Donald Trump

[grapidianclaret]

The WHO like most global organizations ,the U.N. ,the International atomic energy commission and most U.N. agencies depend on member co operation,they can not just fly into a country and start sniffing around. The W.H.O. delayed nine days in January,declaring a pandemic. The U.S intelligence communities,not restricted on investigation,like the W.H.O warned on early February,or before,that the virus was a global threat,and a direct threat to U.S. national security. It still took Trump ten weeks to start taking the virus seriously. Ten weeks. Seventy days.
If that delay is defendable, then good luck to you all.

[Uwe Noble]

Trump stopped flights coming into the US from China in 31st January. Did you support that move or did you call him a racist?

[KateR]

The WHO like most global organizations ,the U.N. ,the International atomic energy commission and most U.N. agencies depend on member co operation,they can not just fly into a country and start sniffing around. The W.H.O. delayed nine days in January,declaring a pandemic. The U.S intelligence communities,not restricted on investigation,like the W.H.O warned on early February,or before,that the virus was a global threat,and a direct threat to U.S. national security. It still took Trump ten weeks to start taking the virus seriously. Ten weeks. Seventy days.
If that delay is defendable, then good luck to you all.

when you are going to state things it's best to check facts, you are totally wrong and you are spreading FAKE NEWS! The W.H.O. delayed nine days in January,declaring a pandemic: SEE BEOW FOR ACTUAL FACT:

BREAKING

"We have therefore made the assessment that #COVID19 can be characterized as a pandemic"-@DrTedros #coronavirus pic.twitter.com/JqdsM2051A
— World Health Organization (WHO) (@WHO) March 11, 2020

This was long after Trump stopped flights from China on 2nd Feb against WHO advise that so no reason to stop international flights, but don't let facts get in the way of how you see things

[SonofPog]

AIR CANADA
Air Canada said on Jan. 28 it was cancelling select flights to China.

AIR SEOUL
South Korean budget carrier Air Seoul said on Jan. 28 it had suspended all flights to China.

AMERICAN AIRLINES
American Airlines said it would cancel flights to Beijing and Shanghai starting Jan. 31

EGYPTAIR
Egypt's flag carrier said on Jan. 30 it would suspend all flights to and from China starting Feb. 1.

EL AL ISRAEL AIRLINES
El Al Israel Airlines said on Jan. 30 it was suspending flights to Beijing

AIR FRANCE
Air France said on Jan. 30 it had suspended all scheduled flights to and from mainland China until Feb. 9.

BRITISH AIRWAYS
BA said on Jan. 30 it had canceled all flights to mainland China for a month.

DELTA AIR LINES
Delta Air Lines accelerated earlier announced suspensions: the last China-bound flights were due to leave on Feb. 1

IBERIA AIRLINES
Spanish airline Iberia said on Jan.29

LION AIR
Indonesia's Lion Air Group said on Jan. 29

--- ---- -----

Etc... Etc. Etc.... The whole world cancelled flights from China at the end of January.

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/artic ... s-outbreak

Btw, Delta, United and American Airlines all cancelled flights before Trump stopped flights.

[Devils_Advocate]

Trump stopped flights coming into the US from China in 31st January.

No he didn't

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... china-or-/

Trump’s Chinese travel ban only banned “foreign nationals who had been in China in the last 14 days.” This wording did not—at all—stop people from arriving in America from China. In fact, for much of the crisis, flights from China landed in America almost daily filled with people who had been in China, but did not fit the category as Trump’s “travel ban” defined it.

[Taffy on the wing]

Trump stopped flights coming into the US from China in 31st January. Did you support that move or did you call him a racist?

He is a Racist and proud of it ...why do you keep bringing this up?
If he doesn't care, why do you?

[SonofPog]

when you are going to state things it's best to check facts, you are totally wrong and you are spreading FAKE NEWS! The W.H.O. delayed nine days in January,declaring a pandemic: SEE BEOW FOR ACTUAL FACT:

BREAKING

"We have therefore made the assessment that #COVID19 can be characterized as a pandemic"-@DrTedros #coronavirus pic.twitter.com/JqdsM2051A
— World Health Organization (WHO) (@WHO) March 11, 2020

This was long after Trump stopped flights from China on 2nd Feb against WHO advise that so no reason to stop international flights, but don't let facts get in the way of how you see things

30 January 2020
The WHO Director-General reconvened the Emergency Committee (EC). This was earlier than the 10-day period and only two days after the first reports of limited human-to-human transmission were reported outside China. This time, the EC reached consensus and advised the Director-General that the outbreak constituted a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC).

Arguing they only called it a Pandemic in March is basically semantics of when a Storm becomes a hurricane. 30 of Jan is the date when they told the world to take it seriously. But hey, don't let facts get in the way of how you see things

[RingoMcCartney]

The WHO like most global organizations ,the U.N. ,the International atomic energy commission and most U.N. agencies depend on member co operation,they can not just fly into a country and start sniffing around. The W.H.O. delayed nine days in January,declaring a pandemic. The U.S intelligence communities,not restricted on investigation,like the W.H.O warned on early February,or before,that the virus was a global threat,and a direct threat to U.S. national security. It still took Trump ten weeks to start taking the virus seriously. Ten weeks. Seventy days.
If that delay is defendable, then good luck to you all.

University of Southampton study found there would have been a 95 % REDUCTION in cases & less spread if Beijing intervened 3 wks sooner.”

This Jan. 14 tweet came less than two months before WHO declared COVID-19 to be a global pandemic.

“Preliminary investigations conducted by the Chinese authorities have found no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission of the novel #coronavirus (2019-nCoV) identified in #Wuhan, #China,” the organization had said.

On 11 March a pandemic was declared by the WHO. By this time, 114 countries had reported cases.

[SonofPog]

Also on Jan 14

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

[SonofPog]

University of Southampton study found there would have been a 95 % REDUCTION in cases & less spread if Beijing intervened 3 wks sooner.

I tried to find a link to this University of Southampton study, I pasted this into Google, the no.1 link... This article from Foxnews.

https://www.foxnews.com/world/world-hea ... oronavirus

Copied word for word...

University of Southampton study found there would have been a 95 % REDUCTION in cases & less spread if Beijing intervened 3 wks sooner.

Edit: I found no links to an actual University of Southampton Study btw...

[RingoMcCartney]

The Chinese government reportedly knew the disease was spreading before the tweet was sent, according to the South China Morning Post.

The New York Times’ China correspondent, Amy Quin, said Tuesday on Twitter that the country had begun expelling American journalists.

Axios reporter Jonathan Swan drew attention to Quin’s story on social media the next day and went on to criticize the Chinese government for instituting a cover-up and failing to deliver life-saving information to the public.


“Terrible. We desperately need accurate reporting from China,” he tweeted. “The pandemic originated in Wuhan & was initially covered up by Chinese authorities. University of Southampton study found there would have been a 95 % REDUCTION in cases & less spread if Beijing intervened 3 wks sooner.”


“The world is directly affected by China’s domestic governance,” he added. “The suppression of doctors sounding the alarm, censoring of public health info online and now the expulsion of the journalists who are working to reveal what happened in the crucial early days of this pandemic.”

[RingoMcCartney]

I tried to find a link to this University of Southampton study, I pasted this into Google, the no.1 link... This article from Foxnews.

https://www.foxnews.com/world/world-hea ... oronavirus

Copied word for word...

University of Southampton study found there would have been a 95 % REDUCTION in cases & less spread if Beijing intervened 3 wks sooner.

Edit: I found no links to an actual University of Southampton Study btw...

Journalist quotes in this link from the New York Post.

https://nypost.com/2020/03/20/who-haunt ... ronavirus/

[Uwe Noble]

Wow, a whole bunch of apologists for WHO and China on this board!

[evensteadiereddie]

This is brilliant.

[KateR]

30 January 2020
The WHO Director-General reconvened the Emergency Committee (EC). This was earlier than the 10-day period and only two days after the first reports of limited human-to-human transmission were reported outside China. This time, the EC reached consensus and advised the Director-General that the outbreak constituted a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC).

Arguing they only called it a Pandemic in March is basically semantics of when a Storm becomes a hurricane. 30 of Jan is the date when they told the world to take it seriously. But hey, don't let facts get in the way of how you see things

so you 100% agree the WHO did not call it a PANDEMIC officially until 11 March, thank you.

There were very good reasons the WHO did not react and did not want to call a PANDEMIC until March, it is NOT semantics, you need to understand and learn the difference regarding facts and what happens when the WHO calls a PANDEMIC, this is a trigger action and they were severely criticized in 2009 when they did it then. Plus look up Storm Planning versus Hurricane planning, it might help you understand a little, I've lived through several hurricanes and the planning is hugely different to a storm including city evacuations, highways turned in to one way systems etc. huge difference.

[Devils_Advocate]

If anyone is interested on the full Southampton University study that Ringo mentioned for fuller context I have put a link below

https://www.southampton.ac.uk/news/2020 ... china.page

The report also states that early detection, isolation of cases, travel restrictions and cordon sanitaire has prevented the infection from affecting 6700% more people

[Uwe Noble]

Wow, not only anti-Trump but pro-Chinese Communist Party and the useless WHO. It's laughable how if Trump says black how many in this board would say white.

[evensteadiereddie]

Even better !

[KateR]

Etc... Etc. Etc.... The whole world cancelled flights from China at the end of January.

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/artic ... s-outbreak

Btw, Delta, United and American Airlines all cancelled flights before Trump stopped flights.

you are providing good facts here, thank you, it's much appreciated, so you 100% agree that the whole world was cancelling flights by the end of Jan because of China but the WHO did not call a PANDEMIC until March. It took WHO 2 months from being informed by China on the 31 Dec to get a team in there, at the same time ignoring Taiwan for political reasons.

Please stop trying to defend the WHO because they clearly made mistakes, big ones that has lead to thousands of deaths in many peoples opinion including the medical and scientific community. I am NOT say Trump is great nor that he has not made mistakes he has and they are also clear but when he criticizes WHO he has good reason and is correct, yes it also helps deflect away from him he thinks but it doesn't, everyone knows. I object to you and others lying to further your aims, you have been called and proven wrong, its indefensible what your trying to say so please stop, there are so many Trump failures you can point to, he's an easy target stick to those areas please.

[KateR]

Even better !

YAWN

[evensteadiereddie]

I think you must be asleep, kid, don't you realise what this Uwe plonker is doing ? And you're falling for it !
Yawn indeed.

[KateR]

Eddie,
I have ignored UWE and left him to make his own statements, in fact I've done the same with Ringo because they are big boys and can provide info/posts to how they think and refute others. For me it's the hatred and twisting of facts that annoys, not just on here, I don't like bullying, it's so wrong.

I used your own YAWN on you because it's merely boring and adds nothing when people mock and trying to be clever saying Whooooosh plus the most annoying not answering and saying ohh you spelt that wrong or, well let's wait and see when they can't answer. OK rant over, I'm obviously losing it, maybe time for a glass of wine, maybe a bottle actually!

Hope you and the family are well and stay safe, nearly weekend

[KateR]

Also on Jan 14

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

thank you yet again, all of this was in my timeline of main WHO points from last night!!

14 Jan a full 2 weeks after China first informed them, LIMITED, POSSIBLE, WOULD NOT BE SURPRISING. That's a very very clear warning to all the world leaders and the countries who fund WHO, 2 days can make a huge difference and you got those weasel words from WHO with another 2 MONTHS before they declared a PANDEMIC. Many many news outlets were critical of WHO in Feb as to why they had not called a PANDEMIC, businesses let alone countries have there own emergency planning and a WHO Pandemic announcement is a trigger to action.

[ksrclaret]

Crikey, all his different usernames are out in force again!

[KateR]

If anyone is interested on the full Southampton University study that Ringo mentioned for fuller context I have put a link below

https://www.southampton.ac.uk/news/2020 ... china.page

The report also states that early detection, isolation of cases, travel restrictions and cordon sanitaire has prevented the infection from affecting 6700% more people

Thanks, interesting or coincident it came out/published same day WHO triggered the Pandemic, 11 March. The good and the bad of it shows:
The study estimates that by the end of February 2020 there was a total of 114, 325 COVID-19 cases in China. It shows that without non-pharmaceutical interventions – such as early detection, isolation of cases, travel restrictions and cordon sanitaire – the number of infected people would have been 67 times larger than that which actually occurred.

The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively.

Most countries had implemented some form planning well before this date/data was made available.

I myself and mentioned a long time ago had a trip planned to the UK on Singapore Airlines 28 Feb, 2nd March I flew to Aberdeen for the day for business meetings since I was in the UK for personal reasons and flew back Singapore 8 March. I was concerned about the trip but WHO and the company I consult with had nothing in place other than the PH warning and all business travel to China was not allowed. I was on Tube/Train/Taxi plus out and about in London socializing nearly every day/evening plus being with my family son/wife/2 grandchildren. Hindsight is a great thing, I should never have gone, I did and none have suffered because of it thank goodness but many did due to late actions from so many place but none more so than WHO, the people who I would have trusted most with my life prior to this regarding medical/pandemic issues etc.

[KateR]

Crikey, all his different usernames are out in force again!

wow, was that an original thought, come on, be honest did you manage to think that one up all by yourself and offer something meaningful to the adults conversation, did you?

No I thought, not, but we will all wait with baited breath for your next pearls of wisdom to wow us all. Will it be something along spelling, punctuation perhaps, or will it be the, why don't we wait and see, but hopefully it will be more along the village idiots that have to edit because they can't get it right first time.

xx

[Steve1956]

FB_IMG_1587059195111.jpg (37.36 KiB) Viewed 2856 times

What a guy!

[ksrclaret]

wow, was that an original thought, come on, be honest did you manage to think that one up all by yourself and offer something meaningful to the adults conversation, did you?

No I thought, not, but we will all wait with baited breath for your next pearls of wisdom to wow us all. Will it be something along spelling, punctuation perhaps, or will it be the, why don't we wait and see, but hopefully it will be more along the village idiots that have to edit because they can't get it right first time.

xx

You needn't work yourself up into a frenzy on my account. Are you okay hun? Is there someone you can ask for hug?

[grapidianclaret]

My apologies. They did indeed call it an epidemic. Nobody is saying the WHO didn't make mistakes. Their top guy admitted to mistakes made. However, Trump made much bigger and longer lasting mistakes. Ten weeks. Ten long fruitless weeks,unless you are the virus.
From the horses mouth, you just need to listen to interview after interview,rally after rally. Trump ignored and belittled the virus wave as it approached and arrived on U.S shores. Nothing fake about that statement.
Cancelling flights from China,not racist. Cancelling flights from Europe,not racist.
This thread is not about him being a racist. It's about his criminal mismanagement of a health crisis costing lives. The guy is completely unequipped to deal with anything but deregulation and foolish tax cuts.

[KateR]

You needn't work yourself up into a frenzy on my account. Are you okay hun? Is there someone you can ask for hug?

I just want to assure you I am not and that I am ok, 2 people in my little bubble I can ask and occasionally get hugs from, but thank you for asking that's very thoughtful and a nice departure from normal

[ksrclaret]

I just want to assure you I am not and that I am ok, 2 people in my little bubble I can ask and occasionally get hugs from, but thank you for asking that's very thoughtful and a nice departure from normal

No worries hun. If I might offer you another compliment, you've certainly adopted the 'try, try and try again' mantra very well indeed. No matter how many times you get it completely and utterly wrong, you keep posting again, never deterred. Well done you.

Stay safe now. There's a dangerous germ out there at the moment. Ta-ta.

[KateR]

My apologies. They did indeed call it an epidemic. Nobody is saying the WHO didn't make mistakes. Their top guy admitted to mistakes made. However, Trump made much bigger and longer lasting mistakes. Ten weeks. Ten long fruitless weeks,unless you are the virus.
From the horses mouth, you just need to listen to interview after interview,rally after rally. Trump ignored and belittled the virus wave as it approached and arrived on U.S shores. Nothing fake about that statement.
Cancelling flights from China,not racist. Cancelling flights from Europe,not racist.
This thread is not about him being a racist. It's about his criminal mismanagement of a health crisis costing lives. The guy is completely unequipped to deal with anything but deregulation and foolish tax cuts.

As I mentioned in another civilized thread virtually everyone has made mistakes some big some small but unfortunately with this terrible virus even small mistakes cost lives, a days delay can make a big change but unfortunately that was not known in December/January and even most of February. We can all point fingers and find someone to blame, I'm honestly not sure whether you are being sincere or sarcastic around the canceling flights but I think it was a good thing personally, whom ever did it anywhere.

Yet when you mention things you also need to understand how US politics work, Trump could not shutdown States and Cities, that is the governors job, NY Governor getting a lot of praise but why, was he really that effective or is it because of his measured tone and TV presence? However, California was forecast to get it really bad, the Governor shutdown just 2 days before NY and the outcome is dramatic, when questioned the scientific community said 2 days would make a huge difference in the spread. This is not the only difference of course, LA for example is much less dense than NYC, which has a much higher mass transport system Vs LA where most people use a car for work. I am not trying to say Trump has done great or even good, he's made mistakes but he can not shut the country down just as it has been argued he can not make States open up again, that's down to individual Governors.

You can compare in a little way the EU with the states, has the EU passed through this first 4 months with flying colours, did they show unity and rally around Italy, no of course not and some members even blocked PPE getting to Italy when requested. They still have issues to sort out but we will no doubt discuss that at some time in a separate thread.

[KateR]

No worries hun. If I might offer you another compliment, you've certainly adopted the 'try, try and try again' mantra very well indeed. No matter how many times you get it completely and utterly wrong, you keep posting again, never deterred. Well done you.

Stay safe now. There's a dangerous germ out there at the moment. Ta-ta.

A germ, was that your little way of trying to have a quick snide remark at Trump, ooh how cute and lovely, but it did make me smile so your job for the day is done sweetie, am sure mummy will tuck you up nice and safe.

My 15 year old is a little bored and looking for new friends to play with, I could ask him if you want, then you can chat and play, but do play nicely there's a good little boy.
Be careful though he is good I'm told by his friends so no swearing, yet am sure you wont because by now you must be used to be wrong in every thread you touch.

This insulting and blame game is a doddle, even children can play

xx

[ksrclaret]

No post

[Devils_Advocate]

Thanks, interesting or coincident it came out/published same day WHO triggered the Pandemic, 11 March. The good and the bad of it shows:
The study estimates that by the end of February 2020 there was a total of 114, 325 COVID-19 cases in China. It shows that without non-pharmaceutical interventions – such as early detection, isolation of cases, travel restrictions and cordon sanitaire – the number of infected people would have been 67 times larger than that which actually occurred.

The research also found that if interventions in the country could have been conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks earlier, cases could have been reduced by 66 percent, 86 percent and 95 percent respectively – significantly limiting the geographical spread of the disease. However, if NPIs were conducted one week, two weeks, or three weeks later than they were, the number of cases may have shown a 3-fold, 7-fold, or 18-fold increase, respectively.

Most countries had implemented some form planning well before this date/data was made available.

I myself and mentioned a long time ago had a trip planned to the UK on Singapore Airlines 28 Feb, 2nd March I flew to Aberdeen for the day for business meetings since I was in the UK for personal reasons and flew back Singapore 8 March. I was concerned about the trip but WHO and the company I consult with had nothing in place other than the PH warning and all business travel to China was not allowed. I was on Tube/Train/Taxi plus out and about in London socializing nearly every day/evening plus being with my family son/wife/2 grandchildren. Hindsight is a great thing, I should never have gone, I did and none have suffered because of it thank goodness but many did due to late actions from so many place but none more so than WHO, the people who I would have trusted most with my life prior to this regarding medical/pandemic issues etc.

I am not trying to defend the WHO from criticism that they made some mistakes and didn't get everything correct but they are not this big bogie man that following Trumps attacks people suddenly think they are

Also this idea that 11th March statement was some kind of u-turn by the WHO and that until they made this announcement they were giving dangerous advice and creating issues is again way over the top

The WHO task force was full and inclusive of scientists and officials from govts all around the world including the US. I have detailed a bit of a timeline of what the WHO were doing, what statements / advice they were giving and who was involved in Jan / Feb

I think it shows the massive challenge the WHO faced and how so many countries and people worked together on it. Yes they didn't get everything correct but the world is far more at risk today following Trumps attacks and withdrawal of funding and with the division this tribal and negative approach to the WHO has caused

31 Dec 2019

China reported a cluster of cases of pneumonia in Wuhan, Hubei Province. A novel coronavirus was eventually identified.

1 January 2020

WHO had set up the IMST (Incident Management Support Team) across the three levels of the organization: headquarters, regional headquarters and country level, putting the organization on an emergency footing for dealing with the outbreak.

4 January 2020

WHO reported on social media that there was a cluster of pneumonia cases – with no deaths – in Wuhan, Hubei province.

5 January 2020

WHO published our first Disease Outbreak News on the new virus. This is a flagship technical publication to the scientific and public health community as well as global media. It contained a risk assessment and advice, and reported on what China had told the organization about the status of patients and the public health response on the cluster of pneumonia cases in Wuhan.

10 January 2020

WHO issued a comprehensive package of technical guidance online with advice to all countries on how to detect, test and manage potential cases, based on what was known about the virus at the time. This guidance was shared with WHO's regional emergency directors to share with WHO representatives in countries.

Based on experience with SARS and MERS and known modes of transmission of respiratory viruses, infection and prevention control guidance were published to protect health workers recommending droplet and contact precautions when caring for patients, and airborne precautions for aerosol generating procedures conducted by health workers.

12 January 2020

China publicly shared the genetic sequence of COVID-19.

13 January 2020

Officials confirm a case of COVID-19 in Thailand, the first recorded case outside of China.

14 January 2020

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

20-21 January 2020

WHO experts from its China and Western Pacific regional offices conducted a brief field visit to Wuhan.

22 January 2020

WHO mission to China issued a statement saying that there was evidence of human-to-human transmission in Wuhan but more investigation was needed to understand the full extent of transmission.

https://www.who.int/china/news/detail/2 ... a-jan-2020

22- 23 January 2020

The WHO Director- General convened an Emergency Committee (EC) under the International Health Regulations (IHR 2005) to assess whether the outbreak constituted a public health emergency of international concern. The independent members from around the world could not reach a consensus based on the evidence available at the time. They asked to be reconvened within 10 days after receiving more information.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/23 ... 2019-ncov)

28 January 2020

A senior WHO delegation led by the Director-General travelled to Beijing to meet China’s leadership, learn more about China’s response, and to offer any technical assistance.

While in Beijing, Dr. Tedros agreed with Chinese government leaders that an international team of leading scientists would travel to China on a mission to better understand the context, the overall response, and exchange information and experience.

30 January 2020

The WHO Director-General reconvened the Emergency Committee (EC). This was earlier than the 10-day period and only two days after the first reports of limited human-to-human transmission were reported outside China. This time, the EC reached consensus and advised the Director-General that the outbreak constituted a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC). The Director-General accepted the recommendation and declared the novel coronavirus outbreak (2019-nCoV) a PHEIC. This is the 6th time WHO has declared a PHEIC since the International Health Regulations (IHR) came into force in 2005.

3 February 2020

WHO releases the international community's Strategic Preparedness and Response Plan to help protect states with weaker health systems.

11-12 February 2020

WHO convened a Research and Innovation Forum on COVID-19, attended by more than 400 experts and funders from around the world, which included presentations by George Gao, Director General of China CDC, and Zunyou Wu, China CDC's chief epidemiologist.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/12 ... 9-research

16-24 February 2020

The WHO-China Joint mission, which included experts from Canada, Germany, Japan, Nigeria, Republic of Korea, Russia, Singapore and the US (CDC, NIH) spent time in Beijing and also travelled to Wuhan and two other cities. They spoke with health officials, scientists and health workers in health facilities (maintaining physical distancing).

https://www.who.int/docs/default-source ... fce87f4e_2

[Uwe Noble]

Eddie,
I have ignored UWE and left him to make his own statements, in fact I've done the same with Ringo because they are big boys and can provide info/posts to how they think and refute others. For me it's the hatred and twisting of facts that annoys, not just on here, I don't like bullying, it's so wrong.

I used your own YAWN on you because it's merely boring and adds nothing when people mock and trying to be clever saying Whooooosh plus the most annoying not answering and saying ohh you spelt that wrong or, well let's wait and see when they can't answer. OK rant over, I'm obviously losing it, maybe time for a glass of wine, maybe a bottle actually!

Hope you and the family are well and stay safe, nearly weekend

A civilised comment. Thankyou, Kate.

[ksrclaret]

A germ, was that your little way of trying to have a quick snide remark at Trump, ooh how cute and lovely, but it did make me smile so your job for the day is done sweetie, am sure mummy will tuck you up nice and safe.

My 15 year old is a little bored and looking for new friends to play with, I could ask him if you want, then you can chat and play, but do play nicely there's a good little boy.
Be careful though he is good I'm told by his friends so no swearing, yet am sure you wont because by now you must be used to be wrong in every thread you touch.

This insulting and blame game is a doddle, even children can play

xx

Didn't mean to upset you. Soz. We still friends?

[Uwe Noble]

I am not trying to defend the WHO from criticism that they made some mistakes and didn't get everything correct but they are not this big bogie man that following Trumps attacks people suddenly think they are

Also this idea that 11th March statement was some kind of u-turn by the WHO and that until they made this announcement they were giving dangerous advice and creating issues is again way over the top

The WHO task force was full and inclusive of scientists and officials from govts all around the world including the US. I have detailed a bit of a timeline of what the WHO were doing, what statements / advice they were giving and who was involved in Jan / Feb

I think it shows the massive challenge the WHO faced and how so many countries and people worked together on it. Yes they didn't get everything correct but the world is far more at risk today following Trumps attacks and withdrawal of funding and with the division this tribal and negative approach to the WHO has caused

31 Dec 2019

China reported a cluster of cases of pneumonia in Wuhan, Hubei Province. A novel coronavirus was eventually identified.

1 January 2020

WHO had set up the IMST (Incident Management Support Team) across the three levels of the organization: headquarters, regional headquarters and country level, putting the organization on an emergency footing for dealing with the outbreak.

4 January 2020

WHO reported on social media that there was a cluster of pneumonia cases – with no deaths – in Wuhan, Hubei province.

5 January 2020

WHO published our first Disease Outbreak News on the new virus. This is a flagship technical publication to the scientific and public health community as well as global media. It contained a risk assessment and advice, and reported on what China had told the organization about the status of patients and the public health response on the cluster of pneumonia cases in Wuhan.

10 January 2020

WHO issued a comprehensive package of technical guidance online with advice to all countries on how to detect, test and manage potential cases, based on what was known about the virus at the time. This guidance was shared with WHO's regional emergency directors to share with WHO representatives in countries.

Based on experience with SARS and MERS and known modes of transmission of respiratory viruses, infection and prevention control guidance were published to protect health workers recommending droplet and contact precautions when caring for patients, and airborne precautions for aerosol generating procedures conducted by health workers.

12 January 2020

China publicly shared the genetic sequence of COVID-19.

13 January 2020

Officials confirm a case of COVID-19 in Thailand, the first recorded case outside of China.

14 January 2020

WHO's technical lead for the response noted in a press briefing there may have been limited human-to-human transmission of the coronavirus (in the 41 confirmed cases), mainly through family members, and that there was a risk of a possible wider outbreak. The lead also said that human-to-human transmission would not be surprising given our experience with SARS, MERS and other respiratory pathogens.

20-21 January 2020

WHO experts from its China and Western Pacific regional offices conducted a brief field visit to Wuhan.

22 January 2020

WHO mission to China issued a statement saying that there was evidence of human-to-human transmission in Wuhan but more investigation was needed to understand the full extent of transmission.

https://www.who.int/china/news/detail/2 ... a-jan-2020

22- 23 January 2020

The WHO Director- General convened an Emergency Committee (EC) under the International Health Regulations (IHR 2005) to assess whether the outbreak constituted a public health emergency of international concern. The independent members from around the world could not reach a consensus based on the evidence available at the time. They asked to be reconvened within 10 days after receiving more information.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/23 ... 2019-ncov)

28 January 2020

A senior WHO delegation led by the Director-General travelled to Beijing to meet China’s leadership, learn more about China’s response, and to offer any technical assistance.

While in Beijing, Dr. Tedros agreed with Chinese government leaders that an international team of leading scientists would travel to China on a mission to better understand the context, the overall response, and exchange information and experience.

30 January 2020

The WHO Director-General reconvened the Emergency Committee (EC). This was earlier than the 10-day period and only two days after the first reports of limited human-to-human transmission were reported outside China. This time, the EC reached consensus and advised the Director-General that the outbreak constituted a Public Health Emergency of International Concern (PHEIC). The Director-General accepted the recommendation and declared the novel coronavirus outbreak (2019-nCoV) a PHEIC. This is the 6th time WHO has declared a PHEIC since the International Health Regulations (IHR) came into force in 2005.

3 February 2020

WHO releases the international community's Strategic Preparedness and Response Plan to help protect states with weaker health systems.

11-12 February 2020

WHO convened a Research and Innovation Forum on COVID-19, attended by more than 400 experts and funders from around the world, which included presentations by George Gao, Director General of China CDC, and Zunyou Wu, China CDC's chief epidemiologist.

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/12 ... 9-research

16-24 February 2020

The WHO-China Joint mission, which included experts from Canada, Germany, Japan, Nigeria, Republic of Korea, Russia, Singapore and the US (CDC, NIH) spent time in Beijing and also travelled to Wuhan and two other cities. They spoke with health officials, scientists and health workers in health facilities (maintaining physical distancing).

https://www.who.int/docs/default-source ... fce87f4e_2

When you're explaining this much you're definitely losing!

[Devils_Advocate]

When you're explaining this much you're definitely losing!

Just be patent whilst I talk with the grown ups. I know you feel left out but I'll have plenty of time to entertain and play with you children later

[KateR]

DA,
not saying WHO are all to blame, not saying Trump is not to blame for some things, I posted highlights yesterday of what WHO response was as highlights that match yours.

It's April now, the 1Q of 2020 nobody was blaming anyone in reality but I think everyone was sort of waiting for WHO announcements certainly in Feb early March at government levels other than the scientific community but some levels of action were taken due to the PHW issued. Numerous people were still quoting the Flu even at governmental level in Feb and certainly many on this message board were and I will hold my hand up, I made my trip with similar thoughts but was concerned and if WHO had announced by then I would have cancelled.

I am not blaming WHO to say Trump is right or good but they will have to take a share of the blame when this is analyzed in the future and we all need to remember Trump has certain powers and they only relate to the US in these terms, while the WHO is the body that the global community looks to.

I don't see Italy/Spain or France blaming Trump for all the deaths and obviously neither will the UK or numerous other countries, so in comparison which is the bigger bogie man here, Trump or WHO when you discuss deaths around the world and start appropriating blame. Americans can blame Trump but ten pages of blame from British haters really is Fake News, even that injustice doesn't bother me that much but almost ten pages of hatred does.

If this thread was around Jew or Muslims or such like, then it would be branded a Hate Culture, therefore a litany of hate crime and the same hypocrites would be demanding arrests and it should never be allowed. I am not putting you in that category just to be clear.

[KateR]

Didn't mean to upset you. Soz. We still friends?

[KateR]

No post

did you just edit that twice,


priceless

xx

[Devils_Advocate]

DA,
not saying WHO are all to blame, not saying Trump is not to blame for some things, I posted highlights yesterday of what WHO response was as highlights that match yours.

It's April now, the 1Q of 2020 nobody was blaming anyone in reality but I think everyone was sort of waiting for WHO announcements certainly in Feb early March at government levels other than the scientific community but some levels of action were taken due to the PHW issued. Numerous people were still quoting the Flu even at governmental level in Feb and certainly many on this message board were and I will hold my hand up, I made my trip with similar thoughts but was concerned and if WHO had announced by then I would have cancelled.

I am not blaming WHO to say Trump is right or good but they will have to take a share of the blame when this is analyzed in the future and we all need to remember Trump has certain powers and they only relate to the US in these terms, while the WHO is the body that the global community looks to.

I don't see Italy/Spain or France blaming Trump for all the deaths and obviously neither will the UK or numerous other countries, so in comparison which is the bigger bogie man here, Trump or WHO when you discuss deaths around the world and start appropriating blame. Americans can blame Trump but ten pages of blame from British haters really is Fake News, even that injustice doesn't bother me that much but almost ten pages of hatred does.

If this thread was around Jew or Muslims or such like, then it would be branded a Hate Culture, therefore a litany of hate crime and the same hypocrites would be demanding arrests and it should never be allowed. I am not putting you in that category just to be clear.

There's a subtle difference which Tiger76 articulated far better than I could on the reason Trump is attacked more than the French, Italian, UK, Spanish leaders or the WHO

The issue with any of them (inc Trump) is not that they have made mistakes and got things wrong that have cost lives

The difference is Trump has been deliberately divisive and made into some kind of political rally/campaign exercise. Trumps end goal seems to be power, money and reelection over peoples lives

If you show me videos, articles and statements showing leaders like Macron attack journalists, attack people with political differences or blatantly lie and misrepresent stuff then you'll see me attack them as much as attack Trump

[ksrclaret]

?

[KateR]

There's a subtle difference which Tiger76 articulated far better than I could on the reason Trump is attacked more than the French, Italian, UK, Spanish leaders or the WHO

The issue with any of them (inc Trump) is not that they have made mistakes and got things wrong that have cost lives

The difference is Trump has been deliberately divisive and made into some kind of political rally/campaign exercise. Trumps end goal seems to be power, money and reelection over peoples lives

If you show me videos, articles and statements showing leaders like Macron attack journalists, attack people with political differences or blatantly lie and misrepresent stuff then you'll see me attack them as much as attack Trump

I can understand that and accept that with no issues, provided people stick to the truth in the attacks and blame, as I keep saying that so much is wrong the need to embellish or even make it personal about how he looks is, in some ways counterproductive and will lead to others like me calling people out on it. I left this thread alone for days hoping it would die and disappear off the front page, I kept hoping it would and it nearly did but alas it keeps getting dragged back to the top.

[KateR]

?

since you appear confused:

by ksrclaret » Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:24 pm

No post

Last edited by ksrclaret on Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

am just having some fun

[Devils_Advocate]

I can understand that and accept that with no issues, provided people stick to the truth in the attacks and blame, as I keep saying that so much is wrong the need to embellish or even make it personal about how he looks is, in some ways counterproductive and will lead to others like me calling people out on it. I left this thread alone for days hoping it would die and disappear off the front page, I kept hoping it would and it nearly did but alas it keeps getting dragged back to the top.

Admittedly I will post the odd jokey comment especially when dealing with those who dont engage. (mot you)

That aside I think I have tried to be completely factual and to the political point and I dont remember you challenging any of my articles and points for being personal or made up though its fair enough you might try to add some balance where you feel it is needed

I respect anyone who will have a genuine discussion on a topic and enjoy counter views when they are supported by credible sources or are opinions clearly based on reasonable logic

[KateR]

Careful DA, we will soon be accused of being the two sides of the same coin

or worse still, Tim will tell us to get a room lol

[Uwe Noble]

Just be patent whilst I talk with the grown ups. I know you feel left out but I'll have plenty of time to entertain and play with you children later

I think you'll need a lie down after all that "typing".

[Devils_Advocate]

I think you'll need a lie down after all that "typing".

Go and grab Dumber and lets have some fun