BFC TRANSFER NEWS SUMMER/AUTUMN 2020 (MUST CONTAIN LINK)

[Paul Waine]

Has anyone got Mike Garlick's statement from back in April? Didn't he speak of covid-19 costing the club £50 million - and wasn't that just if we couldn't complete 2019/20 season? I don't think MG said anything about any further losses if fans weren't able to attend in 2020/21 - and why would he in April, no one thought covid-19 would go on so long. Wasn't it just 12 weeks for the safeguarding group and an initial 3 weeks for the lockdown?

A lot of things have happened since April. Whatever else has gone on, the cost of covid-19 to Burnley FC has only got bigger.

MG and the Board have only got two choices at the moment:
1) the Directors/shareholders fund transfer activities this window, i.e. lend money to the club;
2) new investors are brought in - which sees to be what may be happening with ALK Capital.

Directors may fund the club with loans either to aim to keep the club in the Premier League and with the expectation that they will be repaid if/when a new investor buys their shares and repays their loans.

Exciting times.

UTC

[Wokingclaret]

Exciting times.

Or not

[Spijed]

Seems a bit laughable to think some want four or five signings.

Sounds as though getting any good additions might be tough.

[Chester Perry]

Has anyone got Mike Garlick's statement from back in April? Didn't he speak of covid-19 costing the club £50 million - and wasn't that just if we couldn't complete 2019/20 season? I don't think MG said anything about any further losses if fans weren't able to attend in 2020/21 - and why would he in April, no one thought covid-19 would go on so long. Wasn't it just 12 weeks for the safeguarding group and an initial 3 weeks for the lockdown?

A lot of things have happened since April. Whatever else has gone on, the cost of covid-19 to Burnley FC has only got bigger.

MG and the Board have only got two choices at the moment:
1) the Directors/shareholders fund transfer activities this window, i.e. lend money to the club;
2) new investors are brought in - which sees to be what may be happening with ALK Capital.

Directors may fund the club with loans either to aim to keep the club in the Premier League and with the expectation that they will be repaid if/when a new investor buys their shares and repays their loans.

Exciting times.

UTC

Here you go Paul viewtopic.php?f=2&t=46481

EDIT - it is interesting to read that thread again with all that we now know

[RVclaret]

Can someone explain where the £50m loss of income comes from exactly? Aside from fans not in the stadium (this equates to nowhere near £50m I believe?).

[Chester Perry]

Can someone explain where the £50m loss of income comes from exactly? Aside from fans not in the stadium (this equates to nowhere near £50m I believe?).

That has been done a number of times in the last 5 months and the £50m was very explicitly if the season did not restart and there was no sign of the next season starting.

At a basic level the season not restarting would have led to a TV rebate of £760m+ - that's £38m for each team then add the lost commercial revenue *the clubs own and Premier Leagues in general, season ticket refunds, no season ticket income for the following season etc - it all happens very quickly

[RVclaret]

Thanks Chester. So basically now that football did restart and seems to be continuing on its fair to say that our main loss of income comes from commercial which is approx £12m per year. It’s interesting though as I did read a thread by Swiss Ramble on Twitter which explained how our higher finish in the league last season would have made up for the losses of covid.

Therefore this whole ‘we have no money at all’ theory doesn’t really make sense.

[Chester Perry]

Thanks Chester. So basically now that football did restart and seems to be continuing on its fair to say that our main loss of income comes from commercial which is approx £12m per year. It’s interesting though as I did read a thread by Swiss Ramble on Twitter which explained how our higher finish in the league last season would have made up for the losses of covid.

Therefore this whole ‘we have no money at all’ theory doesn’t really make sense.

try this viewtopic.php?f=2&t=49975&start=693

[claretandy]

Yes there will be losses, but not £50M, football finished and has restarted, plus we finished tenth, maybe a small loss? (which isn't a bad thing, can be offset against future profit)

[FactualFrank]

So the Wilson transfer was dependant on Tarkowski being sold?

Not if the rumours are true and we're trying to wrap a deal up this week, no.

Seems we are still interested.

[martin_p]

Yes there will be losses, but not £50M, football finished and has restarted, plus we finished tenth, maybe a small loss? (which isn't a bad thing, can be offset against future profit)

But there’s a potential ‘fine’ from the broadcasters because the season didn’t finish on time. There was a lot about it in the news back in the summer but that seems to have gone quiet now so I’m not sure where it’s up to. I remember a figure of £300m being mentioned which would cost each club £15m presumably.

[jojomk1]

There were stories on here about a possible loan of Ryan Sessegnon from Spurs
Would rather see that happen than getting Wilson
Gets us over a short term problem and saves money that we could spend on WR and/or CB

[FactualFrank]

According to the Mirror, we're still keen on signing Wilson before the deadline.

But with SD mentioning the Championship and the 15th October deadline, I do wonder whether the Wilson transfer has now been put to bed.

[colne-claret]

There were stories on here about a possible loan of Ryan Sessegnon from Spurs
Would rather see that happen than getting Wilson
Gets us over a short term problem and saves money that we could spend on WR and/or CB

I'd personally rather get Wilson. Wilson tends to play more on the right. I believe that Sessegnon is very much a direct left winger if I'm right in thinking like Dwight?

[FactualFrank]

I'd personally rather get Wilson. Wilson tends to play more on the right. I believe that Sessegnon is very much a direct left winger if I'm right in thinking like Dwight?

I really can't see us getting Sessegnon anyway. Clubs like Leeds have been sniffing about and think there would be at least 1 other Prem club wanting him, which counts us out.

[AndyClaret]

But there’s a potential ‘fine’ from the broadcasters because the season didn’t finish on time. There was a lot about it in the news back in the summer but that seems to have gone quiet now so I’m not sure where it’s up to. I remember a figure of £300m being mentioned which would cost each club £15m presumably.

That has been deferred until this season.

[martin_p]

That has been deferred until this season.

Ah ok, hadn’t picked that up. I guess it still has a knock on effect though as we know our income this season will be down.

[Long Time Lurker]

Linked with a loan move for Reiss Nelson

I mentioned this as a possibility on another thread. Here is a snippet from that post.

Matt Doherty and Wolves / Arsenal / Spurs

Reiss Nielson and Burnley / Arsenal

Okay, all well and good, but despite replying to a previous comment what does this have to do with important things, like possible Burnley transfers ?

Riggy was very enthusiastic about Reiss Nielson when he first arrived, but he was completely wrong about him not playing well at the time - he was carrying an injury and he was playing superbly before that, drawing numerous plaudits.

https://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/s ... explained/

Neilson would certainly tick the box for a rapid flair winger, even though I personally think we need a winger with a bit more defensive bite, given the way that we currently play and how well it works for us. However, factoring in my own belief that Riggy operates with a stubborn linear thought process, and he seems to be harbouring a desire to change our framework to one where we attack on both wings, I wouldn't rule out some probing interest from us.

How is that for a bit of outlandish speculation, Neilson to Burnley ( more likely on loan ) ?

I would prefer Neilson on loan than spending a big bag of cash on Wilson, but now his availability is out in the open I expect that he will go elsewhere. Hopefully, the possibility of signing him on loan won't distract us from looking at other options. With scant few days left in the window we can't be narrow minded in respect to pursuing options.

[Long Time Lurker]

I want to know who "Long Time Lurker" is.

We go from kids, presumably, who want to know why don't we sign Messi and Ronaldo to LTL's detailed analysis of 20 players I have never heard of.
What do you actually do for a living? Are you Mike Rigg in disguise? (If that is the name of our Chief Scout.)

Okay, you got me, I can't keep up the hoax any longer, I confess, I'm Riggy ( queue Spartacus posts ).

Expressing an opinion about my poor performance as a Technical Director at all of my previous clubs, and now Burnley, was an elaborate ruse to hide who I really am

I should have known my Romulan stealth posts wouldn't fool Captain Kirk, but I had a lot of others believing.

Note: I try to avoid sharing any personal information on the inter webby, but I can say that I don't work in a football related field. I simply have an interest in football, an active mind, and a long standing love affair with Burnley FC, even though she has broke my heart once or twice.

However, the good times outweigh the bad, so we go on together - for better or worse, till death do us part.

[Mala591]

Long Time Lurker

Who do you consider are the most creative/technically strong/visionary young CENTRAL MIDFIELD players in the Championship division?

[KRBFC]

There were stories on here about a possible loan of Ryan Sessegnon from Spurs
Would rather see that happen than getting Wilson
Gets us over a short term problem and saves money that we could spend on WR and/or CB

Wilson is a right midfielder?

[MACCA]

Here you go Paul viewtopic.php?f=2&t=46481

EDIT - it is interesting to read that thread again with all that we now know

2 things I noticed from that thread

1. Claret on a t rex name was in grey like he's banned or deactivated his account
2. The same people get so much wrong over and over again but never learn. I've noticed it looking back on a few posts from over the year(s)

[Bigvince]

But there’s a potential ‘fine’ from the broadcasters because the season didn’t finish on time. There was a lot about it in the news back in the summer but that seems to have gone quiet now so I’m not sure where it’s up to. I remember a figure of £300m being mentioned which would cost each club £15m presumably.

It shouldn’t be a simple sum off £300m divided by 20, surely the bigger clubs who have taken a larger portion of the TV money, should pay a larger portion of the so called fine. They can’t have it both ways

[claretandy]

It shouldn’t be a simple sum off £300m divided by 20, surely the bigger clubs who have taken a larger portion of the TV money, should pay a larger portion of the so called fine. They can’t have it both ways

That's the way it has been divided up, based on league finish.

[boatshed bill]

There were stories on here about a possible loan of Ryan Sessegnon from Spurs
Would rather see that happen than getting Wilson
Gets us over a short term problem and saves money that we could spend on WR and/or CB

Would certainly fill one spot on the bench

[Bigvince]

That's the way it has been divided up, based on league finish.

Surely that isn’t fair either! Teams that feature more times on live tv get a bigger slice of the cake, imagine after this season when Leeds United have had 38 live games and finished 17th. They could end up with more TV money than somebody that finishes 10th and haven’t had as many live games.

[claretandy]

Surely that isn’t fair either! Teams that feature more times on live tv get a bigger slice of the cake, imagine after this season when Leeds United have had 38 live games and finished 17th. They could end up with more TV money than somebody that finishes 10th and haven’t had as many live games.

Life isn't fair ! when finishing 7th and 10th, we have both times received less in tv money than sides finishing below us who have had more live games.

[huw.Y.WattfromWare]

There were stories on here about a possible loan of Ryan Sessegnon from Spurs
Would rather see that happen than getting Wilson
Gets us over a short term problem and saves money that we could spend on WR and/or CB

Sessegnon is a left side line hugger. We are covered with Taylor and Dwight. A no-go for me.

[Long Time Lurker]

Long Time Lurker

Who do you consider are the most creative/technically strong/visionary young CENTRAL MIDFIELD players in the Championship division?

That isn't an easy question to answer at the start of a season. A lot of the prime talent was in the promoted teams, like Periera at QPR ( yes, I know he is a winger ). Adding to that a lot of the better players in the Championship are on loan from the big six clubs, which rules them out for us.

Taking those two factors into account there aren't many creative young players in the Championship who haven't already been snapped up by other clubs, especially in Central Midfield. Most of the creative talent on display in the Championship is found on the wings.

In terms of wingers, the obvious player is Said Benrahma, who could easily step up and play for a PL club. Michael Olise ( Reading ) is a young player who is showing some signs of quality at a young age and Josh Da Silva ( Brentford ) is developing well. In terms of his quality on the ball and creative output on both wings I do rate Niclas Eliasson, two footed players always catch my eye.

If I had to highlight a young Central Midfielder who is currently in the Championship ( with all of the qualities you listed ) then I probably couldn't. The closest I could get is Max Bird ( Derby ) who is a Defensive Midfielder. It will be interesting to see how Gustavo Hamer adapts to the English game.

The reason that I rate Ben Whiteman is that he has been consistently good for a number of seasons now. He is a defensive midfielder, but he also creates and scores his fair share of goals. He is a very well rounded player and standing out in a team of lesser quality is a lot harder than doing it in a team that could be considered one of the strongest in a league ( like Brannagan at Oxford last season ). The strength of Oxford, before they lost important players in the Winter window, and their focus on attacking play, helped him to boost his statistics for goals and assists. Whiteman equalled his output on that front and exceeded it in terms of his defensive output.

I also liked the look of Matt O'Riley who left Fulham when his contract ended and is available on a free transfer. I suspect regular playing time is high on his want list though, which would make him more likely to sign for a League One team or maybe a lesser Championship club instead of joining our development squads.

The absence of any stand out candidates in the domestic league is why we should have been looking far and wide for players. And by that I don't mean the established youngsters who would command large fees and be unlikely to move.

I would also question why we should be looking out for a creative central midfielder when we don't currently have space in the squad to give them regular game time. Adding Stephens into the squad has taken our compliment of central midfielders to four ( when Cork returns ). Add in the deserved new contract for Westy and we don't really have space for another central midfielder. At least not one that would demand game time and a sizeable transfer fee / wages.

Hence my previous suggestion of Whiteman to fill in as fourth choice until Cork returns. He could get experience of playing at a higher level on the training ground with our squad and then a loan to a Championship squad in the next window would be ideal for his development.

[BenWickes]

Liverpool Echo. https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/f ... c-19022034

Not suggesting we go for Shaqiri but we'll need to up our bid a bit for Wilson according to this.

'Wilson has looked very lively in training and his future may be dependent on whether a certain Xherdan Shaqiri leaves the club.

Liverpool are open to offers for the Swiss international and should he depart, Wilson will stay at Liverpool no matter what offer the club receive for him.'

[TVC15]

Liverpool Echo. https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/f ... c-19022034

Not suggesting we go for Shaqiri but we'll need to up our bid a bit for Wilson according to this.

'Wilson has looked very lively in training and his future may be dependent on whether a certain Xherdan Shaqiri leaves the club.

Liverpool are open to offers for the Swiss international and should he depart, Wilson will stay at Liverpool no matter what offer the club receive for him.'

Think that’s a load of rubbish - Liverpool must have double figure number of forwards now. And Wilson is a long way down the pecking order - they didn’t even bring him off the bench for a few minutes when thrashing Barnsley in the cup in a team already full of reserve players.
If a decent offer came in from him (£15m) they would sell him in a heartbeat - and that’s irrespective of whether they sell Shaqiri and Brewster. Their recent history would suggest they are keen to try and recoup a good chunk of the £45m they have just paid for Jota.

[Woodleyclaret]

This Wilson saga is getting tiresome why havent we sorted it?bid in for £15m according to the Echo

[FactualFrank]

This Wilson saga is getting tiresome why havent we sorted it?bid in for £15m according to the Echo

It was a reported £16 million yesterday. Like I say with SD talking of the Championship and the extended deadline to buy from the Championship, that suggests it's where we'll go, after the current window is closed.

[Jakubclaret]

Think that’s a load of rubbish - Liverpool must have double figure number of forwards now. And Wilson is a long way down the pecking order - they didn’t even bring him off the bench for a few minutes when thrashing Barnsley in the cup in a team already full of reserve players.
If a decent offer came in from him (£15m) they would sell him in a heartbeat - and that’s irrespective of whether they sell Shaqiri and Brewster. Their recent history would suggest they are keen to try and recoup a good chunk of the £45m they have just paid for Jota.

It's not that simple, the players agent will be receiving a percentage of what he earns or a annual fee, the player also needs to agree & it helps when advised to if there's no incentive or not enough of 1 the deal will stall. Liverpool might want to offload lot's of reserve surplus playing staff but if there are under contract & the moves aren't attractive or appetising compared to there existing contracts nobody will be going anywhere.

[TVC15]

It's not that simple, the players agent will be receiving a percentage of what he earns or a annual fee, the player also needs to agree & it helps when advised to if there's no incentive or not enough of 1 the deal will stall. Liverpool might want to offload lot's of reserve surplus playing staff but if there are under contract & the moves aren't attractive or appetising compared to there existing contracts nobody will be going anywhere.

I was referring to Liverpool’s willingness to let him go and the number of attacking players they have who are evidently a long way ahead of him in terms of selection. He’s nowhere near their bench in the Premier League.

They are doing what United became very good at - getting top money for their reserve players. Wilson might decide he wants to stay but he won’t get anywhere near the first team...and I doubt very much he’ll financially be getting anywhere near what he could with a big money move by staying at Liverpool.

[FactualFrank]

Latest on Wilson...

wilson.png (65.36 KiB) Viewed 3279 times

[FactualFrank]

And from Alan Nixon just come in...

nixon.png (50.59 KiB) Viewed 3251 times

[Jakubclaret]

I was referring to Liverpool’s willingness to let him go and the number of attacking players they have who are evidently a long way ahead of him in terms of selection. He’s nowhere near their bench in the Premier League.

They are doing what United became very good at - getting top money for their reserve players. Wilson might decide he wants to stay but he won’t get anywhere near the first team...and I doubt very much he’ll financially be getting anywhere near what he could with a big money move by staying at Liverpool.

Yes but that only amounts to half of what is needed, I agree & believe Liverpool do want to offload wilson & brewster ect as they are heavy in numbers, wilson might have children settled in school in merseyside or the Wirral or somewhere else closeby & any potential move might not be advantageous towards his agent, you are looking at things too simplistically without even thinking about wilsons life outside of football.

[Mala591]

If he signed, Wilson would compete with JBG as a right sided attacking midfield player. Owing to JBG's (genuinely unfortunate) fragility he has every chamce of REGULAR PL football.

What could be a greater incentive to sign?

[TVC15]

you are looking at things too simplistically without even thinking about wilsons life outside of football.

Ok....you’ve gone all weirdo again early doors.
I’ve commented purely that he is surplus to requirements at Liverpool - I don’t have a clue and it’s completely irrelevant to my point whether there is a little Chantelle or Mercedes Wilson just started at Kirby Kindergarten.

I’ll leave you to it.

[FactualFrank]

If he signed, Wilson would compete with JBG as a right sided attacking midfield player. Owing to JBG's (genuinely unfortunate) fragility he has every chamce of REGULAR PL football.

What could be a greater incentive to sign?

I thought this was dead in the water and perhaps due to JT staying, that was the end of it. But apparently not.

JBG & Wilson challenging for the RM slot, would be very healthy indeed.

[BOYSIE31]

And from Alan Nixon just come in...


nixon.png

Sounds about right for us

[Vegas Claret]

That isn't an easy question to answer at the start of a season. A lot of the prime talent was in the promoted teams, like Periera at QPR ( yes, I know he is a winger ). Adding to that a lot of the better players in the Championship are on loan from the big six clubs, which rules them out for us.

Taking those two factors into account there aren't many creative young players in the Championship who haven't already been snapped up by other clubs, especially in Central Midfield. Most of the creative talent on display in the Championship is found on the wings.

In terms of wingers, the obvious player is Said Benrahma, who could easily step up and play for a PL club. Michael Olise ( Reading ) is a young player who is showing some signs of quality at a young age and Josh Da Silva ( Brentford ) is developing well. In terms of his quality on the ball and creative output on both wings I do rate Niclas Eliasson, two footed players always catch my eye.

If I had to highlight a young Central Midfielder who is currently in the Championship ( with all of the qualities you listed ) then I probably couldn't. The closest I could get is Max Bird ( Derby ) who is a Defensive Midfielder. It will be interesting to see how Gustavo Hamer adapts to the English game.

The reason that I rate Ben Whiteman is that he has been consistently good for a number of seasons now. He is a defensive midfielder, but he also creates and scores his fair share of goals. He is a very well rounded player and standing out in a team of lesser quality is a lot harder than doing it in a team that could be considered one of the strongest in a league ( like Brannagan at Oxford last season ). The strength of Oxford, before they lost important players in the Winter window, and their focus on attacking play, helped him to boost his statistics for goals and assists. Whiteman equalled his output on that front and exceeded it in terms of his defensive output.

I also liked the look of Matt O'Riley who left Fulham when his contract ended and is available on a free transfer. I suspect regular playing time is high on his want list though, which would make him more likely to sign for a League One team or maybe a lesser Championship club instead of joining our development squads.

The absence of any stand out candidates in the domestic league is why we should have been looking far and wide for players. And by that I don't mean the established youngsters who would command large fees and be unlikely to move.

I would also question why we should be looking out for a creative central midfielder when we don't currently have space in the squad to give them regular game time. Adding Stephens into the squad has taken our compliment of central midfielders to four ( when Cork returns ). Add in the deserved new contract for Westy and we don't really have space for another central midfielder. At least not one that would demand game time and a sizeable transfer fee / wages.

Hence my previous suggestion of Whiteman to fill in as fourth choice until Cork returns. He could get experience of playing at a higher level on the training ground with our squad and then a loan to a Championship squad in the next window would be ideal for his development.

Cantwell at Norwich would be my pick

[MACCA]

I thought this was dead in the water and perhaps due to JT staying, that was the end of it. But apparently not.

JBG & Wilson challenging for the RM slot, would be very healthy indeed.

So if JBG does his standard dozen games, we just got to hope Wilson is capable of the other couple of dozen.
Assuming we manage to haggle liverpool down enough to our sort of fee, and no other club joins the race, as that would spell disaster.

[FactualFrank]

Cantwell at Norwich would be my pick

Off to Leeds apparently... taking their spend to just £80 million.

[Vegas Claret]

Off to Leeds apparently... taking their spend to just £80 million.

yeah just reading that - 15 million, did well last season in a poor team. Shame we don't have any money

[MACCA]

Not as good as Brookes or Maddison was IMO, so not too bothered about not being linked with him tbh.

[FactualFrank]

yeah just reading that - 15 million, did well last season in a poor team. Shame we don't have any money

Location basically. Stick us in a city of 750,000 and be the only team, with a direct link to London and we'd be in the same position finance wise.

[ClaretMov]

FactualFrank post

"And from Alan Nixon just come in"

It's all smoke and mirrors from the Burnley board.....even if Liverpool called our bluff and dropped the price to 4 million Burnley would offer 800k

All those squad player's gone over the summer and we spend 1 million on a 31 year old Brighton or anybody else wanted.......PATHETIC EFFORT by this board.

What's taking so long the price is set by Liverpool, Wilson won't be on massive wages so no problem there...what's the ******* hold up, other clubs seem to get deals done over a few day's, we are probably stalling so another club comes in and signs him so they can turn round and say we can't compete with other clubs bidding

[Granny WeatherWax]

FactualFrank post

"And from Alan Nixon just come in"

It's all smoke and mirrors from the Burnley board.....even if Liverpool called our bluff and dropped the price to 4 million Burnley would offer 800k

All those squad player's gone over the summer and we spend 1 million on a 31 year old Brighton or anybody else wanted.......PATHETIC EFFORT by this board.

What's taking so long the price is set by Liverpool, Wilson won't be on massive wages so no problem there...what's the ******* hold up, other clubs seem to get deals done over a few day's, we are probably stalling so another club comes in and signs him so they can turn round and say we can't compete with other clubs bidding

A bit different to what you were saying last week when you said he would sign on 25.9.20.