A Levels, Covid, Brexit. Worst Government Ever?

[RingoMcCartney]

And a date that will be remembered with regret by many.

The UK left the EU at 11 p.m. GMT on 31 January 2020.


A date that will be celebrated with pride and joy by many more.

[Spijed]

The UK left the EU at 11 p.m. GMT on 31 January 2020.


A date that will be celebrated with pride and joy by many more.

If people losing jobs will be celebrated with pride and joy then I think you are in for a nasty shock.

[RingoMcCartney]

If people losing jobs will be celebrated with pride and joy then I think you are in for a nasty shock.

Heard it all before. Stock market crash, emergency budget the morning after, Siemens to leave the uk, Brexidus of the brightest and best, Nissan to leave the uk , shortage of water! , record levels of unemployment, 3rd world war, "confidence in the uk economy will evaporate over night should we vote to leave". City of london will up sticks to Germany, blah blah blah.

Let it go.

You lost , get over it.

[JohnMcGreal]

So if its all mine (brexiteers) then why is it still dominating your life on here?
Your lot tell us that we won and to get over it, but here you are everyday whinging.

This might come as a shock to you, but some people still care about this country and its reputation, and are rightly angry at the way it's been reduced to an international disgrace by a gang of fanatical crooks.

You might be quite relaxed about that, which is your prerogative, but don't assume other people share your pitifully low standards.

[tiger76]

This might come as a shock to you, but some people still care about this country and its reputation, and are rightly angry at the way it's been reduced to an international disgrace by a gang of fanatical crooks.

You might be quite relaxed about that, which is your prerogative, but don't assume other people share your pitifully low standards.

It's staggering what this pitiful excuse for a government can get away with as long as they mention brexit, yes the public voted to leave the EU, by a narrow majority, but I don't know anybody that advocated trashing our international standing, and bulldozing a no deal through, and that's without even mentioning the blatant disregard they have for international law.

Is it any wonder many people in Congress are expressing concern over a UK-US trade deal, when the UK blithely keep reneging on their legal commitments. And how this affects the GFA, we'll have to wait and see.

The HOL is pretty scathing in their criticism, including many Tory peers https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54105455

[AndrewJB]

So if its all mine (brexiteers) then why is it still dominating your life on here?
Your lot tell us that we won and to get over it, but here you are everyday whinging.

I was responding to Crosspool.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

This might come as a shock to you, but some people still care about this country and its reputation, and are rightly angry at the way it's been reduced to an international disgrace by a gang of fanatical crooks.

You might be quite relaxed about that, which is your prerogative, but don't assume other people share your pitifully low standards.

Get over yourself.

We all care, we all want to see the country improve and we've all noticed how over the decades not much has improved in certain areas etc.
We all know in some ways we are hindered by being in the EU, other ways it's an advantage.

Difference is some of you can't seemingly get on without the comfort blanket that's the EU, others of us are ready to move on.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

It's staggering what this pitiful excuse for a government can get away with as long as they mention brexit, yes the public voted to leave the EU, by a narrow majority, but I don't know anybody that advocated trashing our international standing, and bulldozing a no deal through, and that's without even mentioning the blatant disregard they have for international law.

Is it any wonder many people in Congress are expressing concern over a UK-US trade deal, when the UK blithely keep reneging on their legal commitments. And how this affects the GFA, we'll have to wait and see.

The HOL is pretty scathing in their criticism, including many Tory peers https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-54105455

Pretty sure a judge in Belfast has already ruled on things to do with Brexit and the GFA.

Screenshot_20200908_193710_com.twitter.android.jpg (367.21 KiB) Viewed 3577 times

[Inchy]

Get over yourself.

We all care, we all want to see the country improve and we've all noticed how over the decades not much has improved in certain areas etc.
We all know in some ways we are hindered by being in the EU, other ways it's an advantage.

Difference is some of you can't seemingly get on without the comfort blanket that's the EU, others of us are ready to move on.

I couldn’t give a crap if we are in the EU or not but I am interested when people speak so confidently on the matter


Specifically, what are you wanting to move on to?

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I couldn’t give a crap if we are in the EU or not but I am interested when people speak so confidently on the matter


Specifically, what are you wanting to move on to?

Move on to being out of the EU, I'm fairly sure you knew what I meant.

[Inchy]

Move on to being out of the EU, I'm fairly sure you knew what I meant.

Just wondering how being out of the EU will impact you.


Personally, I doubt it will impact me at all, hence why I’m not that arsed either way

[martin_p]

Move on to being out of the EU, I'm fairly sure you knew what I meant.

That’s meaningless. As Wrongo is fond of telling us we left the EU in January so we’ve all moved on in a very real sense.

What we’re now talking about is reneging of our legal obligations agreed less than a year ago and moving into the worst possible relationship with our biggest trading partners.

[Tall Paul]

Move on to being out of the EU, I'm fairly sure you knew what I meant.

I thought we were out of the EU already.

[Damo]

That’s meaningless. As Wrongo is fond of telling us we left the EU in January so we’ve all moved on in a very real sense.

What we’re now talking about is reneging of our legal obligations agreed less than a year ago and moving into the worst possible relationship with our biggest trading partners.

We are not reneging on a legal obligation.
Parliament is sovereign. Gina Millar and the remainers who funded her legal battle proved this not very long ago.
Thanks again guys

IMG_20200910_173550.jpg (91.88 KiB) Viewed 3526 times

[Spijed]

We are not reneging on a legal obligation.
Parliament is sovereign. Gina Millar and the remainers who funded her legal battle proved this not very long ago.
Thanks again guys
IMG_20200910_173550.jpg

Curious as to why yesterday, the Government admitted to breaking the law if they aren't.

Why is that Damo?

Btw, Professor Mark Elliott, Professor of Public Law at Cambridge University, has described the UK Government’s statement – presumably drafted by the AG – defending its legal position on the Internal Markets Bill as “utterly risible”

https://twitter.com/ProfMarkElliott/sta ... 3827309569

[Damo]

Curious as to why yesterday, the Government admitted to breaking the law if they aren't.

Why is that Damo?

Btw, Professor Mark Elliott, Professor of Public Law at Cambridge University, has described the UK Government’s statement – presumably drafted by the AG – defending its legal position on the Internal Markets Bill as “utterly risible”

https://twitter.com/ProfMarkElliott/sta ... 3827309569

Perhaps, like you, they didn't know the law

[Spijed]

Perhaps, like you, they didn't know the law

Really?

They know full well they are breaking the law, but just trying to make out they aren't, as many people have pointed out, like that professor.

[Devils_Advocate]

More likely is that Suella Braverman doesn't know the law or if she does she's just lying about it

[martin_p]

We are not reneging on a legal obligation.
Parliament is sovereign. Gina Millar and the remainers who funded her legal battle proved this not very long ago.
Thanks again guys
IMG_20200910_173550.jpg

If this is true isn’t one of the pillars of leaving the EU ‘so we can make our own laws’ completely busted? Couldn’t we just have ignored all the EU treaties we’d signed up to and made our own laws anyway? Would’ve saved an awful lot of time and money!

Or it could just be ********.

[Damo]

Really?

They know full well they are breaking the law, but just trying to make out they aren't, as many people have pointed out, like that professor.

I think ill take the courts word for it thanks.
I'd imagine you took the same stance around the time of the court case?

[Damo]

If this is true isn’t one of the pillars of leaving the EU ‘so we can make our own laws’ completely busted? Couldn’t we just have ignored all the EU treaties we’d signed up to and made our own laws anyway? Would’ve saved an awful lot of time and money!

Or it could just be ********.

Yes we could. And if the EU didn't like it, they would have to decide what they were going to do about it.
Just as they will have to decide now.

It could all be just ******** Martin. Again, I'd imagine you are another poster who has only just decided the court were wrong after previously supporting the ruling

[Devils_Advocate]

I think ill take the courts word for it thanks.
I'd imagine you took the same stance around the time of the court case?

If you think the Gina Miller case supports the AGs claim and statement today then you are very wrong

[martin_p]

Yes we could. And if the EU didn't like it, they would have to decide what they were going to do about it.
Just as they will have to decide now.

It could all be just ******** Martin. Again, I'd imagine you are another poster who has only just decided the court were wrong after previously supporting the ruling

But the court didn’t rule on international law.

[Inchy]

At the moment Boris seems to come up with a plan, Scotland and Wales come up with a better plan, then two weeks down the line Boris has a change of heart and follows the Scotland/Wales way.


He should have asked Scotland and Wales to write a brexit plan. Would have been something to fall back on when he realised his was pants

[Spijed]

At the moment Boris seems to come up with a plan, Scotland and Wales come up with a better plan, then two weeks down the line Boris has a change of heart and follows the Scotland/Wales way.


He should have asked Scotland and Wales to write a brexit plan. Would have been something to fall back on when he realised his was pants

Well, he's waiting to see what plan Scotland come up with for independence so he can campaign for that as well.

[tiger76]

At the moment Boris seems to come up with a plan, Scotland and Wales come up with a better plan, then two weeks down the line Boris has a change of heart and follows the Scotland/Wales way.


He should have asked Scotland and Wales to write a brexit plan. Would have been something to fall back on when he realised his was pants

Scotland & Wales did submit brexit proposals in the aftermath of the referendum, as did NI, but they were all totally ignored by the Conservatives, and that's worked out really swimmingly hasn't it.

[tiger76]

Well, he's waiting to see what plan Scotland come up with for independence so he can campaign for that as well.

Well he'll get his wish soon enough, because there will be Indyref2 before the end of this current WM parliamentary term, if our esteemed PM wants to keep the union as one he'll STFU, and stay away from Scotland, everytime he sets foot north of the border Nicola Sturgeon's ratings go up, as do the numbers for independence, and if he's determined to push through a damaging no deal brexit, he'll ultimately oversee Scotland going its own way, this is what happens when you give people an ultimatum, they rebel and vote for what they consider the least worst option, and whether everyone agrees with the Scots or not, they believe independence within the EU, is better than staying in the UK, but being outside the EU, the warnings have been aired for the last few years, and they've been falling on deaf ears.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Well he'll get his wish soon enough, because there will be Indyref2 before the end of this current WM parliamentary term, if our esteemed PM wants to keep the union as one he'll STFU, and stay away from Scotland, everytime he sets foot north of the border Nicola Sturgeon's ratings go up, as do the numbers for independence, and if he's determined to push through a damaging no deal brexit, he'll ultimately oversee Scotland going its own way, this is what happens when you give people an ultimatum, they rebel and vote for what they consider the least worst option, and whether everyone agrees with the Scots or not, they believe independence within the EU, is better than staying in the UK, but being outside the EU, the warnings have been aired for the last few years, and they've been falling on deaf ears.

Scotland was always going to want another referendum at some point.

There does seem to be a belief amongst pro-indy Scots that they'll be allowed straight back into the EU, but I think there is opposition from Spain and another country.

The SNP have also failed to fully explain how they'll get by, no currency plan has been given and several other things.
The pro-indy Scots also appear to think they can leave the UK and have no debts, or refuse to pay them and still get a good international credit rating...

[BennyD]

Curious as to why yesterday, the Government admitted to breaking the law if they aren't.

Why is that Damo?

Btw, Professor Mark Elliott, Professor of Public Law at Cambridge University, has described the UK Government’s statement – presumably drafted by the AG – defending its legal position on the Internal Markets Bill as “utterly risible”

https://twitter.com/ProfMarkElliott/sta ... 3827309569

Most probably just another Liberal remainer who is sticking his oar in, much like the b!tch with the broaches.

[Devils_Advocate]

[aggi]

We are not reneging on a legal obligation.
Parliament is sovereign. Gina Millar and the remainers who funded her legal battle proved this not very long ago.
Thanks again guys
IMG_20200910_173550.jpg

I've already said this earlier, Parliament is sovereign, always has been regardless of what those Brexit people try and tell you.

However, it is still a beach of International law (Vienna convention I think) which is a different thing.

[Erasmus]

To me, this whole business has a strong whiff of Cummings about it, and I fear that he is the person who is now really in charge. A bit like in Lord of the Rings, when you had the evil Wormtongue lurking behind the hopelessly incapable King of Rohan and wielding all the power.

[Siddo]

The Government are promising 10 million tests per day, but the technology to do this doesn't yet exist.
Are they setting themselves up for a fall?

[Bordeauxclaret]

Nah they’ll just claim they’ve done it regardless. Again.

[Spijed]

I've already said this earlier, Parliament is sovereign, always has been regardless of what those Brexit people try and tell you.

However, it is still a beach of International law (Vienna convention I think) which is a different thing.

People like Damo haven't really thought this through. If they think UK parliament is sovereign in this case then it would mean that the UK parliament could override ANY international law it chooses.

[TheFamilyCat]

People like Damo haven't really thought this through. If they think UK parliament is sovereign in this case then it would mean that the UK parliament could override ANY international law it chooses.

And so we should. Rule Britannia etc

[clarethomer]

These trade talks are going into overdrive by the sounds of it. Not had much time to look at what has been going on in detail but from the various sources of news and opinion out there - it's appears like a wet dream for both remainers and brexiteers depending on the narrative that they are following.

From - Breaching international treatys and our word being no good etc. The end of the UK as we know it .

To - Moving to protect the union against an EU threatening to stop movement of food/goods into NI.

It's fascinating stuff that Interpretations of complicated international laws and many moving parts that anyone can really conclude anything with certainty. I will certainly be following the ongoing narrative and will be interested to see what happens.

As much as I know there will be calls around this being another example of the governments shambolic approach - I think this story will take a few more twits and turns before we know it.

[RingoMcCartney]

Remoaners / The Left 2019 -

"This isn't about frustrating Brexit, it's about the sovereignty of parliament. Isn't that what brexiteers told us this was all about!?" Hahaha....


Remoaners / The Left- 2020

"How very dare parliament use sovereignty to do what's best for Britain and prioritise British interests!?" Grrrrrrr .......

Remoaners / The Left- 2020

"This will permanently damage out international reputation"

The Silent minority

"We seemed to manage get over Labour's illegal war resulting in the death of millions of innocent Iraqi men, women and children, pretty quick"

[CrosspoolClarets]

People like Damo haven't really thought this through. If they think UK parliament is sovereign in this case then it would mean that the UK parliament could override ANY international law it chooses.

Major countries break international law all the time. I despair of the guff being spouted by people who should know better, like Theresa May (who caused this problem) and others.

Example - it is international law for prosecution of cross border bribery cases. The UK and USA have highly active enforcement. Japan, Spain, Ireland, Denmark, Belgium and others - not a single prosecution. Does that make them international pariahs? If they don’t prosecute, organised crime could go widespread in another country, costing lives. This thing is just about the people of Northern Ireland and ensuring they aren’t left high and dry.

As with many other things in this era of madness, criticism is fine and dandy but please don’t portray yourself as beyond reproach (e.g. Irish Taioseach in this example).

[martin_p]

Remoaners / The Left 2019 -

"This isn't about frustrating Brexit, it's about the sovereignty of parliament. Isn't that what brexiteers told us this was all about!?" Hahaha....


Remoaners / The Left- 2020

"How very dare parliament use sovereignty to do what's best for Britain and prioritise British interests!?" Grrrrrrr .......

Remoaners / The Left- 2020

"This will permanently damage out international reputation"

The Silent minority

"We seemed to manage get over Labour's illegal war resulting in the death of millions of innocent Iraqi men, women and children, pretty quick"

I didn’t think you’d understand the issue, I was right.

[TheFamilyCat]

These trade talks are going into overdrive by the sounds of it. Not had much time to look at what has been going on in detail but from the various sources of news and opinion out there - it's appears like a wet dream for both remainers and brexiteers depending on the narrative that they are following.

From - Breaching international treatys and our word being no good etc. The end of the UK as we know it .

To - Moving to protect the union against an EU threatening to stop movement of food/goods into NI.

It's fascinating stuff that Interpretations of complicated international laws and many moving parts that anyone can really conclude anything with certainty. I will certainly be following the ongoing narrative and will be interested to see what happens.

As much as I know there will be calls around this being another example of the governments shambolic approach - I think this story will take a few more twits and turns before we know it.

Plenty of twists, that's for sure!

[martin_p]

Major countries break international law all the time. I despair of the guff being spouted by people who should know better, like Theresa May (who caused this problem) and others.

Example - it is international law for prosecution of cross border bribery cases. The UK and USA have highly active enforcement. Japan, Spain, Ireland, Denmark, Belgium and others - not a single prosecution. Does that make them international pariahs? If they don’t prosecute, organised crime could go widespread in another country, costing lives. This thing is just about the people of Northern Ireland and ensuring they aren’t left high and dry.

As with many other things in this era of madness, criticism is fine and dandy but please don’t portray yourself as beyond reproach (e.g. Irish Taioseach in this example).

How does the existing WA leave the people of Northern Ireland high and dry?

[RingoMcCartney]

I didn’t think you’d understand the issue, I was right.

Thought youd be left crying inside. I was right.

[CombatClaret]

Major countries break international law all the time. I despair of the guff being spouted by people who should know better, like Theresa May (who caused this problem) and others.

Example - it is international law for prosecution of cross border bribery cases. The UK and USA have highly active enforcement. Japan, Spain, Ireland, Denmark, Belgium and others - not a single prosecution. Does that make them international pariahs? If they don’t prosecute, organised crime could go widespread in another country, costing lives. This thing is just about the people of Northern Ireland and ensuring they aren’t left high and dry.

As with many other things in this era of madness, criticism is fine and dandy but please don’t portray yourself as beyond reproach (e.g. Irish Taioseach in this example).

Let say you're buying a house from me, we agree terms and draw up a legal agreement. You break the legal agreement and your argument is that it's ok because people get speeding fines?

I'm not sure the EU or anyone would care if the UK broke a law in the International Plant Protection Convention whilst Brexit negotiations are ongoing.
People are annoyed because the law we are breaking is inside an agreement to do with the future trade deal we are trying to secure and requires the trust of the we've infringed against to achieve.
One is related to the other, your example is not.

[Quickenthetempo]

The same people complaining about upholding laws seem perfectly happy for ILLEGAL immigrants to keep coming over our borders when they should of claimed asylum in the first country they entered.

[Spijed]

Apparently we've got a cracking trade deal with Japan.

However, Department for Trade figures reveal that, in 2018, the UK's trade with the EU was worth £659.5bn while trade with Japan was worth £29.1bn.

Now it's worth only £15 billion!

Leaving the EU is turning into a masterstroke.

[martin_p]

Thought youd be left crying inside. I was right.

Go on then, explain to me why the sovereignty of parliament means we won’t break international law.

There’s an argument being made that it’s not illegal to discuss the legislation required but even the government admit once the legislation is carried through into UK law it will break international law. So come on Wrongo, tell me why the government if wrong.

[martin_p]

The same people complaining about upholding laws seem perfectly happy for ILLEGAL immigrants to keep coming over our borders when they should of claimed asylum in the first country they entered.

Yes, and every time my car creeps up to 34 in a 30 mph zone I’m implicitly condoning murder.

[Quickenthetempo]

Yes, and every time my car creeps up to 34 in a 30 mph zone I’m implicitly condoning murder.

Are you?

I know you're breaking the law as well as being a tad hypocritical towards Boris and co.

Maybe hand yourself in to the nearest cop shop if you think so?

[martin_p]

Are you?

I know you're breaking the law as well as being a tad hypocritical towards Boris and co.

Maybe hand yourself in to the nearest cop shop if you think so?

It’s the logical extension of your argument which is effectively if I haven’t condoned everyone breaking any law I can’t condone the government.