Keir Starmer the future

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RingoMcCartney
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by RingoMcCartney » Sat May 16, 2020 1:05 pm

TheFamilyCat wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 12:59 pm
Nobody has ever claimed there is but that hasn't stopped a minority from trying to claim that there is?
Rochdale arent world beaters

Doesn't stop their fans singing ,"we're by far the greatest team the world has ever seen. And its super Rochdale....."

Like I said

There is no lever that any government has access to that has a sign above it with the words -



"FOR PERFECT RESPONSE TO UNPRECEDENTED GLOBAL PANDEMIC PULL HERE"




It just doesn't exist. Repeat it does not exist.

Swizzlestick
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Swizzlestick » Sat May 16, 2020 1:07 pm

You ruin every single debate.

nil_desperandum
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by nil_desperandum » Sat May 16, 2020 1:09 pm

Swizzlestick wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 1:07 pm
You ruin every single debate.
Unless ignored, which all but a minority on here now seem to do.

TheFamilyCat
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by TheFamilyCat » Sat May 16, 2020 1:10 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 1:05 pm
Rochdale arent world beaters

Doesn't stop their fans singing ,"we're by far the greatest team the world has ever seen. And its super Rochdale....."

Like I said

There is no lever that any government has access to that has a sign above it with the words -



"FOR PERFECT RESPONSE TO UNPRECEDENTED GLOBAL PANDEMIC PULL HERE"




It just doesn't exist. Repeat it does not exist.
Righto

TVC15
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by TVC15 » Sat May 16, 2020 1:10 pm

Swizzlestick wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 1:07 pm
You ruin every single debate.
Of course he does.
Most of the board just ignore him now.
It annoys him even more.
He’s completely and utterly irrelevant.

All that cutting, pasting, repeating, bold type and formatting and nobody gives a flying f-uck.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by ksrclaret » Sat May 16, 2020 1:11 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 1:05 pm
Rochdale arent world beaters

Doesn't stop their fans singing ,"we're by far the greatest team the world has ever seen. And its super Rochdale....."

Like I said

There is no lever that any government has access to that has a sign above it with the words -



"FOR PERFECT RESPONSE TO UNPRECEDENTED GLOBAL PANDEMIC PULL HERE"


It just doesn't exist. Repeat it does not exist.
Wrongo making up his own arguments that nobody has ever argued for? No, surely not!! Still, we can't deny him another hollow victory.

Unusual for him to be so steaming at this time though, normally he's sleeping it off at this point. I suspect he'll be late for 'work' soon.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by AndrewJB » Sat May 16, 2020 1:11 pm

Holtyclaret wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 9:48 am
I wish I had a tenth of the intelligence you think you have. Hindsight eh? At least I understand the meaning of the word ‘unprecedented’.
I’m sure there’s nobody unaware of the meaning of unprecedented - so often is that word used by ministers, and by the media. Unprecedented in modern times, like the financial crash of ten years ago, but we can’t say it was never planned for, or that we didn’t know it could happen.

Even putting aside the mistakes, there’s absolutely no excuse for the lies, the spin, the lack of transparency, and threatening doctors who speak out.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Swizzlestick » Sat May 16, 2020 1:15 pm

Thing is, I like seeing other points of view - people I don’t usually
agree with like Paul Waine, taio, Grumps - but at least they put together coherent, thought provoking points of view. I can’t do with people like him. Look at me, look at me. Will ignore but it’s a shame how he derails so many threads with his repetitive drone.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Billy Balfour » Sat May 16, 2020 1:54 pm

My scroll wheel is aching again. I do wish people wouldn't quote the needy troll. This thread, by and large, has been a decent one to read until today.
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keith1879
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by keith1879 » Sat May 16, 2020 4:16 pm

Ringo who?

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by android » Sat May 16, 2020 4:18 pm

Corky wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 9:30 am
Why do people feel the need to say it is my opinion. Obviously it is but it is also shared by others.

I see you are making all the obvious infantile schoolboy excuses for the Falstafian buffoon. I commented on the BAME issue earlier but it does not alter the facts that he has referred to people of colour as piccaninnies or that they have watermelon smiles. He is inherently a racist. He has also referred to the working class in a most derogatory manner. But what the hell, he's a laugh so we will ignore the consequences.

Lets say I decide to start a new political party and lets call it the National Socialist Party. I promise to make my country great again and millions flock to its banner.Years down the line..... You may not like it but if you as I suspect voted Tory then you voted for a racist leader. If you are comfortable with that then perhaps your moral compass needs a bit of oiling. But me, I'm afraid and so should we all.
Corky - have you read the article with the offensive terms or the letterbox article?

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Colburn_Claret » Sat May 16, 2020 4:42 pm

Corky wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 9:30 am
Why do people feel the need to say it is my opinion. Obviously it is but it is also shared by others.

I see you are making all the obvious infantile schoolboy excuses for the Falstafian buffoon. I commented on the BAME issue earlier but it does not alter the facts that he has referred to people of colour as piccaninnies or that they have watermelon smiles. He is inherently a racist. He has also referred to the working class in a most derogatory manner. But what the hell, he's a laugh so we will ignore the consequences.

Lets say I decide to start a new political party and lets call it the National Socialist Party. I promise to make my country great again and millions flock to its banner.Years down the line..... You may not like it but if you as I suspect voted Tory then you voted for a racist leader. If you are comfortable with that then perhaps your moral compass needs a bit of oiling. But me, I'm afraid and so should we all.
Nothing wrong with my moral compass. I voted Tory, and I hate racists with a passion. The problem is the way you characterise a racist. Much as Dianne Abbott and Corbyn, if people don't share your myopic view of what is politically correct, then they are instantly branded racist. I'm sorry but you're wrong. Boris can put his foot in his mouth, he has come out with some regrettable statements, we all have probably, but that just makes him human, not racist. Explain to me why so many coured people voted Tory, campaign for the Tories and represent the Tories. In your myopic view are they all racists as well.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Colburn_Claret » Sat May 16, 2020 5:00 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 12:05 pm
“Certainly not racist” because he’s hired a few ethnic people? He made racist comments in columns he wrote. Homophobic comments, misogynistic comments, sneering nasty comments about working class people, and of course the “letterboxes and bank robbers” article. If it’s not racism, is it just unfunny jokes? He’s not a racist, but a bully who makes fun of the different person in the room? I’m not sure which is more unpleasant, but which do you think it is? He either knew, or he didn’t know that his column making fun of some Muslim women would lead to a rise in racism against them. If he knew, he’s callous. If he didn’t know, then he’s seriously lacking in judgement. Which do you think?
Many people, me included, don't like the burka. It doesn't sit right with the British way of life. It's demeaning for women, and it has nothing to do with religion. If it does then why do the vast majority of Muslim women around the world not require one. Boris raised an important point in a tongue in cheek manner, as I've already said his rhetoric isn't always politically correct, but that's the way he is.
To suggest that the rise in racist attacks was attributable to his column is typical left wing bullshittery. I doubt the people who carry out racist attacks ever read any papers, never mind the rags that Boris wrote in. But hey, it makes a good sound bite doesn't it.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Tall Paul » Sat May 16, 2020 5:24 pm

Colburn_Claret wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 4:42 pm
Nothing wrong with my moral compass. I voted Tory, and I hate racists with a passion. The problem is the way you characterise a racist. Much as Dianne Abbott and Corbyn, if people don't share your myopic view of what is politically correct, then they are instantly branded racist. I'm sorry but you're wrong. Boris can put his foot in his mouth, he has come out with some regrettable statements, we all have probably, but that just makes him human, not racist. Explain to me why so many coured people voted Tory, campaign for the Tories and represent the Tories. In your myopic view are they all racists as well.
Hates racists, describes non-white people as "coloured" (presumably that's what "coured" is supposed to say).

:lol:
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by keith1879 » Sat May 16, 2020 5:24 pm

android wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 4:18 pm
Corky - have you read the article with the offensive terms or the letterbox article?
I believe that one of the phrases used by Johnson in the past was as follows. "It is said that the Queen has come to love the Commonwealth, partly because it supplies her with regular cheering crowds of flag-waving piccaninnies."

Could this sentence have been rewritten to mean the same while not using the same (racist) final word? Yes it could. I think that the left do have a tendency to see racism/homophobia where none exists ......but it would take a heroic effort not to see it here.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by android » Sat May 16, 2020 5:37 pm

Have you read the article Keith?

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Corky » Sat May 16, 2020 5:55 pm

Yes Keith I have and also his apology.

What is staggering is that not one of the Tory apologists on this thread have actually said well yes he has made racist remarks, he has demeaned the LGBT community, he has made Islamophobic remarks, the list goes on. It is always well Boris can be a bit whatever word fits the latest gaff. He is demonstrably a typical bullinger boy who cares nothing for anyone or anything that is not in his right wing establishment clique. He doesn't even like the working class yet idiots in Burnley voted for him based on his oven ready brexit.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by AndrewJB » Sat May 16, 2020 7:09 pm

Colburn_Claret wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 5:00 pm
Many people, me included, don't like the burka. It doesn't sit right with the British way of life. It's demeaning for women, and it has nothing to do with religion. If it does then why do the vast majority of Muslim women around the world not require one. Boris raised an important point in a tongue in cheek manner, as I've already said his rhetoric isn't always politically correct, but that's the way he is.
To suggest that the rise in racist attacks was attributable to his column is typical left wing bullshittery. I doubt the people who carry out racist attacks ever read any papers, never mind the rags that Boris wrote in. But hey, it makes a good sound bite doesn't it.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/h ... 88476.html

You don’t believe it, but it’s true. What have hijab wearers done to deserve such abuse? Johnson was mocking a small group of women for the sake of getting laughs from intolerant people.
That’s the behaviour of a bully. And it’s the same with all the other things. Not racist toward black people? Who actually knows? But he’s happy to use racist language and to demean them to get laughs from readers who are somewhat if not wholly racist themselves. Does he despise working class people, as his articles suggest? Let’s be generous and say hi doesn’t - but he still wrote those words - so at the least he’s a bully playing to a baying crowd.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by AndrewJB » Sat May 16, 2020 7:14 pm

Corky wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 5:55 pm
Yes Keith I have and also his apology.

What is staggering is that not one of the Tory apologists on this thread have actually said well yes he has made racist remarks, he has demeaned the LGBT community, he has made Islamophobic remarks, the list goes on. It is always well Boris can be a bit whatever word fits the latest gaff. He is demonstrably a typical bullinger boy who cares nothing for anyone or anything that is not in his right wing establishment clique. He doesn't even like the working class yet idiots in Burnley voted for him based on his oven ready brexit.
He gets the pass because nobody in the press repeatedly brings it up day after day. If the press did this (some might call it doing their job) his career would sink. Ask yourself what kind of deal he’s done with Murdoch et al to keep them from pulling the trigger.
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android
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by android » Sat May 16, 2020 9:05 pm

Well Corky, if you have read the article then I am even more dismayed by your comments. I hope you might read this with an open mind...

Johnson wrote a piece of satire in 2002, in which he lampooned Blair for escaping his troubles at home to seek a friendly welcome in Africa. He lampooned Blair as the "big white chief" arriving on his "big white bird" (aeroplane not his latest woman). He pictured Blair as some kind of outdated imperial overlord taking advantage of foreign politeness to get the welcome he craved. So in this context he used some archaic descriptive words from the colonial era that people no longer use and we now see as offensive. He did not express any negative sentiment towards black people. There was some anti - Imperialist sentiment and possibly a very weak case for anti-white sentiment but his main target was Blair. Do you think he has used those terms - including describing any of our prime ministers as a "big white chief" - in any other context since? Has he shown prejudice against people due to their race? I could not disagree with you and Keith more and I think you need to be highly creative and/or desperate to call someone a racist for that article.

The "letterbox" comment is related to clothing based on an extreme interpretation of a religion and is not about race. He was defending the right of women to wear what they want, including the niqab, but at the same time making what Rowan Atkinson described as a good joke about it's appearance. There are very few muslims in this country who want or are made to wear it but Johnson was saying we should not ban it, unlike France and other countries. I am old enough to remember when it was a cool left wing thing to do to mock Christianity and Rowan Atkinson was a keen exponent. I personally think it's a good thing that diversity has brought more respect towards peoples religions but it would be tragic if we could no longer take aim at it's more undesirable aspects. For me Johnson's "feel free to wear it but don't expect me to like it" (my summary) stance is sound. Andrew makes a good point that this article could be deemed insensitive and likely to stir up trouble. This is a matter of opinion. The newspare headline in Andrew's link reports a dramatic 375% spike in anti muslim attacks. How many thousands do you think that was? If I have read the report correctly, I think it was about a dozen people (seriously!) over the course of a week!

Ironically the case against Corbyn was much stronger in my view but he is yesterday's man and there's no point going over all the anti-semitism stuff again. I stopped short of calling Corbyn racist but I was certainly pleased to hear Starmer declare his intent on anti-semitism.

I have written all this because I am not a racist and I don't appreciate being called a racist, which is what you branded me along with about 14 million others.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Colburn_Claret » Sat May 16, 2020 9:43 pm

AndrewJB wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 7:09 pm
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/h ... 88476.html

You don’t believe it, but it’s true. What have hijab wearers done to deserve such abuse? Johnson was mocking a small group of women for the sake of getting laughs from intolerant people.
That’s the behaviour of a bully. And it’s the same with all the other things. Not racist toward black people? Who actually knows? But he’s happy to use racist language and to demean them to get laughs from readers who are somewhat if not wholly racist themselves. Does he despise working class people, as his articles suggest? Let’s be generous and say hi doesn’t - but he still wrote those words - so at the least he’s a bully playing to a baying crowd.
I've already said, speaking unpolitically correct, could make Boris many things, but doesn't make him a racist.
If you actually believe that loads of peaceful living citizens, decide to go attacking Muslims because of an article written by Johnson, well that is really putting 2 and 2 together and making 6. I've read the article, its ********. Have they actually any interviews with anybody caught committing racist attacks, who claimed he was inspired to do it because of Boris Johnson. Linking two unrelated events, is just cheap journalism, it's based on nothing but speculation and supposition. As I've said many times Andrew, you are always willing to believe anything that supports your point of view, disbelieve everything that counters it. Try seeing through the flam and work it out for yourself.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by AndrewJB » Sat May 16, 2020 11:27 pm

Colburn_Claret wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 9:43 pm
I've already said, speaking unpolitically correct, could make Boris many things, but doesn't make him a racist.
If you actually believe that loads of peaceful living citizens, decide to go attacking Muslims because of an article written by Johnson, well that is really putting 2 and 2 together and making 6. I've read the article, its ********. Have they actually any interviews with anybody caught committing racist attacks, who claimed he was inspired to do it because of Boris Johnson. Linking two unrelated events, is just cheap journalism, it's based on nothing but speculation and supposition. As I've said many times Andrew, you are always willing to believe anything that supports your point of view, disbelieve everything that counters it. Try seeing through the flam and work it out for yourself.
Who here is the one disbelieving a report assembled from over a thousand Islamophobic incidents in 2018? You're ready to believe claims of anti-Semitism when it suits you, but dismiss racism, homophobia, and anti-working class diatribes even when it's written in a newspaper with Johnson's name underneath the byline. You are guilty of exactly what you're accusing me of.

Of course it's not "loads of peaceful living (sic) citizens" deciding to attack Muslims. It's people who already hate Muslims feeling emboldened and empowered to go out and abuse them, because a well know Tory MP has just done so. Quoting from the article:

"In the three weeks after the article was published last August, 42 per cent of offline Islamophobic incidents reported “directly referenced Boris Johnson and/or the language used in his column”, a report said."

Lazy journalism? The newspaper didn't write the report! They're just writing about it.

Let's just say that writing racist things in a newspaper doesn't automatically make someone a racist. Doing so makes Johnson (if not a racist) a bully, an idiot, and or a person playing upon the racism of others for his own political gain. All of these are deeply unpleasant characteristics. Add to this the fact he lies all the time, makes promises and breaks them easily, shirks actual hard work, and has an appalling record of infidelity, and we have someone most people on here wouldn't have as a friend, let alone be fit for high office.
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GodIsADeeJay81
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun May 17, 2020 12:15 am

I've had and probably still have friends worse than Boris.

You wouldn't cope with some of the stuff they goes on in my WhatsApp...

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by ksrclaret » Sun May 17, 2020 12:20 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:15 am
I've had and probably still have friends worse than Boris.

You wouldn't cope with some of the stuff they goes on in my WhatsApp...
Who'd want to?

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun May 17, 2020 12:25 am

ksrclaret wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:20 am
Who'd want to?
Let me know your number for the invite..

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by ksrclaret » Sun May 17, 2020 12:30 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:25 am
Let me know your number for the invite..
God I can just imagine it now. A load of fat ugly blokes salivating over women who'd not look twice at them, raging that migrants are taking their mates jobs...

Can't wait thanks Sid. :)

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun May 17, 2020 12:39 am

ksrclaret wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:30 am
God I can just imagine it now. A load of fat ugly blokes salivating over women who'd not look twice at them, raging that migrants are taking their mates jobs...

Can't wait thanks Sid. :)
We don't really bang on about the women that much, just the amusing jokes, memes and videos.

As for migrants, meh, none of us have any issues with jobs being affected, can't remember ever having a conversation about them.

No issue with the fat and ugly comment though, I still get laid aplenty, or was before this damned pandemic put a stop to it all :roll:
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by ksrclaret » Sun May 17, 2020 12:42 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:39 am
We don't really bang on about the women that much, just the amusing jokes, memes and videos.

As for migrants, meh, none of us have any issues with jobs being affected, can't remember ever having a conversation about them.

No issue with the fat and ugly comment though, I still get laid aplenty, or was before this damned pandemic put a stop to it all :roll:
:lol: :lol: :lol:

What's so bad about this Whatsapp group then that means some wouldn't be able to cope with it?

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Hipper » Sun May 17, 2020 8:21 am

AndrewJB wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 1:11 pm
............there’s absolutely no excuse for the lies, the spin, the lack of transparency, and threatening doctors who speak out.
I think there may be an excuse.

If what we are being told is covering something far worse then it makes sense to deceive us.

It seems clear from the reactions to various government messages that there are a number (some, many, most?) that cannot or will not process the information in a sensible manner. We don't want panic, people who give up etc.. We have to have the feeling that there is hope; that this virus is controllable without altering our lives too radically. Our hope is surely based on a vaccine but at the moment there is little evidence that we can control the virus without massive economic damage and all the consequences that will have.

In these circumstances there are two choices: open up the economy to some semblance of normality and accept that there will be a large number of deaths (the Trump model perhaps) or, continue with some sort of lockdown/social distancing so reducing deaths but destroying large parts of the economy. The latter could lead to suffering, strife, political instability and perhaps revolution from those that will suffer most, the young and employable.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Corky » Sun May 17, 2020 8:55 am

android wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 9:05 pm
Well Corky, if you have read the article then I am even more dismayed by your comments. I hope you might read this with an open mind...

Johnson wrote a piece of satire in 2002, in which he lampooned Blair for escaping his troubles at home to seek a friendly welcome in Africa. He lampooned Blair as the "big white chief" arriving on his "big white bird" (aeroplane not his latest woman). He pictured Blair as some kind of outdated imperial overlord taking advantage of foreign politeness to get the welcome he craved. So in this context he used some archaic descriptive words from the colonial era that people no longer use and we now see as offensive. He did not express any negative sentiment towards black people. There was some anti - Imperialist sentiment and possibly a very weak case for anti-white sentiment but his main target was Blair. Do you think he has used those terms - including describing any of our prime ministers as a "big white chief" - in any other context since? Has he shown prejudice against people due to their race? I could not disagree with you and Keith more and I think you need to be highly creative and/or desperate to call someone a racist for that article.

The "letterbox" comment is related to clothing based on an extreme interpretation of a religion and is not about race. He was defending the right of women to wear what they want, including the niqab, but at the same time making what Rowan Atkinson described as a good joke about it's appearance. There are very few muslims in this country who want or are made to wear it but Johnson was saying we should not ban it, unlike France and other countries. I am old enough to remember when it was a cool left wing thing to do to mock Christianity and Rowan Atkinson was a keen exponent. I personally think it's a good thing that diversity has brought more respect towards peoples religions but it would be tragic if we could no longer take aim at it's more undesirable aspects. For me Johnson's "feel free to wear it but don't expect me to like it" (my summary) stance is sound. Andrew makes a good point that this article could be deemed insensitive and likely to stir up trouble. This is a matter of opinion. The newspare headline in Andrew's link reports a dramatic 375% spike in anti muslim attacks. How many thousands do you think that was? If I have read the report correctly, I think it was about a dozen people (seriously!) over the course of a week!

Ironically the case against Corbyn was much stronger in my view but he is yesterday's man and there's no point going over all the anti-semitism stuff again. I stopped short of calling Corbyn racist but I was certainly pleased to hear Starmer declare his intent on anti-semitism.

I have written all this because I am not a racist and I don't appreciate being called a racist, which is what you branded me along with about 14 million others.
Nope you are still racists.

I will say it again, it is staggering the lengths that you will go to to try and assuage your guilt and embarrassment for voting for this Prime Minister. I am happy to accept his article was in part satirical but I thought we had long passed these pathetic and infantile racist comments. So I guess you would be more than happy to watch Bernard Manning say "why do blacks smell, so the blind can hate them to". No doubt you would be rolling in the aisles. The Falstafian buffoon has no empathy for the common man or woman and is unfit to govern. But what the hell he a laugh. Your excuses are pathetic.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by taio » Sun May 17, 2020 9:05 am

Corky wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 8:55 am
Nope you are still racists.

I will say it again, it is staggering the lengths that you will go to to try and assuage your guilt and embarrassment for voting for this Prime Minister. I am happy to accept his article was in part satirical but I thought we had long passed these pathetic and infantile racist comments. So I guess you would be more than happy to watch Bernard Manning say "why do blacks smell, so the blind can hate them to". No doubt you would be rolling in the aisles. The Falstafian buffoon has no empathy for the common man or woman and is unfit to govern. But what the hell he a laugh. Your excuses are pathetic.
What is most staggering and pathetic is you labelling 14 million people racists because they don't align with your political beliefs.
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by keith1879 » Sun May 17, 2020 10:16 am

android wrote:
Sat May 16, 2020 5:37 pm
Have you read the article Keith?
Morning Android.

Before I made my original posting I tried to find the full article on line without success. I managed to find this piece which includes an extended quote https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... 17ef059528 and I looked at a number of other sources (mostly supportive of Johnson) so I understand that it was essentially a satirical attack on Tony Blair.

It would have been possible to have written the sentence I quoted as follows.
" It is said that the Queen has come to love the Commonwealth, partly because it supplies her with regular cheering crowds of flag-waving enthusiastic children; and one can imagine that Blair, twice victor abroad but enmired at home, is similarly seduced by foreign politeness.”

This would have been an attack on Blair ....just as strong an attack. Why did BJ choose to use a word which is acknowledged to be a racist term? Comic effect? This was not some late-night set in a half-full comedy club at the Edinburgh fringe.....it was a featured column in a national newspaper that considers itsself to be one of the quality papers.

I do not suggest that Boris is a racist in the sense that he dislikes people from (for example) Africa but he casually used a racially unacceptable word and also made reference to a racial stereotype (watermelon smiles) in an earlier paragraph.

He used a racial term and a racial stereotype in a column where neither was required. That tells us something about him.

(Edited to clarify that I had researched before I made my earlier posting).
Last edited by keith1879 on Sun May 17, 2020 10:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Sun May 17, 2020 10:17 am

ksrclaret wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 12:42 am
:lol: :lol: :lol:

What's so bad about this Whatsapp group then that means some wouldn't be able to cope with it?
Given that he admits Katie Hopkins says things that he’s inclined to agree with then I can well imagine.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by BurningBeard » Sun May 17, 2020 10:27 am

Mail on Sunday going after Starmer this morning because he bought some land in 1996 next to his parents home so they could keep rescue donkeys.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by NottsClaret » Sun May 17, 2020 10:31 am

BurningBeard wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:27 am
Mail on Sunday going after Starmer this morning because he bought some land in 1996 next to his parents home so they could keep rescue donkeys.
He’s definitely got them rattled. They rejoiced when Jeremy got in, they know this is more serious.

They’re right though, what a scumbag. Buying his mum a field to look after rescue donkeys. He’s a monster. Almost as bad as being intelligent and successful from a modest background.
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by evensteadiereddie » Sun May 17, 2020 10:39 am

If the donkey sanctuary story is meant to show SKS in a bad light, that's a miscalculation, surely ?
He's made a very good early impression. As you say, they are rattled and he'll be ready for them.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Devils_Advocate » Sun May 17, 2020 10:39 am

Keir Starmer’s mum loved donkeys so much Keir brought her a field to house rescued ones...

...Boris Johnson loves donkeys so much he filled the cabinet with them.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by evensteadiereddie » Sun May 17, 2020 10:47 am

Anybody see Gavin Williamson's er, briefing yesterday................... :o

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by taio » Sun May 17, 2020 10:47 am

evensteadiereddie wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:47 am
Anybody see Gavin Williamson's er, briefing yesterday................... :o
Yes. I thought he was dreadful.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by BurningBeard » Sun May 17, 2020 10:50 am

evensteadiereddie wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:39 am
If the donkey sanctuary story is meant to show SKS in a bad light, that's a miscalculation, surely ?
He's made a very good early impression. As you say, they are rattled and he'll be ready for them.
I think they're counting on the numbskulls who actually buy the rag reading the headline and a bit of the story but getting bored and stopping reading at the point their assumptions and biases are met but before the actual reality of what's transpired.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by keith1879 » Sun May 17, 2020 10:52 am

evensteadiereddie wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:47 am
Anybody see Gavin Williamson's er, briefing yesterday................... :o
Saturday seems to be the day where they wheel out the dead wood.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by Steve-Harpers-perm » Sun May 17, 2020 10:52 am

Starmer must be pleased if the best they can come up with is he bought a field for his parents.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by keith1879 » Sun May 17, 2020 10:55 am

BurningBeard wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:50 am
I think they're counting on the numbskulls who actually buy the rag reading the headline and a bit of the story but getting bored and stopping reading at the point their assumptions and biases are met but before the actual reality of what's transpired.
Exactly ..... I get depressed sometimes thinking "How can you change the minds of people who voted for Trump/Johnson/whoever?" but of course you don't need to try with the great mass... you just need to appeal to the ones who really think about how they vote. Which is the problem with FPTP of course.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by tiger76 » Sun May 17, 2020 11:07 am

keith1879 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:55 am
Exactly ..... I get depressed sometimes thinking "How can you change the minds of people who voted for Trump/Johnson/whoever?" but of course you don't need to try with the great mass... you just need to appeal to the ones who really think about how they vote. Which is the problem with FPTP of course.
Johnson's biggest electoral asset was Jeremy Corbyn,now Labour have got a new leader who actually knows his onions,Johnson's bluster is being exhibited for all to see,why Labour ever thought Corbyn was the answer heaven knows,but thankfully they've regained their senses,and the opposition can now be taken seriously.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by AndrewJB » Sun May 17, 2020 11:13 am

Hipper wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 8:21 am
I think there may be an excuse.

If what we are being told is covering something far worse then it makes sense to deceive us.

It seems clear from the reactions to various government messages that there are a number (some, many, most?) that cannot or will not process the information in a sensible manner. We don't want panic, people who give up etc.. We have to have the feeling that there is hope; that this virus is controllable without altering our lives too radically. Our hope is surely based on a vaccine but at the moment there is little evidence that we can control the virus without massive economic damage and all the consequences that will have.

In these circumstances there are two choices: open up the economy to some semblance of normality and accept that there will be a large number of deaths (the Trump model perhaps) or, continue with some sort of lockdown/social distancing so reducing deaths but destroying large parts of the economy. The latter could lead to suffering, strife, political instability and perhaps revolution from those that will suffer most, the young and employable.
I'm sure there may be good reasons for the government to tell us "white lies" on occasion, but much of what I see is spin, and all it will do is undermine confidence and trust in the government. If we get a second wave, and the government are forced to lock the country down heavier than it is now, and few people believe what they say, then it will be harder to implement.

I don't think opening up the economy and accepting large numbers of deaths is a viable choice, so the only way forward in my opinion is to lock down. If we're going to lock down, and we want it to be successful, we have to make sure everyone is looked after. There is nothing inevitable about everyone suffering during a lock down, but if we keep the economy going as per normal, and everyone retains their financial obligations while living without an income, then that will bring about economic ruin.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by jrgbfc » Sun May 17, 2020 11:25 am

I'm sure the Tory press have been busy trying to dig up some dirt on Starmer. If that's the best they can come up with they really are desperate.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by TheFamilyCat » Sun May 17, 2020 11:27 am

keith1879 wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:52 am
Saturday seems to be the day where they wheel out the dead wood.
I don't think it's exclusively a Saturday thing. I do wonder whether Boris sends these muppets out to try to make himself look a bit better.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by tiger76 » Sun May 17, 2020 11:29 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:39 am
Keir Starmer’s mum loved donkeys so much Keir brought her a field to house rescued ones...

...Boris Johnson loves donkeys so much he filled the cabinet with them.
Now DA don't insult donkeys by comparing them to cabinet members,although you could argue both are taking the public for a ride.
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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by TheFamilyCat » Sun May 17, 2020 11:30 am

jrgbfc wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 11:25 am
I'm sure the Tory press have been busy trying to dig up some dirt on Starmer. If that's the best they can come up with they really are desperate.
Unfortunately there's plenty of stuff beyond what the press can write about him "letting Jimmy Savile go free" and "not protecting the victims of CSE". The press know what's libellous, sadly Tory MPs don't.

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Re: Keir Starmer the future

Post by BurningBeard » Sun May 17, 2020 11:32 am

evensteadiereddie wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:47 am
Anybody see Gavin Williamson's er, briefing yesterday................... :o
I've a reception aged child and live in the area of England with the highest estimated R. There are many reasons for it, but no way I'm sending him into school on 1st June as things stand.

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