Covid-19

[NewClaret]

And who is deciding who the lucky 25% are? What will be the criteria that needs to be met? Under a certain age? Doesn't suffer from asthma? Already had the virus?

I just don't see that working, therefore it's all fans back in or none at all, in my opinion.

Sounds horrendous. Think we’re better waiting until we can all go back.

Having just posted my disagreement about wearing masks in shops, I would wear one to a match. I’d have thought in that setting, compulsory sanitising, Temperature checks and masks would be sufficient by say September (when hopefully cases will be much lower)?

[UnderSeige]

Does the face mask thing actually work? I know the theory, that if you wear a face mask your sneezes will be caught in the mask and won't spread around the vicinity.

But will people keep the masks on while they sneeze? What they are being asked to do, basically, is sneeze into a handkerchief which is wrapped tightly round their face, and then after sneezing keep that handkerchief tightly wrapped round their face. Who will choose to keep a snotty handkerchief on their face? Most sneezers, I would guess, will lift the mask to sneeze into a handkerchief in the old fashioned way.

anyone any experience, either first hand or second hand?

I think it reduces the spread of the virus by about 90% if everyone wears a mask properly. Most people won't be sneezing when they go out.

If they sneeze a snotty one into the mask (ache-chzto) like you say they will be inclined to take it off and will likely to have crud all over their hands. If they take it off they will then not be able to enter shops legally. It is probably better to carry a spare mask, a paper hanky and a small bottle of hand sanitiser. If a person is sneezing a lot they shouldn't be going out anyway. That applies to people who have COVID and even those who just have a cold.

[cricketfieldclarets]

And who is deciding who the lucky 25% are? What will be the criteria that needs to be met? Under a certain age? Doesn't suffer from asthma? Already had the virus?

I just don't see that working, therefore it's all fans back in or none at all, in my opinion.

I dont know.

But a staggered approach makes sense on a lot of levels.

[NottsClaret]

You're overthinking it a bit, dsr. Just sneeze into a handkerchief or tissue as normal, then put your mask back on.

Seen it described as 'horrific' elsewhere. Jeez, you just need to wear a mask in a shop for half an hour so we can all help each other for a bit. This isn't horrific. Anyway, it helps with hay fever in the summer and flu in the winter, so even if Covid19 is a deep state 5G hoax, it's only going to help once you get past the trauma of putting it on.

I'm not unduly bothered about Covid19, haven't been from the start, but still follow the rules because one day I'll be old or ill.

[Zlatan]

Just tell the conspiracy theorists that the mask will protect them from the 5G facial recognition surveillance cameras and the metal strip interferes with the vaccine implant from Bill Gates.

[UnderSeige]

But if it prevents round two I’m all for it.

Too true. We don't want to go into 'second lockdown' which could be longer if in winter and with less generous financial help from the government.

In some countries 'wearing masks', 'social distancing' and 'contact tracing' has been enough to prevent them ever having to go into lockdown. They started their 'containment strategies' at the start when case rates were very low.

[fidelcastro]

I dont know.

But a staggered approach makes sense on a lot of levels.

Not for those who will miss out when they want to attend it won't.

[UnderSeige]

And who is deciding who the lucky 25% are? What will be the criteria that needs to be met? Under a certain age? Doesn't suffer from asthma? Already had the virus?

I just don't see that working, therefore it's all fans back in or none at all, in my opinion.

I agree. I won't be renewing my season ticket until I can be certain it's back to normal. I enjoy going to matches but attitude to football is that I can 'take it or leave it'.

Just allowing certain groups of people in, according to their 'virus risk profile' would also involve discrimination against the disabled, elderly and BAME groups. If you were also allowing attendance according to 'virus risk profile' you would need to discriminate against people who are overweight.

[Swizzlestick]

Staggered entry fraught with all sorts of difficulties, as outlined. It’s all or nothing.

[UnderSeige]

Face masks are horrific.

In some cases they are an improvement.

[UnderSeige]

I don't know either. I sneeze more than most - it's congenital, not caused by any illness. Hay fever sufferers sneeze a fair bit. Whether the mask will help by keeping out the pollen, I don't know.

It will help to keep out the pollen. I have hay fever. I don't sneeze much if I use one of the 'over the counter nasel sprays'.

Perhaps if you sneeze more than most you have some kind of allergy to something.

A good tip for holding back a sneeze is the 'tip of your tongue'. Press it against the roof of your mouth.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Not for those who will miss out when they want to attend it won't.

Such is life. I wanted to go to sheffield united. Gone to most away games for 30+ years. didnt get a ticket. such is life.

[UnderSeige]

Sounds horrendous. Think we’re better waiting until we can all go back.

Having just posted my disagreement about wearing masks in shops, I would wear one to a match. I’d have thought in that setting, compulsory sanitising, Temperature checks and masks would be sufficient by say September (when hopefully cases will be much lower)?

We don't know that cases will be much lower in September. They might be. They might be higher. They might be lower in September and then higher in November. We also might have a vaccine by October.

We just don't know at the moment.

[claretonthecoast1882]

I dont know.

But a staggered approach makes sense on a lot of levels.

Makes sense to me as well, we have to start the process of moving on at some stage. Sadly we have an element of selfish fans who if it was decided the 25% of fans could go to home games and they got say Brighton at home but the next game was Liverpool they wouldn't want to go to that one and start complaining about who we are playing.

[UnderSeige]

Just tell the conspiracy theorists that the mask will protect them from the 5G facial recognition surveillance cameras and the metal strip interferes with the vaccine implant from Bill Gates.

The pandemic could even be a conspiracy against conspiracy. With aircraft being grounded the conspirators are limited in sprinkling the people with biological agents through chem trails.

[NottsClaret]

Makes sense to me as well, we have to start the process of moving on at some stage. Sadly we have an element of selfish fans who if it was decided the 25% of fans could go to home games and they got say Brighton at home but the next game was Liverpool they wouldn't want to go to that one and start complaining about who we are playing.

Yeah, the argument against it seems to be 'if I can't go to the games I want to, I don't want anyone else to either'.

[martin_p]

Just tell the conspiracy theorists that the mask will protect them from the 5G facial recognition surveillance cameras and the metal strip interferes with the vaccine implant from Bill Gates.

There was a story in the news yesterday of a guy in the states who went to a ‘Covid party’. This is apparently something that people who think the virus is fake do. Someone who has tested positive holds a big party with all his/her fellow conspiracy theorists to prove that no one will catch it and it’s therefore a fake. Anyway he did catch it and died. Apparently he did admit that he was mistaken to think that it was all fake on his death bed.

[martin_p]

Makes sense to me as well, we have to start the process of moving on at some stage. Sadly we have an element of selfish fans who if it was decided the 25% of fans could go to home games and they got say Brighton at home but the next game was Liverpool they wouldn't want to go to that one and start complaining about who we are playing.

I go to watch Burnley so I’d be delighted whoever the opposition was.

[Rileybobs]

Perhaps if you sneeze more than most you have some kind of allergy to something.

I ‘suffer’ from ‘photic sneeze reflex’ - where sunlight and sudden changes from dark to light can trigger a sneeze. Up until recently I thought that this was normal and affected everyone but on bringing it up at work it turns out not.

[Rileybobs]

As for staggered approach to attendances at football, it will cause a lot of headaches but surely it is better for some people to be able to attend games than none - for everyone involved?

[cricketfieldclarets]

Yeah, the argument against it seems to be 'if I can't go to the games I want to, I don't want anyone else to either'.

Exactly what it is.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Makes sense to me as well, we have to start the process of moving on at some stage. Sadly we have an element of selfish fans who if it was decided the 25% of fans could go to home games and they got say Brighton at home but the next game was Liverpool they wouldn't want to go to that one and start complaining about who we are playing.

Spot on. Better to see how things go slowly and sensibly, especially with any new measures (temporary or permanent). And then go from there.

My view (even if I miss out) is that its better that some can go and some miss out than none can go and all miss out.

[UnderSeige]

Yeah, the argument against it seems to be 'if I can't go to the games I want to, I don't want anyone else to either'.

I don't want to go to the games if everyone can't go. It would be like going to a pre-season friendly. You wouldn't even have the background crowd noise that you get on the TV.

If you were to disperse the crowd it would also mean that a lot of people would have to move seats. You wouldn't be able to sit next to your mates in a bunch. Singing and chanting would be difficult with fans separated from each other. It would be unlikely that refreshment bars would be open. Toilet facilities would be a major 'virus risk' but you would have to have them.

There would also be the discrimination issues. The club has been excellent in it's measures against racial discrimination. It provides reduced season ticket prices for the elderly and provides good disabled facilities. I don't think it would want to divert from all that good work by not allowing those groups in.

[UnderSeige]

I ‘suffer’ from ‘photic sneeze reflex’ - where sunlight and sudden changes from dark to light can trigger a sneeze. Up until recently I thought that this was normal and affected everyone but on bringing it up at work it turns out not.

Have you seen an optician about it? Perhaps some tinted glasses would help.

[NottsClaret]

I don't want to go to the games if everyone can't go. It would be like going to a pre-season friendly. You wouldn't even have the background crowd noise that you get on the TV.

If you were to disperse the crowd it would also mean that a lot of people would have to move seats. You wouldn't be able to sit next to your mates in a bunch. Singing and chanting would be difficult with fans separated from each other. It would be unlikely that refreshment bars would be open.

You know you wouldn't be forced to go, right?

[Spijed]

I don't want to go to the games if everyone can't go. It would be like going to a pre-season friendly. You wouldn't even have the background crowd noise that you get on the TV.

If you were to disperse the crowd it would also mean that a lot of people would have to move seats. You wouldn't be able to sit next to your mates in a bunch. Singing and chanting would be difficult with fans separated from each other. It would be unlikely that refreshment bars would be open. Toilet facilities would be a major 'virus risk' but you would have to have them.

There would also be the discrimination issues. The club has been excellent in it's measures against racial discrimination. It provides reduced season ticket prices for the elderly and provides good disabled facilities. I don't think it would want to divert from all that good work by not allowing those groups in.

What about clubs who really need gate receipts?

Surely for them, a half filled stadium is better than an empty one?

[Rileybobs]

Have you seen an optician about it? Perhaps some tinted glasses would help.

No, it doesn't cause me any bother. I just sneeze when I leave a dark place and emerge into brightness. More often in winter when the sun is low.

[Rileybobs]

Are people just assuming that the attendance criteria will be based on age/health etc. or has this been published? I would assume that 25% attendance would give adequate social distancing, particularly if face masks are worn, so I don't know why any discrimination would be needed.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Are people just assuming that the attendance criteria will be based on age/health etc. or has this been published? I would assume that 25% attendance would give adequate social distancing, particularly if face masks are worn, so I don't know why any discrimination would be needed.

Exactly. Those at risk would need to take the appropriate risks and measures themselves.

If someone obese, over 70 and unwell was comfortable with the risk than thats there choice if no shielding rules apply. Nobody will be forced to go on

[cricketfieldclarets]

[jrgbfc]

We have to get fans back in grounds as soon as possible, even if its 25% capacity. Would be a nightmare to arrange though, what about all the people who take kids on or elderly relatives? Group ticket applications, so you either all get tickets or none of you?

[Grumps]

We have to get fans back in grounds as soon as possible, even if its 25% capacity. Would be a nightmare to arrange though, what about all the people who take kids on or elderly relatives? Group ticket applications, so you either all get tickets or none of you?

It's quite clear BFC have very limited IT infrastructure. I cannot see them being able to organise any type of fancy booking system, that's not a criticism, because nobody saw this scenario happening, so I don't think they will let anyone in until its simple to manage, such as season ticket holders only, with no away fans.

[UnderSeige]

You know you wouldn't be forced to go, right?

No I wouldn't. I am a season ticket holder but as far as football goes I can 'take it or leave it'. I just wouldn't bother going.

[UnderSeige]

What about clubs who really need gate receipts?

Surely for them, a half filled stadium is better than an empty one?

Good point. As long as it's safe and 'cost effective' to put a match on with a reduced crowd.

[UnderSeige]

No, it doesn't cause me any bother. I just sneeze when I leave a dark place and emerge into brightness. More often in winter when the sun is low.

I get a bit of that too. It's not a real bother. I am not sure but I think it might have been caused by doing a lot of welding when I was younger.

[UnderSeige]

Are people just assuming that the attendance criteria will be based on age/health etc. or has this been published? I would assume that 25% attendance would give adequate social distancing, particularly if face masks are worn, so I don't know why any discrimination would be needed.

Then that would solve the 'discrimination problem'.

The reason why some think it would discriminate against certain groups is that some posters from a while back were arguing that the ground could be opened up but that the elderly and those with health conditions would have to be excluded.

[ŽižkovClaret]

Seeing people say they might be put off visiting the high street if they have to wear a mask.

Country of bloody snowflakes, what happened to you?

[UnderSeige]

We have to get fans back in grounds as soon as possible, even if its 25% capacity. Would be a nightmare to arrange though, what about all the people who take kids on or elderly relatives? Group ticket applications, so you either all get tickets or none of you?

You would all likely have to sit apart as well if you were not from the same household.

[FactualFrank]

Just ordered: https://shop.burnleyfc.com/claretsstore/FACEMASK

If I'm going to look like a prat, I might as well look like a Burnley supporting prat.

[Volvoclaret]

In some cases they are an improvement.

Is this Bosscayt on the Chase?

[NewClaret]

We don't know that cases will be much lower in September. They might be. They might be higher. They might be lower in September and then higher in November. We also might have a vaccine by October.

We just don't know at the moment.

True.

I’d just have thought a combination of hand sanitising, temp checks and masks would be enough to lower the risks to acceptable levels.

[UnderSeige]

Returning with 25% capacity could have many problems.

Would it be cost effective?
You would only be able to charge the people attending. You can't expect the other 75% to pay the full price of the season ticket. There would have to be some sort of deal with the TV companies to allow the excluded season ticket holders to watch the match on TV (perhaps in a similar way to the 2 free NOWTV tickets). I am not sure how easy this would be to arrange or even if the TV companies would be showing every match. BT might prove awkward.

There are costs to putting matches on (police, stewards, ground staff, cleaners etc.) I can't see these costs being much lower with a 25% crowd - especially since extra pandemic measures will be required. You wouldn't need to pay catering staff but neither would you get the revenue from the food and drink bars. There is a rumour that 87% of the clubs match day revenue comes from Twix sales alone .

The exclusions could also be sensitive since these would likely be against groups who are vulnerable to the virus. These would be elderly, disabled, people with health conditions, BAME, overweight, smokers etc. I think one of the players recently said that the fan base needs to be more diverse. It's a very sensitive issue among the players and club at the moment also. If we start excluding groups, even though it's for health reasons, it might reflect badly on the club.

Perhaps there would be ways round this but they might be at a financial cost to the club as well as proving difficult to arrange. One or more of the following might help to redress the balance:

• Enable free access to TV matches for season ticket holders.

• Reduced price of season ticket for those excluded. Possibly half price or less.

• Discount on the following season's ticket price for the excluded.

The lucky 25% would be at large cost to the club. Perhaps they could pay a little extra on their season ticket price.

[FactualFrank]

Is this 25% back in, a theory, or has it been covered in the media somewhere?

[Rileybobs]

In yesterday’s Guardian Football Weekly podcast they suggested that the PL were in talks to enable 40% attendance from the start of next season. Haven’t seen this elsewhere though.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Is this 25% back in, a theory, or has it been covered in the media somewhere?

I had heard from a pretty good source that we would be back in september on 25% capacity. Posted a thread on it which disappeared. Dont know why or if that suggests something in it or not.

But I suspect its likely to be the case.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Returning with 25% capacity could have many problems.

Would it be cost effective?
You would only be able to charge the people attending. You can't expect the other 75% to pay the full price of the season ticket. There would have to be some sort of deal with the TV companies to allow the excluded season ticket holders to watch the match on TV (perhaps in a similar way to the 2 free NOWTV tickets). I am not sure how easy this would be to arrange or even if the TV companies would be showing every match. BT might prove awkward.

There are costs to putting matches on (police, stewards, ground staff, cleaners etc.) I can't see these costs being much lower with a 25% crowd - especially since extra pandemic measures will be required. You wouldn't need to pay catering staff but neither would you get the revenue from the food and drink bars. There is a rumour that 87% of the clubs match day revenue comes from Twix sales alone .

The exclusions could also be sensitive since these would likely be against groups who are vulnerable to the virus. These would be elderly, disabled, people with health conditions, BAME, overweight, smokers etc. I think one of the players recently said that the fan base needs to be more diverse. It's a very sensitive issue among the players and club at the moment also. If we start excluding groups, even though it's for health reasons, it might reflect badly on the club.

Perhaps there would be ways round this but they might be at a financial cost to the club as well as proving difficult to arrange. One or more of the following might help to redress the balance:

• Enable free access to TV matches for season ticket holders.

• Reduced price of season ticket for those excluded. Possibly half price or less.

• Discount on the following season's ticket price for the excluded.

The lucky 25% would be at large cost to the club. Perhaps they could pay a little extra on their season ticket price.

We played Sunderland this season in front of around 7,000 which is about 33% capacity. Pre Season even less fans usually. As are early league cup games which dont have the same following sunderland do.

I am sure all stands were open too.

[taio]

I had heard from a pretty good source that we would be back in september on 25% capacity. Posted a thread on it which disappeared. Dont know why or if that suggests something in it or not.

But I suspect its likely to be the case.

It's what is being reported in the media so no big secret.

[cricketfieldclarets]

It's what is being reported in the media so no big secret.

absolutely so unsure why it disappeared.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Blackburn and Pendle could face stricter measures.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-l ... e-53400376

[tiger76]

Deaths are definitely falling in the last few weeks.

Deaths up by 26 in England, none in Scotland and NI

A further 26 people who tested positive for Covid-19 have died, bringing the total number of confirmed reported deaths in hospitals in England to 29,103, NHS England has said.

Patients were aged between 49 and 94 years old, and one person, aged 71, had no known underlying health conditions.

Scotland and Northern Ireland have recorded no new deaths from the virus.

There were two more deaths recorded in Wales.

Separate UK-wide figures will be released later.

6th straight day no deaths have been recorded in Scotland, and NI have been reporting no deaths,,or very low deaths for a few weeks now.

So progress is being made, it's whether when the lockdown is eased, these low figures can be maintained.