Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

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dermotdermot
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Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by dermotdermot » Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:44 pm

According to an NGO (non governmental organisation) the Chinese continue to butcher dogs at meat markets in Yulin, Southern China. Chinese activists have said that up to 400 dog and 200 cat carcasses are being sold daily ahead of an annual dog meat festival that has taken place since 2010. They stress that the vast majority of Chinese do not eat dog meat but plenty of them still do, along with just about every other species on the planet.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Zlatan » Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:47 pm

I’m not sure that it’s what they eat that is the issue, but more likely hygiene standards for food preparation.

It’s only frowned upon because cats and dogs are pets in the West.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:43 pm

Zlatan wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:47 pm
I’m not sure that it’s what they eat that is the issue, but more likely hygiene standards for food preparation.

It’s only frowned upon because cats and dogs are pets in the West.
Not necessarily.

Eating meat is one thing. But eating other meat eaters is something you shouldn’t do. All sorts of diesease and the like passed through eating like this.
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Zlatan » Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:45 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:43 pm
Not necessarily.

Eating meat is one thing. But eating other meat eaters is something you shouldn’t do. All sorts of diesease and the like passed through eating like this.
If that’s factually correct then I stand corrected
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Bin Ont Turf » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:33 pm

The Chinese in general would eat dog sh1t with sugar on.

Not necessarily all their fault though.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Paul Waine » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:38 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:43 pm
Not necessarily.

Eating meat is one thing. But eating other meat eaters is something you shouldn’t do. All sorts of diesease and the like passed through eating like this.
I recommend you check out the diet of pigs. Maybe there are also other omnivores that we would not find surprising in our diet.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by DCWat » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:54 pm

Were dogs and cats ever the issue?

I thought it was the eating of other, ‘wilder’ animals and the various states of produce within the markets, that was the issue.

Alive and caged, in the process of being killed, raw, cooked etc. The blood of animals being killed, spilled in the market and people eating food prepared in the same area.

The farming of cats and dogs for food, is for most of us westerners, a horrible thing, but I’ve heard seen it said that it causes risks to humans.

It’s the way the markets operate and the wild animals that they capture and kill that causes the issues, isn’t it? Bats, rats, snakes etc.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by DCWat » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:57 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:43 pm
Not necessarily.

Eating meat is one thing. But eating other meat eaters is something you shouldn’t do. All sorts of diesease and the like passed through eating like this.
If we ignore what we eat from the sea, rivers and some other animals, in the west. There’s plenty restaurants around selling crocodile.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by chekhov » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:35 am

Bin Ont Turf wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:33 pm
The Chinese in general would eat dog sh1t with sugar on.

Not necessarily all their fault though.
As oppose to us Brits you mean? Do you know the stuff that goes in our food?
I’d place a bet that the Chinese have a far healthier diet than we do in the civilised west.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by fatboy47 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:56 am

If you lived in Rawtenstall in the 70s and went near the chinky then you've probably eaten Fido.

And Tiddles too I daresay.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:18 am

This just sounds like another anti foreigner thread to me. If the West was as poor as some parts of China (Or at least, some people in China.) then we would probably be eating the same sort of things. (The point has already been made about what pigs eat.) As it is, the food fed to our own farm animals caused Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease (Mad cow disease.) which may as yet cause greater problems for humans who were unfortunate enough to eat those animals before it became known.

Amimal husbandry all over the world needs attention if we are not going to cause a lot more problems for ourselves.

As for Covid 19. That was most likely caused (According to WHO.) by a bat or other animal biting a cow while it was still on the farm. That's hardly the farmer's fault, or the fault of anyone else.

Have people learned nothing from the current Black lives matter protests? We are all humans trying to make a life for ourselves.
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Foulthrow » Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:23 am

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:18 am


Amimal husbandry all over the world needs attention if we are not going to cause a lot more problems for ourselves.
Especially in Blackburn. ;)

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Hendrickxz » Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:28 am

Watched a Gordon Ramsay out Far East programme the other nightwhere he was dining with some locals. They went for the snake in the end but they had a live mountain rat in a cage on the table to choose from as well as a load of other unspeakable delicate little morsels. Disgusting buggars. They should stick to Twix like the rest of us!

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by mdd2 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:28 am

The first thing we need to do is to sort the size of our population-the more we are the closer we get to animals but no doubt more plant viruses will get us too if they mutate enough

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Stayingup » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:29 am

When I was in Asia it was the Koreans who were known for eating dog. Back in the day though travelling around China, particularly the north in winter, I have to say the food was, well, different at times. Simply because the people didn't have much choice, so they ate what they could and what was available and at times that was not a lot. I drew the line at Scorpion. But fast forward 25 years and China has moved on at terrific pace and I had some splendid meals then. Shanghai is just a fantastic place. There is a line of opinion that Covid 19 somehow escaped from a virus testing lab in Wuhan and did not emanate from a wet market. One of the main virus testing labs is at Wuhan and of course ot is for research purposes. The CPC has thrown a blanket of secrecy over this which could well be impeding the search for a vaccine, as to develop one its obviously useful to know about the source of it.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:38 am

Stayingup wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:29 am
When I was in Asia it was the Koreans who were known for eating dog. Back in the day though travelling around China, particularly the north in winter, I have to say the food was, well, different at times. Simply because the people didn't have much choice, so they ate what they could and what was available and at times that was not a lot. I drew the line at Scorpion. But fast forward 25 years and China has moved on at terrific pace and I had some splendid meals then. Shanghai is just a fantastic place. There is a line of opinion that Covid 19 somehow escaped from a virus testing lab in Wuhan and did not emanate from a wet market. One of the main virus testing labs is at Wuhan and of course ot is for research purposes. The CPC has thrown a blanket of secrecy over this which could well be impeding the search for a vaccine, as to develop one its obviously useful to know about the source of it.
Some good and bad points in that. You started well but finished with a totally unsubstantiated rumour put out by Donald Trump. All the top scientists have already ridiculed the idea that Covid 19 was made in a lab. Amost certainly it was started by a bat, or some other animal, biting a cow (Or other farm animal.) whilst it was still on the farm. So despite the Western Press's racist efforts, it was no one's fault and it didn't start in a wet market, although the meat may have been sold there.

I agree about the pace of change in China. Do you know that in nearly all the major cities, cash is almost unheard of. Everything is paid for by mobile phone, even in the wet markets. It's difficult to even buy an ice cream with cash these days.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Jakubclaret » Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:45 am

There’s a global food standard agency, there should be an accepted recognised list of all foods which are safe & fit for human consumption & any country that doesn’t follow that list & allows trade or human consumption in cafes/restaurants should be hit with massive fines & any country persistently ignoring this a trade embargo.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Bin Ont Turf » Mon Jun 22, 2020 10:44 am

chekhov wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:35 am
As oppose to us Brits you mean? Do you know the stuff that goes in our food?
I’d place a bet that the Chinese have a far healthier diet than we do in the civilised west.
No
Yes

Well we do like our dog deep fried in batter.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by dermotdermot » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:10 am

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 8:18 am
This just sounds like another anti foreigner thread to me. If the West was as poor as some parts of China (Or at least, some people in China.) then we would probably be eating the same sort of things. (The point has already been made about what pigs eat.) As it is, the food fed to our own farm animals caused Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease (Mad cow disease.) which may as yet cause greater problems for humans who were unfortunate enough to eat those animals before it became known.

Amimal husbandry all over the world needs attention if we are not going to cause a lot more problems for ourselves.

As for Covid 19. That was most likely caused (According to WHO.) by a bat or other animal biting a cow while it was still on the farm. That's hardly the farmer's fault, or the fault of anyone else.

Have people learned nothing from the current Black lives matter protests? We are all humans trying to make a life for ourselves.
What on earth are you talking about ‘another anti foreigner thread’? This virus more than likely came from the Wuhan wet market. Have you seen the conditions and the way animals are treated in these places prior to being boiled alive to order. I have veered away from watching such sub human scenes but snippets are sometimes difficult to avoid. The Sars virus, along with many others, originated from such a place but was contained. Lessons weren’t learnt and the world has been brought to its knees with hundred of thousands dying. This has absolutely nothing to do with racism. As for your flippant idea that this all started because of a bat biting a cow! Bats don’t attack or bite anything unless they are provoked. Irrespective of previous outbreaks, China has done next to nothing to cease this disgusting ‘exotic’ animal trade and we are all having to live-at least try to-through this terrible pandemic on account of it. As for your last sentence, what have the BLM protests got anything to do with this? I can’t see any connection at all. This has nothing to do with racism, simply fact. The Chinese are responsible for this pandemic and have done little to rectify the situation. The latest outbreak in Beijing is slightly baffling as well. The virus, if it’s the same one, has been discovered on contaminated chopping boards and is being blamed on imported salmon from Norway, of all places. Perhaps you might refer to that as a ‘racist’ slant by the Chinese on the Norwegians.
Last edited by dermotdermot on Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Stayingup » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:16 am

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:38 am
Some good and bad points in that. You started well but finished with a totally unsubstantiated rumour put out by Donald Trump. All the top scientists have already ridiculed the idea that Covid 19 was made in a lab. Amost certainly it was started by a bat, or some other animal, biting a cow (Or other farm animal.) whilst it was still on the farm. So despite the Western Press's racist efforts, it was no one's fault and it didn't start in a wet market, although the meat may have been sold there.

I agree about the pace of change in China. Do you know that in nearly all the major cities, cash is almost unheard of. Everything is paid for by mobile phone, even in the wet markets. It's difficult to even buy an ice cream with cash these days.
Hi Daleman. You have allowed your antipathy for Mr D Trump to colour your reply to my post. I certainly did not get the information that there is a body of opinion that is suggesting the virus could have leaked from a Wuhan Research lab, from anything Donald Trump has said. I got it from an independent source, a journalist. But it is an opinion as is that it came from eating a bat. There is no proof either way. Perhaps the most preposterous comment so far is from the CCP who say that it came from vsisitng American millitary personnel last year. Speaking to my associate this morning about this very subject he said the same. No-one in China (where he is) has any proof af where it started from but one thing is for sure the CPC has thorwn a blancket of secrecy over it.

Why is it racist to try to find out where this virus came from? Thats about as preposterous as blaming visiting military for it. As I say if scientsts new more about it maybe they would have a vaccine by now.

As to the change in China yes I know I am very aquainted with China and have been for many years. I am a Sinophile, despite certain aspects of its governance.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:37 am

Stayingup wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:16 am
Hi Daleman. You have allowed your antipathy for Mr D Trump to colour your reply to my post. I certainly did not get the information that there is a body of opinion that is suggesting the virus could have leaked from a Wuhan Research lab, from anything Donald Trump has said. I got it from an independent source, a journalist. But it is an opinion as is that it came from eating a bat. There is no proof either way. Perhaps the most preposterous comment so far is from the CCP who say that it came from vsisitng American millitary personnel last year. Speaking to my associate this morning about this very subject he said the same. No-one in China (where he is) has any proof af where it started from but one thing is for sure the CPC has thorwn a blancket of secrecy over it.

Why is it racist to try to find out where this virus came from? Thats about as preposterous as blaming visiting military for it. As I say if scientsts new more about it maybe they would have a vaccine by now.

As to the change in China yes I know I am very aquainted with China and have been for many years. I am a Sinophile, despite certain aspects of its governance.
Who said it was 'Racist' to try and find out where the virus came from? Not me, that's for certain. What I said was racist, was the way some people go out of their way, particularly the press, to make it a race issue.

Quoting one journalist, or one Chinese diplomat is not the way to find the truth either and saying that the CCP "Threw a blanket of secrecy over it", isn't either. Yes, the local authorities in Wuhan took their time releasing details, but then they didn't really know what they were dealing with in the early stages. One local official is NOT the CCP.

I think although you say you are a Sinophile, you have allowed the Western media to colour you judgement somewhat.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Stayingup » Mon Jun 22, 2020 12:58 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:37 am
Who said it was 'Racist' to try and find out where the virus came from? Not me, that's for certain. What I said was racist, was the way some people go out of their way, particularly the press, to make it a race issue.

Quoting one journalist, or one Chinese diplomat is not the way to find the truth either and saying that the CCP "Threw a blanket of secrecy over it", isn't either. Yes, the local authorities in Wuhan took their time releasing details, but then they didn't really know what they were dealing with in the early stages. One local official is NOT the CCP.

I think although you say you are a Sinophile, you have allowed the Western media to colour you judgement somewhat.
The western media to colour my judgement??? Judgement of what? The Morninf=g Star do you mean? You are not making sense to me.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:08 pm

Stayingup wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 12:58 pm
The wetern media to colour my judgement??? Judgement of what? The Morninf=g Star do you mean? You are not making sense to me.
Believing everything you hear about how this was covered up by the CCP. It wasn't. It was covered up by one low ranking member of the CCP in Wuhan, not the big boys in Beijing. When they found out, they gave the genetic code to the WHO almost immediately.

China is a very modern, and progressive country as you know. What would they gain from suppressing news of the outbreak? They have been as helpful as they could be since that early delay, when to be honest, they were unsure what they were dealing with.

I'm really surprised that you seem to believe all the hate stories conjured up by the British and American media.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Dyched » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:11 pm

Our food in the west isn’t that much better. We have to cook chicken all the way through for example due to the conditions and **** that they eat. Same to some extent with Pork (which it’s now considered okay to leave a little pink).

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by tarkys_ears » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:13 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:08 pm
Believing everything you hear about how this was covered up by the CCP. It wasn't. It was covered up by one low ranking member of the CCP in Wuhan, not the big boys in Beijing. When they found out, they gave the genetic code to the WHO almost immediately.

China is a very modern, and progressive country as you know. What would they gain from suppressing news of the outbreak? They have been as helpful as they could be since that early delay, when to be honest, they were unsure what they were dealing with.

I'm really surprised that you seem to believe all the hate stories conjured up by the British and American media.
We need re-captcha on this board to stop these communists bots from posting!!!

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:17 pm

tarkys_ears wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:13 pm
We need re-captcha on this board to stop these communists bots from posting!!!
You're not another of these poor sods that gets their news from 'The Sun' 'The Mail' and the 'Express' are you? They are the real 'Fake news' experts.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Tribesmen » Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:53 pm

Bin Ont Turf wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:33 pm
The Chinese in general would eat dog sh1t with sugar on.

Not necessarily all their fault though.
The Catonesse have a saying .
If it flies and it's not a Plane
If it has 4 legs and it's not a chair
And if it swims and it's not a submarine , then they will eat it .
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by KateR » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:27 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 1:17 pm
You're not another of these poor sods that gets their news from 'The Sun' 'The Mail' and the 'Express' are you? They are the real 'Fake news' experts.
Have you ever been and actually sat down to a meal with a local group, not a restaurant, I'm interested to hear your thoughts on that?

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:31 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:38 pm
I recommend you check out the diet of pigs. Maybe there are also other omnivores that we would not find surprising in our diet.
But we shouldn’t really eat pig. The Muslims and Jewish know this.
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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:40 pm

DCWat wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:57 pm
If we ignore what we eat from the sea, rivers and some other animals, in the west. There’s plenty restaurants around selling crocodile.
Correct. Doesn’t mean it’s clean though. These animals eat anything and everything.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by KateR » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:41 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:31 pm
But we shouldn’t really eat pig. The Muslims and Jewish know this.
It's to do with religious teachings that are quite old, it's to do with the temperatures in the home countries of the time, it's to do with having zero refrigeration, it's to do with many dying from food poising because of the said points. We really shouldn't eat anything if it has spoiled no because some ancient religious teachings tell us not to unless of course you subscribe to those religious teachings.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:41 pm

KateR wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:27 pm
Have you ever been and actually sat down to a meal with a local group, not a restaurant, I'm interested to hear your thoughts on that?
And your point is?

Not actually been to China but I've been to Hong Kong, the Philippines and Malaysia. All wonderful, friendly people who eat as well as people in the West and have very healthy diets. I stayed with a family in the Philippines for a week and although I can't say I enjoyed the food myself, there was plenty of fruit and veg. Yes, the food is different but no less wholesome.

Not much obesity in any of those places because by and large, they don't eat junk food or pre packaged meals. We could learn a lot from them.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by ŽižkovClaret » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:43 pm

Mofos act like they never went in papa sams sober ;)

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Paul Waine » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:44 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:31 pm
But we shouldn’t really eat pig. The Muslims and Jewish know this.
Hmm... I believe that Hindus don't eat cow. For a long time a lot of Christians didn't eat meat on Friday.

Why shouldn't we eat pig - assuming we aren't vegetarians?

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:46 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:44 pm
Hmm... I believe that Hindus don't eat cow. For a long time a lot of Christians didn't eat meat on Friday.

Why shouldn't we eat pig - assuming we aren't vegetarians?
Because of the **** they eat. The fact they can’t sweat. The fact that they roll around in and eat their own crap. And various other reasons.

But they taste good mind :lol:

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by KateR » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:02 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:41 pm
And your point is?

Not actually been to China but I've been to Hong Kong, the Philippines and Malaysia. All wonderful, friendly people who eat as well as people in the West and have very healthy diets. I stayed with a family in the Philippines for a week and although I can't say I enjoyed the food myself, there was plenty of fruit and veg. Yes, the food is different but no less wholesome.

Not much obesity in any of those places because by and large, they don't eat junk food or pre packaged meals. We could learn a lot from them.
My point is you are making a lot of noise about something you don't know much about. An extract regarding SARS:

SARS in 2002 and now Covid-19 and you are trying to defend something that has clearly been to blame for many deaths, I have been to all the countries you mention plus most others in SE Asia, including China quite a few times, Cities like Beijing and Shanghai are very nice, as are KL/Manila etc etc but the food is an issue, which is clear for all to see. I have had monkey brains/insects and snake put in front of me for dinner, it is simply totally different but food prep is a major risk and will be again unless they change. An extract regarding SARS:

Analysis of occupation status, excluding healthcare workers and case-patients with known exposure, shows that the proportion of cases in students (0% in January 2003 or before; 7% in February; 14% in March; 18% in April, p < 0.001) and housewives (0% in January 2003 or before; 5% in February; 14% in March; 15% in April, p < 0.001) increased as the epidemic progressed (Table 2). A high proportion (9/23, 39%) of early cases were food handlers (this category includes persons who handle, kill, and sell food animals, as well as those who prepare and serve food), but none were farmers handling livestock or poultry. Of the nine early cases in food handlers, seven were restaurant chefs working in township restaurants (where a variety of animals were slaughtered on the premises), one was a market produce buyer for a restaurant, and one was a snake seller in a produce market (where a variety of live animals were offered for sale). Six of the food handlers lived or worked in Shunde (1.7 million population), an urban district of Foshan municipality, though none could be directly linked to each other through contact history.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by ŽižkovClaret » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:05 pm

While i eat pork im not going to slag off the Chinese for eating cat or dog.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:17 pm

KateR wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:02 pm
My point is you are making a lot of noise about something you don't know much about. An extract regarding SARS:

SARS in 2002 and now Covid-19 and you are trying to defend something that has clearly been to blame for many deaths, I have been to all the countries you mention plus most others in SE Asia, including China quite a few times, Cities like Beijing and Shanghai are very nice, as are KL/Manila etc etc but the food is an issue, which is clear for all to see. I have had monkey brains/insects and snake put in front of me for dinner, it is simply totally different but food prep is a major risk and will be again unless they change. An extract regarding SARS:

Analysis of occupation status, excluding healthcare workers and case-patients with known exposure, shows that the proportion of cases in students (0% in January 2003 or before; 7% in February; 14% in March; 18% in April, p < 0.001) and housewives (0% in January 2003 or before; 5% in February; 14% in March; 15% in April, p < 0.001) increased as the epidemic progressed (Table 2). A high proportion (9/23, 39%) of early cases were food handlers (this category includes persons who handle, kill, and sell food animals, as well as those who prepare and serve food), but none were farmers handling livestock or poultry. Of the nine early cases in food handlers, seven were restaurant chefs working in township restaurants (where a variety of animals were slaughtered on the premises), one was a market produce buyer for a restaurant, and one was a snake seller in a produce market (where a variety of live animals were offered for sale). Six of the food handlers lived or worked in Shunde (1.7 million population), an urban district of Foshan municipality, though none could be directly linked to each other through contact history.
You are being very selective to match your own personal views. I suppose you will also blame the abbatoirs and food prepartion establishments in Ireland and Wales as well, seeing as how there have been large outbreaks in both locations.

No-one country is to blame for Covid 19. Humans have increasingly fed animals all sorts of crap, including us Brits and it caused Mad Cow Disease. I suppose you think that that doesn't count?

Let's just say that I disagree with your analysis and leave it at that.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by KateR » Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:30 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:17 pm
You are being very selective to match your own personal views. I suppose you will also blame the abbatoirs and food prepartion establishments in Ireland and Wales as well, seeing as how there have been large outbreaks in both locations.

No-one country is to blame for Covid 19. Humans have increasingly fed animals all sorts of crap, including us Brits and it caused Mad Cow Disease. I suppose you think that that doesn't count?

Let's just say that I disagree with your analysis and leave it at that.
when I quote WHO to you, your answer is to say I am being selective, my own experiences plus seeing exotic animals and inspects being sold along with dogs has nothing to do with me being selected but I certainly think you are being. Of course Mad Cow Disease counts, it's all to do with hygiene and mixing wild animals with domestic and everyday animals in what we eat, you could point to frog legs but we have no virus from that, MCD did not kill millions of humans world wide. Bird Flu and others show how quickly these viruses can spread and infect huge populations of all life forms, therefore we need to learn and not repeat in a way that China has and would say all countries/nationalities need to learn, however I think China in particular.

China did not learn from SARS and the world has suffered, surely if you read the thread title you would hope they learn this time and would say so rather than your own argumentative defense posts, but yes we can definitely and obviously do disagree on this thread subject title.

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Re: Will the Chinese never learn from this mess

Post by Gordaleman » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:20 pm

KateR wrote:
Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:30 pm
when I quote WHO to you, your answer is to say I am being selective, my own experiences plus seeing exotic animals and inspects being sold along with dogs has nothing to do with me being selected but I certainly think you are being. Of course Mad Cow Disease counts, it's all to do with hygiene and mixing wild animals with domestic and everyday animals in what we eat, you could point to frog legs but we have no virus from that, MCD did not kill millions of humans world wide. Bird Flu and others show how quickly these viruses can spread and infect huge populations of all life forms, therefore we need to learn and not repeat in a way that China has and would say all countries/nationalities need to learn, however I think China in particular.

China did not learn from SARS and the world has suffered, surely if you read the thread title you would hope they learn this time and would say so rather than your own argumentative defense posts, but yes we can definitely and obviously do disagree on this thread subject title.
Whether the Chinese learned anything from SARS is hard to say, but animal husbandry all over the world needs looking at. So you're saying Mad cow disease was OK because it didn't immediately kill millions world wide, as though Covid 19 has done. It hasn't. It still hasn't killed one million, never mind millions and it still hasn't killed as many as Flu does every year on average. Mad cow disease is STILL killing people in the form of Variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease, although it doesn't hit the headlines in the same way as Covid 19 because it's not transmittable.

That doesn't mean we can't all learn from this and we can start by ending the blame game and looking at facts and not speculation. No one knows the exact cause of Covid 19 as yet but it did not start in a Wuhan wet market. If it came from an animal there, and I stress IF, then that animal must have had it several days earlier because it has to incubate the disease before it becomes infectious. Therefore it likely got the disease on a farm as I said earlier.

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