Wigan

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claretonthecoast1882
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Wigan

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:31 pm

Following a good win last night have now gone into administration this morning.

karatekid
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Re: Wigan

Post by karatekid » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:32 pm

I used to love a bit of fishing off the pier there as a kid. ;)

ClaretTony
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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:32 pm

Just beat me to it. That will drop them back into the relegation zone I think.

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Re: Wigan

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:34 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:32 pm
Just beat me to it. That will drop them back into the relegation zone I think.
If its 12 points they will go bottom, saw a stat last night they are 2nd in the form table over the last 20 games, done a good job there has Cook

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Re: Wigan

Post by Barry_Chuckle » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:38 pm

I fear they'll not be the last.
Last edited by Barry_Chuckle on Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wigan

Post by SalisburyClaret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:38 pm

Another manager doing very well with minimal resources. Just our sort

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Re: Wigan

Post by ralphc » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:39 pm

Only got taken over last month to avoid the impact of Covid-19. Fit and proper owner test?

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Re: Wigan

Post by claretburns » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:40 pm

Currently on a run of 9 unbeaten, clean sheets in their past 7 games and 6 wins in their past 7.

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Re: Wigan

Post by claretburns » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:41 pm

If 10 points is deducted then the Championship relegation battle looks interesting, you'd have Luton bottom on 40 points and Charlton in 17th on 46 points with 6 or 7 games to go for some clubs.

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Re: Wigan

Post by depechedingle » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:47 pm

Whilst Wigan wouldn't be a favourite club of mine, I watch out for there results as Paul Cook is manager.

Seemed to take a while to adapt to the Championship following promotion from League 1, but as stated are now doing amazing.

Definetly a shame if this now plunges them to relegation.

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Re: Wigan

Post by s6t9a2f3f » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:47 pm

another north west club (exactly like Rovers) where the local businessman (Whelan like Jack Walker) who loved the club pulled out after several years of good success to be run like a business by investors and it goes belly up.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Gordaleman » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:54 pm

s6t9a2f3f wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:47 pm
another north west club (exactly like Rovers) where the local businessman (Whelan like Jack Walker) who loved the club pulled out after several years of good success to be run like a business by investors and it goes belly up.
I wonder why that doesn't send a message to some Burnley fans who want us to find a 'Sugar Daddy'?
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Re: Wigan

Post by claretburns » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:55 pm

s6t9a2f3f wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:47 pm
another north west club (exactly like Rovers) where the local businessman (Whelan like Jack Walker) who loved the club pulled out after several years of good success to be run like a business by investors and it goes belly up.
Also Eddie Davies at Bolton and Trevor Hemmings at Preston.

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Re: Wigan

Post by randomclaret2 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:55 pm

Paul Cook and the players must be devastated after their efforts of late

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Re: Wigan

Post by s6t9a2f3f » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:01 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:54 pm
I wonder why that doesn't send a message to some Burnley fans who want us to find a 'Sugar Daddy'?
The sugar daddy with us is because we are "in the wrong league" finance wise, we are in a league where the playing field is not the same for the entire league thus the desire for somebody to come in and invest to create a more fairer playing field for us to compete. But as with several clubs - classic example is west ham - how much have they spent ? how much is their wage bill ? joint 2nd bottom !!!!!!

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Re: Wigan

Post by pushpinpussy » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:02 pm

always been a rugby town anyway

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Re: Wigan

Post by conyoviejo » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:04 pm

pushpinpussy wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:02 pm
always been a rugby town anyway
Yes it has,the rugby league fans will be smiling after the stick they took from the football club a few years ago.

Burnleybabe
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Re: Wigan

Post by Burnleybabe » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:05 pm

Oh what a shame. "NOT"

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:09 pm

ralphc wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:39 pm
Only got taken over last month to avoid the impact of Covid-19. Fit and proper owner test?
Taken over in November 2018

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Re: Wigan

Post by bfcjg » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:09 pm

Gordaleman wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:54 pm
I wonder why that doesn't send a message to some Burnley fans who want us to find a 'Sugar Daddy'?
Spot on.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Leisure » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:10 pm

claretburns wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:41 pm
If 10 points is deducted then the Championship relegation battle looks interesting, you'd have Luton bottom on 40 points and Charlton in 17th on 46 points with 6 or 7 games to go for some clubs.
The standard deduction is 12 points.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:10 pm

s6t9a2f3f wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:47 pm
another north west club (exactly like Rovers) where the local businessman (Whelan like Jack Walker) who loved the club pulled out after several years of good success to be run like a business by investors and it goes belly up.
I don’t recall Jack Walker pulling out at Blackburn. Had he still been alive I suspect he’d still have been funding them.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ChrisG » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:18 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:09 pm
Taken over in November 2018
They were taken over again last month according to this

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... g-takeover

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Re: Wigan

Post by kaptin1 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:23 pm

claretburns wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:40 pm
Currently on a run of 9 unbeaten, clean sheets in their past 7 games and 6 wins in their past 7.
Players suddenly putting a shift in because they know they might be looking for another club soon

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Re: Wigan

Post by Chester Perry » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:31 pm

ChrisG wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:18 pm
They were taken over again last month according to this

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... g-takeover
I had a few posts a bit about this on the MMT thread at the time - The new owner was the previous owner - just a new investment vehicle with new partners. All his previous non interest loans were changed to interest paying loans at commercial rates (£2m p.a.) and if payments were late interest would jump to over 20% immediately. It seemed very strange at the time, and now this, seems like they were preparing for it.

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Re: Wigan

Post by nil_desperandum » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:36 pm

randomclaret2 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:55 pm
Paul Cook and the players must be devastated after their efforts of late
Teams entering administration often raise their game - for a variety of reasons.
If they are deducted 12 points they'll be 4 short of safety, but with 6 games to go it gives them a decent chance of being competitive.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:40 pm

ChrisG wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:18 pm
They were taken over again last month according to this

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.thegua ... g-takeover
Sorry, wasn’t aware of that. Something fishy there surely.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ElectroClaret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:41 pm

randomclaret2 wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:55 pm
Paul Cook and the players must be devastated after their efforts of late

Aye. Just glad they raised their game the other day so they could whack Rovers.

Good luck, Cooky.
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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:44 pm

I’ve just been looking at the points deduction they will face and it won’t be applied until after the season finishes.

If they don’t finish in the bottom three it will then be applied immediately.
If they do finish in the bottom three it will then be applied for next season so they will start on minus 12 in League One.

Stayingup
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Re: Wigan

Post by Stayingup » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:46 pm

Barry_Chuckle wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:38 pm
I fear they'll not be the last.
I think you are right about that.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Top Claret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:47 pm

This sounds like it was planned to wipe of debts and do deal with the administrater.

An holding company will more than likely own the football club and are waiting in the wings to do a deal with Begbies to buy back the club for pennies

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Re: Wigan

Post by huw.Y.WattfromWare » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:51 pm

Not a financial wiz but seems strange they couldn’t put the money in for 6 more games to ensure Championship football. The sell on price would be higher than for a Div1 side.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Paul Waine » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:52 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:09 pm
Taken over in November 2018
and Nov-2018 buyers sold to new owner again in June-2020.

I'll see if I can post the Guardian report.

EDIT: Guardian already linked, above.
Last edited by Paul Waine on Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:53 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:52 pm
and Nov-2018 buyers sold to new owner again in June-2020.

I'll see if I can post the Guardian report.
Link already posted by ChrisG
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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:55 pm


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Re: Wigan

Post by huw.Y.WattfromWare » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:56 pm

Sky sports now saying 12 point deduction.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:56 pm

huw.Y.WattfromWare wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:56 pm
Sky sports now saying 12 point deduction.
See my post above as to when and how it will be applied.

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Re: Wigan

Post by tiger76 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:57 pm

Sheff Wed could be next?https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53242237 and as has been alluded to sadly there's likely to be many others.

Yes CV has obviously had a major impact, but the warning signs were on the wall long before that hit, Birmingham being a notable example.

Hopefully this might lead to clubs being run on a more sustainable basis in the future.

You do wonder how long the Venky's will continue pumping millions into Rovers, before they lose interest, their losses are growing by the year, and another season in the Championship isn't going to help.

The Huddersfield owner did warn that up to 70 clubs could be struggling, and it looks like he's right.

From a selfish BFC POV, all this financial upheaval in the lower leagues, might allow us to pinch a couple of bargains in the window.

Paul Cook will be highly sought after by several fellow Championship clubs come the end of the season, so he'll be fine, he's shown he's capable of managing at that level, and he'll be relatively cheap to hire i'd have thought.
Last edited by tiger76 on Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wigan

Post by huw.Y.WattfromWare » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:59 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:56 pm
See my post above as to when and how it will be applied.
Cheers. Apologies for repetition I scanned back but not far enough.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Paul Waine » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:03 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:44 pm
I’ve just been looking at the points deduction they will face and it won’t be applied until after the season finishes.

If they don’t finish in the bottom three it will then be applied immediately.
If they do finish in the bottom three it will then be applied for next season so they will start on minus 12 in League One.
I know this isn't how it's done, I'd always like the points deduction to be in current season, limited to the minimum number of points that relegate the club and then the balance that is left deducted in the following season. So, if a club finishes in bottom three, before points deduction, they have max points deduction in the following season. But, if club finishes above the relegation spots, before points deduction, then only the minimum points are deducted to place them in bottom 3... It will stop this strategy of "we are down, anyway, so let's get go into administration, because there's no difference being relegated by 1 point or 13 points...
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Re: Wigan

Post by ElectroClaret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:08 pm

Yes, you do wonder about the Venkys long-term strategy, and just how much they're prepared to pump into the Ewood bottomless pit, surely the Vs are being hit like everyone else.

What the hell are they getting out of it?

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Re: Wigan

Post by matttheclaret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:12 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:44 pm
I’ve just been looking at the points deduction they will face and it won’t be applied until after the season finishes.

If they don’t finish in the bottom three it will then be applied immediately.
If they do finish in the bottom three it will then be applied for next season so they will start on minus 12 in League One.
So effectively, they need to make sure they're 13 points clear of the drop zone by the end of the season

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:13 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:03 pm
I know this isn't how it's done, I'd always like the points deduction to be in current season, limited to the minimum number of points that relegate the club and then the balance that is left deducted in the following season. So, if a club finishes in bottom three, before points deduction, they have max points deduction in the following season. But, if club finishes above the relegation spots, before points deduction, then only the minimum points are deducted to place them in bottom 3... It will stop this strategy of "we are down, anyway, so let's get go into administration, because there's no difference being relegated by 1 point or 13 points...
I've never liked points deductions at all, it distorts the league. I've always advocated that a club going into administration should start the following season one division lower than they would have done otherwise. So if they are relegated on league position they go down two leagues.
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Re: Wigan

Post by tiger76 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:16 pm

ElectroClaret wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:08 pm
Yes, you do wonder about the Venkys long-term strategy, and just how much they're prepared to pump into the Ewood bottomless pit, surely the Vs are being hit like everyone else.

What the hell are they getting out of it?
I can only assume they're hoping for promotion, and then they might consider cashing in, they have poured a heck of a lot into Rovers over the years, and even the dullards in the Rovers community realise that they're reliant on this investment to sustain the club, how long the Venky's will continue to throw money at the problem you do have to ponder, especially in light of the likely worldwide downturn.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Colburn_Claret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:22 pm

With their form they could still survive if they don't let it get to them.
With banks negating charges for people who dip in to their overdrafts, due to Covid, you think the EFL would show a bit of latitude, if this because of Covid.

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Re: Wigan

Post by s6t9a2f3f » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:26 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:10 pm
I don’t recall Jack Walker pulling out at Blackburn. Had he still been alive I suspect he’d still have been funding them.
ok I will simplify things for you, Jack Walker sadly passed away and his family still became benefactors within the club but their interest waned and eventually sold out their shares/stake in the club. That so far has not proved a success for the club both on and off the field.
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Re: Wigan

Post by FCBurnley » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:38 pm

Something stinks about this. Takeover then Admin ? Interesting who the receivers are aswell. Follow the money on this one

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Re: Wigan

Post by ElectroClaret » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:38 pm

I think the main problem with Jack Walker was that he was the only football fan in the family, from all that's been in the papers, etc.
When he died, interest lapsed.

The Walker Trust seems to have been a bit of a disaster for them.

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Re: Wigan

Post by ClaretLoup » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:44 pm

claretburns wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:55 pm
Also Eddie Davies at Bolton and Trevor Hemmings at Preston.
However the seven clubs above us in the table seem to be doing OK, at the moment.

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Re: Wigan

Post by Paul Waine » Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:25 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:13 pm
I've never liked points deductions at all, it distorts the league. I've always advocated that a club going into administration should start the following season one division lower than they would have done otherwise. So if they are relegated on league position they go down two leagues.
OK. I think you are even tougher than I was proposing. "Tough love" is good reminder of the need for correct financial soundness by all boards.

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