Ashley Westwood - The Times

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Paul Waine
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Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Paul Waine » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:11 am

Article in The Times:

Ashley Westwood should say sorry for stitching up Emiliano Buendía
Tommy Conlon
Sunday July 19 2020, 6.00pm, The Times

The theatre was Carrow Road, the stage was the pitch, the thespian was Ashley Westwood. It looked to me like a bravura performance of ham acting.

Watching the Burnley midfielder writhe in agony, medical staff may have been caught in two minds, not knowing whether to give him the last rites or a standing ovation.

He had tangled with Norwich City’s Emiliano Buendía in the 33rd minute on Saturday evening. The Argentinian was in possession; Westwood lunged in and the ball broke away; a few afters followed. The English midfielder kneed Buendía in the thigh and pinned him momentarily using his arm and leg, preventing Buendía from walking away. Buendía turned to extricate himself and in the same movement dropped his elbow on to the back of Westwood’s head. Replays showed he applied moderate contact. One would doubt it left a skin mark, much less a bruise. The whole incident was nothing.

It was Westwood’s reaction that escalated it. Had he done the decent thing and walked away, it would in all likelihood have petered out. Instead he enacted a pitiful display of victimhood. Westwood collapsed on the floor clutching his head. He got to his knees clutching his head with both hands. Then he lay flat on the ground clutching his head. He executed one roll, then a second, still clutching his head. He managed then to haul himself on to all fours. At this point there was some sign of an improvement in his condition, for now he was applying just one hand, albeit he was using it vigorously to massage the afflicted area. From there he made it on to his knees and finally into an upright position.

By this stage, play was suspended and VAR was investigating for possible violent conduct. After multiple viewings in the video room, Kevin Friend, the referee, was advised to have a look for himself on the pitch-side monitor. It appears the incident was not shown to him in full on the monitor. It had been edited down to the split-second where Buendía’s elbow made contact with Westwood’s head. Without any context to complicate his considerations, Friend quAnd he ought to have it for another reason too: his own manager has previously condemned this kind of behaviour. In fact, Sean Dyche was preaching about it only last August. “The game’s in a really poor state for people diving, feigning injury, all sorts,” he declared. A few weeks earlier he had attended a meeting of the Premier League where he was told that a yellow card was the only sanction available for such conduct. “And I said, ‘So that means basically that every player in the Premier League can cheat at least once a game?’ . . . It’s about the greater good of the game. The game’s in a really poor state for people just literally falling on the floor.”ickly made up his mind: red card.

Letter of the law? Probably correct. Violent conduct? Not remotely. Had Friend been able to assess the whole sequence, he’d have seen at least some possibility for mitigation in that Buendía was trying to extricate himself from the tangle – and that Westwood had been looking to extract a reaction. One would have thought the Burnley player was entitled to a yellow card for his part in the proceedings.

Instead he is entitled to a black card in the court of public opinion. In my view, his was the classic stitch-up job of long and ignoble tradition. It requires two acting roles, the first as the provocateur who goads his opponent into retaliation, the second as the injured party when said retaliation arrives. But this was a particularly shameless performance. The feigning on the floor was not so much laughable as contemptible. Westwood is 30, a senior professional who ought to have some sense of duty to the wider game.

Did Westwood’s behaviour on Saturday therefore trouble his conscience? Or did he just think, great, Norwich are down to ten men? It would be taking idealism into pie-in-the-sky territory to expect that Dyche might publicly distance himself from one of his players. Even a charge of hypocrisy against him would be unfair, given there is no evidence that he encourages his players to cheat in this fashion. If the buck ultimately stops with the manager, it doesn’t mean that a player should be spared the obligation of taking responsibility for his own actions. This one is on Westwood. He owes Buendía an apology.

Notwithstanding the fact that one of his players failed dismally to practise what he preached, Dyche did the game a service last August.

As he also pointed out at that press conference, very few other people in the industry are talking about the issue any more. This form of cheating has become normalised to the point that it is barely even noticed, much less discussed. It continues to poison the water.

Maybe it is because there has never been more at stake for clubs financially, that players feel under greater pressure than previous generations to salvage results, by fair means or foul. In a time of supercharged professionalism, perhaps the ancient ideal of sportsmanship is seen as a dying relic of amateurism. But the game in its entirety is played overwhelmingly by amateurs, including the millions of children and juveniles who are daily watching their heroes behave with dishonour. And of course the behaviour becomes learned and replicated.

It is an abiding plague on the game, this particular brand of cynicism, and there is seemingly no desire to find a cure.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:15 am

Very bitter.

Dyche has been pretty open about the difference in ‘gamesmanship’ and diving.
Westwood made the most of it no doubt but if your going to whack someone on the head you can’t complain too much.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by claptrappers_union » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:20 am

If someone did the same to him arriving at the stadium, putting there elbow on his neck, he’d just turn around and ask “what are you doing?”

If the roles were reversed for the sending off, we’d be throthing at the mouth.

I know it’s part of the game now, but it’s disappointing
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Corky » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:24 am

If Buendía hadn't, with fist clenched, elbowed Westwood in the head, however moderate the contact then he would not have got sent off. Simple really.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Hibsclaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:31 am

More media anti Claret stuff tbh.

The problem is something like this has always been in the offing when Dyche constantly bangs the cheating drum (one of our players was inevitably going to be caught in this sort of scenario).

Do I think any or many of our other players would have acted like Westwood...no?
Was what Westwood did anywhere near as bad as some we have seen (ala Bamford for example)....no way?
If this was a club other than ours it wouldn’t have anything like that size of story sticking the knife in.....

I bet Bardo and Tarky had a bit of a pi55 take with Westy at half time tbh

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by JohnMac » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:33 am

I keep inviting people to tap themself on the cranium behind the ear with something similar to the point of an elbow. Maybe the end of a rolling pin will do, just a short sharp tap.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by duncandisorderly » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:33 am

This article could be written a dozen times a weekend about world class players from the big six, but instead it's about the one time a Burnley player does it.

I'm not one for all this media hate us spiel, but it's borderline transparent now.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by HahaYeah » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:44 am

"Violent conduct? Not remotely."

Was a blatant elbow!

Fake news.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Burnley1989 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:54 am

Wow, i’d love to discuss this with whoever wrote that. He’s absolutely clueless
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Erasmus » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:54 am

Agree with the article entirely. I can't stand the type of cheating and faking Westwood used to get an opponent sent off. Lying and cheating is lying and cheating as in any profession and it is absolutely unacceptable. I have been so pleased to see Sean Dyche repeatedly speaking out against it and most of us supporters have agreed with his words wholeheartedly. The test comes when one of our own players is guilty of this blight on the modern game. We should show that our disgust at cheating in football is absolute and be willing to condemn our own players even more than we would players of other teams.

Personally, I felt sickened by what Westwood did and would rather have missed out on the victory than get a win through such dishonest, cheating means.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by 4:20 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:56 am

The guy looks down, closes his opened hand into a fist, brings his elbow down onto Westwood's head, rubs it around a bit, pulls his arm up and off Westy's head and releases his clenched fist back into the open palm he had at the beginning of the manoeuvre.
I don't care if Westwood then flapped around like a carp that's just escaped the landing net on the shoreline, you can't go about elbowing folk, intentionally, on the back of your opponent's head like that, it's a straight red. Non event my arse.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Firthy » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:00 am

So it's okay for all the big overpaid stars at the big clubs to feign injuries, manufacture a foul and overreact to any sort of contact without question but when a player from a smaller club does it, they have a go at him. What a crock of shite, in the words of the usual MOTD pundits "There was contact" which is all it seems to take these days so end of story. Tommy Cotton should crawl back onto his whole.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Burnley1989 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:00 am

Erasmus wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:54 am
Agree with the article entirely. I can't stand the type of cheating and faking Westwood used to get an opponent sent off. Lying and cheating is lying and cheating as in any profession and it is absolutely unacceptable. I have been so pleased to see Sean Dyche repeatedly speaking out against it and most of us supporters have agreed with his words wholeheartedly. The test comes when one of our own players is guilty of this blight on the modern game. We should show that our disgust at cheating in football is absolute and be willing to condemn our own players even more than we would players of other teams.

Personally, I felt sickened by what Westwood did and would rather have missed out on the victory than get a win through such dishonest, cheating means.
And explain how it’s any different to what Pieters did? He wasn’t caught too badly but it was still a red card and he still rolled about no doubt so that the ref would send the player off. ‘Felt Sickened’ give over
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Damo » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:04 am

I can see an argument for Westwood getting booked for his part in the altercation.
That absolutely doesn't detract from what Buendia did though. It was as blatant a red card as you will see all season
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Firthy » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:09 am

Erasmus wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:54 am
Agree with the article entirely. I can't stand the type of cheating and faking Westwood used to get an opponent sent off. Lying and cheating is lying and cheating as in any profession and it is absolutely unacceptable. I have been so pleased to see Sean Dyche repeatedly speaking out against it and most of us supporters have agreed with his words wholeheartedly. The test comes when one of our own players is guilty of this blight on the modern game. We should show that our disgust at cheating in football is absolute and be willing to condemn our own players even more than we would players of other teams.

Personally, I felt sickened by what Westwood did and would rather have missed out on the victory than get a win through such dishonest, cheating means.
You're right with everything you say and two wrongs don't make a right but the elbow was deliberate and it was a red card regardless of Westwood's reaction. It's now become a case of "what''s good for the goose is good for the gander" and if the top players can get away with it then the rest will think they can.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by AlargeClaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:10 am

You throw an elbow no matter how tame you’re off really . AW should have been booked for starting it and his ridiculous almost “ Chelsea-esque” play acting was uncalled for and I hope SD bollocked him ,but it happens multiple times in any of the “ big 6” games .To highlight this is like busting a couple of students smoking a joint at a Mexican drug cartel party .

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by BenWickes » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:12 am

Two ex-players in studio at the time, one ex-Norwich both agreed in real time and slowed down they were both reds. I'll believe them over some jumped up bitter journo.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Hibsclaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:15 am

If that’s Bardsley or Tarks they don’t go down like that tbh but only because they are as hard as nails. I think the pain threshold will be different for each player but there is absolutely no doubt that it is nowhere near as bad as some of the feining stuff we see and no need at all for the pointless times article....

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by FactualFrank » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:18 am

I coud only read a bit of that. Whoever wrote it needs sacking.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Erasmus » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:22 am

Yes, by the modern definition of 'violent conduct' he should have been sent off regardless of Westwood's cheating tactics. Westwood didn't get him sent off, but that doesn't alter the fact that his reaction was dishonest. After all he has said about this, I hope Sean Dyche gave him a good dressing down and told him that at Burnley we don't do that. We're better than the rubbish at the top of the league because we have repeatedly shown greater integrity. It's important to me that we maintain that superiority over them.

I thought the foul on Pieters was a bad one. When you jump off the ground to make a tackle you are risking doing serious damage to an opponent. My initial impresssion was that the blow on Westwood's head was the best part of nothing whilst Pieters got hit quite hard by a bad foul.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by huw.Y.WattfromWare » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:23 am

Farke said they were both reds, that’ll do for me. This journo reads like a Canary with an agenda.
Anybody who says he was play acting has never been hit on the head with an elbow. It ******* hurts. The exaggerated time scale regarding rolling around and rubbing his head is rubbish. I’ll watch it back later to time it but less time than it took to read that garbage.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by TsarBomba » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:23 am

duncandisorderly wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:33 am
This article could be written a dozen times a weekend about world class players from the big six, but instead it's about the one time a Burnley player does it.

I'm not one for all this media hate us spiel, but it's borderline transparent now.
Absolutely agree. My first thoughts were this article would never be written if it was a top 6 club or player involved.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Swizzlestick » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:27 am

Always likely to happen after Dyche decided to make cynical play his hobby horse. Made a rod for his own back. Hopefully he’ll quieten down about it now because incidents like the Westwood one make him look hypocritical and will only make articles like this more common.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Leisure » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:30 am

Erasmus wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:54 am
.

Personally, I felt sickened by what Westwood did and would rather have missed out on the victory than get a win through such dishonest, cheating means.
Sickened! 😢 It was definitely an intentional elbow and fully deserved a red. Hope you never get whacked on the back of the head, especially when you're not expecting it. We'd have won anyway! UTC
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by SalisburyClaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:31 am

Westwood - should have been booked
Buendia - correctly sent off
Drmic - correctly sent off
Journalist - should have a sharp elbow in the side of the head to check his opinion is correct
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Hipper » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:31 am

Paul Waine wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 8:11 am
Article in The Times:

Ashley Westwood should say sorry for stitching up Emiliano Buendía
Tommy Conlon
Sunday July 19 2020, 6.00pm, The Times

The theatre was Carrow Road, the stage was the pitch, the thespian was Ashley Westwood. It looked to me like a bravura performance of ham acting.

Watching the Burnley midfielder writhe in agony, medical staff may have been caught in two minds, not knowing whether to give him the last rites or a standing ovation.

He had tangled with Norwich City’s Emiliano Buendía in the 33rd minute on Saturday evening. The Argentinian was in possession; Westwood lunged in and the ball broke away; a few afters followed. The English midfielder kneed Buendía in the thigh and pinned him momentarily using his arm and leg, preventing Buendía from walking away. Buendía turned to extricate himself and in the same movement dropped his elbow on to the back of Westwood’s head. Replays showed he applied moderate contact. One would doubt it left a skin mark, much less a bruise. The whole incident was nothing.

It was Westwood’s reaction that escalated it. Had he done the decent thing and walked away, it would in all likelihood have petered out. Instead he enacted a pitiful display of victimhood. Westwood collapsed on the floor clutching his head. He got to his knees clutching his head with both hands. Then he lay flat on the ground clutching his head. He executed one roll, then a second, still clutching his head. He managed then to haul himself on to all fours. At this point there was some sign of an improvement in his condition, for now he was applying just one hand, albeit he was using it vigorously to massage the afflicted area. From there he made it on to his knees and finally into an upright position.

By this stage, play was suspended and VAR was investigating for possible violent conduct. After multiple viewings in the video room, Kevin Friend, the referee, was advised to have a look for himself on the pitch-side monitor. It appears the incident was not shown to him in full on the monitor. It had been edited down to the split-second where Buendía’s elbow made contact with Westwood’s head. Without any context to complicate his considerations, Friend quickly made up his mind: red card.

Letter of the law? Probably correct. Violent conduct? Not remotely. Had Friend been able to assess the whole sequence, he’d have seen at least some possibility for mitigation in that Buendía was trying to extricate himself from the tangle – and that Westwood had been looking to extract a reaction. One would have thought the Burnley player was entitled to a yellow card for his part in the proceedings.

Instead he is entitled to a black card in the court of public opinion. In my view, his was the classic stitch-up job of long and ignoble tradition. It requires two acting roles, the first as the provocateur who goads his opponent into retaliation, the second as the injured party when said retaliation arrives. But this was a particularly shameless performance. The feigning on the floor was not so much laughable as contemptible. Westwood is 30, a senior professional who ought to have some sense of duty to the wider game.

And he ought to have it for another reason too: his own manager has previously condemned this kind of behaviour. In fact, Sean Dyche was preaching about it only last August. “The game’s in a really poor state for people diving, feigning injury, all sorts,” he declared. A few weeks earlier he had attended a meeting of the Premier League where he was told that a yellow card was the only sanction available for such conduct. “And I said, ‘So that means basically that every player in the Premier League can cheat at least once a game?’ . . . It’s about the greater good of the game. The game’s in a really poor state for people just literally falling on the floor.”

Did Westwood’s behaviour on Saturday therefore trouble his conscience? Or did he just think, great, Norwich are down to ten men? It would be taking idealism into pie-in-the-sky territory to expect that Dyche might publicly distance himself from one of his players. Even a charge of hypocrisy against him would be unfair, given there is no evidence that he encourages his players to cheat in this fashion. If the buck ultimately stops with the manager, it doesn’t mean that a player should be spared the obligation of taking responsibility for his own actions. This one is on Westwood. He owes Buendía an apology.

Notwithstanding the fact that one of his players failed dismally to practise what he preached, Dyche did the game a service last August.

As he also pointed out at that press conference, very few other people in the industry are talking about the issue any more. This form of cheating has become normalised to the point that it is barely even noticed, much less discussed. It continues to poison the water.

Maybe it is because there has never been more at stake for clubs financially, that players feel under greater pressure than previous generations to salvage results, by fair means or foul. In a time of supercharged professionalism, perhaps the ancient ideal of sportsmanship is seen as a dying relic of amateurism. But the game in its entirety is played overwhelmingly by amateurs, including the millions of children and juveniles who are daily watching their heroes behave with dishonour. And of course the behaviour becomes learned and replicated.

It is an abiding plague on the game, this particular brand of cynicism, and there is seemingly no desire to find a cure.
Thanks Paul but there was a problem with your copying. I think I've corrected it here (starting in the middle of the fifth paragraph and including the sixth and seventh).
Last edited by Hipper on Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:50 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:34 am

BenWickes wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:12 am
Two ex-players in studio at the time, one ex-Norwich both agreed in real time and slowed down they were both reds. I'll believe them over some jumped up bitter journo.
That’s spot on and then Dion Dublin on Match of the Day referred to the clenched fist. Clear red card and the only player responsible for it is Buendía.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by frankinwales » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:42 am

Not happy about the quality of this reporting.. In my opinion this journalist is making a huge assumption that if the referee saw the whole of the available video of the incident then he would not have sent him off... There is no evidence to support his opinion but he writes it up as if that would definitely have been the case... Up The Clarets.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ian » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:53 am

Ironic at the same time as this article was published a player was being stretchered off from taking a whack to the head. The risk is clear.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by warksclaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:55 am

No one other than Westwood will ever know the severity and pain from the impact. I watch boxing and think "that was a nothing punch" and then you see the fighter on the floor not even being able to stand on his feet after the count of 10

Poor reporting and I sense having a go at SD for what he is regularly preaching about play acting over pain. Sadly every single PL game will see someone rolling round in pain. What no-one can deny is Buendia had his hand gripped and after elbowing with intent followed up with a rubbing movement into Westwood's head. What I witnessed was severe frustration by the Norwich team already doomed for relegation
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:58 am

frankinwales wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:42 am
Not happy about the quality of this reporting.. In my opinion this journalist is making a huge assumption that if the referee saw the whole of the available video of the incident then he would not have sent him off... There is no evidence to support his opinion but he writes it up as if that would definitely have been the case... Up The Clarets.
Kevin Friend clearly saw the incident and initially appeared to play an advantage before pulling it back for a free kick to us. What he hadn't seen was the elbow into the neck. He will have spoken at length to Lee Mason who was on VAR. Mason will have told him that he believed there had been a red card offence and suggested he go and look for himself. Friend, quite rightly, didn't need to look for two long. It's an obvious red card.

I still don't think Ashley Westwood has done anything wrong here whatsoever.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Hipper » Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:58 am

I agree that both cards were red but also agree with the sentiment of The Times piece.

Westwood played a big part in the incident exactly as described. Pieters too over reacted like a typical Premier League player. Wood tripped over his own feet and claimed a penalty and Brady decided to dive in the penalty area but completely misjudged Krul's approach which made Brady look a prat. If he had concentrated instead on controlling the ball and trying to do something positive we might have benefited.

Despite all Dyche's comments on the subject of cheating we are actually no better then any other club.

I'm wondering if he's changed his views on the matter and become like all the rest.

As the article says, 'it is an abiding plague on the game, this particular brand of cynicism, and there is seemingly no desire to find a cure'.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by IanMcL » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:00 am

warksclaret wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:55 am
No one other than Westwood will ever know the severity and pain from the impact. I watch boxing and think "that was a nothing punch" and then you see the fighter on the floor not even being able to stand on his feet after the count of 10

Poor reporting and I sense having a go at SD for what he is regularly preaching about play acting over pain. Sadly every single PL game will see someone rolling round in pain. What no-one can deny is Buendia had his hand gripped and after elbowing with intent followed up with a rubbing movement into Westwood's head. What I witnessed was severe frustration by the Norwich team already doomed for relegation
This is the definitive post.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by randomclaret2 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:00 am

The irony of a journalist on a national newspaper writing about dishonesty
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretLoup » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:01 am

Quite possibly Kevin didn’t want to send Buendia off and the VAR ref was in two minds but if you stick an elbow into someone’s head then he has to else risk being marked down by the assessor. It’s a pity we didn’t have Friend at Palace as he most certainly would have sent Ayew off for a far more violent action.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:02 am

Hipper wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:58 am
I agree that both cards were red but also agree with the sentiment of The Times piece.

Westwood played a big part in the incident exactly as described. Pieters too over reacted like a typical Premier League player. Wood tripped over his own feet and claimed a penalty and Brady decided to dive in the penalty area but completely misjudged Krul's approach which made Brady look a prat. If he had concentrated instead on controlling the ball and trying to do something positive we might have benefited.

Despite all Dyche's comments on the subject of cheating we are actually no better then any other club.

I'm wondering if he's changed his views on the matter and become like all the rest.

As the article says, 'it is an abiding plague on the game, this particular brand of cynicism, and there is seemingly no desire to find a cure'.
I think much of that is even worse than the garbage from Conlon, who is from the Irish Times. I do not think Westwood played a big part, no way do I think Pieters over reacted and to suggest we are no better than any other club when we see so much that's wrong week after week id beyond belief to me.

I know it is easy to support your own club, but I don't think we've done anything wrong at all here. I don't think Westwood or Pieters have overreacted.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:03 am

ClaretLoup wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:01 am
Quite possibly Kevin didn’t want to send Buendia off and the VAR ref was in two minds but if you stick an elbow into someone’s head then he has to else risk being marked down by the assessor. It’s a pity we didn’t have Friend at Palace as he most certainly would have sent Ayew off for a far more violent action.
VAR was not in two minds. He would only ask the on field referee to take a look on the screen if he is of the opinion that he's missed a clear red card.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Swizzlestick » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:03 am

There’s a clear delay between impact and Westwood’s reaction. If the roles were reversed we (and Dyche) would be spitting feathers. He needs to dial back the moral crusade - everyone does it and we are one of them.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by mdd2 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:03 am

You can tell Westy makes a meal of it just as Martial took a dive after being tripped and even Pieters rolling in agony after little contact. it is a horrible part of the game that is getting worse and needs stamping out literally.
The fragility of players increases as a team approaches the opposition penalty area. I wager if Martial had been clear on an empty goal with that tackle yesterday he would have stayed on his feet and scored. Badly injured players tend not to move after hitting the deck.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Clarets4me » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:05 am

The Norwich player attempted to elbow the Burnley player on the back of the neck, his arm strengthened and his intent there, for all to see, by having his fist clenched. He made contact, with a passing blow .... Westwood felt the blow, dropped to the ground and covered up, not knowing what further assaults may be coming next.

Is the author seriously suggesting that Buendia should have escaped with a yellow card, because the execution of his " violent conduct " was so poor ? :lol: :lol:

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by FactualFrank » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:08 am

Whether Westwood made a meal of it, shouldn't really matter.
Buendia had the intent, clenched and swung at him. You can go to headbutt an opposing player, but because the player on the receiving end moved back, it didn't catch him as hard as it could have - this is irrelevant though - it's still an attempted headbutt and still a sending off.

And look at Buendia's reaction when the referee says he's going to go and watch it on the screen - you can tell by the look on his face he knows what's coming.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by JTClaret » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:09 am

It was a soft red card. But a red card.'
Westwood made the most of it, but we've learnt, if you don't they get away with it - But it certainly wasn't as embarrassing as a lot we see and at least he was holding and rubbing the right place. He doesn't need to apologise at all, maybe a chat after 'sorry mate, it did hurt, but you know how it is'.
Looks like he's the type of reporter who likes to stir it up.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:12 am

mdd2 wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:03 am
You can tell Westy makes a meal of it just as Martial took a dive after being tripped and even Pieters rolling in agony after little contact. it is a horrible part of the game that is getting worse and needs stamping out literally.
The fragility of players increases as a team approaches the opposition penalty area. I wager if Martial had been clear on an empty goal with that tackle yesterday he would have stayed on his feet and scored. Badly injured players tend not to move after hitting the deck.
You might be able to tell he made a meal of it, I can't and don't. As for Pieters, maybe you should look at it again. You see the pained expression on his face at the point of impact which suggests the contact cannot be described as little, He lands and then rolls from his back onto his side to get into a comfortable position. He is very definitely not rolling in agony as you have suggested.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Funkydrummer » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:17 am

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but that report is just wrong. ;)
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Polesworth » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:18 am

What a bitter Norwich knob that journo is, writing an absolutely disgraceful article. It was a totally deliberate elbow by Buendia. The only thing I agree with him in the article is that 'simulated' behaviour is a plague of the modern game but there are more laughable incidents than this. The 'there was contact' brigade need to call out the divers and fakers. The journo should be calling out the players who head up the free kicks won table like Jack Grealish who throw themselves to ground at the slightest contact.I think it is a very different case when a player gets an elbow to the back of the head.
I've watched quite a few neutral footy games since the resumption and some of the simulation makes me laugh out loud. I can't understand why refs don't see it too. I know the ex-pro's see it in the studio and when they're co-comentating but they too trot out the old 'I think there was contact'. Why don't they too laugh along at the pratfalls.
The bitter journo should take a look a Buendia's Argentinian compatriot Simione getting Beckham sent of in the 1998 World Cup. Should that have been a red card?
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by mdd2 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:24 am

ClaretTony wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:12 am
You might be able to tell he made a meal of it, I can't and don't. As for Pieters, maybe you should look at it again. You see the pained expression on his face at the point of impact which suggests the contact cannot be described as little, He lands and then rolls from his back onto his side to get into a comfortable position. He is very definitely not rolling in agony as you have suggested.
He is amongst a host of players who hit the deck as if poleaxed when in reality they then get up and trot off. Been happening in all the years I have watched the game and is worse now than it ever was. A pity we do not have what we used to call that magic sponge in the NHS as there would be far more folk walking out of A&E than currently happens. :D :D

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by Quickenthetempo » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:29 am

It could be a world record number of words to describe one little incident?

That lad just does waffle on.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by KRBFC » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:35 am

People on here are very quick to cry about this kinda stuff when it’s not a Burnley player doing it.

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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by ClaretTony » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:36 am

KRBFC wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:35 am
People on here are very quick to cry about this kinda stuff when it’s not a Burnley player doing it.
And no Burnley player was doing it - I think that's the point.
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Re: Ashley Westwood - The Times

Post by KRBFC » Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:48 am

ClaretTony wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 10:36 am
And no Burnley player was doing it - I think that's the point.
I don’t mind our players rolling around like they’ve been shot, it’s part of the game unfortunately.

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