No programmes for home games this season

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ClaretTony
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No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:05 pm

The club are not producing any printed programmes and it appears you can only have the download version if you pay for this new Clarets+.

Really disappointed with this, more so given they told us last week they were doing them.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Claret Till I Die » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:08 pm

Maybe they're using the money to add to the Harry Wilson fee....

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Wellsy1882 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:39 pm

Disappointed?

Whos going to physically buy them during a pandemic. Ther not going to just make a handful

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by DCWat » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:46 pm

Wellsy1882 wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:39 pm
Disappointed?

Whos going to physically buy them during a pandemic. Ther not going to just make a handful
They’d have had plenty of takes if they’d done a pre order.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Granny WeatherWax » Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:56 pm

Probably not worth their while.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Wellsy1882 » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:03 pm

DCWat wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:46 pm
They’d have had plenty of takes if they’d done a pre order.
Nowhere near enough to bother printing

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by MT03ALG » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:07 pm

How much does Claret+ cost ? The website states that the first 30 days are free.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:57 pm

Millwall did one tonight, Newcastle & West Brom, our next two opponents away, are doing them. Our club told us last week that they were doing them and then about turned in a matter of days. A digital version that only those who pay for the new version of Clarets Player can get them.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by burnmark » Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:58 pm

MT03ALG wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 9:07 pm
How much does Claret+ cost ? The website states that the first 30 days are free.
£5 a month or £45 for a season pass

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Wed Sep 23, 2020 10:57 pm

If I’d have know they weren’t doing them I wouldn’t have bought the 2 I did last week for nephew & godson

What was the point in doing them for the Sheffield United game and no other

And is any part of the new Clarets+ free?
The only part of ClaretsPlayer you needed to pay for was the commentary, everything else was free

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:27 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 10:57 pm
If I’d have know they weren’t doing them I wouldn’t have bought the 2 I did last week for nephew & godson

What was the point in doing them for the Sheffield United game and no other

And is any part of the new Clarets+ free?
The only part of ClaretsPlayer you needed to pay for was the commentary, everything else was free
They told us they were doing print programmes for ALL the games and have now stopped after one, and they sneaked out the news on the club site while a match was on.

Suggests that all the video content will now be chargeable and that's how you get the digital edition of the programme. Real downer for me as an avid collector.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Dyched » Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:49 pm

Cost of printing is cheap as chips these days.

They could easily do 200/500 or so.

CT, why not do an Up The Clarets fanzine this season? Could do 3 or 4 over the duration of the season.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:18 am

https://www.burnleyfootballclub.com/con ... nd-clarets

I do see the reason for the decision, re printing costs but I’d be interested to know how many programmes they usually sell, and how many take up the subscription.

If you bought a programme for one game you’re likely to buy for them all. They’ll have an idea how many to print.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by MDWat » Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:20 am

Can’t cost that much to print and even if it makes a small loss, doing something like programmes for the fans creates far more in goodwill than it does in cash. The lack of them, particularly with a forced paid route of Clarets+, alienates fans.

Another short-term decision.

The fact that Clarets+ is here and now charging for everything is also a massive disappointment (the content they have available doesn’t warrant any fee in my opinion, it’s miles away from other clubs).

You can tell Baldwin has gone - he was well up on moving everything to YouTube and it being free given we’re a Premier League club.
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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 7:23 am

Free Subscription
Access to all archive footage and match highlights

Monthly Subscription - One Month Free Trial
£4.99
One Month Free
Everything included in the free subscription +
Live Match Commentary of every League and Cup Game
Live Press Conferences
Exclusive Premium Content
Digital Matchday Programmes (Home Fixtures Only)
The only thing I really used ClaretsPlayer for was “Turf Moor”
I’m at work when the press conferences are on so unable to watch those live
I don’t need the match Commentary of every game as I’m usually at every home game and either able to watch the away games or doing something else.

This seems a really big backward step

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by RammyClaret61 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:46 am

ClaretTony wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:27 pm
They told us they were doing print programmes for ALL the games and have now stopped after one, and they sneaked out the news on the club site while a match was on.

Suggests that all the video content will now be chargeable and that's how you get the digital edition of the programme. Real downer for me as an avid collector.
I just had an email conversation with Darren Bentley & the programme editor last week, about my 50 years anniversary. I asked if they were printing programmes, I was told they were. Told to send a photo, and some words and it would be in the Southampton programme.
Very disappointed. But my mind is made now. 50 years of programme collection comes to an end now. :cry:

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Conroysleftfoot » Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:29 am

RammyClaret61 wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 8:46 am
I just had an email conversation with Darren Bentley & the programme editor last week, about my 50 years anniversary. I asked if they were printing programmes, I was told they were. Told to send a photo, and some words and it would be in the Southampton programme.
Very disappointed. But my mind is made now. 50 years of programme collection comes to an end now. :cry:
Sorry to hear this. I stopped collecting some years ago but after you have been doing it for 50 years and then the piece in the Southampton programme, feel for you.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Leisure » Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:42 am

Must have been a quick change of mind as they only advertised on the 18th that they were producing them and that they would be available to pre-order. They even asked Acc Clarets if we would do the usual sponsorship of the 2nd Year Scholars section.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:11 am

Leisure wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 9:42 am
Must have been a quick change of mind as they only advertised on the 18th that they were producing them and that they would be available to pre-order. They even asked Acc Clarets if we would do the usual sponsorship of the 2nd Year Scholars section.
The decision was made following the Government’s decision, earlier this week, to extend restrictions during the Covid-19 pandemic, and the subsequent announcement that fans will not be back in stadiums for the foreseeable future.

That move, in tandem with the cost of producing small print runs - based on previous pre-orders placed during the last few games of last season - has led the club to move pro-actively to a digital-only version.
Looks like was made after the decision not to allow fans to start returning from October.

I’m all for things going digital. I read the news online, I read books on a kindle but there is still the option to buy an actual version of those

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:19 am

Does this mean that with having to have clarets+ then we aren't offering opposition fans the option of buying one ?

If that is the case then it is poor from the club

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 11:39 am

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:19 am
Does this mean that with having to have clarets+ then we aren't offering opposition fans the option of buying one ?

If that is the case then it is poor from the club
That's how I see it. I've no intention of paying money for Clarets+ and why should they get even a download when season ticket holders (for instance) paying a lot more don't.

I have every home programme from the day I started going on the Turf (October 1960). I'm absolutely appalled at this decision, made worse by the fact that they told us all last week that they were doing them.

One Club For All says Hart - One Club for All My Arse.
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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:21 pm

I'm assuming you can print as many copies as you want to from a single download

Is there anything to stop somebody "buying a download" then getting orders in from people for printed copies?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:50 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:21 pm
I'm assuming you can print as many copies as you want to from a single download

Is there anything to stop somebody "buying a download" then getting orders in from people for printed copies?
I paid £1.50 for a Leicester download last Sunday. It came in two versions (pc or mobile) and I was able to forward it on.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by DCWat » Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:54 pm

Tin pot! If it did cost the club, it’d hardly be big sums.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:25 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:50 pm
I paid £1.50 for a Leicester download last Sunday. It came in two versions (pc or mobile) and I was able to forward it on.
Well that makes their decision even more baffling.

In theory, one person can get the download for a few quid that can be sent onto x other people

I wouldn't be surprised if the claret+ subscriptions aren't what they expect (excluding those not local/in UK) and change their decision

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Leon_C » Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:29 pm

A few comments that printing is cheap, above.
When you're printing 8-12,000 programmes, the unit cost is relatively low.
But in reality - would they sell 400-500 if there was nobody in the ground? This would end up costing around a tenner per unit, I guess!
I know it's disappointing.. if I was a collector, I'd be p****ed off, but surely this is a commercially sound decision from the club.

(PS - modern 'cheap' printing is digital, and relatively low cost per click. Unless I'm mistaken, the programmes will be litho printed (using plates) which is only lower cost on longer runs.)

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by UpTheClaretsFCBK » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:50 pm

Dyched wrote:
Wed Sep 23, 2020 11:49 pm
Cost of printing is cheap as chips these days.

They could easily do 200/500 or so.

CT, why not do an Up The Clarets fanzine this season? Could do 3 or 4 over the duration of the season.
If it's that cheap then you can take your digital programme file to a print shop and get it done yourself.

Absolutely no point in the club engaging in anything that's not commercially viable.

We've got 12-13 fit first team players, transfers and a potential bid to buy the club with no match day income at all for, what looks like now, the whole season. I'd wager printing programmes is not high on the priority list.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:54 pm

UpTheClaretsFCBK wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 3:50 pm
If it's that cheap then you can take your digital programme file to a print shop and get it done yourself.

Absolutely no point in the club engaging in anything that's not commercially viable.

We've got 12-13 fit first team players, transfers and a potential bid to buy the club with no match day income at all for, what looks like now, the whole season. I'd wager printing programmes is not high on the priority list.
It's not on the list at all - but why did they announce last week that they were printing them on pre-order?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:02 pm

Bentley seems to have cleared that up on twitter.
They were expecting crowds back in soon which would have meant the losses were not as high. That changed this week.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:13 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:02 pm
Bentley seems to have cleared that up on twitter.
They were expecting crowds back in soon which would have meant the losses were not as high. That changed this week.
Doesn't clear anything up, all it does is make last week's announcement totally incorrect. And I still think to offer the digital offering for those who wish to sign up for the video content is very poor.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:14 pm

He’s explained why they changed their minds though.

You can disagree with the decision but he’s explained why they made it.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:32 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:14 pm
He’s explained why they changed their minds though.

You can disagree with the decision but he’s explained why they made it.
I'll disagree and I think it is appalling.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Grumps » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:42 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:13 pm
Doesn't clear anything up, all it does is make last week's announcement totally incorrect. And I still think to offer the digital offering for those who wish to sign up for the video content is very poor.
Apparently the print run would be less than 200. Not cost effective.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:47 pm

Grumps wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:42 pm
Apparently the print run would be less than 200. Not cost effective.
Then why tell people they are doing it in the first place? And where have you got the 200 from?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by claptrappers_union » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:48 pm

I know the creators of the programme are very proud of what they produce, I know that for a fact. Burnley's programmes over the past decade have been excellent. This would've been a hard decision for them to make, understandable though.
Last edited by claptrappers_union on Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by DCWat » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:48 pm

How do they know that figure?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Grumps » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:52 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:47 pm
Then why tell people they are doing it in the first place? And where have you got the 200 from?
Bentley quoted that figure this morning

Things are changing fast in the current climate.
The government said help for employees was ending, but have had to change their mind due to the rising infection rates. They also stopped crowds going back to grounds, which is why the club have changed their minds

I don't collect program's, if I did I would be peeved off, but I would also understand why the decision has been taken.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Grumps » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:53 pm

DCWat wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:48 pm
How do they know that figure?
200 was based on previous orders...

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:55 pm

Grumps wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:52 pm
Bentley quoted that figure this morning

Things are changing fast in the current climate.
The government said help for employees was ending, but have had to change their mind due to the rising infection rates. They also stopped crowds going back to grounds, which is why the club have changed their minds

I don't collect program's, if I did I would be peeved off, but I would also understand why the decision has been taken.
If he's quoting that number, it's totally different to the one I was given by someone else at the club. I'm beyond peeved with this. Even more so given you have to buy Clarets+ to get a digital version. I'm not paying any more than I already give the club who still take my money for a season ticket I can't use.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by claptrappers_union » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:56 pm

I can't imagine many people downloading or ordering the programme throughout the whole season - the club is probably better off putting in more effort with creative online content ready for matchday - that's where the eyes are going to be and that's where businesses are more likely to spend money for sponsorship - much more value than a glorified PDF.

To be honest, the programme hardly makes any money anyway in the grand scheme of things - but this is a shame because as I said before, the editors are really proud of it.
Last edited by claptrappers_union on Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by wilks_bfc » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:57 pm

I’m not sure how they’ve worked out it would only be 200

How many did they sell per game during the restart?

What happens if/when fans start to return?
Are they going to decide that they aren’t going to resume with the print version as there’s “no demand”

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:59 pm

claptrappers_union wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:56 pm
To be honest, the programme hardly makes any money anyway in the grand scheme of things.
Who cares? They told us they were doing one and started last week with the first match.

So will you share the details of hardly making any money?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by claptrappers_union » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:07 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:59 pm
Who cares? They told us they were doing one and started last week with the first match.

So will you share the details of hardly making any money?
And they changed their mind... I think the fans not coming into the stadiums for the fore-seeable has obviously affected that

The amount of time and effort they the club put into producing it with the printing costs - there isn't a massive return - that been the case for years though... probably the same for all football clubs. Burnley's programmes have been excellent with quality content at a decent price - my observation of other clubs' are lesser quality and more expensive.

But if the quality of the programme is getting replaced with online content, then that's an understandable alternative isn't it?

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Grumps » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:10 pm

wilks_bfc wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:57 pm
I’m not sure how they’ve worked out it would only be 200

How many did they sell per game during the restart?

What happens if/when fans start to return?
Are they going to decide that they aren’t going to resume with the print version as there’s “no demand”
I think you've answered your own question with the 2nd question :lol:
It was based on how many were ordered then.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Grumps » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:13 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:55 pm
If he's quoting that number, it's totally different to the one I was given by someone else at the club. I'm beyond peeved with this. Even more so given you have to buy Clarets+ to get a digital version. I'm not paying any more than I already give the club who still take my money for a season ticket I can't use.
I can only go off what he said
I won't be paying either, certainly whilst they currently have £1500 of my money. Free digital content for those who have paid up front would have been a good PR excercise, without costing the club too much

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Conroy92 » Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:28 pm

What I wouldn't give for a new "when the ball moves"

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:13 pm

claptrappers_union wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:07 pm

But if the quality of the programme is getting replaced with online content, then that's an understandable alternative isn't it?
No it’s not. I’m not forking out even more money.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:14 pm

Grumps wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 5:13 pm
I can only go off what he said
I won't be paying either, certainly whilst they currently have £1500 of my money. Free digital content for those who have paid up front would have been a good PR excercise, without costing the club too much
Not as much of my money but more than that for the whole family.

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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by Jimmymaccer » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:15 pm

I always buy them when at the match, home and away.........bit of an addiction really ........and ordered them since “lockdown”, but sense this may be the end of my collecting............and in a way the bigger risk, is the longer this goes on people will get out of the habit of attending matches and keeping the money in their pockets instead....
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Re: No programmes for home games this season

Post by ClaretTony » Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:20 pm

Jimmymaccer wrote:
Thu Sep 24, 2020 6:15 pm
I always buy them when at the match, home and away.........bit of an addiction really ........and ordered them since “lockdown”, but sense this may be the end of my collecting............and in a way the bigger risk, is the longer this goes on people will get out of the habit of attending matches and keeping the money in their pockets instead....
I’ve not made a decision yet and have been able to get the away programmes. But I do know that, on the back of this decision, the club will be getting a lot less of my money in future.

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