Injuries hit Clarets for opener

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Sorry I'm a bit busy here juggling 2 threads and it's nearly bed time, I'll try and drop another couple and check my haul in the morning.

Yeh I’d probably be concentrating on the other thread if I was you.

[warksclaret]

Lets not forget the impact Coronavirus may be having on Garlicks main business.It may have temporarily taken his eye off the ball. However if our CEO is on the ball this is where he can be helping sort out contracts etc

[IWOODLOVETT]

Maybe the Club are missing David Baldwin now - more than they thought that they would!!

[MACCA]

Yeh I’d probably be concentrating on the other thread if I was you.

Yeah I agree, you've got to ask yourself is the juice worth the squeeze, I'm not even squeezing and its gushing.

I'll stick to that one, it would be a nailed on record if football was up and running properly or a weekend.

Come join

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Yeah I agree, you've got to ask yourself is the juice worth the squeeze, I'm not even squeezing and its gushing.

I'll stick to that one, it would be a nailed on record if football was up and running properly or a weekend.

Come join

Blimey this is a long drawn out bedtime. Come on I bet you’ve got a busy day tomorrow.

[MACCA]

Blimey this is a long drawn out bedtime. Come on I bet you’ve got a busy day tomorrow.

I cant resist, I love the attention.

Busy day? Pfft, I 'm lazier than some teachers!

[MACCA]

Blimey this is a long drawn out bedtime. Come on I bet you’ve got a busy day tomorrow.

Seriously going now, good night, god bless

[dougcollins]

Just thinking back to when I said 'We won't see Ash before the end of the season' and got some proper grief from the glitterati on here.

[IanMcL]

Never thought it would come to this.

Throughout his press interview, Mr Dyche pointed the finger at the board's languid approach to sorting contracts, which is now, clearly affecting the squad.

It seems the board, led by the chairman, has failed to deliver any of the contracts requested by the manager, some time ago (months). This included tying down other players, already under contract, that will probably go into their last year, at the end of the month.

He also had a dig, at the end of the session, by saying that he couldn't see the board forking out for aeroplanes. "They are quite expensive. Not the way the club likes to spend its money" etc.

Given the newspaper articles about Mr D being eyed by other clubs and his answer to a question, that he had taken time to 'personally reflect', it seems to me that we could be on the verge of an implosion, resulting in the loss of half the squad and the management team.

Mr Garlick had better sort it all, very swiftly or he will lose all his credibility in one week and the backing of Burnley fans, everywhere.

Fingers crossed.

[Bfcboyo]

He will give Sean another nice flat screen to keep him quiet.

[Vino blanco]

I don't mind losing a couple of players, but losing Dyche would be a disaster at this very tricky moment in time.

[Funkydrummer]

I reckon, if it hits the fan, that Sean will sack the chairman and proceed as he wishes.

[Bfcboyo]

I reckon, if it hits the fan, that Sean will sack the chairman and proceed as he wishes.

Then back to selling TVs for mr garlic

[Quickenthetempo]

Garlick is right to not just give Dyche all the money he wants.

His transfer dealings recently aren't sustainable for our club without selling star players.

Losing Hendricks fee and probably Brady's. Joe Hart and Lennon were disastrous moves in hindsight.

The club can't afford to many expensive mistakes.

[huw.Y.WattfromWare]

which is now, clearly affecting the squad.

Explain please?

[TVC15]

Garlick has never given SD all the “money he wants”.
SD has in the most part been fine about that - he has often praised the way the club operates.
This current issue does not appear to be about the normal manager v chairman spending debate.
SD is being very specific that he advised the chairman to sort our certain players contracts 18 months ago and that his failure to do so has left the club in a position it didn’t need to be.

As for referencing some of the spend that SD has made that has not turned out to be great that’s very easy to do with all managers as nobody gets everything right. Dyche during his tenure has got a lot more right than he has got wrong and his record in terms of minimising expensive mistakes will be up there as the best with every manager in this league.

This issue seems serious to me - and in the scheme of things given what Dyche has achieved looks to me that Garlick has made the wrong call.
And now because the lay of the land has changed and the risk to our future finances is significantly more than it was 18 months ago when SD wanted this resolving there is little or no chance it can be resolved.

If SD calls it a day because of this then we will have lost the best manager we have had more than 50 years and anyone who thinks we will be ok and find a new manager anywhere near as good as SD is in my view deluded. Things will unfold quickly when he leaves.

[Quickenthetempo]

Garlick has never given SD all the “money he wants”.

I never said he has. I said he's right not to.

SD has in the most part been fine about that - he has often praised the way the club operates.
This current issue does not appear to be about the normal manager v chairman spending debate.
SD is being very specific that he advised the chairman to sort our certain players contracts 18 months ago and that his failure to do so has left the club in a position it didn’t need to be.

Sounds like the chairman doesn't want to pay top dollar for Hendrick and Bardsley. Bardsley has done fine but if it was us making financial decisions I don't think we could sign off having 2 right backs on 40k a week?

As for referencing some of the spend that SD has made that has not turned out to be great that’s very easy to do with all managers as nobody gets everything right.

Very true, but the chairman will have to work with the facts he knows and I did mention hindsight. In general his transfers have been spot on. His older player signings not so.


Dyche during his tenure has got a lot more right than he has got wrong and his record in terms of minimising expensive mistakes will be up there as the best with every manager in this league.

This issue seems serious to me - and in the scheme of things given what Dyche has achieved looks to me that Garlick has made the wrong call.
And now because the lay of the land has changed and the risk to our future finances is significantly more than it was 18 months ago when SD wanted this resolving there is little or no chance it can be resolved.

If SD calls it a day because of this then we will have lost the best manager we have had more than 50 years and anyone who thinks we will be ok and find a new manager anywhere near as good as SD is in my view deluded. Things will unfold quickly when he leaves.

I never thought Coyle could replace Cotterill or Dyche replace Howe.

You just never know what is round the corner.

[Wile E Coyote]

Garlick has never given SD all the “money he wants”.
SD has in the most part been fine about that - he has often praised the way the club operates.
This current issue does not appear to be about the normal manager v chairman spending debate.
SD is being very specific that he advised the chairman to sort our certain players contracts 18 months ago and that his failure to do so has left the club in a position it didn’t need to be.

As for referencing some of the spend that SD has made that has not turned out to be great that’s very easy to do with all managers as nobody gets everything right. Dyche during his tenure has got a lot more right than he has got wrong and his record in terms of minimising expensive mistakes will be up there as the best with every manager in this league.

This issue seems serious to me - and in the scheme of things given what Dyche has achieved looks to me that Garlick has made the wrong call.
And now because the lay of the land has changed and the risk to our future finances is significantly more than it was 18 months ago when SD wanted this resolving there is little or no chance it can be resolved.

If SD calls it a day because of this then we will have lost the best manager we have had more than 50 years and anyone who thinks we will be ok and find a new manager anywhere near as good as SD is in my view deluded. Things will unfold quickly when he leaves.

credit where its due moment, dyche was appointed by our club. the facilities he uses were supplied by our club. his acquisitions have been paid for by our club.

[COBBLE]

It's not Sean Dyche's club. To let him run riot with the cash flow and jeopardise our existence is not acceptable. The situation we find ourselves in today vindicates what the chairman has done. He is a very competent professional investor and manager. If Sean can do better then maybe its not a bad time for us to be bringing in someone new.

[randomclaret2]

Who would you suggest ?

[rob63]

Certainly not wishing to take sides on this potentially explosive situation, but the Chairman and board have a much bigger picture to consider than that of the team manager. The broadcast rebates at the end of July, and an even bigger figure next season, will hit Total Income hard. I understand this will not be Dyche's main consideration, but the overall future health of BFC has to come first and foremost.

It's certainly a bigger picture situation for Garlick, he's had to hand back a good chunk(in Burnley terms) of this season's TV money, Until this season is completed he doesn't know the level of TV/gate income for next year, or worst case scenario, how much of that money will need to be returned in the event of a fresh Covid outbreak, so presumably he's keeping the dry powder room locked for the time being.

Nobody knows for sure the Hendrick contract situation, apart from the club & player, although SD has previously intimated that an offer had been made but in the light of Covid, the contract offer might no longer be the same. Who knows, Hendrick might also be regretting not signing pre-Covid?

I can only hope that SD can understand MG's perspective but I for one can't see us splashing much cash the next couple of windows. it'll be development players & old-stagers on 2 year contracts again, I fear.

[Wokingclaret]

If you take it that Hendrick has been offered terms and not signed.....

All I can say having witnessed his performances, whether at the turf or on telly, then Bardsley deserves a new contract

[rob63]

So he's off then. What are the bookies saying about his replacement? Do you think Peter Reid's in the running?

Don't think Peter Reid can run anywhere these days!

[Wokingclaret]

Garlick has to be strong here and back his man, if not he will pay the price.

[mdd2]

In a different time that outburst of SD would have been his last appearance as Burnley manager. Lord Bob would have sacked him by now.
It looks as if it is all coming to a sad end rather than one where SD goes to a club with the well wishes of everyone.
If OC's departure ripped the heart from our club 10 years ago this will take the body and soul for a long long time IMO.
We are going to need someone who can find gems in our youth set up and keep them. All looking really sad.

[mdd2]

Garlick has to be strong here and back his man, if not he will pay the price.

With what does he back him once we have spent our reserves, which Garlick said would keep us going until the end of August?
There is not a snowball chance in hell next season will be a return to normality

[Dyched]

Garlick has never given SD all the “money he wants”.
SD has in the most part been fine about that - he has often praised the way the club operates.
This current issue does not appear to be about the normal manager v chairman spending debate.
SD is being very specific that he advised the chairman to sort our certain players contracts 18 months ago and that his failure to do so has left the club in a position it didn’t need to be.

As for referencing some of the spend that SD has made that has not turned out to be great that’s very easy to do with all managers as nobody gets everything right. Dyche during his tenure has got a lot more right than he has got wrong and his record in terms of minimising expensive mistakes will be up there as the best with every manager in this league.

This issue seems serious to me - and in the scheme of things given what Dyche has achieved looks to me that Garlick has made the wrong call.
And now because the lay of the land has changed and the risk to our future finances is significantly more than it was 18 months ago when SD wanted this resolving there is little or no chance it can be resolved.

If SD calls it a day because of this then we will have lost the best manager we have had more than 50 years and anyone who thinks we will be ok and find a new manager anywhere near as good as SD is in my view deluded. Things will unfold quickly when he leaves.

How is it Garlicks failure if players haven’t signed a new contract? If he’s offered them what we’re only prepared to pay and they haven’t signed then good on him for not panicking and offering more, that’s what some clubs do. Plus tbh, the players we’re talking about ain’t 1 in a 1000 kinds, there are plenty out there at their level.

[Wokingclaret]

With what does he back him once we have spent our reserves, which Garlick said would keep us going until the end of August?
There is not a snowball chance in hell next season will be a return to normality

He has to back his renewals, but that does not mean we don't have to sell someone at the end of the season. Sean has agreed to that in the past.

We bet the ranch in the championship every time. Its now he has to be stronger and take some risks.

[Wile E Coyote]

but, on another note, ....drum roll. we are sky high in the top flight. therefore dyche is a modern day genius. long live sean.

[KRBFC]

Dyche has always had a whine in the press about the boards lack of spending. I don’t blame the board here, why on earth would they give Lennon, Legzkins, Bardsley, Hart, Hendrick new contracts 18 months ago when Dyche said so?

Hart Legzkins Lennon need to go.

Hendrick will be one of our highest earners and should’ve been sorted sooner but it appears it’s actually Hendrick refusing to sign, is Hendrick really the player we should be extending our wage cap to keep? Players have all the power, if Hendrick doesn’t want to re sign with us, what can the board do?


18 months ago I wouldn’t have extended Bardsleys contract either, he has since shown his worth and earned a new deal but I still think we need to replace either Lowton or Bardsley.

[KRBFC]

Also, the players out of contract aren’t exactly key players are they? Hendrick aside, the rest are fringe players who need upgrading.

I’d understand the panic and outburst if it was Pope, Tarkowski, Mee, Wood and Mcneil out of contract and we were fighting relegation with 9 games to play.

We are safe already, 9 meaningless games to play and a few old fringe players without contracts. I don’t understand Dyches frustration here at all which makes me think there’s something else he’s frustrated about but won’t comment on.

[Long Time Lurker]

Who would you suggest ?

As a Head Coach ?

No idea

Reading between the lines the Chairman and the Directors have decided not to pursue new contracts for quite a few of our players. Even Westwood only received an extension, even though he has clearly communicated his desire to stay for longer in recent weeks.

Now, obviously that isn't down to the manager, so who migth have been arguing the case for releasing and replacing said players?

Could it be, every third word out of my mouth is young right back, Rigg?

Surely not. In his first interview he pinned his heart firmly on his sleeve and stated that the FIRST and LAST decisions on players was down to Sean. He was very clear that he wouldn't be picking players, he would only be providing options in direct response to Dyches requirements and he would never ever force a player on the manager. His primary job was to support the manager.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q4-6pVaNAI

First say from Sean - ( 18 months ago ) I want these players signed up to new contracts.

Last say from Sean - ( Today ) Why haven't these ******* contracts been signed, I ******* want these players.

After todays declaration I would expect Rigg to add his full and unwavering support to Seans appeal for action in the next few days, along with the full backing of his new commercial lap dog Paulo. Well no, actually I wouldn't, because he has a long standing history ( which is embarassingly well documented ) of promising his support, only to turn round and plunge in the knife to maintain or improve his own positional influence.

Oh, and while I am ranting why the **** did we hire Mike Riggs new golden boy Paulo Araujo as our head of scouting for Latin America and the USA, the bloke with the elementary FA Level 1 in Talent Identification ( that he got online shortly before joining us ). With such a prestigious title you would think that he might actually have some prior technical scouting experience. Except he hasn't.

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/paulo-araujo-a4b7105

The twaddle about developing our knowledge beyond Europe with a view to maybe getting a player or two six years down the line was laughable. Even if he could scout a player from under the noses of the other clubs with better networks in those regions we would struggle to overcome the work permit hurdle. Brexit isn't going to change things, because our more stringent permit requirements are down to our Government and not Europe. On top of that a lot of other clubs have established relationships with European clubs that enables them to loan players out to get their work permits. The owners of some EPL clubs even own European clubs. That isn't " ahead of the curve " thinking it is cloud cookoo land clap trap.

Hiring somebody on the basis that they might make a positive contribution in six years or so is ridiculous. Unless you are swelling the ranks with like minded thinkers to change a corporate culture from within, which is usually accompanied by squeezing our those who think differently or work in line with different value systems.

This interview was recorded a short time before Rigg did a hatchet job on Kit Symmons, who was then replaced ( after a ridiculously long period of ******* about ) with a Head Coach. Coincidently Jokanovic also complained about a two boxes ticked approach to Recruitment and demonstrated his frustration at having his players picked for him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuFbfGFy7eQ

http://www.fulhamfc.com/news/2015/november/10/mike-rigg

The manager will receive my full support, golden thread, the CEO will focus on non football aspects, fantastic club and the best people I've worked with in football. He said the same things at QPR, the bloke seems to be stuck in a time loop of his own making. The only difference was that he started his time at QPR saying the plan was to bring in young talent, before bringing in a bunch of veterans. He said the same thing when he joined us and in the Summer he signed up three veterans after making a complete mess of things. Had he done a good job then we might currently have more financial freedom to offer contracts to players ( despite their age ) who have actually proven themselves.

We need to stop listening to the bloke with the persistent record of failure and start listening to the bloke who ( working in tandem with Garlick and Baldwin ) consistently delivered us success. Rigg has had a devastating impact on every club that has made the mistake of hiring him ( Man City included ). Apart from a couple of phone calls to buy us a WYSCOUT package and some " bums on seats " hiring what has he actually done for us so far ?

Our recruitment needed investment and improvement, but the performance of the recruitment team has been an utter shambles since he **** talked his way into our club.As far as I can see we have gone backwards since he arrived, we were in a much better position before he took control of our recruitment and strategic vision.

I would rather keep Sean, give Mike Rigg his marching orders and poach Sven Mislintat from Stuttgart when his short term contract ends - providing he wants to move. If Sven doesn't want to move then I would happily replace Rigg with a turd in a teacup. All of his previous clubs registered a pronounced performance improvement after he moved on, which says a lot about his contribution, so even if we don't replace him with anyone we could still get a positive boost.

Give Bardsley a new 1 year contract + another year based on appearances. Maehle could work out to be a very costly mistake. He is quite a good player, but square pegs don't fit in round holes and he has already said that he doesn't want to play the way that we do in his " Felice Mazzu wanted warriors and we are not " interview.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... rev=search

I think he is more likely to join his friend at Sheffield if he does move. His playing style would be more suited to them.

Sign a young left wing back - which is what we should have bought instead of a veteran left back. Pieters is still a good player but he isn't a wing back and asking him to play like one turns him into a liability. Caci would be my first choice, followed by Ryan Manning from QPR, Omar Richards from Reading or Max Lowe from Derby - maybe Demetri Mitchell or Liberato Cacace as riskier punts.

If Vydra is sold buy a young attacker - which is what we should have bought instead of buying Jay. Jay has done very well on the playing front, but spending £10m on a player that is only going to decrease in value was a mistake ( especially when Vyds can perform a similar role linking midfield to attack.

If Hendrick leaves us on a free we need to buy a young central midfielder/winger who doesn't mind tracking back to do the dirty work. I've already listed my personal preference - based on his performance levels in both of those areas, set piece ability, scoring chance creation and his ability to progress the ball dribbling.

Midfield development options could be Matt O'Riley from Fulham ( if he is available on a free ) Niklas Dorsch ( with his 3m release clause ), Ben Whiteman ( who is better than Cameron Brannagan in my opinion ) and maybe Andre Dozzell.

If Hendrick leaves and we sell Brady - sign Kevin Stoger on a free transfer. His ability to rack up the progressive distance with pin point passes from midfield would suit us. We could play him as a left sided version of Hendrick with Pieters in behind. He seems to have recovered well from his ACL, although he seems a little bit more timid than he was before it.

If we sell Gibson - Scott McKenna, Waldemar Anton or Robin Knoche ( if he is on a free ). On the domestic front, and less likely to be available at a good price, Joe Rodon or Ben Davies - maybe Jake Clarke-Salter from Chelsea. I'm not entirely convinced by Rob Dickie and Dael Fry can stay at Middlesborough for me. Luke Woolfenden could be a good signing as one for the future.

I can see lots of possible transfer work for us to do, without looking for a right back or a specialist right winger in the next window. Besides, quite a few quality right backs will be coming to the end of their contracts in 2021.

I'm guessing that our one stop shop Stoke would try their level best to bleed us for Tom Edwards and he will be cheaper in Winter. Kenny Tete is the closest I can come up with for a right sided Charlie Taylor ( superb defensively, a little eager in the challenge and a minor blip on his police record from a few years ago - but no problems since ). Callum Brittain could be one for the future ( if he is available on a free ), gets forward but needs to improve on his end product and defensive work.

I strongly suspect that we will wait to see how everyone else is handling the window before acting late on. Then we will dick around chasing after all manner of statistically hyped trash, crossing our fingers that Bardlsey et al will stick by us and wait around ( so they can serve as our get out of jail free cards if Rigg screws everything up again ).

Personally, if thats the case then I hope all of our out of contract players tell us to **** off, because they have earned the right to be treated with far more respect and consideration than that. I would happily bet on them to perform well for us next season, far better than I expect Rigg to perform for us prior to it. Back the proven winners and release the proven failures, in times of marked uncertainty that is always a sound strategy.

Streaming rant over, I will endeavour to include some pictures in my next forum book.

[Grumps]

I think Sean has a very short memory

For as long as he's been here he has been very vocal in the fact that there is constant dialogue between the club, manager, player and agents regarding contracts, and transfers, something he has seemed very proud about.

Is he saying that's not been the case for the past 18 months? If so, I haven't heard him complain about it.

Iam sure all the discussions were taking place as normal prior to March, and that Sean was in the loop. The goalposts have moved, nobody is going to get a big fat contract at the moment, perhaps Hendrick not signing a contract might come back to bite him now, as not many clubs who were looking at him will be throwing better contracts at him

There's a time to pick your battles, and Sean has maybe picked the wrong time.

[Vegas Claret]

there is only one person who should be deciding who needs a new contract and that is the manager. Dyche has had plenty of digs at the board over the last few years - we have to give them great credit for how they run the club to profitability but it will ultimately cost us Dyche in the long run

[ElectroClaret]

Don't really see how anyone can judge that its "affecting the squad". How so?
There's been nothing recently to reasonably make that call on.

And the last time I looked, we were tenth in the PL and last time out we secured an impressive
point against Spurs.

[Jakubclaret]

Don't really see how anyone can judge that its "affecting the squad". How so?
There's been nothing recently to reasonably make that call on.

And the last time I looked, we were tenth in the PL and last time out we secured an impressive
point against Spurs.

I don't think anybody is not at the earlier point where the form was reasonably ok enough to command a midtable positional slot, without question that shouldn't be debatable glancing at the league table, it's moving forwards & onwards where it will hit if it doesn't get sorted.

[gtclaret]

This looks very bad for the club. The fact that we have SD v Mr Garlick is bad news. I feel the SD era is coming to the end, and next season will be our last in the prem. Sadly this golden era will be something to look back on with very fond memories. Rightly or wrongly Mr G will not provide the necessary funds to maintain our Premier league status, and it's impossible to keep working miracles

[yosserhughes]

It could be that Garlick might be thinking of selling the Club ?

I don't know anybody at the Club, its just me thinking out loud.

[bfcjg]

Let's pretend the world isn't in the worst recession ever, let's pretend money isn't circulating, let's pretend people are dieing including Clarets, let's pretend Sky and BT don't want their money back, let's pretend cashflow projections for the next 2 years are impossible to forecast, let's pretend local job cuts won't affect our attendances let's pretend businesses closing wont haven effect on our corporate income, let's pretend Spurs have been bailed out by the BofE, lets pretend everyone one of us left our refunds with the club to help out and lets keep blaming the board and give Sean everything we dont actually have.

[jojomk1]

Let's pretend the world isn't in the worst recession ever, let's pretend money isn't circulating, let's pretend people are dieing including Clarets, let's pretend Sky and BT don't want their money back, let's pretend cashflow projections for the next 2 years are impossible to forecast, let's pretend local job cuts won't affect our attendances let's pretend businesses closing wont haven effect on our corporate income, let's pretend Spurs have been bailed out by the BofE, lets pretend everyone one of us left our refunds with the club to help out and lets keep blaming the board and give Sean everything we dont actually have.

Totally agree

And let's pretend we, at last, have a recruitment team who can find replacements for our ageing squad giving better value for money

[Long Time Lurker]

There's a time to pick your battles, and Sean has maybe picked the wrong time.

If Sean was in the loop before he certainly doesn't sound like he is in the loop now. Considering we are currently linked with more Zooms than a Walls ice cream factory communication shouldn't be much of a problem.

In the past Sean has had a little dig here and there. However, those comments have always struck me as being half in jest. He understands how things are and he has been happy to work with that. Something seems to have changed.

Actually coming out and publicly questioning the wisdom of our actions relating to contracts in the last year is a step beyond anything we have seen before. I think this could be as much about the fair treatment of our lads as it is about the strength of our squad for all the remaining matches.

Sean could be viewing this as a matter of not showing the correct respect and failing to demonstrate old fashioned values. He looked genuinely concerned about the contract situation in the snippet that I watched. If that is the case then this is EXACTLY what he should be fighting for and a very important time to draw a line in the sand, because something's are unacceptable.

It's like the recent article by Rigg in which he said

"Ultimately, what we are doing all this for is so that we can know, for example, who the best young right-back is domestically, in Europe and in the rest of the world. Which is the one who is the best, which is the one who we can afford, and which is the one who will come."

With Bardsley waiting on a contract decision that was incredible tactless and rude.

Or the equally disrespectful comments about those who are taking time to adjust to the use of new tools.

"The majority of people are embracing that. It can be difficult if people are less au fait with technology but it is not an age barrier it is just a willingness barrier. It has nothing to do with age, it is about being prepared to evolve and adapt. That is the key."

which reminded me of the way Grady Fuson was treated by Billy Beane

"If he wants to show no appreciation to the team he had in place, it’s his prerogative,’’ Fuson told San Francisco Chronicle baseball writer Susan Slusser at the time of the book’s publication, "but it’s sad because of the loyalty of those people who travelled from city to city and spent nights and nights away from home and are now called old codgers."

Forget about the Moneyball film, it was Hollywood hogwash. All of the moneyball players that Beane signed actually amounted to very little. The book and the film glorified him and them, while ignoring the fact all of the real difference makers in the Oakland team were scouted by traditional means.

They had a superb pitching roster that included Barry Zito, Mark Mulder and Tim Hudson. They also had a number of other stand out performers including Miguel Tejeda and Eric Chavez. Playing in one of the weaker leagues helped them a lot and they were very lucky.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Beauty-Short-H ... 0786462884

Billy Beane woke the world up to the fact that sabremetrics could help to highlight things that were being ignored, like on base percentages. That was it, he didn't find a magic formulae that could turn a recruitment halfwit into a homerun hero, he encouraged other teams to look more closely at data driven tools. And like all tools it is the person using them that makes the real difference.

The availability of data is far less important than the application of data.

In the case of Billy Beane, after the Athletics flirted with the playoffs for a couple of seasons, they sank like a stone as they became more and more reliant on statistics and less open to the input of " old fashioned " scouts. So much so that Billy Beane swallowed his pride and asked Fuson to come back in 2010. Fuson is now happy to point out that the division of scouting input at Oakland is 40% stats and 60% old school scouting with better results.

Riggs most embarrassing gaff in recent weeks was the Freudian slip that he made during his cringe worthy interview about our new scouting set up. The one that came across as a poor promotional video for WYSCOUT ( which is actually a very good product and very useful in the right hands ).

" We have quite a good team" oops " excellent team ". Nice save Mike, you hired them after all or were you thinking about the ones you didn't hire. Still, it was better than showing us how to use a simple menu system that a primary school kid could navigate with little assistance.

I'm not posting a link, because it isn't worth watching.

Considering the multiplicity of things he could have talked about, given the state of play in relation to recruitment, it was very poor. I felt genuinely sorry for Pete Oliver who repeatedly tried to steer him towards topics worthy of the megabytes. It was like watching a man without a clue desperately trying to fill time. He looked a scruffy sod as well, everyone else made an effort to look presentable in their interviews, but he looked like he had just wandered in after an all night bender.

Core values matter and some people seem to be forgetting that. When you view people as numbers or commercial properties first and foremost, instead of viewing them as people who deserve to be accorded respect and consideration it is a step too far. The pounds and pennies matter, of course they do ( football is a business ), but that doesn't mean you can't treat people fairly as well. Personally, I try to treat everyone fairly, apart from the people I don't trust.



Look a picture

[claretonthecoast1882]

The statue posts were more entertaining than lurkers agenda with Rigg.

Still can't believe no club has employed in a recruitment role

[gtclaret]

Totally agree

And let's pretend we, at last, have a recruitment team who can find replacements for our ageing squad giving better value for money

But the recruitment team are bound by the conditions set by the chairman. If other clubs are offering more attractive options for the players, there is nothing the recruitment team can do about it. You must remember, we are not the only club with a recruitment team, and talented players are going to be sort after by many clubs. All Rigg and Co can do is identify the target, after that, it's upto the chairman to offer attractive terms go get the players

[Grumps]

Lurker...... Which of the players out of contract would you have tried to keep, had this been a normal season?
Hart has said he's going
Lennon wasn't getting any games, so would probably have moved
Bardsley probably wants two years, doubt we want to give him that
Hendrick if you believe rumours, he wanted away, and might not have signed any contract placed in front of him

I doubt we would have retained any of these players, and certainly that decision would not have been taken 18 months ago. We are where we are due to an unprecedented set of circumstances, certainly not the time to be complaining about money, or lack of it.

[Hibsclaret]

I never thought Coyle could replace Cotterill or Dyche replace Howe.

You just never know what is round the corner.

Great comparison. Replacing Cotterill or Howe was like replacing Moyes for United....Replacing Dyche is like replacing Fergie for United.....

As for Dyche, I reckon he has got used to being home with the family and wants more of this. He doesn’t need the money and time nearer his family is more important. Reckon this is the main reason behind all the comments from yesterday...he needs a few things to use as a rationale beyond the main reason

[Hipper]

From a discussion regarding a few injuries and only one of them potentially damaging, we seem to have descended into a collective frame of mind that Dyche is definitely going as are five key players. There's no evidence of the former and only Hendrick can be regarded as being anywhere near key .

I too don't get the doom and gloom.

Before coronavirus it seems reasonable to negotiate with Lennon and Bardsley 'to the wire' as they are both unlikely to get other Premier League deals surely. I can't believe we want to keep Hart. And Hendrick from what we've heard on here seems to want away and there's nothing that can be done about it. Legzdins is the third goalkeeper which I would have thought he would be relatively easy to replace.

Looking at the current situation, these players who haven't signed or been given new contracts are here until the end of this month are they not? That covers three of the nine matches. In the case of Hart and Legzdins, if they are not wanted or won't do a short extension, we still of course have Peacock-Farrell who is presumably the future. Hendrick may be on his way, and Bardsley and Lennon may not have long term futures although I can see the importance of both for another year, but I don't see why they wouldn't all agree short term deals to cover the final six games.

We are not certainly safe but are nearly there. Apart from Hendrick and to a lesser degree Bardsley, these loses aren't vital.

Surely Dyche won't leave solely on this basis? If he does then it seems he is looking for an excuse to go. If there's more to it then that, what is this 'more'?

[gtclaret]

I think this is all about how you see the club, if like Garlick it's important that the club profit each fiscal year, then you will have to be happy watching League one football, as Premiership football will be impossible, and the average attendance of 10k we will eventually get in the championship will not be enough to sustain us when the parachute payment end. If you want Premiership football, we would need to invest in a tightly knit squad backed by a productive youth system. This would mean financial losses for a couple of years ie a bit of a gamble

[GodIsADeeJay81]

So is there anything concrete to suggest issues between manager and owner or is this just more a case of people reading between lines and making assumptions like they'd do during a normal season after a couple of defeats etc?

Yeah the club made some poor signings, others have been very good value, same as everywhere else.

Global pandemic does change the way clubs will be operating for the next season though, possibly 2.
Player transfers will be interesting because clubs won't have the same amount of money to spend/take punts with and won't be throwing silly wages at players etc.

[fatboy47]

If Dyche were to leave then rest assured they'll be dancing on the tables long into the night at Ewood.

And its hard to imagine a demoralised depleted Burnley finishing above 18th next year.

His availability when we were recruiting last time was probably a once in a lifetime fluke, and it's hard to predict another miracle appointment.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I think this is all about how you see the club, if like Garlick it's important that the club profit each fiscal year, then you will have to be happy watching League one football, as Premiership football will be impossible, and the average attendance of 10k we will eventually get in the championship will not be enough to sustain us when the parachute payment end. If you want Premiership football, we would need to invest in a tightly knit squad backed by a productive youth system. This would mean financial losses for a couple of years ie a bit of a gamble

So despite the club being ran financially prudently for a number of years whilst still being in the PL you're saying we will end up in league 1?
Isnt that where Sunderland currently are after taking a gamble and running at a loss for a number of years to stay in the PL?
Our model currently works, even better with this Pandemic as we aren't a mess.