How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

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Guller Bull
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How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Guller Bull » Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:04 pm

Preston and Rovers been mid table sides for the last couple of years.

Reckon one of them will probably be up there at the end of this season.

Obviously hope we stay up but miss the rivalry.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by jrgbfc » Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:21 pm

We may get to play them in the Championship next season.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Guller Bull » Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:23 pm

jrgbfc wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:21 pm
We may get to play them in the Championship next season.
I would enjoy that!

Relegation is not the end of the world as long as we stay reasonably well adjusted financially. I would prefer that both Rovers and Preston were promoted and we stay up.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Jakubclaret » Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:24 pm

jrgbfc wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:21 pm
We may get to play them in the Championship next season.
That's definitely more likely than any of the 2 getting promoted.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Longsider » Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:05 pm

Preston are long over due a meal at the top table but the are Anorexic and won't again this year. Illegitimates could go up this year through the play offs . we are going down.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by boatshed bill » Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:23 pm

Hopefully not in what's left of my life :D :D

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by thelaughingclaret » Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:46 pm

Guller Bull wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:23 pm
I would enjoy that!
Why? It’s not like anyone of us are going to be able to go on any of the games. What is the point in playing your local rivals without the atmosphere and the banter?

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Erasmus » Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:48 pm

In terms of what would be our 'natural' status, all three of us would probably be bottom half of the Championship with occasional dips down into League 1. Somehow, Burnley have been able to massively over-achieve, relying almost solely on their own means of self-elevation. Blackburn and Preston seem to get just about enough subsidy from their owners to boost them up into the top half of the Championship, but not beyond on that. Bolton should be top half of the Championship, but have been undermined by financial mismanagement.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Somethingfishy » Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:05 pm

I agree with the majority of that but Bolton should be top end Championship yet we should be expecting dips into League 1? What exactly is it that makes them any bigger than we are? Maybe you are being blinkered by their relatively recent stint in the Premier League that was subsidised heavily by Eddie Davies and boy are they now paying for that. Bolton were in the 4th division with us in 87/88. Bolton like Blackburn have been heavily influenced and elevated into positions they would come nowhere near without big investment.They in my opinion are no bigger than ourselves, Blackburn or Preston. I would say we are all very similar size clubs.
These 2 users liked this post: Juan Tanamera Quicknick

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Clarets4me » Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:18 pm

Erasmus wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:48 pm
In terms of what would be our 'natural' status, all three of us would probably be bottom half of the Championship with occasional dips down into League 1. Somehow, Burnley have been able to massively over-achieve, relying almost solely on their own means of self-elevation. Blackburn and Preston seem to get just about enough subsidy from their owners to boost them up into the top half of the Championship, but not beyond on that. Bolton should be top half of the Championship, but have been undermined by financial mismanagement.
A couple of years ago, I averaged out both Burnley and Blackburn's average League position since 1946 ....

We were virtually next to each other at between 6-8th in the Championship. There are some bigger Towns and even Cities with " smaller " Clubs, but very few if any smaller places with bigger Clubs. Some bigger towns ( Newport, Gloucester ) are more Rugby focussed, others are relatively new, such as Milton Keynes, over twice the size of Burnley .... Preston is now probably the biggest City never to have had a taste of Premier League football ..

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by tiger76 » Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:11 am

Clarets4me wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:18 pm
A couple of years ago, I averaged out both Burnley and Blackburn's average League position since 1946 ....

We were virtually next to each other at between 6-8th in the Championship. There are some bigger Towns and even Cities with " smaller " Clubs, but very few if any smaller places with bigger Clubs. Some bigger towns ( Newport, Gloucester ) are more Rugby focussed, others are relatively new, such as Milton Keynes, over twice the size of Burnley .... Preston is now probably the biggest City never to have had a taste of Premier League football ..
Yes I haven't got all the data to hand but ours and Rovers fortunes throughout ours histories have been pretty similar, we've each enjoyed successful spells and we've each experienced slipping down the leagues, although their stint in the lower reaches has generally been briefer than ours, and to my knowledge they've never played as low as the 4th tier under it's many different guises, where of course we experienced that horror in the late 80's/early 90's.

At a guess the biggest city not to have had a taste of the PL is probably Bristol, but again there is a strong focus on egg-chasing in those parts.

We are definitely over-achieving right now, as all the indicators suggest our average would be a mid-table Championship outfit, and we've somehow managed to defy gravity for the past 5 seasons, now whether we can continue to defy gravity this season is still to be determined, but at least we won't have the burden of their enormous debts should we drop into the 2nd tier, and we will be among the favourites to bounce right back up.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Quicknick » Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:54 am

We'll stay up. Blackburn and PNE will stay where they are.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:19 am

Bolton will be in league 2 for a couple of seasons minimum I suspect.
The way they've been this season so far, they're probably going to be in a relegation fight for most of the season.

Wigan - bottom of league 1, will probably join Bolton next season.

Blackburn and Preston - will carry on dossing in the middle of the championship for the foreseeable.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Clarets4me » Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:34 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:11 am
Yes I haven't got all the data to hand but ours and Rovers fortunes throughout ours histories have been pretty similar, we've each enjoyed successful spells and we've each experienced slipping down the leagues, although their stint in the lower reaches has generally been briefer than ours, and to my knowledge they've never played as low as the 4th tier under it's many different guises, where of course we experienced that horror in the late 80's/early 90's.

At a guess the biggest city not to have had a taste of the PL is probably Bristol, but again there is a strong focus on egg-chasing in those parts.
I'd overlooked Bristol, which despite having two League Clubs, is better known for the Rugby ...

Five out of the 12 Premiership Rugby Union Clubs are on the M5 corridor, Worcester, Gloucester, Bristol, Bath and Exeter, with Sale being the only Club north of Leicester ... although there's still a lot of Northern born players representing England.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Clarets4me » Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:38 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 8:19 am
Bolton will be in league 2 for a couple of seasons minimum I suspect.
The way they've been this season so far, they're probably going to be in a relegation fight for most of the season.
If Bolton do get relegated, it's going to make the old jibe about Burnley having the " Best ground in the 4th Division " look tame ... that's one heck of a Stadium for the National League .... :roll: :roll:

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by tiger76 » Sun Nov 08, 2020 2:16 pm

Clarets4me wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 1:34 pm
I'd overlooked Bristol, which despite having two League Clubs, is better known for the Rugby ...

Five out of the 12 Premiership Rugby Union Clubs are on the M5 corridor, Worcester, Gloucester, Bristol, Bath and Exeter, with Sale being the only Club north of Leicester ... although there's still a lot of Northern born players representing England.
The West Country has always been a hotbed of rugby, and now even more so with the emergence of Exeter in the last few years.

Plymouth is another city that feels like their team should be at a higher level, they've had several spells in the 2nd tier, but apart from the odd flirt with the play-offs they've never seriously threatened the top flight, the very definition of a sleeping giant, except they've never really been a giant, but they're a club that with the right type of investment could achieve what Bournemouth did under Eddie.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Shaggy » Sun Nov 08, 2020 2:22 pm

One thing I miss about playing our local rivals is the banter, especially when we win.

Always remember that fat lass PNE supporter crying and ripping up her program :lol:

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun Nov 08, 2020 2:42 pm

Shaggy wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 2:22 pm
One thing I miss about playing our local rivals is the banter, especially when we win.

Always remember that fat lass PNE supporter crying and ripping up her program :lol:
There's a gif of her kicking about somewhere

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by gandhisflipflop » Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:49 pm

Guller Bull wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 4:23 pm
I would enjoy that!

Relegation is not the end of the world as long as we stay reasonably well adjusted financially. I would prefer that both Rovers and Preston were promoted and we stay up.
I'm sorry but I really can't agree that relegation wouldn't be the end of the world. This isnt the championship that we left 5 or 6 years ago. Salaries and transfer fees are that inflated now that we wouldn't even be able to compete in that league as there is no TV money which we are heavily reliant on. We have an aging squad many of whom are out of contract at the end of the season and any parachute payments would only cover wages and leave little left for actual transfers and that's before we even get into the loss of revenue from potential zero or seriously reduced crowds due to the ongoing pandemic.

Simply put, relegation this season would be an absolute disaster, and many stare at the championship dreamy eyed and wouldn't mind it! We must stay up this season at all costs, because a takeover is the only way we can compete in both the PL and the division below long term and that isn't likely to happen if we drop this season.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Guller Bull » Mon Nov 09, 2020 10:33 am

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Sun Nov 08, 2020 3:49 pm
Simply put, relegation this season would be an absolute disaster, and many stare at the championship dreamy eyed and wouldn't mind it! We must stay up this season at all costs, because a takeover is the only way we can compete in both the PL and the division below long term and that isn't likely to happen if we drop this season.
No not having that. It's not about dreamy eyed it is more about just being competitive. The Prem is OK but this ever increasing reliance on just being there for the money just sucks the fun out of football. I'ts great to aspire to but the reality once you are there is that you are playing to survive and each year you do that it just becomes more desperate because otherwise you will you will financially implode. There may be tough times ahead but that is the reality.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by gandhisflipflop » Mon Nov 09, 2020 1:29 pm

Guller Bull wrote:
Mon Nov 09, 2020 10:33 am
No not having that. It's not about dreamy eyed it is more about just being competitive. The Prem is OK but this ever increasing reliance on just being there for the money just sucks the fun out of football. I'ts great to aspire to but the reality once you are there is that you are playing to survive and each year you do that it just becomes more desperate because otherwise you will you will financially implode. There may be tough times ahead but that is the reality.

But the point I'm making is that without the PL money we couldn't even survive in the championship. We would be back to 12k gates if we didn't bounce back first time and we would be fighting to survive in that league like we are doing now in the PL. The money in the championship has moved on greatly in the last 5 years.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Mon Nov 09, 2020 1:58 pm

Somethingfishy wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:05 pm
I agree with the majority of that but Bolton should be top end Championship yet we should be expecting dips into League 1? What exactly is it that makes them any bigger than we are? Maybe you are being blinkered by their relatively recent stint in the Premier League that was subsidised heavily by Eddie Davies and boy are they now paying for that. Bolton were in the 4th division with us in 87/88. Bolton like Blackburn have been heavily influenced and elevated into positions they would come nowhere near without big investment.They in my opinion are no bigger than ourselves, Blackburn or Preston. I would say we are all very similar size clubs.
Perhaps if things continue we should merge as Lancashire United.

We could use our training ground. Boltons stadium. Blackburns owners. And Prestons kit.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by cricketfieldclarets » Mon Nov 09, 2020 2:01 pm

As for could they come up? Yes. Easily. Lots of smaller clubs have done so. Lots of clubs have done so far more unexpectedly.

Only takes a good run and a bit of luck in that league.

Us, Bournemouth, Huddersfield, Blackpool, Wigan, Hull, Sheff Utd were all probably more unexpected than it would be for Rovers to return and possibly even Preston.

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Re: How long till a local rival makes the top flight again?

Post by Erasmus » Mon Nov 09, 2020 9:39 pm

With the exception of Blackpool, all of those named had significant subsidy from their owners that enabled them to get promotion. A better example would be Burnley. If we can do it, then Blackburn and Preston have a better chance than we did because of the subsidies they are given each season. I imagine this is what Venkys are waiting for in order to recoup some of their losses.

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