This Forum is the main messageboard to discuss all things Claret and Blue and beyond
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claretonthecoast1882
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by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:42 pm
Burnley1989 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:40 pm
A race course has to be the easiest sporting event to social distance
Correct, even the horses I back social distance from the winner
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Burnley1989
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by Burnley1989 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:48 pm
claretonthecoast1882 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:42 pm
Correct, even the horses I back social distance from the winner
Haha, I really miss the races, I usually get to 3-4 a year and sometimes take the kids to the Fun day at Ripon.
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gandhisflipflop
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by gandhisflipflop » Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:10 pm
My grandma has to catch the bus into town and has complained to me about the amount of kids not wearing masks making herself feel vulnerable and uncomfortable. What's more, the drivers of the busses she has been on are saying nothing to them and allowing entry. I've told her to email the bus company with her concerns because as far as I'm concerned the company are showing a complete disregard for public health all because a driver can't be arsed with the aggro by saying something. It makes you very angry indeed.
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RingoMcCartney
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by RingoMcCartney » Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:23 pm
Do the new rules now apply to the Marxist organisations Black lives matter and Extinction Rebellion protests? Upto to now they seem to have some sort of special exemption.
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claret2018
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by claret2018 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:26 pm
Don't worry Ringo I'm sure there will still plenty of things for you to be furious about
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mkmel
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by mkmel » Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:27 pm
mkmel wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:24 am
People should not be asked to wear a mask it should be mandatory whenever away from home. As long as of course they do not have severe asthma or similar
It was me uni_queue who said this
Here in the Philippines it is mandatory to wear a face mask whenever away from home. And now we also have to wear a face shield whenever in a shopping mall. And in England shop workers do not have to wear a face mask and only adviced to wear.....wtf
Here all shop staff wear both face masks and shields
Johnson has not got a clue!
Last edited by
mkmel on Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Newcastleclaret93
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by Newcastleclaret93 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:29 pm
gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:10 pm
My grandma has to catch the bus into town and has complained to me about the amount of kids not wearing masks making herself feel vulnerable and uncomfortable. What's more, the drivers of the busses she has been on are saying nothing to them and allowing entry. I've told her to email the bus company with her concerns because as far as I'm concerned the company are showing a complete disregard for public health all because a driver can't be arsed with the aggro by saying something. It makes you very angry indeed.
I appreciate your point but one of best friends is a bus driver, the physical and mental abuse he has received over the last 6 months has been a disgrace. I can fully understand why no bus driver enforces this ruling
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aggi
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by aggi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:04 pm
Burnley1989 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:40 pm
A race course has to be the easiest sporting event to social distance
It may be easier, it's not going to be easy. Although it looks like the local council has decided to put a stop to it after today.
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aggi
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by aggi » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:07 pm
RingoMcCartney wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:23 pm
Do the new rules now apply to the Marxist organisations Black lives matter and Extinction Rebellion protests? Upto to now they seem to have some sort of special exemption.
You don't seem to have mentioned the right wing protests there. I guess, applying your hyperbole, it's just that you're fine with fascist protests.
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gandhisflipflop
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by gandhisflipflop » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:12 pm
Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:29 pm
I appreciate your point but one of best friends is a bus driver, the physical and mental abuse he has received over the last 6 months has been a disgrace. I can fully understand why no bus driver enforces this ruling
No bus driver should be subject to abuse however, to simply not enforce this for an easy life is sweeping the issue under the carpet and putting others at risk. The bus companies should hire an extra person on board (a conductor) if need be to make sure these rules are enforced. If need be, stop the bus where it is and call the police, I'm sure the passengers would be on the drivers side.
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bfcmik
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by bfcmik » Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:56 pm
gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:12 pm
No bus driver should be subject to abuse however, to simply not enforce this for an easy life is sweeping the issue under the carpet and putting others at risk. The bus companies should hire an extra person on board (a conductor) if need be to make sure these rules are enforced. If need be, stop the bus where it is and call the police, I'm sure the passengers would be on the drivers side.
Neither bus drivers or 'conductors' are trained in law enforcement. It is not their job to do so and any intervention runs the risk of being arrested or sued. They are no better informed than the general populace when it comes to what is legal today or just advisory. In many places police forces have already stated they will not enforce the rules on public transport, shops, bars and restaurants or at people's homes unless serious disorder may occur or is occuring
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martin_p
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by martin_p » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:00 pm
bfcmik wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:56 pm
Neither bus drivers or 'conductors' are trained in law enforcement. It is not their job to do so and any intervention runs the risk of being arrested or sued. They are no better informed than the general populace when it comes to what is legal today or just advisory. In many places police forces have already stated they will not enforce the rules on public transport, shops, bars and restaurants or at people's homes unless serious disorder may occur or is occuring
You’d think their employer might be telling them what is or isn’t legal on their buses. And surely they must have been curious about those ‘passengers must wear a face covering’ signs that have gone up in their buses.
To suggest bus drivers don’t know the rules is to do them and the companies they work for a disservice. However, I suspect they are advised not to get involved when people aren’t wearing face masks.
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Zlatan
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by Zlatan » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:07 pm
I feel for bus drivers, I’ve seen them being abused by people refusing to wear a mask.
I do think there is a much bigger societal problem though, especially when security at a hospital (where I visited) could not refuse entry to a horrible person who refused to wear a mask. They shouted abuse about human rights etc and just did what they wanted.
I honestly don’t have any answers, but in my younger days I would have probably got involved and physicially thrown them out myself - the resulting jail time would have been fun when I was younger, not now
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claretonthecoast1882
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by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:34 pm
Burnley1989 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:48 pm
Haha, I really miss the races, I usually get to 3-4 a year and sometimes take the kids to the Fun day at Ripon.
Yeah I have missed York and Cartmel this summer
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conyoviejo
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by conyoviejo » Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:24 pm
Burnley1989 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:40 pm
A race course has to be the easiest sporting event to social distance
There will be no spectators for the rest of the meeting at the racing after today.
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Jakubclaret
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by Jakubclaret » Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:30 pm
Zlatan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:07 pm
I feel for bus drivers, I’ve seen them being abused by people refusing to wear a mask.
I do think there is a much bigger societal problem though, especially when security at a hospital (where I visited) could not refuse entry to a horrible person who refused to wear a mask. They shouted abuse about human rights etc and just did what they wanted.
I honestly don’t have any answers, but in my younger days I would have probably got involved and physicially thrown them out myself - the resulting jail time would have been fun when I was younger, not now
Sensible policy, age usually brings wisdom, nowadays people on the buses & security & retail assistants generally take home a low wage & have families to support, it's not worth confronting somebody about a mask for all there know that person could be a crazy maniac tooled up with a blade in their pocket & no hesitation in using it, play the game pick the wage up & get back to the family safe & well.
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dsr
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by dsr » Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:47 pm
Red Fox Rocks Socks wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:59 am
Or you could have it sent to your phone which everyone always has.
Or you could have a letter in the post.
Or you could go to your Drs who could provide letter headed paper.
If you want to make a fake of any of these good luck to you but I’m guessing most people couldn’t be arsed and would fall on line
It might be quicker to wait for a vaccine than to wait for a letter from a GP. They are very hard to see even when you're ill.
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mdd2
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by mdd2 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:09 pm
Zlatan wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:07 pm
I feel for bus drivers, I’ve seen them being abused by people refusing to wear a mask.
I do think there is a much bigger societal problem though, especially when security at a hospital (where I visited) could not refuse entry to a horrible person who refused to wear a mask. They shouted abuse about human rights etc and just did what they wanted.
I honestly don’t have any answers, but in my younger days I would have probably got involved and physicially thrown them out myself - the resulting jail time would have been fun when I was younger, not now
You can stop people who do not obey the rules and who are risking others from entering hospital if you deem that they are risking others.
I have personally had removed many people over the years for not complying with what is expected and the threat of removal often results in compliant behaviour. At this time it is even more important that people follow the rules and are admonished when they don't.
Hospital cases in the NW seem to be on the up again now. Given how people have been behaving I suppose it was inevitable
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Spijed
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by Spijed » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:11 pm
When will Christmas be officially cancelled?
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mdd2
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by mdd2 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:20 pm
It will not be officially cancelled but the reality is that unless an effective vaccine is found before then it will be Xmas without crackers
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Zlatan
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by Zlatan » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:45 pm
mdd2 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:09 pm
You can stop people who do not obey the rules and who are risking others from entering hospital if you deem that they are risking others.
I have personally had removed many people over the years for not complying with what is expected and the threat of removal often results in compliant behaviour. At this time it is even more important that people follow the rules and are admonished when they don't.
Hospital cases in the NW seem to be on the up again now. Given how people have been behaving I suppose it was inevitable
The point I wanted to make was that the apathy of the hospital security in regards to the offending person, they just didn’t care enough to make them comply. If the security in our hospitals don’t care, and many of the staff didn’t seem to care either what hope is there for the rest of us?
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mdd2
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by mdd2 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:53 pm
I get your point but we all have a role to play judging when politely to point out peoples errors having first risk assessed getting a fistful of fives for your troubles.
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bfcmik
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by bfcmik » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:18 pm
Billy Balfour wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:30 am
I'd make them carry an exemption note from their GP. No mask + no note = no entry.
Row Z wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:35 am
I don't understand why shops just don't refuse to serve people who aren't wearing a mask until the exemption is provided.
The government's own guidance states
Those who have an age, health or disability reason for not wearing a face covering should not be routinely asked to give any written evidence of this, this includes exemption cards. No person needs to seek advice or request a letter from a medical professional about their reason for not wearing a face covering.
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Row Z
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by Row Z » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:47 pm
bfcmik wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:18 pm
The government's own guidance states
Confirms it can't be enforced, but is trusting the population to follow
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TheFamilyCat
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by TheFamilyCat » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:59 pm
Row Z wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:47 pm
Confirms it can't be enforced, but is trusting the population to follow
A bit like everything else. Putting rules in place that they can't possibly enforce.
I loved the bit in Johnson's statement when he said something like: "I spoke to the police and asked them what would make it easier for them" I suspect their answer was "100,000 more coppers, please".
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tiger76
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by tiger76 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:09 pm
Jakubclaret wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 4:30 pm
Sensible policy, age usually brings wisdom, nowadays people on the buses & security & retail assistants generally take home a low wage & have families to support, it's not worth confronting somebody about a mask for all there know that person could be a crazy maniac tooled up with a blade in their pocket & no hesitation in using it, play the game pick the wage up & get back to the family safe & well.
Yes a perfectly valid point Jakub, and I wouldn't condemn bus drivers for not confronting non mask wearers, there's sadly far too may folks of all ages that are tooled up these days , and it's not worth taking the risk for them, I've seen a few news reports about drivers being abused or even physically assaulted. I work in a university, and we've been told not to
anyone who isn't wearing a mask, and there is of course exemptions on medical grounds.
I prefer to walk to work it's not that far and it saves me money and also gives me the benefit of exercise. I certainly wouldn't get on public transport in the near future.
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Jakubclaret
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by Jakubclaret » Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:10 pm
TheFamilyCat wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:59 pm
A bit like everything else. Putting rules in place that they can't possibly enforce.
I loved the bit in Johnson's statement when he said something like: "I spoke to the police and asked them what would make it easier for them" I suspect their answer was "100,000 more coppers, please".
That's been the issue from the start, you can have sensible people not following the rules but in no way spreading the virus by wearing masks & going way over & beyond any social distancing measures (well over 2m) & sanitising every single thing that's touched (even gloves frequently disposed) & a handful of people following the rules but disregarding common sense & spreading the virus, surely a point needs to be reached by just trusting people without any rules in place because them same very people ignoring the rules & using common sense aren't the people spreading the virus. It's ok to fly thousands of miles & go to pubs ect but shy reclusive extreme clean people can't do certain things.
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Steve-Harpers-perm
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by Steve-Harpers-perm » Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:28 pm
Spijed wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:11 pm
When will Christmas be officially cancelled?
Have you not heard about Operation Moonshit I mean Moonshot?
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TheFamilyCat
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by TheFamilyCat » Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:56 pm
Jakubclaret wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:10 pm
That's been the issue from the start, you can have sensible people not following the rules but in no way spreading the virus by wearing masks & going way over & beyond any social distancing measures (well over 2m) & sanitising every single thing that's touched (even gloves frequently disposed) & a handful of people following the rules but disregarding common sense & spreading the virus, surely a point needs to be reached by just trusting people without any rules in place because them same very people ignoring the rules & using common sense aren't the people spreading the virus. It's ok to fly thousands of miles & go to pubs ect but shy reclusive extreme clean people can't do certain things.
Do you ever stop to read what you are typing?
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RingoMcCartney
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by RingoMcCartney » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:10 am
aggi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:07 pm
You don't seem to have mentioned the right wing protests there. I guess,
applying your hyperbole, it's just that you're fine with
fascist protests.
Rearrange into a well known phrase-
"Own by hoist petard your."
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Devils_Advocate
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by Devils_Advocate » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:40 am
The Seven Dwarfs have just been told they can only meet in groups of six. One of them isnt Happy
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nil_desperandum
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by nil_desperandum » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:44 am
Devils_Advocate wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:40 am
The Seven Dwarfs have just been told they can only meet in groups of six. One of them isnt Happy
No, I think you'll find that only one is Happy. The other six aren't.
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Cirrus_Minor
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by Cirrus_Minor » Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:57 am
My granddaughters both started school again last week. The school had all the precautions, from parents/grandparents not gathering at gates, plenty of hand washing, social distancing, hand sanitizing, etc., etc.
They both have colds now - how does that work?
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Inchy
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by Inchy » Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:41 am
RingoMcCartney wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:49 am
Yeah , forget
personal responsibility. Nice one.
The government have a responsibility to effectively manage a pandemic. They are failing
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aggi
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by aggi » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:02 am
RingoMcCartney wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:10 am
Rearrange into a well known phrase-
"Own by hoist petard your."
I assume you realise your response didn't actually make sense. I guess it was easier than explaining why you had no issue with violent, right wing protests.
Anyway, you'll be glad to know that there is a carve out in the new rules for protests.
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claretonthecoast1882
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by claretonthecoast1882 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:03 am
Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:28 pm
Have you not heard about Operation Moonshit I mean Moonshot?
I was hoping it was operation moonshine
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martin_p
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by martin_p » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:10 am
aggi wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:02 am
I assume you realise your response didn't actually make sense. I guess it was easier than explaining why you had no issue with violent, right wing protests.
I’m not sure whether he doesn’t read responses properly or genuinely has a problem comprehending the English language!
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FactualFrank
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by FactualFrank » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:14 am
The seven dwarfs have just been informed and one of them isn't happy.
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martin_p
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by martin_p » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:22 am
FactualFrank wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:14 am
The seven dwarfs have just been informed and one of them isn't happy.
You’re an hour and a half too late.
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Devils_Advocate
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by Devils_Advocate » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:32 am
martin_p wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:22 am
You’re an hour and a half too late.
Looks like Dopey has arrived
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FactualFrank
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by FactualFrank » Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:40 am
martin_p wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 11:22 am
You’re an hour and a half too late.
More like 24 hours. But I took into account the slowness of some folk on here, so chanced it!
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aggi
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by aggi » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:28 pm
So, is there anyone on here who expects this moonshot testing to actually happen?
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tiger76
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by tiger76 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:41 pm
aggi wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:28 pm
So, is there anyone on here who expects this moonshot testing to actually happen?
Not this side of Xmas no, I just wish this government would stop making absurd promises that they can't deliver, a world-beating track & trace system, that was a total fallacy, it doesn't even function effectively ATM, and we'll be back to near normal by Xmas, nobody seriously believed that, and once again the PM has had to backtrack on those claims, I appreciate his enthusiasm and positivity, but it's got to be based on something tangible, otherwise it's just empty rhetoric, let's deal with the reality we're living through, and not the fantasy world we'd like to be in.
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CrosspoolClarets
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by CrosspoolClarets » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:17 pm
To be fair to the PM, his bluster and promises may seem like enough hot air to lift off a balloon, but there is often a method to his madness as long as he isn’t taken literally (which many seem to do).
No other major developed country apart from Australia (I don’t class Denmark as major) did as many Covid tests last week per head of population. That is a direct result of the pressure on Hancock and others caused by the PM’s bullish insistence we would be world class. The testing is creaking at the edges, but moving at such pace will always do that.
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RingoMcCartney
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by RingoMcCartney » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:21 pm
Inchy wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:41 am
The government have a responsibility to effectively manage a pandemic. They are failing
if a lever existed that had a sign above it saying, "for perfect response to unprecedented global pandemic. Pull here", and Boris pulled it. If large swathes of the population chose to consider themselves above the law. Even the perfect response would fail.
The lever doesn't even exist.
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evensteadiereddie
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by evensteadiereddie » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:28 pm
Neither does the government's effective management.....
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Swizzlestick
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by Swizzlestick » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:31 pm
You've misunderstood aggi's post you complete spanner.
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martin_p
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by martin_p » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:32 pm
Swizzlestick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:31 pm
You've misunderstood aggi's post you complete spanner.
It’s not the first time he’s made a fool of himself, it won’t be the last.