Covid-19

[KateR]

9th March is a bit more than a week earlier than 23rd March when the lockdown started.

in fairness he did say he and almost everyone he knew was in lockdown a week or two before the Gov. lockdown, which is not quite true I don't think but we all lose track of time so not a hanging offense but not a reason to lie to blame the Gov. either.

[martin_p]

in fairness he did say he and almost everyone he knew was in lockdown a week or two before the Gov. lockdown, which is not quite true I don't think but we all lose track of time so not a hanging offense but not a reason to lie to blame the Gov. either.

In fairness the post I responded to said

The lockdown has worked because the public accepted it was/is needed

Would they have accepted it in the same way a week earlier, when the number of deaths were?

[AndrewJB]

Yes Andrew comes up with some outlandish suggestions,but that one takes the biscuit,how does he propose we change the government,when many MP'S aren't even sitting in Westminster,and why would Keir Starmer even agree to such a request,in purely political terms if the CV crisis is being handled so badly,Labour's best bet is too sit back offer constructive advice,and wait for the government to collapse,Oh! dear they've got an 80 seat majority you say,Oh! well i guess Labour will have to wait until the next election then.At least that gives them 4 years to get their house in order,and rid themselves of the Corbyn cultists,whether they take that chance is another altogether,Starmer's a sensible sort,i'm not sure some of his backbenchers are the type to wait,if Labour really fancy their chances they could call a VONC,but there's more chance of Burnley lifting a domestic cup,then them carrying the house,i admire Andrew's passion,but you have to deal in the land of real politik,oh yeah! i forgot he's a GP member.

A government of national unity steered us through WW2. Was that outlandish?

A problem for the Tories is many of them don’t believe in government intervention. A lot of them have disdain for the public sector, and over the last ten years two health secretaries have had serious run ins with the employees of the NHS. Lansley and Hunt alienated many people. Judging by Hancock’s dismissive call for Khan (a doctor of many years service) to “watch her tone” in parliament the other day (all she had done was ask a question), I’d say he too is not on many people’s Christmas card list either. As well as this there is a suspicion that Johnson filled cabinet posts with “yes people” promoted for having the right brexit views, but possibly beyond their abilities. This would go some way to explain some of the monumental foul ups we’ve seen. The Home Secretary has been noticeably absent from view. Maybe she’s waiting for the “eleventy-th hour”?

Having a national government of unity could bring in fresh points of view, and would go further to unite the country, and if it succeeds in getting us through this better than we have, that’s good for everyone.

[CombatClaret]

duplicate

[Taffy on the wing]

Keith from my perspective there are numerous nuances that get's us to today but in terms of lockdown, if Germany had done it earlier they could have reduced the number of deaths also and therefore I totally agree doing the lock down earlier would have been very beneficial, no doubt, no argument from me. However if your medical and scientific advisors say something different you would be absolutely stupid to go against them and I don't believe the Gov. did.

Maybe the thought was similar to Sweden but as more data came in there was a change of advice and therefore the plan changed, if more people had listened at the beginning and stayed home and isolated we would have saved thousands of lives, but they didn't.

Maybe if the Chinese had shutdown all travel in and out sooner it would have saved a world pandemic

Maybe if WHO had called a Pandemic 2 months earlier many other countries would have closed down earlier and saved tens of thousands but they didn't

Why are "blacks" being touted as twice as likely to die as white people, what is the density population of London versus Milan/Madrid/Barcelona/Paris/New York & LA, what is the back population in those density areas to get a good comparison.

I don't know but think they are all valid questions and many more that need to be answered, so we can see the final outcome of what has and what has still to unfold, including how we all do during a phased release of lockdowns.

Yes there are simple statements that they could have and should have done better, that is a given, as within your example, they could/should have locked down earlier and stronger plus PPE should have been more readily available, a change to rolling out the testing program is another. To be honest I think one side is saying everything, absolutely everything is the Governments fault and BJ is the main culprit while some others are saying no, not everything, particularly since we don't know the facts yet. I also don't believe I have seen anyone say we should not have a full and open review with all the failures and mitigations to prevent it happening again, but some, including me, are saying now is not the time.

Disingenuous clap trap at best.

[dsr]

A government of national unity steered us through WW2. Was that outlandish?

A problem for the Tories is many of them don’t believe in government intervention. A lot of them have disdain for the public sector, and over the last ten years two health secretaries have had serious run ins with the employees of the NHS. Lansley and Hunt alienated many people. Judging by Hancock’s dismissive call for Khan (a doctor of many years service) to “watch her tone” in parliament the other day (all she had done was ask a question), I’d say he too is not on many people’s Christmas card list either. As well as this there is a suspicion that Johnson filled cabinet posts with “yes people” promoted for having the right brexit views, but possibly beyond their abilities. This would go some way to explain some of the monumental foul ups we’ve seen. The Home Secretary has been noticeably absent from view. Maybe she’s waiting for the “eleventy-th hour”?

Having a national government of unity could bring in fresh points of view, and would go further to unite the country, and if it succeeds in getting us through this better than we have, that’s good for everyone.

For once I almost agree with you (the second paragraph, not the first or third). The tories don't much believe in government intervention, which is why they gave the NHS more or less independence from government interference - that's what Public Health England was all about. The government provides the funds, increasing in real terms every year, and the newly independent PHE looks after them.

Which is why criticism of the Health Minister for not checking the dates on the face masks and gowns is absurd. It wasn't his job to see the stocks are kept up to date. PHE was supposed to do that in its guise as overlords of the NHS, and it failed miserably.

It's a valid criticism of the government to say that PHE should never have been formed and the NHS should have stayed under Departent of Health control. It's also a valid criticism to say that PHE has spent its money foolishly and should have stockpiled more and should have controlled that stock better - if any private company finds that 45% of its stock had been allowed to go out of date, not because no-one wanted it but because they had used the wrong stuff first, then heads would roll. One of the faults of government generally is lack of accountability.

I can well believe that ministers are promoted beyond their capabilities, but so are many of the civil servants they have to work with. Hancock shouldn't need to be able to find where the necessary PPE can be found; it's not his job. His job is to say to his Permanent Secretary that PPe must be found and the Permanent Secretary runs it through his department. If the Permanent Secretary then sits on his backside saying this is how we always do it, it can't be done any other way, then Hancock's fault is the fault of not putting a rocket up the Permanent Secretary's backside and making him get a move on. I don't for a moment think that Hancock hasn't told his department that PPE must be found; but the department does not have the ability to do it, and crucially, does not have the common sense to find someone else who can.

[tiger76]

A government of national unity steered us through WW2. Was that outlandish?

A problem for the Tories is many of them don’t believe in government intervention. A lot of them have disdain for the public sector, and over the last ten years two health secretaries have had serious run ins with the employees of the NHS. Lansley and Hunt alienated many people. Judging by Hancock’s dismissive call for Khan (a doctor of many years service) to “watch her tone” in parliament the other day (all she had done was ask a question), I’d say he too is not on many people’s Christmas card list either. As well as this there is a suspicion that Johnson filled cabinet posts with “yes people” promoted for having the right brexit views, but possibly beyond their abilities. This would go some way to explain some of the monumental foul ups we’ve seen. The Home Secretary has been noticeably absent from view. Maybe she’s waiting for the “eleventy-th hour”?

Having a national government of unity could bring in fresh points of view, and would go further to unite the country, and if it succeeds in getting us through this better than we have, that’s good for everyone.

A government of national unity is a totally different suggestion,i'd not be against that for a temporary period,but i don't know if it's wise for Labour to enter into a national unity government now,but if politicians across the house can make it work then i'm all for that,you raise some valid points around Priti Patel for one,mind you after her appearance at the press briefing i'm not surprised they're hiding her away.She should never have been brought back into the cabinet in the first place after her previous faux-pas.

Rosena Allin-Khan isn't the only Labour MP working on the front line to speak out,Nadia Whittome has also,and due to her views she's now been made redundant from her care worker role https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... -52568038 the BBC link has more details i'll leave other readers to decide for themselves who's telling the truth.

[CombatClaret]

Two weeks earlier? Now I know you tell porkies

Why?
A week or two I said, I live in London which has been a couple weeks ahead this whole time.
I'm self employed in an industry that was already starting to wind down by then, should I have been out riding the underground just for the fun of it?

I had a small supply of N95 masks, gloves for myself as well as powdered milk and other long life goods delivered by mid February.
Didn't take a genius to see which way it was going, could see the writing on the wall well before the government had to admit the horse had bolted.

[KateR]

Disingenuous clap trap at best.

is that, puerile attempt to belittle with zero knowledge or ability to debate any point, the best you've got?

[AndrewJB]

For once I almost agree with you (the second paragraph, not the first or third). The tories don't much believe in government intervention, which is why they gave the NHS more or less independence from government interference - that's what Public Health England was all about. The government provides the funds, increasing in real terms every year, and the newly independent PHE looks after them.

Which is why criticism of the Health Minister for not checking the dates on the face masks and gowns is absurd. It wasn't his job to see the stocks are kept up to date. PHE was supposed to do that in its guise as overlords of the NHS, and it failed miserably.

It's a valid criticism of the government to say that PHE should never have been formed and the NHS should have stayed under Departent of Health control. It's also a valid criticism to say that PHE has spent its money foolishly and should have stockpiled more and should have controlled that stock better - if any private company finds that 45% of its stock had been allowed to go out of date, not because no-one wanted it but because they had used the wrong stuff first, then heads would roll. One of the faults of government generally is lack of accountability.

I can well believe that ministers are promoted beyond their capabilities, but so are many of the civil servants they have to work with. Hancock shouldn't need to be able to find where the necessary PPE can be found; it's not his job. His job is to say to his Permanent Secretary that PPe must be found and the Permanent Secretary runs it through his department. If the Permanent Secretary then sits on his backside saying this is how we always do it, it can't be done any other way, then Hancock's fault is the fault of not putting a rocket up the Permanent Secretary's backside and making him get a move on. I don't for a moment think that Hancock hasn't told his department that PPE must be found; but the department does not have the ability to do it, and crucially, does not have the common sense to find someone else who can.

You think the government of national unity during the war was outlandish? I know bringing Labour into government brought about the Labour landslide of ‘45, but without that national government we could not have won the war.

I could go further and point out the Labour government and consequent welfare state was a huge bulwark against communism, as well as creating the NHS.

But you think this government is handling the crisis well enough that we don’t need another unity government? I think time will tell us different.

[Taffy on the wing]

is that, puerile attempt to belittle with zero knowledge or ability to debate any point, the best you've got?

Read it!.......it's just rambling, made-up claptrap.

[KateR]

Read it!.......it's just rambling, made-up claptrap.

come on be a man don't be a child like you normally are, sat behind your little keyboard calling me a liar for the world to see, prove it, take any single point you want and prove I have made something up and it's an outright lie as you say it is.

you've flirted enough like the shy little boy, move in like a man and kiss me, here's your chance.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Apr 7th Confirmed Cases UK 4,4,80

May 7th Confirmed Cases UK 4,867

Cases are actually rising in the UK due to the complete incompetence of this shambolic tory government and the worst prime minister in history...

[AndrewJB]

A government of national unity is a totally different suggestion,i'd not be against that for a temporary period,but i don't know if it's wise for Labour to enter into a national unity government now,but if politicians across the house can make it work then i'm all for that,you raise some valid points around Priti Patel for one,mind you after her appearance at the press briefing i'm not surprised they're hiding her away.She should never have been brought back into the cabinet in the first place after her previous faux-pas.

Rosena Allin-Khan isn't the only Labour MP working on the front line to speak out,Nadia Whittome has also,and due to her views she's now been made redundant from her care worker role https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-n ... -52568038 the BBC link has more details i'll leave other readers to decide for themselves who's telling the truth.

A government of national unity was what I was originally suggesting, mirroring Colburn’s WW2 example. Apologies if it sounded otherwise.

There’s this: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... rus-crisis

A government more worried about public opinion than saving lives.

[NewClaret]

183 pages of “the Tories are doing a terrible job”, “no they’re not - they’re doing okay”. You’d struggle to get 183 pages of football chat if you put all of them together over the last few months. Shall we rename this site Up the Westminster?

[KateR]

183 pages, pffff, Brexit is up to 445 pages and that's got another year to run yet as we come/transfer out of this virus chit chat.

[taio]

A government of national unity was what I was originally suggesting, mirroring Colburn’s WW2 example. Apologies if it sounded otherwise.

There’s this: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... rus-crisis

A government more worried about public opinion than saving lives.

You have referred to Exercise Cygnus several times on here to heavily criticise the UK's response to the pandemic. Given your interest in it, you have posted a link to the report and so have presumably read it, what do you feel are the key lessons learned and recommendations made from that exercise that have been ignored during the Covid-19 pandemic?

[Taffy on the wing]

come on be a man don't be a child like you normally are, sat behind your little keyboard calling me a liar for the world to see, prove it, take any single point you want and prove I have made something up and it's an outright lie as you say it is.

you've flirted enough like the shy little boy, move in like a man and kiss me, here's your chance.

Your true colors are showing now..........NASTY!
I wouldn't flirt with you if you were the last 'they' on Earth....let alone kiss you.
I'm sure your friend on the coast will be along to defend you from my vicious attacks any minute now.....He's so chivalrous!

[Grumps]

Apr 7th Confirmed Cases UK 4,4,80

May 7th Confirmed Cases UK 4,867

Cases are actually rising in the UK due to the complete incompetence of this shambolic tory government and the worst prime minister in history...

Cases in UK are rising because of the increase in testing!

[Lowbankclaret]

Cases in UK are rising because of the increase in testing!

Agreed, but we need to be under 1000 new cases a day before we can relax lockdown.

So this is going to be going on longer than most people thought.

[Bangers&Mash]

Agreed, but we need to be under 1000 new cases a day before we can relax lockdown.

So this is going to be going on longer than most people thought.

longest-ejaculation-south-park.jpeg.jpg (175.82 KiB) Viewed 3284 times

[Colburn_Claret]

I understand your argument...but where I differ from you is "without all the facts". If you reckon that you have to have "all the facts" to mount a critique then you can never mount the critique because you never will have all the facts....and even if you do you probably won't know. It's a classic way of deflecting criticism to argue for delay. I know what you mean about being wise after the event but did the Times have a reason to even investigate these matters at the end of January? And I would also say that "picking faults" is understating what is at stake here. When the dust settles one of the big issues will be whether the lockdown started soon enough....and a week's delay could have cost 10,000 lives I suspect.

I agree with that, but I take it for granted that the government made its decision on the facts it had. Those facts may have been wrong, we may never know. Now you want to make a critique on the 'facts' available now. In my opinion that's harsh. Those facts you base your critique on may have changed again by next week.
There will undoubtedly be a time to look back, and see what mistakes were made, what lessons can be learned, I just don't agree that doing it whilst the country is in this crisis, is the right time.

[Grumps]

Agreed, but we need to be under 1000 new cases a day before we can relax lockdown.

So this is going to be going on longer than most people thought.

I don't disagree
I was just pointing out to the poster why the cases were going up, I think he had difficulty understanding

[Spijed]

I agree with that, but I take it for granted that the government made its decision on the facts it had. Those facts may have been wrong, we may never know. Now you want to make a critique on the 'facts' available now. In my opinion that's harsh. Those facts you base your critique on may have changed again by next week.
There will undoubtedly be a time to look back, and see what mistakes were made, what lessons can be learned, I just don't agree that doing it whilst the country is in this crisis, is the right time.

A bit odd that the facts our government had were completely different from everywhere else.

As I said, they completely ignored any facts that countries like Italy had.

Even Australia is sticking the boot in, and rightly so:

"Says Martin McKee, professor of European public health at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and an adviser to the World Health Organisation: "The countries that moved fast have curtailed the epidemic. The countries that delayed have not. It's as simple as that."


https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/big ... bLJ-BJZYjo

[Bordeauxclaret]

I think it’s clear they were thinking about releasing the lockdown in a number of ways, released it to the press via their “sources”.
The reaction hasn’t been the best so it’s been rowed back on it.
We are being led by the science though.....

[NewClaret]

I think it’s clear they were thinking about releasing the lockdown in a number of ways, released it to the press via their “sources”.
The reaction hasn’t been the best so it’s been rowed back on it.
We are being led by the science though.....

I think the press jumped on Boris’ “perhaps from Monday” comments and got all over excited, printing whatever they can make up. They all had a different take on it, with completely different timings/phases, etc. They have papers to sell.

The messaging from all government briefings has not changed: stay at home, obey the lockdown, it’s too early to release. Only a few days ago, Boris was doing a private video to that effect.

Peston addressed this on ITV news last night, saying that ITV have been saying all week that the maximum restriction they expect lifting is the “exercise once” rule, because the science doesn’t support the virus is being passed on in those settings. We’ll know on Sunday if the papers or ITV are right.

Interesting thing I’ve noticed about the papers is they blow hot and cold on this. Can guarantee that whatever Boris announces on Sunday, it will be criticised by someone.

[NewClaret]

183 pages, pffff, Brexit is up to 445 pages and that's got another year to run yet as we come/transfer out of this virus chit chat.

Come back Brexit thread, all is forgiven.

[NewClaret]

A bit odd that the facts our government had were completely different from everywhere else.

As I said, they completely ignored any facts that countries like Italy had.

Even Australia is sticking the boot in, and rightly so:

"Says Martin McKee, professor of European public health at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and an adviser to the World Health Organisation: "The countries that moved fast have curtailed the epidemic. The countries that delayed have not. It's as simple as that."


https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/big ... bLJ-BJZYjo

When did Oz lockdown? Is there a table of dates somewhere?

Worth also noting that I was effectively locked down sooner. 16th, I think? Whenever Boris said I should work from home if I could, anyway.

[Bordeauxclaret]

I think the press jumped on Boris’ “perhaps from Monday” comments and got all over excited, printing whatever they can make up. They all had a different take on it, with completely different timings/phases, etc. They have papers to sell.

The messaging from all government briefings has not changed: stay at home, obey the lockdown, it’s too early to release. Only a few days ago, Boris was doing a private video to that effect.

Peston addressed this on ITV news last night, saying that ITV have been saying all week that the maximum restriction they expect lifting is the “exercise once” rule, because the science doesn’t support the virus is being passed on in those settings. We’ll know on Sunday if the papers or ITV are right.

Interesting thing I’ve noticed about the papers is they blow hot and cold on this. Can guarantee that whatever Boris announces on Sunday, it will be criticised by someone.

I disagree mate. I believe they are using these “a government source said” to get a story out and check the reaction.
That way they can row back on them.

In general it’s not all that bad of a plan, when you are claiming to be guided exclusively by the science it’s a bit different.

[Grumps]

I disagree mate. I believe they are using these “a government source said” to get a story out and check the reaction.
That way they can row back on them.

In general it’s not all that bad of a plan, when you are claiming to be guided exclusively by the science it’s a bit different.

They are probably waiting for all the advice from the experts on here, and then doing exactly what they suggest, because they clearly know better than anybody else, and have the ability to see into the future. This virus should be over soon and we'll all be back to normal if they do that.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Yeah that’s probably what they are doing.

[NewClaret]

I disagree mate. I believe they are using these “a government source said” to get a story out and check the reaction.
That way they can row back on them.

In general it’s not all that bad of a plan, when you are claiming to be guided exclusively by the science it’s a bit different.

Well, we’ll have to agree to disagree there.

Agree that tactic is used to gauge press/public reaction. Or perhaps force the press to take a stance that they then have to stick to after the announcement? But when you read the huge differences in how it was reported (the planned approach, timings, etc) it is clear that they haven’t a scooby. If something was leaked, it wasn’t much, because they all have their own take on it.

Wouldn’t shock me to see that change this weekend.

[taio]

I disagree mate. I believe they are using these “a government source said” to get a story out and check the reaction.
That way they can row back on them.

In general it’s not all that bad of a plan, when you are claiming to be guided exclusively by the science it’s a bit different.

What are you saying they are rowing back on? Because from what I've seen they have been consistent in saying the first step to adjusting lockdown will be only minor easements, and they have been clear about the five evidence based conditions that will lead to further easing.

[Bordeauxclaret]

What are you saying they are rowing back on? Because from what I've seen they have been consistent in saying the first step to adjusting lockdown will be only minor easements, and they have been clear about the five evidence based conditions that will lead to further easing.

The info they released to the Tory friendly papers which made the headlines yesterday.
I’m very sceptical about where these came from.
Obviously we’ll I’m ever know for sure and therefore won’t agree but that’s life.

[taio]

The info they released to the Tory friendly papers which made the headlines yesterday.
I’m very sceptical about where these came from.
Obviously we’ll I’m ever know for sure and therefore won’t agree but that’s life.

All the stories I saw yesterday were suggesting only minor tweaks in the first instance and I didn't get a sense there was much to row back on.

[NewClaret]

See Russia have announced 10,000 more cases for a 6th day in a row. 180k cases with 1,700 deaths. Either they are very early in their curve or there seems to be something dodgy with their data?!

[nyclaret]

Isn’t it worrying that those who don’t want to hold the government to account clearly don’t have an interest in living in a democracy?

[CombatClaret]

It's like Newspapers have a vested interest in getting people outside and walking past newsagents.
Or their owners & backers need the proles to get back to work as it's starting to hurt their investments.

[tiger76]

All the stories I saw yesterday were suggesting only minor tweaks in the first instance and I didn't get a sense there was much to row back on.

Any changes will be minimal according to Oliver Dowden https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52585373

Hardly surprisingly,especially if the R number is still rising,which some scientists believe it is.

[Devils_Advocate]

I appreciate the comparison between country's data is problematic and my view is to focus on our own actions and what we have and have not done well (this in itself can be in context of what was going on in other countrys and how it informed us)

That said the debate goes on and the Govt themselves produce comparison graphs and the current narrative around the defense of our death rate is around how we more rigorously count and assign Covid as the reason for death where other countrys may (deliberately or innocently) hide the covid death figure behind other deaths

As a result I thought people on here might be interested in this piece of data analysis completed by the Economist which looks at excess mortality rates and what % the official Covid deaths make up of that overall number.

They have also added in some analysis around what share share of official deaths come from Care homes as one of the theory's behind the research is that a lot of the hidden unofficial Covid deaths are likely to linked to care home deaths

This in no way overcomes some of the issues with trying to compare one country with another but maybe it can be used as a warning shot that we may not be quite the leaders we see ourselves in counting deaths and when the final analysis happens after the event we might instead see that our stats are even bleaker than they seem at the moment



https://twitter.com/PedderSophie/status ... 2953219072

Anyway I'll leave it here for anyone who's interested but I will leave you to discuss amongst yourselves as the openness, intelligence and interest in fact over ideology of the debate on here is really poor for the political threads.

I will continue dip in and out and entertain myself with some of the rubbish spouted but I am finding there are much better platforms where ideas are discussed and argued with a desire to inform and educate as opposed to the unfounded tribal point scoring rhetoric I see on here

[lakedistrictclaret]

I think the only change on Sunday will be that we will be allowed more than one daily exercise.

That won't make any difference to me. I live in a fairly remote village, and I have two or three walks a day, without breaking any of the social distancing rules. The change will be good news, though, for those who live in big towns and cities.

[Grumps]

Isn’t it worrying that those who don’t want to hold the government to account clearly don’t have an interest in living in a democracy?

I haven't seen anyone who doesn't want to hold them to account. The thing people disagree on is the timing of such an exercise

[FactualFrank]

Any changes will be minimal according to Oliver Dowden https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52585373

Good.

[evensteadiereddie]

I haven't seen anyone who doesn't want to hold them to account. The thing people disagree on is the timing of such an exercise

Aye a few years should do it, when the knighthoods, OBE's etc have been awarded and loons like Hancock have moved on into whichever investment banking arm will have him and ordinary people are too stressed about their lives and families to care about the reckless waste of life any more.

[Grumps]

Aye a few years should do it, when the knighthoods, OBE's etc have been awarded and loons like Hancock have moved on into whichever investment banking arm will have him and ordinary people are too stressed about their lives and families to care about the reckless waste of life any more.

You have a weird view of life.

[CombatClaret]

UK scientists furious over attempt to censor Covid-19 advice
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... are_btn_tw

1985.jpg (53.11 KiB) Viewed 2988 times

Several SPI–B members told the Guardian that the redacted portions of the document contained criticisms they had made of potential government policies they had been formally asked to consider in late March and early April.

One SPI-B adviser said: “It is bloody silly, and completely counterproductive.” A second committee member said: “The impression I’m getting is this government doesn’t want any criticism.”

[TheFamilyCat]

I think the only change on Sunday will be that we will be allowed more than one daily exercise.

That won't make any difference to me. I live in a fairly remote village, and I have two or three walks a day, without breaking any of the social distancing rules. The change will be good news, though, for those who live in big towns and cities.

I'm thinking similar but why the big fanfare and Boris "addressing the nation" at 7.00 instead of the normal daily briefing?

In a side note, how many references, quotes and paraphrased from Churchill's VE Day speech do you think Boris will shoehorn in?

[Rileybobs]

I think the only change on Sunday will be that we will be allowed more than one daily exercise.

That won't make any difference to me. I live in a fairly remote village, and I have two or three walks a day, without breaking any of the social distancing rules. The change will be good news, though, for those who live in big towns and cities.

Why would it make any more difference for people living in towns or cities than you? They are just as free to break the current rules as you are.

[NottsClaret]

I think the only change on Sunday will be that we will be allowed more than one daily exercise.

Yeah, probably and the garden centres can open. I honestly didn’t know about the once a day rule anyway. Been out loads here, but then we usually end up getting something from the local shop on the way back so I guess that counts as shopping.

Not that anyone cares anyway, no curtain twitchers in our town fortunately. Or police.

[TVC15]

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