Drinking a pint whilst wearing a face covering could prove a bit tricky!fidelcastro wrote: ↑Fri Jul 03, 2020 10:27 amNo. Breeding ground for the virus. People in close proximity without face coverings.
Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Everybody is terrified of dying. Sensible precautions if you have a Pre existing condition otherwise it won't kill you.Gordaleman wrote: ↑Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:07 amI'd rather not risk my life to save a pub thank you.
I assume that you aren't in a vulnerable group? I am.
I find people are terrified of life, just getting up in the morning scares them and even more terrified of dying.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Wouldn’t surprise me.
There was a video going round of a woman unconscious at the swan and a bloke being pinned down by the old bill.
Don’t know what’s worse whatever happened or them filming it.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Believe me, I'm not terrified of much at all. I just don't see the point of putting myself and others at risk, for the sake of a pint or two.Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:09 amEverybody is terrified of dying. Sensible precautions if you have a Pre existing condition otherwise it won't kill you.
I find people are terrified of life, just getting up in the morning scares them and even more terrified of dying.
The scenes last night prove the point that people can't 'Social distance' when they have drink in them.
I like a drink as much as the next man, but I'll bide my time thank you.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
I do like a glass of wine at home after work on a Friday and with my Sunday lunch but drinking at home can be damaging because its just too easy to drink more than you would in a pub. I suppose that's where self discipline comes in. Only at weekends! But I agree the whole point of pubs is to socialise!Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑Fri Jul 03, 2020 12:37 pmI don't go the pub that often these days but I have never got into drinking at home. Nothing social in that at all for me
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Really? Well, maybe you should go and tell my mate's wife that her husband isn't dead. Please don't post dangerous rubbish on here.Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:09 amEverybody is terrified of dying. Sensible precautions if you have a Pre existing condition otherwise it won't kill you.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
As I said sensible precautions.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:34 amReally? Well, maybe you should go and tell my mate's wife that her husband isn't dead. Please don't post dangerous rubbish on here.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
You said sensible precautions IF you have a Pre-existing condition OTHERWISE it won't kill you. Now maybe I'm reading this incorrectly or your grammar is poor. Anyway, whatever. I'll leave you to your ignorance.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Did it kill Prince Charles. Did it kill Boris Johnson?Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:30 pmYou said sensible precautions IF you have a Pre-existing condition OTHERWISE it won't kill you. Now maybe I'm reading this incorrectly or your grammar is poor. Anyway, whatever. I'll leave you to your ignorance.
I'll leave you to cultivate your seeds of FEAR. It won't kill everybody.
Thousands tested positive with no symptoms whatsoever.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Oh that's most reassuring. I don't know where we would be without your thoughtful insight. Thank you.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:37 pmOh that's most reassuring. I don't know where we would be without your thoughtful insight. Thank you.
You are welcome. And remember not to be frightened of the shadows. Especially your own.
.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
This isn't just about me or indeed you. For me, it's not only about keeping myself safe - it's about the risk I pose to other people should I become infected. You don't see this though, do you. You're one of those self-centered people who see the virus in terms of their own safety, but not the wider community.Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 1:46 pmYou are welcome. And remember not to be frightened of the shadows. Especially your own.
Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Unlike seasonal flu it's clear that if you are fit and healthy you should be fine. However, if you are elderly with underlying health issues you wont if you catch it.Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:34 pmDid it kill Prince Charles. Did it kill Boris Johnson?
I'll leave you to cultivate your seeds of FEAR. It won't kill everybody.
Thousands tested positive with no symptoms whatsoever.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
And you don't know me from a bar of soap. Yet you know all about me? It's about putting things into context.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 2:14 pmThis isn't just about me or indeed you. For me, it's not only about keeping myself safe - it's about the risk I pose to other people should I become infected. You don't see this though, do you. You're one of those self-centered people who see the virus in terms of their own safety, but not the wider community.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 12:34 pmDid it kill Prince Charles. Did it kill Boris Johnson?
I'll leave you to cultivate your seeds of FEAR. It won't kill everybody.
Thousands tested positive with no symptoms whatsoever.
And thousands died.
What's your point?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
And people who had been diagnosed with cancer had COVID documented on their death certificates. Therefore making the figures unreliable.
What's your point?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
What a stupid argument.Healeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:15 amAnd people who had been diagnosed with cancer had COVID documented on their death certificates. Therefore making the figures unreliable.
What's your point?
If, God forbid, I had been diagnosed with bowel cancer, and on the way to see my consultant, I was hit by a car whilst crossing the road, which would have killed me?
The car or the cancer?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Hi Billy, Maybe you could give more detail how your friend died and give more information to people? Educate people.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Sun Jul 05, 2020 11:34 amReally? Well, maybe you should go and tell my mate's wife that her husband isn't dead. Please don't post dangerous rubbish on here.
Nothing adds up to me, so the more true information we can see the better.
Obviously nobody knows your friend on here or you for that matter, so the info is anonymous.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
I went to a few places in Burnley on Saturday, and all of them were enforcing the rules quite stringently. I left in the evening though so I'm not sure how much it deteriorated when the night time crowd came out.
Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Jesus wept if you are going to make sweeping statements like that ... then at least back it up with proofHealeywoodclaret wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 7:15 amAnd people who had been diagnosed with cancer had COVID documented on their death certificates. Therefore making the figures unreliable.
What's your point?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
All the pubs that were open on Exeter Quayside on Saturday and in Shaldon, near Teignmouth, and in my local yesterday, enforced the rules/advice admirably.
There wasn't even a hint of a risk. Granted, there could well have been problems elsewhere but the dramaqueen - like suggestion that people - all people, one presumes - can't or won't social distance is cobblers.
There wasn't even a hint of a risk. Granted, there could well have been problems elsewhere but the dramaqueen - like suggestion that people - all people, one presumes - can't or won't social distance is cobblers.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
I've mentioned it before on here, Quicken. He was 48 and had no underlying health conditions and wasn't overweight. He was tested positive and three weeks later he was dead. He was on a ward at first and ended up an ICU and sadly didn't make it. I don't want to add anything else for privacy reasons.Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:29 amHi Billy, Maybe you could give more detail how your friend died and give more information to people? Educate people.
A colleague of mine (31 years of age) was tested positive at the beginning of April and he's still recovering. Struggles to climb the stairs and some days he says it's like it has comeback and it floors him with pains in his lungs and kidneys. Also, he no longer has the antibodies according to the test results he received the other week. TBH: The antibodies thing is most concerning.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Quite understandable about the privacy as with plenty of others.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 12:06 pmI've mentioned it before on here, Quicken. He was 48 and had no underlying health conditions and wasn't overweight. He was tested positive and three weeks later he was dead. He was on a ward at first and ended up an ICU and sadly didn't make it. I don't want to add anything else for privacy reasons.
A colleague of mine (31 years of age) was tested positive at the beginning of April and he's still recovering. Struggles to climb the stairs and some days he says it's like it has comeback and it floors him with pains in his lungs and kidneys. Also, he no longer has the antibodies according to the test results he received the other week. TBH: The antibodies thing is most concerning.
It would just be a great help to the public to find out how people were catching it first hand.
There's been far too much info for the average person to digest that's why most have switched off.
Thankfully there's no new cases in Burnley which is great news.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Not supporting Healeywood in general, but I can back up that particular point from personal experience. We know of someone (elderly) who was admitted to hospital, initially just overnight for an assessment - following a nasty fall. Sadly this person died overnight.
They put Covid on the "death certificate". The family quite correctly challenged this since there had been no symptoms, and it had major implications for people attending the funeral, for care workers who had been going to the home etc. etc. They were told that when old people were admitted like this they were all regsistered as Covid. It was "official policy". The family dug in and asked to speak to superiors etc etc., and importantly they insisted that the results of a swab test, (which had been taken when the patient was admitted), should be released. The hospital authorities were not happy. Due to persistence however the results were produced and - of course - it was negative. This was a great relief since it mean't that the funeral could go ahead and no family members or carers had to isolate for 14 days.
So you have to ask, how many elderly patients at our local hospital have been routinely registered as Covid deaths.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Eddie Large is another good examplenil_desperandum wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:00 pmNot supporting Healeywood in general, but I can back up that particular point from personal experience. We know of someone (elderly) who was admitted to hospital, initially just overnight for an assessment - following a nasty fall. Sadly this person died overnight.
They put Covid on the "death certificate". The family quite correctly challenged this since there had been no symptoms, and it had major implications for people attending the funeral, for care workers who had been going to the home etc. etc. They were told that when old people were admitted like this they were all regsistered as Covid. It was "official policy". The family dug in and asked to speak to superiors etc etc., and importantly they insisted that the results of a swab test, (which had been taken when the patient was admitted), should be released. The hospital authorities were not happy. Due to persistence however the results were produced and - of course - it was negative. This was a great relief since it mean't that the funeral could go ahead and no family members or carers had to isolate for 14 days.
So you have to ask, how many elderly patients at our local hospital have been routinely registered as Covid deaths.
Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Happening in all hospitals, and most care homes.nil_desperandum wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:00 pmNot supporting Healeywood in general, but I can back up that particular point from personal experience. We know of someone (elderly) who was admitted to hospital, initially just overnight for an assessment - following a nasty fall. Sadly this person died overnight.
They put Covid on the "death certificate". The family quite correctly challenged this since there had been no symptoms, and it had major implications for people attending the funeral, for care workers who had been going to the home etc. etc. They were told that when old people were admitted like this they were all regsistered as Covid. It was "official policy". The family dug in and asked to speak to superiors etc etc., and importantly they insisted that the results of a swab test, (which had been taken when the patient was admitted), should be released. The hospital authorities were not happy. Due to persistence however the results were produced and - of course - it was negative. This was a great relief since it mean't that the funeral could go ahead and no family members or carers had to isolate for 14 days.
So you have to ask, how many elderly patients at our local hospital have been routinely registered as Covid deaths.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
So, ALL old people admitted to hospital are registered as having COVID?nil_desperandum wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:00 pmNot supporting Healeywood in general, but I can back up that particular point from personal experience. We know of someone (elderly) who was admitted to hospital, initially just overnight for an assessment - following a nasty fall. Sadly this person died overnight.
They put Covid on the "death certificate". The family quite correctly challenged this since there had been no symptoms, and it had major implications for people attending the funeral, for care workers who had been going to the home etc. etc. They were told that when old people were admitted like this they were all regsistered as Covid. It was "official policy". The family dug in and asked to speak to superiors etc etc., and importantly they insisted that the results of a swab test, (which had been taken when the patient was admitted), should be released. The hospital authorities were not happy. Due to persistence however the results were produced and - of course - it was negative. This was a great relief since it mean't that the funeral could go ahead and no family members or carers had to isolate for 14 days.
So you have to ask, how many elderly patients at our local hospital have been routinely registered as Covid deaths.
Sorry, I simply don't believe that.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Many people who have lost loved ones have complained that COVID has been documented on death certificates. A guy we know lost his mother aged 94. She had all manner of health problems. He was told its easier to put COVID on the death certificate. There was a big debate about it on Radio 2 a couple of weeks ago with many people ringing on to say the same thing. That's not proof but depends what you believe. Why would relatives question it? Because they did not believe COVID was the cause of death.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Stupid questionfidelcastro wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 11:08 amWhat a stupid argument.
If, God forbid, I had been diagnosed with bowel cancer, and on the way to see my consultant, I was hit by a car whilst crossing the road, which would have killed me?
The car or the cancer?
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Why?
Do give me the benefit of your superior expertise.
Last edited by fidelcastro on Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
I didn't actually say ALL. I was referring to those who died at our local hospital (East Lancs Hosp Trust at Blackburn). It may not have been the same in other authorities, but there are reports of it being the case.fidelcastro wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:18 pmSo, ALL old people admitted to hospital are registered as having COVID?
Sorry, I simply don't believe that.
Also, I didn't say that all admissions of the elderly were registered as having Covid. They are tested on arrival. That could be negative. It's only if they die that - apparently - they are recorded as Covid deaths.
Sorry, I simply don't believe that.
Is there any reason do you think why I would make this up?. It was a very traumatic time. It was an unexpected death following a fall. There were "heated" arguments with the registrar, (who passed the buck to the hospital). There were then arguments with the hospital authorities and the medical staff. (To be fair to medical staff they said they were only following the guidance / instructions from management). It took a couple of days to sort out.
Anyone who was less tenacious than the person trying to register the death could easily have accepted their initial "diagnosis" simply for an "easy life"
EDIT: I now note (3 posts up) that Healeywood has also provided further evidence of this.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Yes, you did say ALL.nil_desperandum wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:00 pmThey were told that when old people were admitted like this they were all regsistered as Covid. It was "official policy".
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
If what is being said above is true about deliberately putting Covid as cause of death with no evidence, then it is scandalous. Is it because of a shortage of tests earlier? Or have we got some people in the NHS playing politics at such a sensitive time? I hope it is not the latter, but it would not surprise me if an anti- Tory agenda was in play.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
You need to read the whole post again I was clearly referring to all "deaths" - not ALL those admitted, (which is what you wrote). And I've clarified that I mean't ALL at the Blackburn Hospital because that is what we were told was the official policy of ELHT. (Obviously I can't speak for other health authorities since we haven't had communication with them on this topic , (thankfully).)
Last edited by nil_desperandum on Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
To be honest, (and having experienced it) I think it's more a matter of simplifying things, avoiding post-mortems etc. I think hospitals have more pressing things to do than pull political stunts.summitclaret wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:09 pmIf what is being said above is true about deliberately putting Covid as cause of death with no evidence, then it is scandalous. Is it because of a shortage of tests earlier? Or have we got some people in the NHS playing politics at such a sensitive time? I hope it is not the latter, but it would not surprise me if an anti- Tory agenda was in play.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Don't tell me it's the first you've heard of it? A guy who works with my partner lost his mum in April. 8 months earlier she had been diagnosed with lung cancer. COVID was documented as cause of death and his dad challenged this. But as Nil says its Government Policy and like it or not this situation is very political and completely media driven in my view.summitclaret wrote: ↑Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:09 pmIf what is being said above is true about deliberately putting Covid as cause of death with no evidence, then it is scandalous. Is it because of a shortage of tests earlier? Or have we got some people in the NHS playing politics at such a sensitive time? I hope it is not the latter, but it would not surprise me if an anti- Tory agenda was in play.
Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Seems this argument was caused by Healeywood saying that covid wont kill you unless you have underlying health problems.
That does seem to be a strange comment.
That does seem to be a strange comment.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Well - it's clearly a false claim, but I think his general point is reasonable.
The official "fact checked" figure (as of May 20th) for deaths of those under 60 with no underlying conditions was 253*. It's terrible of course for their families, but it is a very low number compared to deaths by other causes, (they're far more likely to die on the way to the pub) In fact I've read that you are about twice as likely to be struck by lightning.
* I don't know the current figure, but the death rate since May has been much lower anyway.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
UK in 30 years (1987-2016), 58 people were known to have been killed by lightning.
If only the past ten years are considered, a period with fewer average lightning deaths, the risk was one person in 71 million.
If only the past ten years are considered, a period with fewer average lightning deaths, the risk was one person in 71 million.
Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Well it took all of 2 days. Three pubs closed already because someone has been there with Covid 19. Surely these people had symptons before going to the pub for it to be found so soon.
I really do feel for those landlords who have made all the effort to open up again and be shou down so quickly. We have zero cases on the island and I still won't risk going to the pub because my son has to be shielded.
This is going to drag on for years while we have irresponsible people spreading it.
I really do feel for those landlords who have made all the effort to open up again and be shou down so quickly. We have zero cases on the island and I still won't risk going to the pub because my son has to be shielded.
This is going to drag on for years while we have irresponsible people spreading it.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
That's why I used the term "struck by lightening". It's a pretty common metaphor for saying that the odds are really small.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:37 amUK in 30 years (1987-2016), 58 people were known to have been killed by lightning.
If only the past ten years are considered, a period with fewer average lightning deaths, the risk was one person in 71 million.
(I'm not diminishing the impact that the death of a healthy person from Covid has, but statistically the chances of a healthy person under 60 dying from Covid really are very, very small. You're far more likely - for example - to be diagnosed with terminal illness or have a fatal accident).
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Ok then. We'll go with 'struck' by lightening.
You said that deaths of people aged under 60 (as of May 20th) with no underlying conditions was 253. Then you went onto to say; "In fact I've read that you are about twice as likely to be struck by lightning".
So by my reckoning, this means you believe that it's possible that somewhere in the region of 506 people here in the UK (aged under 60) are likely to be stuck by lightening in a 3 or 4 month period.
It might be a pretty common metaphor, but you posted it while quoting the deaths of 253 people. I just think it's fair to point out that 253 deaths, of people aged under the age of 60 with no underlying conditions, comes absolutely nowhere near to your 'common metaphor'.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
For a bit of perspective, how many people were killed, pre-lockdown, on our roads each day ?
Although 253 deaths, especially if avoidable, is 253 deaths too many but it doesn't sound significant, statistically, to me.
Although 253 deaths, especially if avoidable, is 253 deaths too many but it doesn't sound significant, statistically, to me.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Getting back to the pub discussion, it is being suggested that all adults in Britain could be given a £500 voucher to spend on 'Hospitality' to get the industry up and running again. That should include pubs and clubs, so how long will it take you to spend it on pints?
It might take me quite a while as I haven't been back as yet and I'm in no rush.
It might take me quite a while as I haven't been back as yet and I'm in no rush.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
I don't think there will be a £500 voucher. More like a thinktank getting some free publicity.
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Just one source.Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:17 pmI don't think there will be a £500 voucher. More like a thinktank getting some free publicity.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -hit-firms
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
Ooooh, yes please !
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Re: Will you be going to the pub tomorrow?
But remember...its no worse than Flu.Gordaleman wrote: ↑Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:12 pmGetting back to the pub discussion, it is being suggested that all adults in Britain could be given a £500 voucher to spend on 'Hospitality' to get the industry up and running again. That should include pubs and clubs, so how long will it take you to spend it on pints?
It might take me quite a while as I haven't been back as yet and I'm in no rush.