bfcmik wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:03 pm

There have to be discussions between the Chairman, manager and transfer team about what would be a reasonable maximum value for any potential transfer before a target list is drawn up. Our maximum valuation on JayRod was less than WBA were prepared to accept. If we continually pay that 'little bit extra' clubs are asking then they will just keep bigging up their player valuations before talking to us. Which is what happens when clubs like Man Utd, Barca and Real Madrid go looking.

Dyche has to take some blame for this, he likes players who have shown their character over a few seasons. Most players who have shown such character at this level do not come cheap, either on transfer fees or wages, or wouldn't come to Burnley for double the money - we just ain't fashionable enough!

I do understand what you are saying but surely the project would be to make us fashionable. There's a huge market to be tapped into, the only difference between the successful owners and unsuccessful owners is the owners actually knowing what they are doing and how to tap into this. A lot of owners think they will be successful in football because they are successful in business but the two don't go hand in hand you have to be able to understand football too or be humble enough to leave operations to people who do. Success can be achieved but the stars must align.

bfcmik wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 09, 2020 8:03 pm

There have to be discussions between the Chairman, manager and transfer team about what would be a reasonable maximum value for any potential transfer before a target list is drawn up. Our maximum valuation on JayRod was less than WBA were prepared to accept. If we continually pay that 'little bit extra' clubs are asking then they will just keep bigging up their player valuations before talking to us. Which is what happens when clubs like Man Utd, Barca and Real Madrid go looking.

nobody is saying pay the little bit extra that clubs are trying to get (like we do).

If Dyche wants a much better winger who costs 15 million as opposed to an average one that costs 10 then that is where I'd like to see a sensible stretch to try and get the better player.

That is not the same as paying 12 million for the winger that is worth 10

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:51 pm

nobody is saying pay the little bit extra that clubs are trying to get (like we do).

If Dyche wants much better winger who costs 15 million as opposed to an average one that costs 10 then that is where I'd like to see a sensible stretch to try and get the better player.

That is not the same as paying 12 million for the winger that is worth 10

I didn't try to second guess the discussions that will happen on a regular basis between the Chairman and Sean Dyche as to the maximum amounts we can afford, or wish, to pay for target players and whether they believed those targets would improve, and fit into, the 1st team squad.

I was addressing the idea of the paying that little bit extra to get a target player even if that takes us into the "paying 12 million for the winger that is worth 10" territory as advocated by several posters on this thread

Listen to what the Professionals are saying on BT for christ sake...back him or loose him. Debt my arse

dsr wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 10, 2020 12:04 am

At risk of stating the obvious, if you buy a house there is a very fair chance that it will still be worth at least the value of the mortgage for the life of the mortgage - even if it's 25 years.

When you buy a footballer, that's not true. A footballer's worth can drop to zero virtually overnight. (Insurance won't cover all eventualities.)

My comment was more, if you dont take a chance then what's the point...this wont last forever, let's push it now.

ewanrob wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:13 pm

Listen to what the Professionals are saying on BT for christ sake...back him or loose him. Debt my arse

the money a lot are complaining about would come from tripling the season ticket prices (so long as everyone keeps buying them) still wouldn't be the most expensive in the league - how many would do that?

Well, we have all dined off our teams success for the last 5 years....maybe it's time the board said if you want the next level we are all going to have to invest....I really get a lot of fans especially older ones are scared of going back to 1986...but we are on the cusp of something very special here.

Chester Perry wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:17 pm

the money a lot are complaining about would come from tripling the season ticket prices (so long as everyone keeps buying them) still wouldn't be the most expensive in the league - how many would do that?

What are we talking there - £4 or £5 million - perhaps less with people not being willing to pay the increase?

The age of some of our squad does mean that some investment will be needed soon. It might be that we have to take a bit of a punt on a season of heavier investment, with reduced levels in future seasons.

It’s perhaps where it’s important that we have assets that we can turn a profit on, should the need arise. We’ve three, perhaps four in that category right now.

Nixon

and

if Nixon is correct at least we know what the plan is

I getting sick of the parrots in the media. What bit of we don't know what our budget for next season is yet don't they get?

We have got rid of what we needed to, apart from Jeff, who has chosen to leave and probably made a big mistake. We can't help injuries and we can"t sign anyone yet. Just STFU.

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:51 pm

nobody is saying pay the little bit extra that clubs are trying to get (like we do).

If Dyche wants a much better winger who costs 15 million as opposed to an average one that costs 10 then that is where I'd like to see a sensible stretch to try and get the better player.

That is not the same as paying 12 million for the winger that is worth 10

Bournemouth have just had a £16 million winger leave for free.
He was barely average from what I can recall.

The same summer we signed JBG for £1 million or so.

Which club would you say has had better value for their money?

You can use Dwight Gayle and Jay Rod for similar comparisons, because Gayle is gash in the PL despite what the fan boys on here think of him

ewanrob wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 5:13 pm

Listen to what the Professionals are saying on BT for christ sake...back him or loose him. Debt my arse

How many times have you now mentioned debt on this thread without saying who will lend us the money ?

They might be ex professional footballers but that does not mean they have any idea about finance - infact they probably know less than most about it.

Dyche won't go unless someone offers him a job he likes better. These public comments are with a view to letting other chairmen know that he is available if they have money to burn and are willing to let him spend it.

If the right offer doesn't come along - and there are only a very limited number of clubs who can make that right offer - then he will stay. If he was thinking of retiring / resigning because he is sick of it, then he wouldn't make any public comment at all; he would just resign and have done with it.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 10:54 pm

Bournemouth have just had a £16 million winger leave for free.
He was barely average from what I can recall.

The same summer we signed JBG for £1 million or so.

Which club would you say has had better value for their money?

You can use Dwight Gayle and Jay Rod for similar comparisons, because Gayle is gash in the PL despite what the fan boys on here think of him

aye, but i'm not comparing our manager to Eddie "sign young over priced players" Howe or Steve "we need more players" Bruce.

Huge difference and to compare them is quite ridiculous, Dyche isn't stupid and I expect him to have the same thought and attention towards our signings regardless of budget - it's not in his interest to waste money, all part of him building his reputation

TVC15 wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:13 pm

How many times have you now mentioned debt on this thread without saying who will lend us the money ?

They might be ex professional footballers but that does not mean they have any idea about finance - infact they probably know less than most about it.

and how many times do we need to ask how much does Dyche want to stretch the budget ? Huge difference between 5/10 million and 50+ million - the question rubs both ways

Vegas Claret wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 11, 2020 11:49 pm

aye, but i'm not comparing our manager to Eddie "sign young over priced players" Howe or Steve "we need more players" Bruce.

Huge difference and to compare them is quite ridiculous, Dyche isn't stupid and I expect him to have the same thought and attention towards our signings regardless of budget - it's not in his interest to waste money, all part of him building his reputation

Rafa signed Gayle and last I checked Howe left us with some pretty good young players that were reasonably priced so he does have a good eye for a young player.

My point being you suggested the club go out and sign a player for £15 million instead of £10 million but we've already shown that we can actually get better value for money than clubs who spend more.

Pope currently leads the Golden glove with 14.
The most expensive keeper in the world is sat down in 13th spot with 7.

We refused to pay the rumoured £20 million WBA wanted for Jay, instead picking him up for a bargain £10 million a season later.

We don't need to keep pushing the boat out that little bit further to find players that will improve the team.
Admittedly we could do with picking up some bargains from outside the UK though.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:12 am

Rafa signed Gayle and last I checked Howe left us with some pretty good young players that were reasonably priced so he does have a good eye for a young player.

My point being you suggested the club go out and sign a player for £15 million instead of £10 million but we've already shown that we can actually get better value for money than clubs who spend more.

Pope currently leads the Golden glove with 14.
The most expensive keeper in the world is sat down in 13th spot with 7.

We refused to pay the rumoured £20 million WBA wanted for Jay, instead picking him up for a bargain £10 million a season later.

We don't need to keep pushing the boat out that little bit further to find players that will improve the team.
Admittedly we could do with picking up some bargains from outside the UK though.

"We don't need to keep pushing the boat out that little bit further to find players that will improve the team"

that's not what Dyche says and his opinion is the only one that counts when it comes to the football side of things. I've no interest really on what the pundits think about it but either way, if Dyche wants a player we should do our best to get him, his record for the most part is bloody good in terms of value for money!

Also, Dyche and Garlick seem pretty level headed, not sure even if we managed to secure investment of some sort that the correct thought about value would suddenly go out the window - people seem to be losing their heads that that will happen and I'm yet to see any indication whatesoever that that would be the case. I've said it before, I trust the board to do what is right for the football club regardless of funds available

Latest reference to a potential new owner below.
This is aligned to the “Middle East” link made on here afew weeks back with a suggestion that the club could be sold after the end of the season.
Any ideas who the Egyptians are and any thoughts on how far progressed the due diligence process is?

- - - -



Multiple sources have told The Athletic that Burnley are one of a number of clubs to have been floated around the market, looking for expressions of interest for a takeover or a significant investment.

The Athletic understands that interest in Burnley is furthest along with an Egyptian group and due diligence is being carried out by the club and the interested party. It is understood several American investors have looked too, and been impressed with the financial shape of the club.

US groups are looking at clubs all over Europe with a growing interest in “soccer” and particularly the Premier League. The likes of Southampton, Bournemouth and Crystal Palace have been checked out. There is a suggestion that Garlick and fellow director John Banaszkiewicz would like to stay involved.

However, those American, and any other, investors do have questions about how they would be able to grow Burnley commercially. They are still a regional club and the large portion of their fanbase is made up of those in the town, where the club is the centre of the community. Essentially the question is: how can they run it better when it is so well run already?

However, those American, and any other, investors do have questions about how they would be able to grow Burnley commercially. They are still a regional club and the large portion of their fanbase is made up of those in the town, where the club is the centre of the community. Essentially the question is: how can they run it better when it is so well run already?

Exactly.

Being towards the top of the football pyramid must help...

You only have to look at Swansea to see can happen to a similarly sized club in the PL taken over by Americans who aren't really sure what they're upto initially.

My love for BFC goes when we are not owned by Clarets. WTF do Americans/Egyptians etc know about the partisan nature of football fans, since footballs inception smaller towns and cities get less supporters it is the way of things, the triumph and glory is beating the odds which we are doing now.
For those wetting their pants at the thought that a wealthy foreign owner will keep pumping money in so we are appeased when the likes of Lallana turns up kisses the badge and goes through the motions for 90k a week need to get a reality check.
It will end in tears.

Americans or Egyptians? Please god no. Would rather go down and do it our way.

Change is inevitable. Nothing lasts forever and we now have three Board members who are in their 70's, one in particular who has been on the Board for 34 years since 1986. We have to hope that both Mike G and John B have the desire to stick around for some time yet and hopefully the knowledge gained from their Far East businesses will stand us in good stead in choosing the right people to join the Board. I'm certain the reality of potentially this season not being played to a conclusion (and consequently the finances running out by August) has really focussed the mind of particularly Mike G, so don't be surprised if there are some changes in the not too distant future.

Royboyclaret wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:15 pm

Change is inevitable. Nothing lasts forever and we now have three Board members who are in their 70's, one in particular who has been on the Board for 34 years since 1986. We have to hope that both Mike G and John B have the desire to stick around for some time yet and hopefully the knowledge gained from their Far East businesses will stand us in good stead in choosing the right people to join the Board. I'm certain the reality of potentially this season not being played to a conclusion (and consequently the finances running out by August) has really focussed the mind of particularly Mike G, so don't be surprised if there are some changes in the not too distant future.

I think it is four board members over 70 but then again I don’t think many of the directors are particularly active now. The chairman seems to run the show.

With foreign ownership we'd most likely be looking for a fans-led consortium to buy them out again in 5-10 years time when they've ripped the heart and soul out of the club. Might as well just cut out the middle (eastern?) men if we're going down that route.

To be serious though, I'd be extremely sceptical of a takeover like the one described above. I love how unique this club is in terms of its ownership and that should be cherished and safeguarded above almost everything else in my opinion. I'd take a relegation into the championship next season with the current board over a couple more seasons in the PL of overspending only to see the same relegation occur minus the heart of the club. I only hope the cautious nature of the board leads to any takeover being treated in the same vein.

The board are wealthy men, they dont need the cash, just sell it to the supporters, we can and should own it.

bfcjg wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:33 pm

The board are wealthy men, they dont need the cash, just sell it to the supporters, we can and should own it.

Fans already own the club.

Unfortunately billionaires are rare as rocking horse poo in Burnley

Some proper bed wetting on this thread in relation to foreign owners.

What will be will be and I personally would have no issue with the current board chasing in, they’ve down their bit.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:50 pm

Fans already own the club.

Unfortunately billionaires are rare as rocking horse poo in Burnley

And that's how it should stay. Love them or hate them they have always had the clubs interest at heart , will an "investor " ?

It might be rubbish and it’s taken a while admittedly but I’ve heard tonight that the £1 million is shortly about to arrive from the ‘button push’

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 25, 2020 10:54 pm

You only have to look at Swansea to see can happen to a similarly sized club in the PL taken over by Americans who aren't really sure what they're upto initially.

Or you can look at Liverpool if it's done successfully.

Nothing to do with where someone is from, it's just having the right people and the right vision. Investment is possible without a dictatorship. You just need the right people.

They'll be a lot of Americans with better business acumen than British and a better understanding of making the most from sport in general. They don't necessarily have to know the ins and outs of the club, just hire the right people.

superdimitri wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:06 am

Or you can look at Liverpool if it's done successfully.

Nothing to do with where someone is from, it's just having the right people and the right vision. Investment is possible without a dictatorship. You just need the right people.

They'll be a lot of Americans with better business acumen than British and a better understanding of making the most from sport in general. They don't necessarily have to know the ins and outs of the club, just hire the right people.

Liverpool are a totally different animal to us

Millions of fans worldwide who add immense amounts of money into the club bank accounts

Whilst not looking at exact figures I would imagine over 90% of our income is generated from the Premier League monies whereas the likes of Liverpool bring in huge amounts of money from additional overseas commercial activities

We are who we are, and foreign investors would be hard pressed to generate much additional income

It may be that owning a Premier League club is seen as a status symbol for them but, as others have said, you reap what you sow

MG/JB could make some money for themselves in a buyout but hopefully they are looking at a bigger picture as far as the club is concerned

any investor wants a return from their investment by taking a share of any profits. Football clubss are a unique beast that revenue is generated by advertising, player sales, prize money and ticket sales but this revenue must also service running cost, player wages transfer fees etc large investment sums are therefore required to create success that will lead to increased revenue, who who invest in a club outside the top 6 without any guarantee the club can grow in terms of success and revenue generation

dushanbe wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 26, 2020 12:16 am

It might be rubbish and it’s taken a while admittedly but I’ve heard tonight that the £1 million is shortly about to arrive from the ‘button push’

Oh yes, the con man of the late 1990s.

superdimitri wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:06 am

Or you can look at Liverpool if it's done successfully.

Nothing to do with where someone is from, it's just having the right people and the right vision. Investment is possible without a dictatorship. You just need the right people.

They'll be a lot of Americans with better business acumen than British and a better understanding of making the most from sport in general. They don't necessarily have to know the ins and outs of the club, just hire the right people.

Can’t agree with that I’m afraid.
I think a lot of Americans just don’t get this country - or any country outside of their own....whether it’s sport, culture or anything else.
When you look at a number of those who have invested in our clubs Liverpool is more the exception than the rule and even there prior to Fenway it was a disaster with the previous yanks.
I don’t believe the Glazers have done anything that other investors could not have done at United - and during the tenure they have also taken out hundreds of millions in interest.
I’m not restricting this doubt in big investors to Americans even - I have my doubts about any overseas investment. The statistics show its very unlikely to prevent us getting relegated and then how interested will they be in our club.
I’m not against investment or being taken over - I think we are at a juncture as a club where we need to look at something new but we also need to look at the model that has worked for us previously when trying to work out where we want to go in the future.

superdimitri wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 26, 2020 7:06 am

Or you can look at Liverpool if it's done successfully.

Nothing to do with where someone is from, it's just having the right people and the right vision. Investment is possible without a dictatorship. You just need the right people.

They'll be a lot of Americans with better business acumen than British and a better understanding of making the most from sport in general. They don't necessarily have to know the ins and outs of the club, just hire the right people.

You can look at Liverpool from both angles, or did you forget about their previous owners who very nearly bankrupt the club?

Realistically there's only 2 ways an investor will allow us to increase spending significantly:

1. Just give us the money, either in the form of a loan (risky as it's likely to be called in sometime) or equity (which is less likely). Generally owners that do this are looking to move some not so clean money, improve their reputation or have a real affinity with the club.

2. Increase our commercial revenue hugely. To have a serious impact you'd need to triple or quadruple it at least. I'd say there is probably limited scope for this in Burnley itself, I imagine you'd be needing to mainly exploit markets overseas with a little bit of additional UK revenue.

Maybe someone with better business acumen than we currently have that idea looking to raise the profile of the club could, for example:

Invest in a website that actually works properly, where buying merchandise and match tickets is not a real chore

Allow replica kit to be sold in outlets other than just the club shop, where you have to either live in close proximity to the ground or use the aforementioned poor website to buy one.

Both the above are limiting our commercial activities and just one area that could be targeted if trying to raise the profile of the brand.

boatshed bill wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 25, 2020 10:51 pm

However, those American, and any other, investors do have questions about how they would be able to grow Burnley commercially. They are still a regional club and the large portion of their fanbase is made up of those in the town, where the club is the centre of the community. Essentially the question is: how can they run it better when it is so well run already?

Exactly.

It's a very good point, if we changed ground to 30k could we fill it...could we attract fans away from the immediate town. I'd suggest being a top 10 team year in year out might help, I get peoples objection to change...but right now we are in a fantastic position, great squad...manager, surely time to look to invest.

What are Harris and Blitzer getting out of Palace, out of interest, and how well received have they been?

I have a feeling this will only end in tears if we go down the route of folks who made money from Chicken , if you get my meaning .

Does anyone know if there is any truth in all these rumours, we don’t know if dyche will stay or wants out, and now uncertainty in the boardroom, not a great situation to be in, when there is only a few weeks until the new season starts again

As much as having additional investment is great from a fan perspective, I don't see what a potential investor would get in return.

There is very little in the area other than scenery, the ground is off the beaten track in an area not ripe for development. Allayed to that, Burnley isn't projected at all well by the Nations media.

Other than that though...

The only club owners of Egyptian descent I can think of are the Allams at Hull City, and things there are in a fairly disastrous state , particularly in terms of the relationship between fans and owners.

Didn't we win an award for most enterprising town in the country at one point? Part of the problem is a lot of people think the world starts and ends in Burnley. There is life outside the town, and people are scared of change. There is huge opportunity out there. When venkys said that they wanted to make them lot massive in India it wasn't such a bad idea. A nation with 1bn population that can be tapped into. The problem is that the people who had this idea didn't have a clue what they were doing. Had they left the guys in charge that ran the club and focussed on promoting Blackburn in India they may well have been a totally different animal today. I bet Leicester are massive in Thailand. A whole mentality shift needs to happen though and it needs to be positive

Fortunately, Turf Moor is not worth much, as a development site. Burnley is not a place to make a fortune. If it was, a new investor would have us out and plonked next to the motorway, somewhere!

Forever paying off the shiny stadium debt.

Sure, try to make Burnley, Egypt's club but it has to belong to Burnley people too.

Burnley is the local town football club, supported by its locals and playing on a world stage. Unique.

DCWat wrote: ↑

Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:19 am

What are Harris and Blitzer getting out of Palace, out of interest, and how well received have they been?

not much and they have been trying to get out for around 3 years now, though continue to invest in the meantime, Palace have a number of advantages over us (they are very distinct too)

- Palace's immediate environs particularly Norwood and Croydon provide a local community of over 385,000 and growing it provides much of their hardcore support and sells out the current capacity.

- The next couple of seasons will see an expansion of the ground by over 8000, of which around 3000 will be corporate seats, that is expected (given the central London Proximity) to double matchday revenues

- The Croydon Norwood area has provided the biggest talent pool of youngsters in the last 10 years or so. much more than any other area of the country, their move to Academy 1 status means that their youth teams, together with a £20m Academy infrastructure upgrade will not be so regularly stripped