ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover

[clarethomer]

Too many unknowns at this stage and like you said it seems unlikely to be asset-stripped.

However, it still does beg the question - which only seems to be answered in riddles by some on how they intend to make their money on this. Even with a modest investment, there is still not a lot you can do to leverage your return.

If the Egyptians are looking to invest in the northern powerhouse - I still find it difficult to why this is better than just investing £200m into the economy in the area and building your credibility that way.

If it's some kind of middle east war of wealth. I hope we are not a toy that is dropped and never picked up again when they get bored.

Will be good to understand the vision/plans when this is possible so we can make an assessment on something other than media tit bits

[Claretnick]

https://www.thenationalnews.com/busines ... n-1.659545
Read this a couple of times no mention of football,no mention of Burnley, this whole thing stinks of asset stripping. It will end in tears ; our tears.

Maybe 6 years ago when that article was written he had never heard of Burnley!

Other posters have given good reasons why our club is not an attraction for asset stripping

[arise_sir_charge]

https://www.thenationalnews.com/busines ... n-1.659545
Read this a couple of times no mention of football,no mention of Burnley, this whole thing stinks of asset stripping. It will end in tears ; our tears.

Do you have any idea what asset stripping is?

Seems you are throwing it about without any real thought as to whether it’s even plausible.

[Vegas Claret]

Maybe 6 years ago when that article was written he had never heard of Burnley!

Other posters have given good reasons why our club is not an attraction for asset stripping

I'd love you to show us all where and how you think they are going to buy the club for 200 million, pay all the wages and asset strip at a profit ?

[Winstonswhite]

Why should there be?

I’m not being funny, but you’d think there would feel at least something about a business he owned, worked at etc etc.

Many articles stating who he is have said that he is a “food and restaurant magnate from Dubai”. You’re not telling me at least something would have been written on the internet about him or his businesses.

To me this has all the hallmarks of the charlatans who were trying to buy Rovers prior to the Venkys from the Middle East who ended up not having a pot to p!ss in. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Garlick is using them to put the pressure on the Americans and get the deal done with ALK asap .

[bfcjg]

Do you have any idea what asset stripping is?

Seems you are throwing it about without any real thought as to whether it’s even plausible.

I've a rough idea thank you. Get your brain into gear what is in it for him ,?

[Grumps]

I’m not being funny, but you’d think there would feel at least something about a business he owned, worked at etc etc.

Many articles stating who he is have said that he is a “food and restaurant magnate from Dubai”. You’re not telling me at least something would have been written on the internet about him or his businesses.

To me this has all the hallmarks of the charlatans who were trying to buy Rovers prior to the Venkys from the Middle East who ended up not having a pot to p!ss in. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if Garlick is using them to put the pressure on the Americans and get the deal done with ALK asap .

The articles are at least 4 years old, not even sure he owns those companies now

He won't get to buy the club if he hasn't got the money

[clarethomer]

I've a rough idea thank you. Get your brain into gear what is in it for him ,?

can you please explain why you think asset stripping is what is in it for him?

[Claretnick]

I'd love you to show us all where and how you think they are going to buy the club for 200 million, pay all the wages and asset strip at a profit ?

Where did I say they were going to asset strip the club. I was actually trying to highlight that other posters have come up with good reasons why the club is not attractive for asset stripping.

[Steddyman]

Just done a little digging and I think I have found something interesting:

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mohamed-elkashashy-9896038

I am pretty sure this is the same guy. Private Equity director and links with the Dubai government:

2008-2009: Worked closely with the leadership of Dubai on setting the marketing strategy for the real estate, healthcare, and educational sectors

[Charlton Boy]

I don’t think Charlton Boy realises that we are a private limited company as opposed to a public one like Charlton.

Buying and seeking shares in private limited companies is much different to buying them in a Plc.

And that stops you asking where the money is coming from?

[clarethomer]

And that stops you asking where the money is coming from?

Of course not. We can ask and I am sure the PL will be asking that too.

[Vegas Claret]

Where did I say they were going to asset strip the club. I was actually trying to highlight that other posters have come up with good reasons why the club is not attractive for asset stripping.

that's me quoting the wrong person !! sorry about that old bean

[arise_sir_charge]

And that stops you asking where the money is coming from?

No, but there is no deal unless the money lands in Mike Garlick’s (and other shareholders) bank so does it really matter where that money has come from?

[jtv]

Of course not. We can ask and I am sure the PL will be asking that too.

Perhaps Mike Garlick has already thought of asking, seeing that they've been talking for 2 years?

[NewClaret]

Just done a little digging and I think I have found something interesting:

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mohamed-elkashashy-9896038

I am pretty sure this is the same guy. Private Equity director and links with the Dubai government:

2008-2009: Worked closely with the leadership of Dubai on setting the marketing strategy for the real estate, healthcare, and educational sectors

Sadly it also tells us that the company he has been running pretty much since then is now in liquidation!!

I’d have no issue with investment from Dubai state whatsoever, just no idea why they have to do it via these dodgy individuals (if indeed it is Dubai state funding him).

[Steddyman]

I've been reading up on the Charlton situation and I'm finding it difficult to understand exactly how Farnell / Elkashashy were involved with the problems there. It seems like they never proved proof of funds, which from media reports they have already done with Burnley. They were already in a real mess and they would have been the fourth owner in 2020 if it had gone through.

This is the pitted history: https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/char ... 600859/amp

What am I missing? Same with Bury and Farnell, brought in for specific advice when it was already too late.

[clarethomer]

Perhaps Mike Garlick has already thought of asking, seeing that they've been talking for 2 years?

I am sure he has asked also. That is why I am not worried about;

- Asset stripping a club which has no assets that make sense to strip for profit to be made.

- That the board are not going to hand over the club ownership without proper due diligence, or payment being made in line with the agreed legal contracts.

- That the directors will likely have to disclose the ultimate influence/owner of the club if they are just fronting the purchase.

I was simply agreeing with the charlton fan that we can ask about the money but so will other people.

[gandhisflipflop]

Sadly it also tells us that the company he has been running pretty much since then is now in liquidation!!

I’d have no issue with investment from Dubai state whatsoever, just no idea why they have to do it via these dodgy individuals (if indeed it is Dubai state funding him).

There is one thing not adding up for me, and please correct me if I'm wrong. Dubai is part of the UAE, and Sheikh Mohammed bin Rashid Al Maktoum is the 70-year-old billionaire ruler of Dubai and vice-president of the United Arab Emirates. As I understand it, don't the ruling family of the UAE own Manchester City? And wouldn't that be a conflict of interests if indeed Dubai was funding this Egyptian?

[Steddyman]

Sadly it also tells us that the company he has been running pretty much since then is now in liquidation!!

I’d have no issue with investment from Dubai state whatsoever, just no idea why they have to do it via these dodgy individuals (if indeed it is Dubai state funding him).

Does it? Where does it say that?

[clarethomer]

There is one thing not adding up for me, and please correct me if I'm wrong. Dubai is part of the UAE, and Sheikh Mohammed bin Rashid Al Maktoum is the 70-year-old billionaire ruler of Dubai and vice-president of the United Arab Emirates. As I understand it, don't the ruling family of the UAE own Manchester City? And wouldn't that be a conflict of interests if indeed Dubai was funding this Egyptian?

Mansour is from Abu Dhabi whose company owns Man City. Dubai is a legally separate emirates of the UAE.

[gandhisflipflop]

So Dubai is an independent emerite like Abu Dhabi that is part of the United Arab Emirates?

Would that be the Arab equivalent of states that made up the U.S.S.R? And nations that make up the United Kingdom? Sorry I just get confused with these sorts of things.

[bodge]

Yes they are seperate entities gandhi, there's a few differences.

For example they don't like the Flintstones in Dubai but Abu Dhabi do.

[gandhisflipflop]

You live and learn. Should they take over some on here will have a right Barney

[scouseclaret]

The way it will work, clarethomer, is that several of the players can be sold. Let's say £40m for Tarks, £40m for Dwight, £40m for Nick Pope. That's £120m of "assets" from just 3 players there. Sell them, there's only a shortfall of £80m to cover from everything else - and then the new investors will have broken even. They'd be "quids in" - but, hang on, don't we need to stay in the Premier League to keep picking up £100+ p.a. (forgetting to c-19 tv rebates).

No, I'm pretty sure it's not an attractive target for an asset stripper.

UTC

EDIT: Of course, my transfer values are "made up" - and ignore the sell-on to Brentford etc etc etc.

Actually, the rest of the squad isn’t worthless. Charlie might be worth £15m, Wood possibly double fugures, JBG, Ben Mee? Then you’ve drastically reduced the wage bill, and you’re guaranteed £80m over the next 3 years assuming relegation. Then you flog it to a “white knight” for £25m...

[Erasmus]

Personally, I wouldn't want to see Dubai having anything to do with Burnley FC. It is totalitarian state with a dreadful record on human rights, and has been heavily involved in the vicious attacks on civilians in Yemen. Do we really want those sort of people involved with our football club, regardless of how much money they have? Abu Dhabi and Saudi Arabia the same. There are certain standards of decency that have to be maintained and Dubai falls well below those standards.

[NewClaret]

Does it? Where does it say that?

I can’t access your link now, but if you google the name of the company that he has been managing partner of for 9 years or so, it’s in liquidation!

[gandhisflipflop]

I don't know if this has been posted before and apologies if so but I've found a company called staunch partners limited on companies House that was set up in November last year by both Farnell and Elkashashy each listing themselves as directors. Under nature of business on companies House it says
Nature of business (SIC)

64304 - Activities of open-ended investment companies

[Claretnick]

that's me quoting the wrong person !! sorry about that old bean

No worries

[Steddyman]

I can’t access your link now, but if you google the name of the company that he has been managing partner of for 9 years or so, it’s in liquidation!

If you look at the bottom of the linked in post, you will see it matches at least 4 companies. There is little chance the one you have found is the same one.

[Paul Waine]

Actually, the rest of the squad isn’t worthless. Charlie might be worth £15m, Wood possibly double fugures, JBG, Ben Mee? Then you’ve drastically reduced the wage bill, and you’re guaranteed £80m over the next 3 years assuming relegation. Then you flog it to a “white knight” for £25m...

Hi scouse, don't you think those issues would be part of the "fit and proper" discussions with FA/PL? Do you think PL will pay "relegation" monies to a team that was following an asset stripping strategy - and was only able to put out the development squad? Too much doubt to buy the club for £200m and to be able to sell off the assets at a sum that exceeds £200m.

[CrosspoolClarets]

No doubts that chap on LinkedIn is the same guy, albeit it seems a long time since he used that account.

But the bit I find intriguing about some of the guesses on the above posts is that when I look at a map of Premier League owners, Dubai is the big omission out of the rich and powerful. We have a few English, Americans, Russian, Chinese, Abu Dhabi, Thailand, Saudi, Egyptian.....

Dubai must feel like they are missing out. Many of the clubs are owned by billionaires so they are effectively “no go” zones. I can see the argument that Burnley is attractive due to being the only established PL club that looks ripe for a takeover, and this El Kashashy being a front for a bigger consortium of very rich people related to the Dubai government appears plausible albeit highly speculative.

No idea if this is the case, but certainly if we stay in this league of leagues the chances of us avoiding becoming a playing chip for the mega rich sporting owners - non existent.

[Paul Waine]

I don't know if this has been posted before and apologies if so but I've found a company called staunch partners limited on companies House that was set up in November last year by both Farnell and Elkashashy each listing themselves as directors. Under nature of business on companies House it says
Nature of business (SIC)

64304 - Activities of open-ended investment companies

Hi gandhi, yes Staunch Partners has already made an appearance in posts. "Open-ended investment company" is abbrieviated as OEIC.

Investopedia Definition: An open-ended investment company (OEIC) is a type of investment fund domiciled in the United Kingdom that is structured to invest in stocks and other securities. The company's shares list on the London Stock Exchange (LSE) and the price of the shares are based largely on the underlying assets of the fund.

I don't know whether there are any regulations that require a company that describes itself as an OEIC to have to perform the actions that are described in the definition, including listing shares on LSE. It's one of those questions I'd assume a lawyer would know the answer to. (Let's hope that it wasn't and administrative oversight or simply the result of picking the wrong code).

If Staunch Partners does intend to be an OEIC, then it appears that it may be following a very similar funding strategy than it is possible - though not certain - that ALK Capital may be following, in their case a SPAC, i.e. special-purpose acquisition corporation - which would be expected to list shares, in their case, on an US stock exchange.

[scouseclaret]

Hi scouse, don't you think those issues would be part of the "fit and proper" discussions with FA/PL? Do you think PL will pay "relegation" monies to a team that was following an asset stripping strategy - and was only able to put out the development squad? Too much doubt to buy the club for £200m and to be able to sell off the assets at a sum that exceeds £200m.

Come off it Paul - do you really believe the fit & proper persons test (or “owners & directors”as I think it’s now called) has any credibility at all? I recall during the near demise of Portsmouth that one would-be owner passed the test and it later transpired he didn’t actually exist!

Look, I’m not saying for a minute that this is their motivation, I’m just saying it’s not as outlandish as people might think. What I would say is I find it difficult to imagine a credible business plan that could make investors a lot of money buying a small provincial football club with no certainty over future revenues for £200m+ the necessary investment needed to compete in the upper echelons of the EPL.

[FactualFrank]

Personally, I wouldn't want to see Dubai having anything to do with Burnley FC. It is totalitarian state with a dreadful record on human rights, and has been heavily involved in the vicious attacks on civilians in Yemen. Do we really want those sort of people involved with our football club, regardless of how much money they have? Abu Dhabi and Saudi Arabia the same. There are certain standards of decency that have to be maintained and Dubai falls well below those standards.

If one of our players puts in a poor performance it won't be a good talking to, or questions from the press. It will be the head clean off and put up as a warning for the next player fancying his chances.

[Duffer_]

"Professional football’s complex organisation and lack of transparency have created fertile ground for the use of illegal resources,” the European Commission said. “Questionable sums of money with no apparent or explicable financial return or gain are being invested in the sport.”

[Steddyman]

"Professional football’s complex organisation and lack of transparency have created fertile ground for the use of illegal resources,” the European Commission said. “Questionable sums of money with no apparent or explicable financial return or gain are being invested in the sport.”

As I've said many times on here, I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a lot of money laundered through the Premier League.

[NewClaret]

As I've said many times on here, I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a lot of money laundered through the Premier League.

Agreed. Issue for us is that, since Garlick wants to sell, we have to find the best possible owner. None are likely to live up to some of the very high standards Garlick has set on the business side, but hopefully we might see more investment on the playing side (we couldn’t see much less than we’ve had in recent windows).

[Paul Waine]

Come off it Paul - do you really believe the fit & proper persons test (or “owners & directors”as I think it’s now called) has any credibility at all? I recall during the near demise of Portsmouth that one would-be owner passed the test and it later transpired he didn’t actually exist!

Look, I’m not saying for a minute that this is their motivation, I’m just saying it’s not as outlandish as people might think. What I would say is I find it difficult to imagine a credible business plan that could make investors a lot of money buying a small provincial football club with no certainty over future revenues for £200m+ the necessary investment needed to compete in the upper echelons of the EPL.

Given that the gov't has been speaking a lot about "elite" football, including the possibility of there needing to an independent regulator, I'd expect the FA/PL to be a lot more diligent about ODT than they have been previously, even in the not too distant past. Newcastle/Saudi Arabia being an example of a more "careful approach" than previously.

OK, on the balance of "outlandish" though I'm pretty clear that "asset stripping" isn't the motivation to buy BFC for £200m, I can agree that how you make money on a (i) buy the club for £200m and (ii) spend several £10s of millions to maintain Premier League success (i.e. mainly staying in the PL) is a little challenging - unless you see that all PL clubs will only become more valuable in future years.

Whatever comes of these discussions....

UTC

[FactualFrank]

Agreed. Issue for us is that, since Garlick wants to sell, we have to find the best possible owner. None are likely to live up to some of the very high standards Garlick has set on the business side, but hopefully we might see more investment on the playing side (we couldn’t see much less than we’ve had in recent windows).

From what I understand, there would be no extra investment on the playing side. We'd be no better off when it comes to players.

[Paul Waine]

From what I understand, there would be no extra investment on the playing side. We'd be no better off when it comes to players.

???? Where do you get that from, FF?

[FactualFrank]

???? Where do you get that from, FF?

I hear the investment company would be borrowing the money to buy the club. So they wouldn't be coming in with millions extra. We'd basically be in a very similar situation than we are now from a fan's pov.

[mybloodisclaret]

???? Where do you get that from, FF?

Was the exact same message I was going to post, however you used 3 less question marks than me as an opener.

[randomclaret2]

There will be no investment on the playing side under the present regime

[Rileybobs]

From what I understand, there would be no extra investment on the playing side. We'd be no better off when it comes to players.

Where have you heard that?

[Paul Waine]

Was the exact same message I was going to post, however you used 3 less question marks than me as an opener.

Given you 3 Likes (didn't know it would let me) for your "3 less ???s."

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Was the exact same message I was going to post, however you used 3 less question marks than me as an opener.

Paul gave you 3 likes though...

[Paul Waine]

I hear the investment company would be borrowing the money to buy the club. So they wouldn't be coming in with millions extra. We'd basically be in a very similar situation than we are now from a fan's pov.

Who will lend them the money, FF? What's the point of buying if there's nothing left for investment in the team?

[boatshed bill]

Who will lend them the money, FF? What's the point of buying if there's nothing left for investment in the team?

Well, they could look for extra investment post purchase?

[Rileybobs]

Well, they could look for extra investment post purchase?

Who’s going to lend someone £200m to buy a football club?