not increased, the populations protection as a whole is increased. However this is dependant upon availability of face masks for everyone, and the supply problems for PPE is currently dictating the governments advice.

[jrgbfc]

Closing fishing lakes is another measure that has been way over the top. Lots of little things that could have been done to make the lockdown more bearable for people.

[Elizabeth]

Golf and tennis were suggestions only and I was also thinking of the benefits to young people and families. I think you can have a safe game of pitch and putt up Towneley for not very much money. Good fun for a father and son or two brothers getting on each others nerves under the same roof.
There are other activities as well and while I get some of the warnings expressed I don't think they should let us stop from offering our full support to anything that helps

[Lowbankclaret]

Closing fishing lakes is another measure that has been way over the top. Lots of little things that could have been done to make the lockdown more bearable for people.

There has been a big campaign online to reopen fisheries. I agree you are social distancing but they would be packed with everyone at home.
So agree with people .
DIY stores, outdoor activities, small shops. Give it a couple of weeks and see what the data says.

I also agree with compulsory masks in shops or in a queue , but not if your on walk outside doing social distancing.

[Elizabeth]

Sorry before I'm shot, or mother and daughter or two sisters together

[FactualFrank]

Sorry before I'm shot, or mother and daughter or two sisters together

Or they.

[Lowbankclaret]

A relaxation in lockdown should be accompanied with an enforcement of wearing face masks IMO. It is an altruistic approach. If we are forced to wear a face mask in public, whilst our individual protection is not increased, the populations protection as a whole is increased. However this is dependant upon availability of face masks for everyone, and the supply problems for PPE is currently dictating the governments advice.

There was plenty on Amazon a couple of weeks ago, I suggest get in early before it’s another toilet roll fiasco.

[Elizabeth]

Indeed Frank.
I was questioned the other week as to why I told a joke from a male perspective.
You know this Elizabeth thing

[tim_noone]

A relaxation in lockdown should be accompanied with an enforcement of wearing face masks IMO. It is an altruistic approach. If we are forced to wear a face mask in public, whilst our individual protection is not increased, the populations protection as a whole is increased. However this is dependant upon availability of face masks for everyone, and the supply problems for PPE is currently dictating the governments advice.

Apparently face masks are not going to be compulsory.

[Elizabeth]

Oh, go on then:

A deaf mute steps up to tee off on the first hole of a golf course, when a large burly guy yells " Hey You! Nobody tees off ahead of Big Ralph"
Being deaf the poor guy continues to prepare for his shot, so Ralph runs up thinking the deaf mute is being obstinate, and knocks the poor guy to the ground, kicks his ball away , and prepares for his own shot.
After Ralph has hit the ball and proceeded down the fairway after it, the mute gets up , brushes himself off, waits a moment and again prepares his shot. He hits a beautiful shot straight up the middle of the fairway . It also goes straight at big Ralph , hitting him in the back of the head and knocking him down.
The mute then walks down the fairway , rolls the stunned man around and holds up four fingers to Ralph's face

[Lowbankclaret]

Apparently face masks are not going to be compulsory.

Probably not, but all the evidence is pointing to it being very sensible.

There was a feature on I think Sky yesterday, which a scientific study said even cloth doubled over stopped 95% of droplets from a person who sneezes being released into the air. That’s got to be a good thing in an indoor situation.

[Grumps]

A relaxation in lockdown should be accompanied with an enforcement of wearing face masks IMO. It is an altruistic approach. If we are forced to wear a face mask in public, whilst our individual protection is not increased, the populations protection as a whole is increased. However this is dependant upon availability of face masks for everyone, and the supply problems for PPE is currently dictating the governments advice.

Why wait to be told? If you feel its beneficial to wear one, then wear one!! Surely we don't have to wait to be told.

[CombatClaret]

Closing fishing lakes is another measure that has been way over the top. Lots of little things that could have been done to make the lockdown more bearable for people.

For a lockdown to be effective it needs to look and feel like a lockdown to people so they go along with the rest of society.

If we allow everyone's own specialist interest to be catered for then for then it will be hard to encourage the general populous to stay indoors when they look outside to see all the people going by and ask well why are they outside?
"Oh it's the anglers, the golfers, the rowers, the twitchers, the model aircraft enthusiasts and the extreme calligraphy team. But you, you have to stay indoors mind."

[NewClaret]

Apparently face masks are not going to be compulsory.

Would hate it if face masks were to become compulsory (or even commonplace) in this country, even if it means being in lockdown for longer.

Compulsory wearing of gloves would be more effective, assuming social distancing remains in place.

[Devils_Advocate]

WHO have shared a new Coronavirus First Aid video. I think everyone should watch and take note just in case you find yourself in this situation

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aio3R-hIoEM

[dushanbe]

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but its definitely busier out and about this last few days than in recent weeks. I think people are easing their own lockdown restrictions.

[Zlatan]

Why wait to be told? If you feel its beneficial to wear one, then wear one!! Surely we don't have to wait to be told.

Pointless wearing it unless it’s compulsory. I wouldn’t be wearing it for my own benefit...

[Grumps]

Pointless wearing it unless it’s compulsory. I wouldn’t be wearing it for my own benefit...

Places where social distancing isn't always possible they do evidently have some benefit, so shops, buses etc. Walking round outside at a safe distance they are of no use.

[CombatClaret]

I don't know if anyone else has noticed, but its definitely busier out and about this last few days than in recent weeks. I think people are easing their own lockdown restrictions.

Weather is a huge factor I imagine, I've been cycling nearly every other day (for long term health/medical reasons!) and when it's sunny it's busy.