Covid-19

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Billy Balfour
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Re: Covid-19

Post by Billy Balfour » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:03 pm

They'll bin him when the Brexit trade deal, or no deal, is out of the way.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:07 pm

Billy Balfour wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:03 pm
They'll bin him when the Brexit trade deal, or no deal, is out of the way.
Spot on and its shocking that a totally incompetent PM is being propped up during the biggest crisis this country has faced in donkeys years so a bunch of the richest people around can get the hard Brexit they are so desperate for.
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tiger76
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Re: Is the End in sight for COVID-19?

Post by tiger76 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:12 pm

Let's all hope your sources are correct, but i'd avoid getting your hopes up too early until more data is available.

And you raise an important point by mentioning the US protest marches, i detect far too many people becoming complacent towards this virus, and dropping their guard, that's dangerous, and could lead to a resurgence or a 2nd wave.

The best method of killing covid off is limiting person-to-person transmissions, if you cut off the supply chain so to speak, then eventually the virus will find itself with nowhere to go.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by FactualFrank » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:29 pm

UK quarantine plans and £1,000 penalties confirmed.

Plans to force almost all arrivals to the UK to isolate for 14 days have been confirmed by the home secretary.

Priti Patel told the Commons that Border Force will check that travellers fill out a form with their contact details and location for isolation.

Leaving isolation prematurely in England could result in a fine of up to £1,000 or prosecution, she said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52907229

It should have been £1000 for anybody breaching lockdown. Not £60 or whatever it was.

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Re: Is the End in sight for COVID-19?

Post by bfcjg » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:29 pm

I really do hope so.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:31 pm

FactualFrank wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:29 pm
UK quarantine plans and £1,000 penalties confirmed.

Plans to force almost all arrivals to the UK to isolate for 14 days have been confirmed by the home secretary.

Priti Patel told the Commons that Border Force will check that travellers fill out a form with their contact details and location for isolation.

Leaving isolation prematurely in England could result in a fine of up to £1,000 or prosecution, she said.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52907229

It should have been £1000 for anybody breaching lockdown. Not £60 or whatever it was.
This is all two months two late.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by tiger76 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:39 pm

martin_p wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:31 pm
This is all two months two late.
Yep! the horse has well and truly bolted, this government's slower than a week in the jail, and seemingly these quarantine restrictions will only be for a few weeks, i assume that's to avoid having them in place during the peak tourist season.

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Re: Is the End in sight for COVID-19?

Post by UnderSeige » Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:05 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:12 pm
Let's all hope your sources are correct, but i'd avoid getting your hopes up too early until more data is available.

And you raise an important point by mentioning the US protest marches, i detect far too many people becoming complacent towards this virus, and dropping their guard, that's dangerous, and could lead to a resurgence or a 2nd wave.

The best method of killing covid off is limiting person-to-person transmissions, if you cut off the supply chain so to speak, then eventually the virus will find itself with nowhere to go.
Yes I would have preferred the UK to release the lockdown measures a bit more slowly. Even if the virus does loose it's vigour (and it might) there is always a possibility of a second wave in the winter. An effective containment strategy is still required.

I am more optimistic now than I was earlier in the week though. I guess that's how it is in a pandemic. Differing information by the day.

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Re: Is the End in sight for COVID-19?

Post by Quicknick » Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:20 pm

Yes; now can we close this thread.

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Re: Is the End in sight for COVID-19?

Post by Inchy » Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:23 pm

10-14 days after VE I was expecting a spike in ICU admissions. That hasn’t happened. Hopefully it’s mutated
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Re: Covid-19

Post by joey13 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:38 pm

martin_p wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:31 pm
This is all two months two late.
More like 4 months

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Re: Coronavirus

Post by UnderSeige » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:06 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:43 pm
What happened with Sars and Bird Flu, how did they come up with a cure for those? Did those take 18 months to get to market?
The two other Coronavirus's were SARS and MERS.

SARS 2003
"The SARS outbreak, which reached 29 countries, was ultimately contained using traditional public health measures, such as testing, isolating patients and screening people at airports and other places where they might spread the virus, Gostin said. The strategy is simple: If sick people can be stopped from infecting healthy people, the disease will eventually die off".
https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... a-epidemic

"Then, after four months of fear, “as quickly as it emerged, Sars vanished,”.
https://www.theweek.co.uk/105436/how-di ... rt-and-end

MERS
Affected Korea badly in 2015. They now have effective containment strategies for virus's. As far as I know there are still some limited outbreaks of MERS today.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Bfcboyo » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:13 pm

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/n ... -snarl-up/

Strong words from a man stood taking a picture inches away from somebody stood next to him. What a childish thing to do .

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:20 pm

Bfcboyo wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:13 pm
https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/n ... -snarl-up/

Strong words from a man stood taking a picture inches away from somebody stood next to him. What a childish thing to do .
Im lost as to what you think was childish?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by ksrclaret » Wed Jun 03, 2020 6:09 pm

More deaths today than the rest of the EU countries put together.

Absolutely staggering. What the hell is going on with this incompetent and negligent government?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by aggi » Wed Jun 03, 2020 6:15 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:20 pm
Im lost as to what you think was childish?
I'm assuming he's referring to Burnley's MP commenting how well the system was working whilst in a picture showing how badly it was working. Not sure whether childish would be how I'd describe it though.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:37 pm

This is the Covid news I wanna see more of :lol: :lol: :lol:

Image

FactualFrank
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Re: Covid-19

Post by FactualFrank » Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:52 pm

Blimey, how long was he clapping for!

android
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Re: Covid-19

Post by android » Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:06 pm

aggi wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 10:29 pm
I guess if it really is the case that the life expectancy of those who died is a few months then we should start to see significant negative excess deaths when the country starts to get the virus under control.
That's true as a stand alone point but it ignores the lockdown impact, which seems to be the elephant in the room.

We now have something of the order of 60,000 excess deaths this year (there are different ways of calculating it so no point trying to be too precise) and of the order of 40,000 covid deaths. The covid deaths total is far from completely objective given the mix of "of covid", "with covid" and "suspected of covid" but setting aside that doubt, there is surely a significant gap between excess deaths and deaths directly as a result of covid infection. And yet, neither government, opposition or media seem willing to engage in consideration of the deaths caused by the lockdown - which could provide the additional motivation we need to get out of it and minimise the human cost. The prevalent mindset seems to be that we must do everything to avoid a covid death and lockdown deaths don't enter into the equation. Any such concern is dismissed as being all about money.

Government will not discuss it, as lockdown is on them. The opposition has tied themselves to the earlier, harder, longer lockdown position so I suppose they cannot pivot from that (although opposition to lockdown should be a classic soft left argument - human rights, liberty, mental health, access to healthcare, economic hardship and so on). But where are the BBC, Sky, ITV and the newspapers on this? There is anecdotal evidence of suicides and lack of cancer care but given there is prima facie evidence of thousands of lockdown deaths already - surely worse to come sadly - why is there seemingly such little interest in the human cost of lockdown?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by android » Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:07 pm

Classic timing for my post just after DA's way more interesting scoop !!!

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Re: Covid-19

Post by TheFamilyCat » Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:13 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:37 pm
This is the Covid news I wanna see more of :lol: :lol: :lol:

Image
And more believable than Cummings' "eye sight" story.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Bfcboyo » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:38 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 5:20 pm
Im lost as to what you think was childish?
Trying to point score taking sneaky pictures then delivering snide childish comments when he was stood inches from the next person himself.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Bfcboyo » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:50 pm

I like a gamble and he who dares wins. Holiday is now booked private villa with pool Portugal in July. At a third of the usual cost. Masks at airport and on the plane. Pick a car up and get all the food in then no contact with other ppl until we return.

Now the gamble is will the government lift the14 day isolation before early August for when we return. I feel like the airport and plane will be the risk of picking the virus up , will it be higher than the supermarket or at work , I doubt it.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Devils_Advocate » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:02 pm

Bfcboyo wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:38 pm
Trying to point score taking sneaky pictures then delivering snide childish comments when he was stood inches from the next person himself.
Ok thanks for the response.

He wasn't taking a sneaky picture and in fact on his Twitter account he openly took and shared several more pictures of the situation

The article you shared focuses more on The Burnley MP and comment from other Lancs MPs because its a local story but Bradshaws target of the photo was not Higginbothan who was nothing to do with Bradshaws Twitter post.

The point was to highlight the absolute farce of the vote (and the health risk) which was tabled by Rees-Mogg to get support for Johnson in PMQs. Loads of MPs have criticised what took place including people like Steve Baker who posted a video of him in line taking the p*ss out of the situation.

I dont think there is anything wrong or childish about his comment and I think he is making a valid observation

"No social distancing at all at bottom of Portcullis House escalator as MPs get stuck in a log jam with the queue stretching back to the bottom of the still moving escalator with MPs still pouring down. An absolute disgrace!"

The govt have already done a part u-turn on the motion that passed after a lot of cross-party backlash

Below is a few other photos Bradshaw posted showing the ridiculous situation where a load of MPs ended up piling up on top of each other at the bottom of the escalators unable to go forward or backwards

Image

Image

Image

Hope that gives you a bit better context to what was going on

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Billy Balfour » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:29 pm

Business Secretary Alok Sharma self-isolating and has been tested for Coronavirus. He began feeling unwell in the chamber today, spokesperson says.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by jrgbfc » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:36 pm

Bfcboyo wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:50 pm
I like a gamble and he who dares wins. Holiday is now booked private villa with pool Portugal in July. At a third of the usual cost. Masks at airport and on the plane. Pick a car up and get all the food in then no contact with other ppl until we return.

Now the gamble is will the government lift the14 day isolation before early August for when we return. I feel like the airport and plane will be the risk of picking the virus up , will it be higher than the supermarket or at work , I doubt it.
Doesn't sound like much of a holiday to me. Stuck in a villa with no contact with the outside world? Personally would rather not bother, but each his own.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by timshorts » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:51 pm

TheFamilyCat wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 8:13 pm
And more believable than Cummings' "eye sight" story.
Hardly. A £200,000 house in runcorn?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by joey13 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:08 pm

Billy Balfour wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:29 pm
Business Secretary Alok Sharma self-isolating and has been tested for Coronavirus. He began feeling unwell in the chamber today, spokesperson says.
Just spotted driving up the A1
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Re: Covid-19

Post by Spijed » Wed Jun 03, 2020 11:14 pm

Swedish scientist admits 'A no lockdown approach' didn't work as well as anticipated.

Probably somewhere in the middle is a successful solution.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... rs-tegnell

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Re: Covid-19

Post by martin_p » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:12 am

Billy Balfour wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:29 pm
Business Secretary Alok Sharma self-isolating and has been tested for Coronavirus. He began feeling unwell in the chamber today, spokesperson says.
Wonder who the people stood in the queue next to him for 90 minutes were yesterday? Presumably the world beating track and trace system has advised them to isolate too.
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Re: Covid-19

Post by Damo » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:45 am

Looking forward to the Barry Gardiner outrage thread.
Any minute now
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Re: Covid-19

Post by ksrclaret » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:49 am

martin_p wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:12 am
Wonder who the people stood in the queue next to him for 90 minutes were yesterday? Presumably the world beating track and trace system has advised them to isolate too.
The first incarnation of track and trace was more like world fleeting, so I if I was one of those MPs in Sharma's vicinity I'd be packing my bags for Durham just in case.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Bfcboyo » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:14 am

jrgbfc wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:36 pm
Doesn't sound like much of a holiday to me. Stuck in a villa with no contact with the outside world? Personally would rather not bother, but each his own.
The villa will be the base. Car is hired so we will be discovering the remote beauty of the Algarve daily from quiet beaches and caves to woodland trails , thermal springs and mountains.

Adventure time . We dont really do the hotel sardine conveyor holidays that the mindless masses like anyway. We like to explore and will be comfortable around others or isolated. But each to his own.
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Quicknick
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Re: Covid-19

Post by Quicknick » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:25 am

Bfcboyo wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:14 am
The villa will be the base. Car is hired so we will be discovering the remote beauty of the Algarve daily from quiet beaches and caves to woodland trails , thermal springs and mountains.

Adventure time . We dont really do the hotel sardine conveyor holidays that the mindless masses like anyway. We like to explore and will be comfortable around others or isolated. But each to his own.
Sounds like an excellent idea. I live in Lagos six months a year and the far southwest and the lower west coast are remote, as you suggest, and really worth exploring. Anyway, Portugal is opening up a bit now. You'll have a great time.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Murger » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 am

Damo wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:45 am
Looking forward to the Barry Gardiner outrage thread.
Any minute now
Can't wait for Mr Starmer to hand him his P45 too.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Bfcboyo » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:47 am

Quicknick wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:25 am
Sounds like an excellent idea. I live in Lagos six months a year and the far southwest and the lower west coast are remote, as you suggest, and really worth exploring. Anyway, Portugal is opening up a bit now. You'll have a great time.
Thanks. I will msg nearer the time if I'm struggling for ideas although a quick search on Google has thrown up a ton of things to do off the beaten track.
We are staying in Carvoeiro .

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Tall Paul » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:52 am

Murger wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 am


Can't wait for Mr Starmer to hand him his P45 too.
What job does Starmer employ him in?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Devils_Advocate » Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:08 am

Murger wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 am


Can't wait for Mr Starmer to hand him his P45 too.
He kicked him out of govt in April. Its now up to his constituents if they want to axe him as an MP

On the subject of what he did I think he's an absolute d*ck. As an MP he should be leading by example and not getting involved in crowds of protesters when we should be social distancing.

There are plenty of other ways he could have shown his support to the protesters but this was not one of them

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Re: Covid-19

Post by Spijed » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:22 am

Murger wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 am


Can't wait for Mr Starmer to hand him his P45 too.
Why should he when we know there are certain people that Boris Johnson would never ever sack, regardless of what they would do.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by martin_p » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:28 am

Spijed wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:22 am
Why should he when we know there are certain people that Boris Johnson would never ever sack, regardless of what they would do.
I was going to say! Those in power can do pretty much what they want and not be brought to task, except by public ‘outrage’. The precedent has been set, by the man at the very top.
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Re: Covid-19

Post by UnderSeige » Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:00 am

Bfcboyo wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:50 pm
I like a gamble and he who dares wins. Holiday is now booked private villa with pool Portugal in July. At a third of the usual cost. Masks at airport and on the plane. Pick a car up and get all the food in then no contact with other ppl until we return.

Now the gamble is will the government lift the14 day isolation before early August for when we return. I feel like the airport and plane will be the risk of picking the virus up , will it be higher than the supermarket or at work , I doubt it.
A few points:
  • Cases and fatalities in Portugal are much lower than the UK 3261 and 142 respectively. In the UK they are 4124 and 585.
  • The gamble does not just affect you it is a gamble that involves the people/family travelling with you and also any person that you encounter during your holiday.
  • Will the 'airport/plane risk' be lower than supermarket/work? Probably. It all depends on how good the safety factors are at your work. I think that supermarkets are one of the highest risk places to go. It only needs someone with the virus to cough and virus particles will remain in the air for around 3 hours. I listened to an interview with the CEO of Ryan Air the other day. He made the point that studies have shown that mask wearing by everyone in a building/plane reduces the spread of the virus by 90%
  • Will the government lift the quarantine? It all depends on the whether the daily virus cases numbers continue to fall over the next month. There is currently a lot of reckless activity (protest marches, beaches, people acting like it's all over etc.) that should cause the virus to spread rapidly throughout the UK by the end of this month. If this doesn't happen it could indicate that something has happened to make the virus less contagious at least for now. Then the government are likely to lift a lot more restrictions - including quarantine of flight travellers. On the other hand, if the virus takes off again we are likely to be back in lockdown by August.
  • You will be both helping and exploiting the holiday/airline companies and their employees. If you are getting the holiday at a third of the cost I hope you tip heavily. A lot of those employees will be very grateful
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Re: Covid-19

Post by Loyalclaret » Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:47 am

Article on Spain's reporting of zero coronavirus deaths in two days

https://www.ft.com/content/77eb7a13-cd2 ... 6708b43673

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Re: Covid-19

Post by AndrewJB » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:17 pm

Did anyone see Channel 4’s Dispatches program last night?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by tiger76 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:34 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:08 am
He kicked him out of govt in April. Its now up to his constituents if they want to axe him as an MP

On the subject of what he did I think he's an absolute d*ck. As an MP he should be leading by example and not getting involved in crowds of protesters when we should be social distancing.

There are plenty of other ways he could have shown his support to the protesters but this was not one of them
His idiotic actions really undermine the argument that MP'S are making about attending the HOC, additionally as an MP he has the public platform to air his views to a large audience, without resorting to marching when we're supposed to be observing the rules.

What this CV crisis has shown is that there is many MP'S of all parties who are thick as mince, and government advisers and scientists are hardly as bright as you'd imagine either.

He's only got a majority of 8,000 or so, so it's not impossible he could be unseated at the next GE, however given he's in his 60's now, he might well retire, or be elevated to the Lords.

His Wiki page throws up some interesting facts both his father, and his son played or are playing football, his boy is currently at Wycombe Wanderers.

Given that Brent has the one of the highest death rates from covid-19 in the country, you'd have thought he'd have had that at the top of his agenda.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by FactualFrank » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:43 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:17 pm
Did anyone see Channel 4’s Dispatches program last night?
I missed it, can you sum it up?

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Re: Covid-19

Post by AndrewJB » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:55 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... is-at-pmqs

Johnson was never going to be a first rate prime minister, but he’s turned out worse that I could have imagined.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/202 ... lert-level

The easing of the lockdown isn’t backed by scientific advice, and above we can see the government tried to get the threat level reduced, against medical advice. Effectively saying now the economy is more important than people’s lives.

AndrewJB
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Re: Covid-19

Post by AndrewJB » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:56 pm

FactualFrank wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:43 pm
I missed it, can you sum it up?
I didn’t see it.

FactualFrank
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Re: Covid-19

Post by FactualFrank » Thu Jun 04, 2020 1:02 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:56 pm
I didn’t see it.
I guess you can't then :)

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Re: Covid-19

Post by TheFamilyCat » Thu Jun 04, 2020 1:17 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:17 pm
Did anyone see Channel 4’s Dispatches program last night?
Yes, I watched it. I tried to keep an open-mind, knowing full well that a programme on C4 called "Did the Government Get It Wrong?" may be a little biased.

There were plenty of examples of where the government hadn't followed scientific advice. Overall it seemed to me to be the scientists preparing for being made the scapegoats and getting in early, telling their side.

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Re: Covid-19

Post by android » Thu Jun 04, 2020 1:26 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:55 pm
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... is-at-pmqs

Johnson was never going to be a first rate prime minister, but he’s turned out worse that I could have imagined.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/202 ... lert-level

The easing of the lockdown isn’t backed by scientific advice, and above we can see the government tried to get the threat level reduced, against medical advice. Effectively saying now the economy is more important than people’s lives.
I think he is saying that lives lost to the lockdown matter just as much as lives lost to the virus. See my post at 8.06pm last might, which generated zero interest - although it did have unfair competition from the Sunday Sport.

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