Caroline Flack found deceased

[jrgbfc]

Not sure I should really head into potentially treacherous waters by asking this but why.how was she talented ? Or is being a presenter on terrible, lowbrow TV programmes like Love Island now enough to be classed as being talented ? The whole "celebrity culture" thing is sick really....vapid nonsense played out in social media forums populated to high degree by dimwits....and she appears to have chosen life in the spotlight amidst idiots and paid a price in terms of her mental health when the same idiot culture turned on her.
Sad for anyone to commit suicide and the only good thing that could come out of this is if it helped people to realise that the trappings of "celebrity" are hollow and not what life is really about.

She won Strictly Come Dancing. You could argue that shows at least a degree of talent.

[KRBFC]

Not sure I should really head into potentially treacherous waters by asking this but why.how was she talented ? Or is being a presenter on terrible, lowbrow TV programmes like Love Island now enough to be classed as being talented ? The whole "celebrity culture" thing is sick really....vapid nonsense played out in social media forums populated to high degree by dimwits....and she appears to have chosen life in the spotlight amidst idiots and paid a price in terms of her mental health when the same idiot culture turned on her.
Sad for anyone to commit suicide and the only good thing that could come out of this is if it helped people to realise that the trappings of "celebrity" are hollow and not what life is really about.

Questioning someone’s talent a day after they have died, classy.

“I don’t like it so nobody else can and if they do they’re dumb wit idiots” get off your high horse your opinion doesn’t hold more weight.

Not to mention she has appeared on some of the most watched TV shows, where thousands of people would’ve wanted to be. The very top of her field, the fame comes with the territory but that doesn’t mean she wanted the fame, she was just doing a popular well paid job, like Cristiano Ronaldo.

Like who are you to question her talent? I’d assume you’re some multimillionaire highly skilled sportsman and not the typical white, overweight, OAP who posts on here?

[claptrappers_union]

Not sure I should really head into potentially treacherous waters by asking this but why.how was she talented? Or is being a presenter on terrible, lowbrow TV programmes like Love Island now enough to be classed as being talented?

That's not fair, I don't watch those shows but I've been in TV Studios and watched these 'presenters' at their craft. I've seen Cat Deeley present a whole series of a TV show in a whole day. She was stood up the whole time, didn't mess anything up, fumble her lines and rolled with the punches when something went unplanned. She was brilliant. Ultimate professional, made it look easy. Her co-host, a well-established comedian (who's name escapes me), struggled with the basics of an autocue.

Television personalities, fall down a certain path - like the rest of us we take opportunities when they come. A job is a job. I think I was reading about Jeremy Paxman, who happened to establish himself in News and Current Affairs. If he made a different choice he could've easily been a Talk Show host or a comedian - in the ilk of someone like Johnathan Ross.

As for talent, that's about perspective. Someone who doesn't follow football might wonder why Jeff Stelling is talented, or why The Undertaker is a highly regarded American Wrestler, or why The Chuckle Brothers are national treasures, or why Phil "The Power" Taylor is a recognised sportsman.

[FactualFrank]

Her co-host, a well-established comedian (who's name escapes me), struggled with the basics of an autocue.

Patrick Kielty?

[fidelcastro]

Patrick Kielty?

No. It was Paddy McGuiness.

[FactualFrank]

No. It was Paddy McGuiness.

He said comedian!

[JohnMcGreal]

Not sure I should really head into potentially treacherous waters by asking this but why.how was she talented ? Or is being a presenter on terrible, lowbrow TV programmes like Love Island now enough to be classed as being talented ?

How is Caroline Flack's level of talent relevant here?

[Stalbansclaret]

I was querying the comment in the previous post to mine that CF was "very talented" , that's all... so my question was asked in that context. Fair enough to those who think she was then and, as per the first words of my post, I was aware I was entering sensitive territory and I hopefully made it clear that her taking her own life is obviously very sad. My larger point was my own, personal, views on the narcissistic "celebrity" domain she seemingly inhabited and which I view as inherently shallow and unhealthy.

[arise_sir_charge]

If you present prime time live tv you are talented. Only a handful make it to the very top and Caroline Flack was one of those.

Someone fairly recently, may have been Claptrappers posted a video of Jeff Stelling in full flow, he described multiple events, in great detail without missing a beat.

i think that because of celebrity culture some people now mix up those that host the shows with the contestants on them. There is a world of difference.

[Jakubclaret]

How is Caroline Flack's level of talent relevant here?

I'm assuming he's trying to understand the root cause & to fully understand you to fully establish the facts & by doing that you need to gauge opinion & so far it seems to be mixed with some people viewing her as talented & others not.

[TVC15]

I'm assuming he's trying to understand the root cause & to fully understand you to fully establish the facts & by doing that you need to gauge opinion & so far it seems to be mixed with some people viewing her as talented & others not.

You’ve lost me me with that response - why does that make her talent relevant sorry ?

Think the point being made is that whatever the rights and wrongs or whether you like her she was famous / well known. It’s been all over the main news and it was the front page of every Sunday paper.
It’s of course extremely sad when anyone commits suicide and of course there are many many deaths that don’t make the front page or the news....but that’s just the same as people who are not famous not making the news for anything else either.
It’s the fact that she is famous / well known to some that somebody decided to start a thread on this forum.
It does not make her life any more or less important than anyone else who has gone through this tragedy - it’s just simply how the news and media is.

[Granny WeatherWax]

I was querying the comment in the previous post to mine that CF was "very talented" , that's all... so my question was asked in that context. Fair enough to those who think she was then and, as per the first words of my post, I was aware I was entering sensitive territory and I hopefully made it clear that her taking her own life is obviously very sad. My larger point was my own, personal, views on the narcissistic "celebrity" domain she seemingly inhabited and which I view as inherently shallow and unhealthy.

West End star too. Clearly a very talented young lady.

[cricketfieldclarets]

I was querying the comment in the previous post to mine that CF was "very talented" , that's all... so my question was asked in that context. Fair enough to those who think she was then and, as per the first words of my post, I was aware I was entering sensitive territory and I hopefully made it clear that her taking her own life is obviously very sad. My larger point was my own, personal, views on the narcissistic "celebrity" domain she seemingly inhabited and which I view as inherently shallow and unhealthy.

I understand to an extent the point you are making. I cant for the life of me understand why anyone would watch never mind partake in shows like Love Island. I suppose X Factor has or at least did have its place mind. Again not for me though.

But like it or not there are literally millions of people unlike us who do think that is great entertainment. Whatever perverse reason that is. So if she can make a successful career being the main presenter on prime time tv and make millions doing it why not. And as CTU says above it is not an easy job. I dont think many could do it. Must be physically and mentally exhausting.

FWIW I dont think its the job that 'killed her'. From what I know she was likeable and popular and great at her job. And you dont read many negative comments about her from men OR women. Which in itself is a talent!!! I think what affected her most was how the media intruded on her and hung her out the minute she allegedly made a mistake. This is the same media who still employs the likes of Piers Morgan who have done far worse on a far greater scale and who continues to thrive off and make a career by offending and probing and upsetting folk.

Imagine being in a situation where you are accused of assaulting your partner.
Your partner claims it isnt true.
Your partner asks for charges to be dropped.
You arent allowd to have any contact with partner while going through toughest battle of your life.
You already suffer depression.
And all this while losing your dream job and it your name is dragged through the mud in front of the entire nation.

Such an obvious and avoidable tragic end.

[Jakubclaret]

You’ve lost me me with that response - why does that make her talent relevant sorry ?

Think the point being made is that whatever the rights and wrongs or whether you like her she was famous / well known. It’s been all over the main news and it was the front page of every Sunday paper.
It’s of course extremely sad when anyone commits suicide and of course there are many many deaths that don’t make the front page or the news....but that’s just the same as people who are not famous not making the news for anything else either.
It’s the fact that she is famous / well known to some that somebody decided to start a thread on this forum.
It does not make her life any more or less important than anyone else who has gone through this tragedy - it’s just simply how the news and media is.

It's all subjective, regarding the talent that she did have or didn't have depending on the viewpoint, could have been a contributing factor in the event of criticism fairly or harshly directed, it lowers people's self esteem when constantly put down.

[TVC15]

It's all subjective, regarding the talent that she did have or didn't have depending on the viewpoint, could have been a contributing factor in the event of criticism fairly or harshly directed, it lowers people's self esteem when constantly put down.

Your sentence construction is, shall we say, a little unorthodox.

Of course talent is subjective but I am still lost as to how you think that’s relevant to this thread.
Are you saying that the fact that some people thought she was talented whilst others didn’t means she had low self esteem and contributed to her suicide ?

[Jakubclaret]

Your sentence construction is, shall we say, a little unorthodox.

Of course talent is subjective but I am still lost as to how you think that’s relevant to this thread.
Are you saying that the fact that some people thought she was talented whilst others didn’t means she had low self esteem and contributed to her suicide ?

All I'm saying is it's a possibility as a contributing factor, I never personally knew the lady so just surmising, whether she did have talent or didn't is irrelevant now, but if she had doubts about her own professional capabilities within her job role it couldn't have helped & contributed to the depression she was suffering from (assuming she was depressed) strangely enough happy people don't tend to commit suicide, it's a logical assumption depression existed.

[Wile E Coyote]

Questioning someone’s talent a day after they have died, classy.

“I don’t like it so nobody else can and if they do they’re dumb wit idiots” get off your high horse your opinion doesn’t hold more weight.

Not to mention she has appeared on some of the most watched TV shows, where thousands of people would’ve wanted to be. The very top of her field, the fame comes with the territory but that doesn’t mean she wanted the fame, she was just doing a popular well paid job, like Cristiano Ronaldo.

Like who are you to question her talent? I’d assume you’re some multimillionaire highly skilled sportsman and not the typical white, overweight, OAP who posts on here?

thats all irrelevant, and you know it, this post has moved on from a particular persons tragic demise, and included debate about the whole celebrity culture. You clearly knew that, but were still intent on vapid remarks and having a pop at another poster for no good reason.

[TVC15]

thats all irrelevant, and you know it, this post has moved on from a particular persons tragic demise, and included debate about the whole celebrity culture. You clearly knew that, but were still intent on vapid remarks and having a pop at another poster for no good reason.

Spot on and there is probably more evidence that vitriol remarks on social media and in the press contributed to the tragedy than anyone questioning whether she was talented or not - they have probably being doing the latter for most of her life - as they do with most people in the public eye / showbiz

[Wile E Coyote]

While a terrible tragedy the bizzare outpouring of “ twitter grief “ is to be expected.
And the lynch mob vilification of Murdoch and the Sun who were lavishly paid by her management /pr to mitigate her situation! not “ hound her to death” Talk about mob justice at its raging foaming misinformed worst

Just out of curiosity, can you elaborate on that please. The bit about the Sun who were lavishly paid etc.

[claptrappers_union]

Someone fairly recently, may have been Claptrappers posted a video of Jeff Stelling in full flow, he described multiple events, in great detail without missing a beat.

It was me, this is the clip - 3 minutes of unscripted excellence, he gets everything in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBXjkTwp-G8

While we are on the topic of improvisation. People seem to judge these celebrities as though their perceived persona in the media. Another one of these 'celebrities', which most people will sneer at but I admire is Russell Brand - he is talented, no matter what the Daily Mail and the right-wing media says about him. Watch this clip where he spontaneously riffs in-character for a movie called The Tempest. Alfred Molina at the end is blown away after watching it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBOMSzhIfjk

Here is Russell Brand using his 'talent' again - in taking over a poorly planned segment on MSNBC. None of the presenters are treating him with respect, the female host falls in love with him partway through, the male contributor says he can't understand him, they get his name wrong on numerous occasions and basically start making it up as they go along. It's a total shambles - so he takes it up upon himself to make it work for him and I think its brilliant - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynUjo99Gzbk

[AlargeClaret]

Just out of curiosity, can you elaborate on that please. The bit about the Sun who were lavishly paid etc.

CF’s pr/management company went into overdrive after the initial arrest. ie doing their job pretty well and using ( it ain’t cheap ) the Sun to do the spin, paint the right picture ,back story, encouragement from celebs etc etc when of course the client involved is advised and then legally restricted from talking so “ friends “ are quoted to fill the story . Then, pending the legal timetable ( whether the client is charged ) they’ll choose to either “ hit em hard” or full on “ “ Mother Theresa” It’s a very unsavoury but effective “Rottweiler mob” running Rupe’s former baby , and the double standards are eye watering . My ex bro in law still takes the Murdoch shilling .

[AlargeClaret]

It was me, this is the clip - 3 minutes of unscripted excellence, he gets everything in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBXjkTwp-G8

While we are on the topic of improvisation. People seem to judge these celebrities as though their perceived persona in the media. Another one of these 'celebrities', which most people will sneer at but I admire is Russell Brand - he is talented, no matter what the Daily Mail and the right-wing media says about him. Watch this clip where he spontaneously riffs in-character for a movie called The Tempest. Alfred Molina at the end is blown away after watching it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBOMSzhIfjk

Here is Russell Brand using his 'talent' again - in taking over a poorly planned segment on MSNBC. None of the presenters are treating him with respect, the female host falls in love with him partway through, the male contributor says he can't understand him, they get his name wrong on numerous occasions and basically start making it up as they go along. It's a total shambles - so he takes it up upon himself to make it work for him and I think its brilliant - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynUjo99Gzbk

Can’t stand Brand but he’s one clever charismatic b@stard , he’s literally got them tickling his balls and they don’t even know it ..

[Burnley Ace]

The CPS must follow the 2 tests. No ifs, no buts. No one, not them not Police not politicians can intervene. Imagine if they'd have dropped it, cos she's rich and famous. The boyfriend has no say. If it's DV it goes ahead.

Like they did yesterday with Nicky Butt? No previous convictions, not even been charged before, no previous allegations retracted so what evidence were the CPS using to determine whether the case should continue?