Dominic Cummings

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by SalisburyClaret » Tue May 26, 2020 9:13 am

Anyone who thinks driving is a good way to test your eyesight should not be allowed near a government

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Paul Waine » Tue May 26, 2020 9:25 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Mon May 25, 2020 11:52 pm
For those who are happy to take Cummings statement today as a truthful account of what happened then be aware that one of his claims has already been shown to be false.

Not only did he lie but he manipulated a document within the last month in preparation to make the pre-meditated lie

In his statement to the nation today Cummings claimed he warned about coronavirus in his 2019 blog. It didnt take much research for some journalists to uncover that the references to SARS and coronavirus were added to his blog post on pandemic risks sometime between April and May of this year.

See the screenshots from April and May showing the change he made and understand this guy and his close allies in govt are not trustworthy and lie constantly

Image

Image
Hi DA, appreciate your post. I wasn't aware that there were services like wayback machine previously. Are the two edits the text in bold type? Are these the only edits in DC's blog? If I was to read the blog now, is it possible to know what text was there previously, but has now been deleted? Similarly, where text has been overwritten, is the previous text accessible?

Little side question: does wayback machine (or similar) work on Twitter? If it does, what is the point of users deleting their tweets if a service like wayback can recall them?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Burnley Ace » Tue May 26, 2020 9:37 am

Zlatan wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:09 am
Of course it’s bloody political! He’s the mastermind behind Brexit and he’s been instrumental in our government response to this crisis and he has admitted to breaking the rules.

I don’t give a f#ck about his cover story of driving 60 miles to see if he can drive - clearly fabricated to excuse a trip out for his wife’s birthday, his wife can also drive you know.

For the record (and my partner will testify) I listen to no one and make my own mind up on things and I will change my mind too, if others can justify a reasonable argument.

I think that the police should be corroborating his account of events - if they prove his movements are as he stated I may reconsider my opinion. However if they discover he lied, then of course he will have to stand down.
You’ve chosen not to believe him, you accept that the pursuit is for political reasons and seem quite content that the Labour PCC is, for political reason, asking the police to investigate a political opponent of his party. Do you want all accusations of breach of regulations investigated with the same thoroughness?

You must listen to someone - where are you getting your information from?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Billy Balfour » Tue May 26, 2020 9:39 am

My final words on this.

The saddest thing about the whole episode is that people are willing trash their own credibility in order to defend the indefensible and I include MPs who previously I've held a bit of respect for.

Cummings' story has more holes in it than a block of Emmental, yet people still defend him. At best I think it makes them look like servile sycophants, at worse it makes them look like gullible idiots and I'd say the same if Cummings had been the Chief Adviser to a Labour/Lib Dem or Coalition govt.

A govt passing emergency laws, then twisting them to save one of their own, is the politics of the gutter and it shames us all.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by BurningBeard » Tue May 26, 2020 9:43 am

Billy Balfour wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:39 am
My final words on this.

The saddest thing about the whole episode is that people are willing trash their own credibility in order to defend the indefensible and I include MPs who previously I've held a bit of respect for.

Cummings' story has more holes in it than a block of Emmental, yet people still defend him. At best I think it makes them look like servile sycophants, at worse it makes them look like gullible idiots and I'd say the same if Cummings had been the Chief Adviser to a Labour/Lib Dem or Coalition govt.

A govt passing emergency laws, then twisting them to save one of their own, is the politics of the gutter and it shames us all.
Douglas Ross, minister for Scotland had just resigned from the govt, so there are people who still have some credibility and integrity.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Ashingtonclaret46 » Tue May 26, 2020 9:54 am

Billy Balfour wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:39 am
My final words on this.

The saddest thing about the whole episode is that people are willing trash their own credibility in order to defend the indefensible and I include MPs who previously I've held a bit of respect for.

Cummings' story has more holes in it than a block of Emmental, yet people still defend him. At best I think it makes them look like servile sycophants, at worse it makes them look like gullible idiots and I'd say the same if Cummings had been the Chief Adviser to a Labour/Lib Dem or Coalition govt.

A govt passing emergency laws, then twisting them to save one of their own, is the politics of the gutter and it shames us all.
It is politics as it has been for many, many years and it will never change!

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue May 26, 2020 9:54 am

Paul Waine wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:25 am
Hi DA, appreciate your post. I wasn't aware that there were services like wayback machine previously. Are the two edits the text in bold type? Are these the only edits in DC's blog? If I was to read the blog now, is it possible to know what text was there previously, but has now been deleted? Similarly, where text has been overwritten, is the previous text accessible?

Little side question: does wayback machine (or similar) work on Twitter? If it does, what is the point of users deleting their tweets if a service like wayback can recall them?
Hi Paul,

I can't answer any of your technical or functional questions about the wayback machine as I know nothing about it. The bits highlighted in bold is the edit from April to May showing Cummings add the text he then later used in his statement as 2019 text.

Im not sure what the purpose of your questions are but if it is genuine interest Im sure if you use the internet you can find the information you want.

The key bit about this thread is it highlights not only Cummings lying but him doctoring something in advance to support his lie. Im sure on that point you are as dismayed and disappointed as me and agree that it his hard to trust anything he says when he lie's and misleads so easily

I dont think you have Twitter but this isn't just some random person who's found and posted this but it has been highlighted and discussed at length by many reputable and respected journalists and data experts and there isn't a single person challenging the accuracy of this.

One of the threads on this came as part of a fuller piece of analysis by Faisal Islam - a political and economics journalist who has held high level positions at Channel 4 and Sky News before becoming the BBC's Economics Editor.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1265 ... 11845.html

I spent a lot of time reading several threads and reading lots of different peoples thoughts on this subject before feeling confident enough to post on this forum as something factual

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by karatekid » Tue May 26, 2020 10:04 am

BurningBeard wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:43 am
Douglas Ross, minister for Scotland had just resigned from the govt, so there are people who still have some credibility and integrity.

https://youtu.be/NUHk2RSMCS8

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:06 am

No apology from Cummings......I hope he stays hes causing mayhem.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by martin_p » Tue May 26, 2020 10:09 am

Ashingtonclaret46 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:54 am
It is politics as it has been for many, many years and it will never change!

And the more worrying trend is that people believe politics has always been like this! I’ve said it before but it’s worth repeating, politics has not always been like this. You get as many lies in a day as you used to in a whole year in the past.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue May 26, 2020 10:10 am

Steve1956 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:06 am
No apology from Cummings......I hope he stays hes causing mayhem.
Agree because when we are in the middle of a health crisis where people are dying political mayhem is just what we need. :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by lakedistrictclaret » Tue May 26, 2020 10:14 am

Steve1956 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:06 am
No apology from Cummings......I hope he stays hes causing mayhem.
Yes, but mayhem is the last thing this country needs at the moment.

The whole incident needs to be put behind us. We all have our opinions of Cummings ( I thought his excuse for driving to Barnard Castle was laughable ), but the fact is he is not going to resign and the PM is not going to sack him.

Let's get on with driving the R rate down and returning to some sort of normality.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:14 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:10 am
Agree because when we are in the middle of a health crisis where people are dying political mayhem is just what we need. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Really?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:16 am

I see the Cummings and Goings has begun at No10

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:21 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:10 am
Agree because when we are in the middle of a health crisis where people are dying political mayhem is just what we need. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Some people reckon the whole thing is a lie,we knew the lies would roll off this governments tongue,i thought they might be just little white lies,not giant porkies,the walls will tumble around Boris's ears long before this governments term ends sit back and enjoy the ride its going to be bumpy as f**k :roll:

The sooner Johnson is gone the better the country will be.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:35 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:10 am
Agree because when we are in the middle of a health crisis where people are dying political mayhem is just what we need. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Just a question for you buddy,do you think the government is handling this crisis well or is it Political Mayhem at the moment?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Ashingtonclaret46 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:35 am

martin_p wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:09 am
And the more worrying trend is that people believe politics has always been like this! I’ve said it before but it’s worth repeating, politics has not always been like this. You get as many lies in a day as you used to in a whole year in the past.
I said for many, many years and from my own experience in dealings with various MPs I can take you back to the 1980s and there were plenty of untruths around then, however, there was nowhere near the media storm that we are subjected to now, whether it be the national media or social media.
You could argue whether the advance of communications is a good thing or a bad thing.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue May 26, 2020 10:40 am

Steve1956 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:35 am
Just a question for you buddy,do you think the government is handling this crisis well or is it Political Mayhem at the moment?
I think they are a bloody disaster and it is complete mayhem distracting from what we really should be fighting. This whole Cummings saga is a mess of their own making and is just increasing the mayhem.

This is why I mocked your post about not wanting him to resign because he is causing mayhem. Your follow up posts look much more sensible and ones I can agree with

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:43 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:40 am
I think they are a bloody disaster and it is complete mayhem distracting from what we really should be fighting. This whole Cummings saga is a mess of their own making and is just increasing the mayhem.

This is why I mocked your post about not wanting him to resign because he is causing mayhem. Your follow up posts look much more sensible and ones I can agree with
We need Johnson gone his undying love and need of Cummings can only hasten things....here' s hoping eh?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue May 26, 2020 10:45 am

Steve1956 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:43 am
We need Johnson gone his undying love and need of Cummings can only hasten things....here' s hoping eh?
I'll raise a glass with you to that mate :)

To add I get your point better about wanting Cummings to stay to hasten up the departure of Johnson. I understand your sentiment but in such tough times I would rather Cummings gone to give Johnson and his govt every chance to succeed because for me now is not the time to want a bad smell to hang around just so someone I want gone looks worst and gets put under more pressure
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by IanMcL » Tue May 26, 2020 10:52 am

Been watching the news this morning. They showed a telling clip of the end of the press conference.

Press mostly gone. Couple folding cameras etc. Cummings drinks his water. He then goes to place the empty glass on the table. At the last moment, his body language changes and he does a John Wayne and slides his glass, petulantly across the table, smiles at someone in the distance and wanders off with a smile on his face.

Arrogance personified.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by aggi » Tue May 26, 2020 10:53 am

Colburn_Claret wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 7:25 am
Driving 200 miles to buy windows, when there are windows nearer would be unnecessary. If your family live 200 miles away, and you want them to be the ones to help look after your child, then you don't have a choice about how far you drive.
If this was anybody other than Dominic Cummings, nobody would give a fart. People have hated him for a long time now, and this is just an excuse to get rid of him.
But there was no suggestion of reasonableness in your first post He deemed it necessary, rightly or wrongly, therefore he did nothing wrong.. So long as the person getting those windows deemed it necessary, rightly or wrongly, they did nothing wrong.

Given that multiple people have been forced to resign over lockdown breaches it clearly isn't just an issue because it's Cummings.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by mdd2 » Tue May 26, 2020 10:58 am

Try going back to Lloyd George and the Monarchy over many hundreds of years.
The only difference is we have 24hr news and now we have Journalists as well as politicians who would not only sell their mother, but give her away for their own glorification. Journalism a la Watergate and many others has much to commend it but in other respects it seems to do its utmost to discredit anyone in office or in the public eye irrespective of the truth. TV Journalism is getting almost as bad as the Newspapers. I would be interested as to know how many "Experts" were dragged along to get the statement that Cummings had endangered the public by driving 200+miles as he could have had an accident. Maybe Jesus didn't weep; maybe it was made up too.
DC broke the spirit of lockdown but where is the collateral damage other than stupid folk who may now endanger their lives and others by thinking they can do what they like. For me they too can drive 200+ miles and stay wherever visit Barnard Castle to test their eyes o long as they practice social distancing and keep washing their hands. Even stop for a **** in the woods so long as they do it in private.
We have much much bigger fish to fry now and sadly for many years to come.
DC is only one silly f*****r amongst many, but a silly one who has managed to convince voters that we need a change of direction even if it is via Barnard Castle
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by FactualFrank » Tue May 26, 2020 10:59 am

I know it's Gove, but even so... he says he was wise to test his eyesight by driving 30 minutes.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by karatekid » Tue May 26, 2020 10:59 am

I don't think a process to elect another Tory party leader and all the uncertainty that surrounds it is what this country needs right now. Stability is key. DC wasn't following the rules, we all know that but to hope that this issue topples the gov't at this critical time is more irresponsible than what DC got up to. IMO of course.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by claptrappers_union » Tue May 26, 2020 11:08 am

What’s become clear to me, is that if your person who holds a high position, it doesn’t matter if you lie. Just tell your version of the facts and just ride out the noise.

It doesn’t matter how absurd the lie is. Eventually it all goes away.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by jojomk1 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:08 am

One of the funny parts of this whole saga was watching Alastair Campbell doing TV interviews with smoke coming out of every orifice of his body

Other interesting side will be what happens with the NHS respiratory registrar who has threatened to resign if Cummings does not

Hope more follow suit and then we will see what colour speedo's Boris is wearing (if any at all )
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:10 am

karatekid wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:59 am
I don't think a process to elect another Tory party leader and all the uncertainty that surrounds it is what this country needs right now. Stability is key. DC wasn't following the rules, we all know that but to hope that this issue topples the gov't at this critical time is more irresponsible than what DC got up to. IMO of course.
It dosent look very stable at the minute buddy,and the longer it drags on the more unstable it will become,i know what you mean though.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by tiger76 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:10 am

BurningBeard wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:43 am
Douglas Ross, minister for Scotland had just resigned from the govt, so there are people who still have some credibility and integrity.
Credit to him for putting his money where his mouth is,this must ramp up the pressure on Downing Street you'd think.

Will he be the last?

OH! and he's also a brexiteer before people start with the usual leave/remain twaddle.

His major sin is he's a Scottish football referee alongside his parliamentary commitments.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve1956 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:11 am

jojomk1 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:08 am
One of the funny parts of this whole saga was watching Alastair Campbell doing TV interviews with smoke coming out of every orifice of his body

Other interesting side will be what happens with the NHS respiratory registrar who has threatened to resign if Cummings does not

Hope more follow suit and then we will see what colour speedo's Boris is wearing (if any at all )
Did you see the Queens message Campbell did jogging through the woods on Twitter the guy needs to calm down.
Last edited by Steve1956 on Tue May 26, 2020 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by aggi » Tue May 26, 2020 11:12 am

On a broader note I was of the view that if Cummings had come out straight away and apologised then this would probably all have blown over (for most people) fairly quickly.

What has been bizarre though is watching people (both on here and MPs and ministers) tie themselves in knots to defend Cummings. Changing their mind from an illness that they'd previously been talking down the impact on fit and healthy people to it suddenly being highly debilitating or effectively saying that the law can be ignored if you have children.

Watching Gove trying to convince people that a reasonable response to not being sure if you're well enough to drive is to put your family in a car and drive for thirty miles just makes me wonder how low an opinion he has of the electorate.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Burnley Ace » Tue May 26, 2020 11:14 am

jojomk1 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:08 am
Other interesting side will be what happens with the NHS respiratory registrar who has threatened to resign if Cummings does not
So when Drs say “lower our tax rate or we will resign” you would be happy with that? Or if they said”the police and the courts aren’t punishing people for breaking lockdown - unless they start increasing sentences we will resign”

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Burnley Ace » Tue May 26, 2020 11:19 am

tiger76 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:10 am
Credit to him for putting his money where his mouth is,this must ramp up the pressure on Downing Street you'd think.

Will he be the last?

OH! and he's also a brexiteer before people start with the usual leave/remain twaddle.

His major sin is he's a Scottish football referee alongside his parliamentary commitments.
Have you read his letter? It doesn’t make sense because the lockdown regulations in Scotland have nothing to do with Westminster or Cummings- it’s a devolved power to Hollyrood and, as we have seen, it’s Nicola Sturgeon who’s responsible.

I’d have more respect if he came out and said I think Cummings isn’t telling the truth, he doesn’t have a reasonable excuse and should have stayed in London and accepted the consequences.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by CombatClaret » Tue May 26, 2020 11:24 am

Paul Waine wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:25 am
Hi DA, appreciate your post. I wasn't aware that there were services like wayback machine previously. Are the two edits the text in bold type? Are these the only edits in DC's blog? If I was to read the blog now, is it possible to know what text was there previously, but has now been deleted? Similarly, where text has been overwritten, is the previous text accessible?
Little side question: does wayback machine (or similar) work on Twitter? If it does, what is the point of users deleting their tweets if a service like wayback can recall them?
Wayback Machine works by taking 'crawling' the web and taking periodic snapshots of websites, it 'scrapes' the data off. It's similar to how Google 'reads' every website so then it can offer you results when you search for a specific term, it knows where those words are. If you look at the users online now at the bottom you'll see there a Google bot doing that right now so If you searched my words here you'd be given UTC as a result.

There's not really any way of knowing what was written when, unless you want to tell people, news often sites do with 'posted on', 'updated on' etc.
But of course you can change your site and don't have to tell anyone.
For example Ticketmaster quietly changed it's refund policy during Covid to remove the obligation to refund customers for postponed events. It's via Wayback and other services were able to call them out.

For twitter it's a bit different as it's using a very custom platform, not just simple HTML text for example. I think there are some archive services but they are not comprehensive. Even then it requires people to do the leg work so deleting tweet as somewhat effective.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by dsr » Tue May 26, 2020 11:26 am

aggi wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 10:53 am
But there was no suggestion of reasonableness in your first post He deemed it necessary, rightly or wrongly, therefore he did nothing wrong.. So long as the person getting those windows deemed it necessary, rightly or wrongly, they did nothing wrong.

Given that multiple people have been forced to resign over lockdown breaches it clearly isn't just an issue because it's Cummings.
It does make a difference what the breach was for. Some people - not everyone, mind - see a trip for the wellbeing of a child is different from a trip to check on the wellbeing of a house, or a small party at home.

Even on the visiting the second home, the Scottish official could have had a case. If she had been told that water was flooding out of the front door, it would have been deemed reasonable to go and visit the house. Just for a day out was not reasonable,.

The irony of Cuimmings is that if he had been divorced and his wife lived in Durham, he could have gone up there every weekend to see his son if that was the routine.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by tiger76 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:34 am

Burnley Ace wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:19 am
Have you read his letter? It doesn’t make sense because the lockdown regulations in Scotland have nothing to do with Westminster or Cummings- it’s a devolved power to Hollyrood and, as we have seen, it’s Nicola Sturgeon who’s responsible.

I’d have more respect if he came out and said I think Cummings isn’t telling the truth, he doesn’t have a reasonable excuse and should have stayed in London and accepted the consequences.
Yes i'm well aware it's a devolved power as i reside in Glasgow,Mr Ross is an MP though not an MSP,and as part of the government regulating these rules he couldn't in good faith expect his constituents to abide to them if senior government aides aren't doing so.

That seems to me a perfectly valid reason for resigning it's a point of principle or maybe you'd prefer our elected officials(note the word elected) to have no morals at all.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Damo » Tue May 26, 2020 11:40 am

Zlatan wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 9:09 am
He’s the mastermind behind Brexit
that's what the real issue is here

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by THEWELLERNUT70 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:41 am

Cummings could have potentially opened himself up to safeguarding issues trying to cover his own ar$e, because the exceptional circumstances he has invoked are there to cover domestic abuse and or child abuse

Well I never
Last edited by THEWELLERNUT70 on Tue May 26, 2020 12:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Erasmus » Tue May 26, 2020 11:41 am

Another difference is that Neil Ferguson and the Scottish lady were doing something very useful for the country, but they had to go. Dominic Cummings is doing something very useful just for Boris Johnson, so he has to stay. It's just so undermining of the spirit of unity we need to preserve at the moment.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by THEWELLERNUT70 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:43 am

I think we are currently in the "give 'em enough rope" phase of proceedings

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by tiger76 » Tue May 26, 2020 11:50 am

Erasmus wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:41 am
Another difference is that Neil Ferguson and the Scottish lady were doing something very useful for the country, but they had to go. Dominic Cummings is doing something very useful just for Boris Johnson, so he has to stay. It's just so undermining of the spirit of unity we need to preserve at the moment.
A genuine :?: what exactly is Dominic Cummings role in the government,and why is he seen as indispensable,or is there something i'm missing here.

And what is he doing that's useful for Boris Johnson cos i'm not seeing it.

And lastly why are all the cabinet acting like a bunch of sycophants towards him it's nauseating to watch,they're treating him like a demigod why?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Zlatan » Tue May 26, 2020 11:54 am

Damo wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:40 am
that's what the real issue is here
Is it the elephant in the room...? Perhaps it is, perhaps that’s the reason he has so much unwarranted support from within the Government at the moment?

Time will tell, won’t it.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by IanMcL » Tue May 26, 2020 12:00 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:50 am
A genuine :?: what exactly is Dominic Cummings role in the government,and why is he seen as indispensable,or is there something i'm missing here.

And what is he doing that's useful for Boris Johnson cos i'm not seeing it.

And lastly why are all the cabinet acting like a bunch of sycophants towards him it's nauseating to watch,they're treating him like a demigod why?
He was the brains behind the Leave campaign. He helped Johnson and Gove, significantly. They want him there to 'Get Brexit Done'. He was caught up in the 'where has the money gone' saga, which has been swept away.

He would welcome a hardline Brexit.

Lethal.
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by mdd2 » Tue May 26, 2020 12:02 pm

Erasmus wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:41 am
Another difference is that Neil Ferguson and the Scottish lady were doing something very useful for the country, but they had to go. Dominic Cummings is doing something very useful just for Boris Johnson, so he has to stay. It's just so undermining of the spirit of unity we need to preserve at the moment.
But did they have to go?

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Steve-Harpers-perm » Tue May 26, 2020 12:03 pm

Whole thing is becoming farcical. Now got Gove claiming he’s driven a car in order to test his eyesight!

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by tiger76 » Tue May 26, 2020 12:10 pm

IanMcL wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 12:00 pm
He was the brains behind the Leave campaign. He helped Johnson and Gove, significantly. They want him there to 'Get Brexit Done'. He was caught up in the 'where has the money gone' saga, which has been swept away.

He would welcome a hardline Brexit.

Lethal.
So it's all down to brexit,but according to the experts on here Brexit's already done.

I wouldn't welcome a hardline brexit and neither would most moderate leave voters.

I'd just prefer a looser trading relationship with our European neighbours based on co-operation.

Hardline Brexit=economic disaster

Ah! explains why Gove and Johnson keep kissing his butt then.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Zlatan » Tue May 26, 2020 12:10 pm

Steve-Harpers-perm wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 12:03 pm
Whole thing is becoming farcical. Now got Gove claiming he’s driven a car in order to test his eyesight!
When the defence of the lie becomes bigger than the lie the argument is lost
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Volvoclaret » Tue May 26, 2020 12:15 pm

Labour party reporting that DC crucified Jesus, shot Abe Lincoln, assassinated Kennedy, started the hundred years war and brought the Black Death to Britain. Let's have some perspective on here.

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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue May 26, 2020 12:25 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 11:50 am
A genuine :?: what exactly is Dominic Cummings role in the government,and why is he seen as indispensable,or is there something i'm missing here.

And what is he doing that's useful for Boris Johnson cos i'm not seeing it.
My take on this and I don't know how he achieves it if im correct but I think he is the one person who can keep all the fractions of the party in line (and keep them scared to break ranks).

Up until the Vote Leave campaign the Torys have constantly teared themselves apart about Europe and this ability to show unity as a party from the different extremes IMO is one of the big reasons they are smashing Labour.

If you even look post Brexit when May was in charge then she couldn't control the ERG and was completely hamstrung by them. Johnson with Cummings has so far solved this issue and I think it is Cummings who manages this in the background.

You just have to look at the way Labour have been dogged by infighting between the Left and the Centre and how they have openly fought about antisemitism issues. They have become such a joke within themselves that their chances of being successful in election terms has diminished greatly

The fear I believe Johnson has is that if he loses Cummings then he will lose his grip on the party and even with a massive majority the infighting and back stabbing that might ensue could cause real political damage

That is purely an opinion based piece by me but that is why I think Cummings holds so much sway over Johnson and the current cabinet who lets face it aren't the most competent but are on team Cummings
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Re: Dominic Cummings

Post by NewClaret » Tue May 26, 2020 12:35 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Tue May 26, 2020 12:10 pm
So it's all down to brexit,but according to the experts on here Brexit's already done.

I wouldn't welcome a hardline brexit and neither would most moderate leave voters.

I'd just prefer a looser trading relationship with our European neighbours based on co-operation.

Hardline Brexit=economic disaster

Ah! explains why Gove and Johnson keep kissing his butt then.
Another thread, I know, but nor would I welcome a hardline Brexit.

I equally do not want a position where the Government cannot invest in industries it wants to support dilute to tying EU state aid rules. I feel we’ve under invested in industry for many decades and I’d like to see that change, so if it came to that compromise, I’d take hardline Brexit over restrictions. Think in the end common sense will prevail and we’ll agree something decent.

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