PSG v Istanbul

[Swizzlestick]

I think the issue is kind of being lost a bit. It's not just that somebody was being pointed as 'black' as per Demba Ba - it's that Pierre Webo was described as 'negru'. That is the Romanian word for 'black' but I'd expect a top ranking UEFA official to realise that this word is very similar to one with a long history of negative, racial connotations. There's video of Webo asking why he "called me a negro". If you're being generous, it's a misunderstanding, but it's one that shouldn't have happened and the reaction is unsurprising.

[Tall Paul]

Pierre Webo was a sub ?

It seems I've misunderstood, I thought he was referring to Demba Ba.

However if Ba was on the bench that means Webo wasn't the only black man on there which defeats the argument that his skin colour was used to distinguish him from all the other men who were white.

[Eyres_11]

What an absolute farce football has become. It seems every week the actual game is becoming lost in a myriad of politics and controversy. I've just realised I don't even know the result of Millwall's game at the weekend. That didn't seem to matter. All we get now are VAR decisions, racism issues, virtue signalling, anti-virtue signalling, wokists, the unwoke, BLM, planes with banners, rainbow laces, female commentators, diversity etc etc. I've had enough. I just want to watch a game of football.

THIS

[nil_desperandum]

Not trying to justify what was said at all as I think everyone just needs to wait for details and facts to emerge first but not sure the officials should have know his name - wasn’t he one of what looked like a number of back room staff / coaches ?

As I've previously posted, at this elite level of officiating, it's not unreasonable to expect the 4th official, (well all the officials), to do a bit of homework on the teams and touchline staff of the 2 teams and know who they are, how they play, etc.
As a former teacher you were expected to teach new classes of 30+ every year and to try to learn their names pretty quickly, and many would look quite similar.. You couldn't just say "you the one with (e.g.) ginger hair in the corner".
The officials at that level should know the majority of the players anyway, and so it should only take a a couple of days to swot up on the rest. Most likely they could test themselves on the flight to the game.

[dsr]

As I've previously posted, at this elite level of officiating, it's not unreasonable to expect the 4th official, (well all the officials), to do a bit of homework on the teams and touchline staff of the 2 teams and know who they are, how they play, etc.
As a former teacher you were expected to teach new classes of 30+ every year and to try to learn their names pretty quickly, and many would look quite similar.. You couldn't just say "you the one with (e.g.) ginger hair in the corner".
The officials at that level should know the majority of the players anyway, and so it should only take a a couple of days to swot up on the rest. Most likely they could test themselves on the flight to the game.

Last tie I counted the players and officials coming from the dressing room to the dugout at Turf Moor, there were over 70 of them. Only 34 had numbers on their backs. I think it's an unnecessary requirement for the referees and officials to learn to identify 40 or so people from photographs in a day or two before a game. If you were on supply teaching and had a different class of thirty every day, I doubt you would recognise them all a year later.

Why would the refs know the players? There are 28 European matches this week; more in the earlier rounds. Apart from very rare exceptions who make it through qualifying rounds to the knockout, club's don't play more than 13 games in a season. If a ref is reffing a team that he hasn't seen for perhaps three years, maybe longer, can he really be expected to know many of the players? Especially the ones he last saw in a different team? That's why they have numbers, frankly.

[dsr]

It seems I've misunderstood, I thought he was referring to Demba Ba.

However if Ba was on the bench that means Webo wasn't the only black man on there which defeats the argument that his skin colour was used to distinguish him from all the other men who were white.

I dare say it had already been made clear that it was an official, not a player, to be sent off.

[dsr]

I think the issue is kind of being lost a bit. It's not just that somebody was being pointed as 'black' as per Demba Ba - it's that Pierre Webo was described as 'negru'. That is the Romanian word for 'black' but I'd expect a top ranking UEFA official to realise that this word is very similar to one with a long history of negative, racial connotations. There's video of Webo asking why he "called me a negro". If you're being generous, it's a misunderstanding, but it's one that shouldn't have happened and the reaction is unsurprising.

Has this been made clear to officials before? By all means if UEFA has made clear that Romanians and Spaniards and whatever other countries have "negro" or similar as their word for black, must never be allowed to use their word "black" in connection with football, then blame the ref. But if other people have used the word "negro" and got away with it, you can't blame the ref for this apparently tragic misunderstanding.

If it is a misunderstanding over the emotive term, then surely the obvious thing is to explain to all concerned that the word negro simply means black and they have all made an ass of themselves over nothing; now please carry on with the game.

[TVC15]

As I've previously posted, at this elite level of officiating, it's not unreasonable to expect the 4th official, (well all the officials), to do a bit of homework on the teams and touchline staff of the 2 teams and know who they are, how they play, etc.
As a former teacher you were expected to teach new classes of 30+ every year and to try to learn their names pretty quickly, and many would look quite similar.. You couldn't just say "you the one with (e.g.) ginger hair in the corner".
The officials at that level should know the majority of the players anyway, and so it should only take a a couple of days to swot up on the rest. Most likely they could test themselves on the flight to the game.

As I said I am not trying to justify this at all as I don’t know the details and facts but Webo was part of the coaching team as far as I understand it and as pointed out that can be a vast number of people and it’s unlikely that a Romanian 4th official (or any official) is going to know the names of all the coaching staff and substitutes of a less than well known Turkish team.
Given the number of substitutes you can name in Europe we must be talking 30 or 40 people in total so even the most competent and thorough of officials is going to struggle to remember names and match faces to this of people they have never seen - even if Derren Brown was officiating !!

[nil_desperandum]

As I said I am not trying to justify this at all as I don’t know the details and facts but Webo was part of the coaching team as far as I understand it and as pointed out that can be a vast number of people and it’s unlikely that a Romanian 4th official (or any official) is going to know the names of all the coaching staff and substitutes of a less than well known Turkish team.
Given the number of substitutes you can name in Europe we must be talking 30 or 40 people in total so even the most competent and thorough of officials is going to struggle to remember names and match faces to this of people they have never seen - even if Derren Brown was officiating !!

I think you have a point, but where I diverge is that I think a 4th official at elite European level is paid enough to do significant preparation before the game.
Nowadays I don't follow the European teams as I did when I was younger, but even I can name and identify most of the PSG starting eleven, and with a bit of studying I would be able to memorise the rest, (I reckon! - even at my age!!). And then I'd be moving on to get familiar with all the Turkish players and officials.
If officiating at Champions league level was my job, I would hope that my professionalism would include researching the two teams and squads leading up to the game. Not to do so, would, to me, be rather like going into a classroom without finding out in advance which pupils in the group had special needs, how many had English as a 2nd language etc. Teachers do this all the time, get paid less, and have to teach 5 days a week.
What do the elite officials do between matches other than keep fit - presumably watch loads of videos of European matches?
It's my view that once an elite official is allocated a top match he should be aware of the protocols, check-out the players and coaches online, and be thoroughly prepared. I think that I might also be aware of what terms in his own language might cause offence to people from other nations cultures. (and i'm not just talking black players here, [I wouldn't expect an English referee to single out a French, German Italian or scot by using a derogatory term]).
So whilst I can see how it might have happened, it's inexcusable(IMO), because it shows a lack of preparation, awareness and professionalism. (We're not talking about a young wild amateur having a bit of strop on Towneley fields here, we're talking about an Elite official.

With rank and status comes responsibility and professionalism.

[Eyres_11]

The guy was the only black guy in a group of white people - he then said its the black guy (in whatever language) simply not racism.

Where do we stop? The tall guy? The fat guy? The Skinny guy? The giner guy?

It was used as a way to describe someone.

People are using anything to be outraged now a days.

Funny that this kicked off because the guy was red carded........

but its only to describe a group of black people by saying ' thats the black lives matter movement / group ' - so black is fine to use as a describing word in that scenario but not any others? come on!

[arise_sir_charge]

I think you have a point, but where I diverge is that I think a 4th official at elite European level is paid enough to do significant preparation before the game.
Nowadays I don't follow the European teams as I did when I was younger, but even I can name and identify most of the PSG starting eleven, and with a bit of studying I would be able to memorise the rest, (I reckon! - even at my age!!).
If officiating at Champions league level was my job, I would hope that my professionalism would include researching the two teams and squads leading up to the game. Not to do so, would, to me, be rather like going into a classroom without finding out in advance which pupils in the group had special needs, how many had English as a 2nd language etc. Teachers do this all the time, get paid less, and have to teach 5 days a week.
What do the elite officials do between matches other than keep fit - presumably watch loads of videos of European matches?
It's my view that once an elite official is allocated a top match he should be aware of the protocols, check-out the players and coaches online, and be thoroughly prepared. I think that I might also be aware of what terms in his own language might cause offence to people from other nations cultures. (and i'm not just talking black players here, [I wouldn't expect an English referee to single out a French, German Italian or scot by using a derogatory term]).
So whilst I can see how it might have happened, it's inexcusable(IMO), because it shows a lack of preparation, awareness and professionalism. (We're not talking about a young wild amateur having a bit of strop on Towneley fields here, we're talking about an Elite official.

With rank and status comes responsibility and professionalism.

I think you expect far too much in that case, especially if you expect the official to know all the coaches and associated officials.

I have never heard of match officials doing pre game research and even so, even if each official did what you have suggested and knew all of the players and officials present, in a pressure situation, I can forgive one forgetting the name of an individual, amongst 70 or so present.

[Devils_Advocate]

It kicked off because some of these players and their friends and family have lived there lives getting negative treatment because of the colour of their skin and are used to being characterised by the colour of their skin in a way white people aren't and again in a way which treats them as inferior.

If someone is white you say that tall guy, that fat guy, that guy with that certain colour hair but with black people you just get that black guy as if being black is an unusual and irregular characteristic unlike the accepted norm of being white.

The fact that this caused so much upset to the point two teams walked off the pitch in solidarity should tell you all you need to know about whether this incident was problematic but as I stated in my first post on this thread there will be plenty desperate to play this down and defend and deflect against racism just like they did with the Millwall fans and just as they will do in the future no matter what the situation.

Its very sad that our society (and this board) is full of these kind of people but at least I can surround myself by good intelligent people who don't spend their energy on trying to defend racism or at least the certain kind of racism that they dont have a problem with.

Over to the the apologists........

[nil_desperandum]

Has this been made clear to officials before? By all means if UEFA has made clear that Romanians and Spaniards and whatever other countries have "negro" or similar as their word for black, must never be allowed to use their word "black" in connection with football, then blame the ref. But if other people have used the word "negro" and got away with it, you can't blame the ref for this apparently tragic misunderstanding.

If it is a misunderstanding over the emotive term, then surely the obvious thing is to explain to all concerned that the word negro simply means black and they have all made an ass of themselves over nothing; now please carry on with the game.

You raise a good point.
Surely there should be training for all Elite officials that makes it clear that certain terms and related words must not be used?
It might be quite a long list, but these are theoretically the top officials, and therefore they should be trained appropriately.
If that training has not been given, (or at least guidance been issued) then your point is reasonable, and UEFA are seriously at fault.

[CFS]

The guy was the only black guy in a group of white people - he then said its the black guy (in whatever language) simply not racism.

Where do we stop? The tall guy? The fat guy? The Skinny guy? The giner guy?

It was used as a way to describe someone.

People are using anything to be outraged now a days.

Funny that this kicked off because the guy was red carded........

but its only to describe a group of black people by saying ' thats the black lives matter movement / group ' - so black is fine to use as a describing word in that scenario but not any others? come on!

Can you read all what you posted Infront of your family members and see what they will tell you instead of trying to fuel a response on here. Unless your a sad little man living alone.

[TVC15]

I think you have a point, but where I diverge is that I think a 4th official at elite European level is paid enough to do significant preparation before the game.
Nowadays I don't follow the European teams as I did when I was younger, but even I can name and identify most of the PSG starting eleven, and with a bit of studying I would be able to memorise the rest, (I reckon! - even at my age!!). And then I'd be moving on to get familiar with all the Turkish players and officials.
If officiating at Champions league level was my job, I would hope that my professionalism would include researching the two teams and squads leading up to the game. Not to do so, would, to me, be rather like going into a classroom without finding out in advance which pupils in the group had special needs, how many had English as a 2nd language etc. Teachers do this all the time, get paid less, and have to teach 5 days a week.
What do the elite officials do between matches other than keep fit - presumably watch loads of videos of European matches?
It's my view that once an elite official is allocated a top match he should be aware of the protocols, check-out the players and coaches online, and be thoroughly prepared. I think that I might also be aware of what terms in his own language might cause offence to people from other nations cultures. (and i'm not just talking black players here, [I wouldn't expect an English referee to single out a French, German Italian or scot by using a derogatory term]).
So whilst I can see how it might have happened, it's inexcusable(IMO), because it shows a lack of preparation, awareness and professionalism. (We're not talking about a young wild amateur having a bit of strop on Towneley fields here, we're talking about an Elite official.

With rank and status comes responsibility and professionalism.

Personally think that is way over the top in terms expectations.....it’s got nothing to do with being an elite official or professionalism or amateurs up at Townley !

It’s just not important enough to the ability of officials to do their job to know every bodies name. Whilst we still await the details of what happened last night I am pretty certain that the issue won’t be that the officials should have known his name.

Where I do agree with you is in the importance of cultural type training for officials who have to referee games around the world. Education is much more likely to avoid situations like last night than expecting officials to memorise the faces and names of players, backroom staff, club doctors etc

[nil_desperandum]

I think you expect far too much in that case, especially if you expect the official to know all the coaches and associated officials.

I have never heard of match officials doing pre game research and even so, even if each official did what you have suggested and knew all of the players and officials present, in a pressure situation, I can forgive one forgetting the name of an individual, amongst 70 or so present.

You're perfectly entitled to hold this view, but elite official should know their sport inside out.
I don't have sufficient interest now, (or the memory) but when I was a teenager I could pretty much identify any player in the top two divisions, and many in the lower divisions too, along with their grounds, their managers etc.
If football is your full-time job and one of your roles is to help identify players, then I don't think it's actually asking too much to ask you to try to check them out in advance.
The coach in question here would be one of the most easily identifiable and recognisable in the "squad" , and he has an easy name to remember.
If, as you suggest, officials don't do pre-match research, then they must have very little interest in the game I would suggest, and are failing to prepare adequately.

[Eyres_11]

Can you read all what you posted Infront of your family members and see what they will tell you instead of trying to fuel a response on here. Unless your a sad little man living alone.

haha. Gladly. not fueling anything.

Good comeback by the way

You seem very upset, has it upset you?

[Grumps]

All football bodies, including referees receive diversity training.
The last time I saw it, the term.. Black... Was acceptable when talking about someone who was black.

[dsr]

You raise a good point.
Surely there should be training for all Elite officials that makes it clear that certain terms and related words must not be used?
It might be quite a long list, but these are theoretically the top officials, and therefore they should be trained appropriately.
If that training has not been given, (or at least guidance been issued) then your point is reasonable, and UEFA are seriously at fault.

Was there this controversy when Negredo was playing for Spain? For that matter, what about people called Black whose name translates inappropriately into Spanish and Romanian?

Has Stefan Kuntz any plans to change his name because of offence caused? He is the sort of name commentators would be apologising for if it comes across on TV matches with no crowd.

[arise_sir_charge]

It kicked off because some of these players and their friends and family have lived there lives getting negative treatment because of the colour of their skin and are used to being characterised by the colour of their skin in a way white people aren't and again in a way which treats them as inferior.

If someone is white you say that tall guy, that fat guy, that guy with that certain colour hair but with black people you just get that black guy as if being black is an unusual and irregular characteristic unlike the accepted norm of being white.

The fact that this caused so much upset to the point two teams walked off the pitch in solidarity should tell you all you need to know about whether this incident was problematic but as I stated in my first post on this thread there will be plenty desperate to play this down and defend and deflect against racism just like they did with the Millwall fans and just as they will do in the future no matter what the situation.

Its very sad that our society (and this board) is full of these kind of people but at least I can surround myself by good intelligent people who don't spend their energy on trying to defend racism or at least the certain kind of racism that they dont have a problem with.

Over to the the apologists........

Whilst you're clearly on one of your daft fishing trips, I will engage you as I actually think it's massively important issue.

If someone is white amongst a group of fellow white people, using a different differentiator like 'tall guy' would of course make perfect sense.

If someone is black amongst a group of fellow black people, using a different differentiator like "tall guy" would of course make perfect sense.

If there is a single white guy then using the differentiator white guy makes sense as does using black guy in the reverse scenario.

In this instance, Webo being black was irregular with those around him.

I think that we all know that in this instance the issue has been an unfortunate misunderstanding in respect of the use of the word negru. I'd be interested to know if we'd have seen the same furore had the Romanina said "the black guy" in English as opposed to in his native tongue.

[Grumps]

It kicked off because some of these players and their friends and family have lived there lives getting negative treatment because of the colour of their skin and are used to being characterised by the colour of their skin in a way white people aren't and again in a way which treats them as inferior.

If someone is white you say that tall guy, that fat guy, that guy with that certain colour hair but with black people you just get that black guy as if being black is an unusual and irregular characteristic unlike the accepted norm of being white.

The fact that this caused so much upset to the point two teams walked off the pitch in solidarity should tell you all you need to know about whether this incident was problematic but as I stated in my first post on this thread there will be plenty desperate to play this down and defend and deflect against racism just like they did with the Millwall fans and just as they will do in the future no matter what the situation.

Its very sad that our society (and this board) is full of these kind of people but at least I can surround myself by good intelligent people who don't spend their energy on trying to defend racism or at least the certain kind of racism that they dont have a problem with.

Over to the the apologists........

The players won't have walked off because they all heard what was said

They will have walked off because of what they were told someone had heard... Or misheard.

[Devils_Advocate]

Whilst you're clearly on one of your daft fishing trips, I will engage you as I actually think it's massively important issue.

If someone is white amongst a group of fellow white people, using a different differentiator like 'tall guy' would of course make perfect sense.

If someone is black amongst a group of fellow black people, using a different differentiator like "tall guy" would of course make perfect sense.

If there is a single white guy then using the differentiator white guy makes sense as does using black guy in the reverse scenario.

In this instance, Webo being black was irregular with those around him.

I think that we all know that in this instance the issue has been an unfortunate misunderstanding in respect of the use of the word negru. I'd be interested to know if we'd have seen the same furore had the Romanina said "the black guy" in English as opposed to in his native tongue.

It had nothing to do with the misinterpretation of the word negru. I've seen the footage with Ba's audio and he is using the correct translation and saying why is it always the black guy but never the white guy

I'm not fishing I just don't try and make me excuses for racism like you do so you are entitled to your views and opinion but I'm just glad I don't share them

[arise_sir_charge]

It had nothing to do with the misinterpretation of the word negru. I've seen the footage with Ba's audio and he is using the correct translation and saying why is it always the black guy but never the white guy

I'm not fishing I just don't try and make me excuses for racism like you do so you are entitled to your views and opinion but I'm just glad I don't share them

The footage of Ba is a follow up to the original altercation where Webo is referencing negru.

I’m not making excuses, I’m simply prepared to consider that not everything is racist, many black pundits agree with me as it happens.

[Devils_Advocate]

The footage of Ba is a follow up to the original altercation where Webo is referencing negru.

I’m not making excuses, I’m simply prepared to consider that not everything is racist, many black pundits agree with me as it happens.

I dont want to go back and forward as thats when these topics can become tiresome for others but I think you ask a fair question in a good way so I think its polite to give a response

Initially there is no question the word negru was used but there are two things id point out. One these are people living and working in and around Europe who unlike the majority of us Brits tend to be multi lingual so I think the people involved would easily understan what the Romanian official is saying and not so easily conflate it with the N word like we might. The second point is they didnt all just storm off. There was a lot of discussion with the officials and amongst themselves and its here the point was clearly being made about the official referring to the coach as the black guy (not a negru or any other variation of that word). When the players made a decision to walk off there was no confusion about what was said and what the issue was and they all felt it necessary to make a stand which says a lot to me especially when how reluctant players and teams have been to walk off in the passed when facing racist situations

As for your last paragraph now if we got past the discussion that using this terminology is not right and has racist connotations then there is a very good discussion around the 4th official and his use of that phrasing.

I dont see the 4th official as being a racist and deliberately making a racist comment and I actually feel a bit sorry for him but its more a case that the negative way BAME people are viewed treated and discussed is just casually embedded in a lot of everyday culture which links back to some horrific times for BAME people in the western world.

This is central to the issue around things like BLM as its not a case that society is full of people in white hoods looking to attack black people but that its much more nuanced and complex than that.

The problem this leads to is it turns into a real culture war where some people will weaponise racism whilst some go straight on the defensive in a way they wouldnt do with any other subject.

IMO we need to get past this initial stage where we have to fight just to get people to recognise racism exists instead of battling against people who will just try and do anything to defend and deflect. Only then will we really be able to make a difference and isolate both the racists and those who use racism as a political weapon (on all sides) and discredit them all.

Unfortunately I think we are miles away from that as there seems to be too many people who seem threatened by addressing racism for whatever reason that might be.

Anyhow thats my full view on the matter so i'll leave it there and others can have their opinions and disagree with mine as its nice to be able to discuss these subjects and in the process be able to disagree completely without overstepping any boundarys and forcing the mods to lock or remove the thread

[FactualFrank]

5-1 to PSG.

[Bosscat]

5-1 to PSG.

Thats the best way to deal with the situation

[CFS]

haha. Gladly. not fueling anything.

Good comeback by the way

You seem very upset, has it upset you?

Closet ones like you do bother me yes sir. Grow a pair come on please we dare you to.

[Elizabeth]

Stop it!

[Lowbankclaret]

Perhaps all club officials should have registered number which is on their team kit. That way everyone can be identified by the club number.

[Quickenthetempo]

5-1 to PSG.

Am I right in thinking PSG had a man sent off early on last night but were able to start the re-arranged match with 11 for the easy win?

[Winstonswhite]

No, you’re not right in thinking that.

[Elizabeth]

Thanks lowbank for a suggestion that raised my morale in this swamp infested arena. I think that’s the way forward , trying to solve problems instead of making them

[elwaclaret]

I can see how this has happened and it is unfortunate. Eastern European’s attitude’s and translation are very different than ours. Nor is it beyond belief that if there had been one white fella in the middle of a group of black players that he would of indeed said the white guy.

The fact is these days in the West it is best never to give any room for offence to be taken... as it surely will be taken by someone.

[Eyres_11]

Closet ones like you do bother me yes sir. Grow a pair come on please we dare you to.

Closet what? Go on, say it, slander me, on here - please - make my evening.

As for your threat; anytime chump - let me know when and where yeah? I’m p1ssing myself - ‘soz hard’

[Elizabeth]

I think the moderators are doing their best on this thread so it would be a shame if a couple of posters spoiled it for everybody else.
I would applaud stronger action is taken against posters not big enough to put the interests of others over their own ego

[Quickenthetempo]

No, you’re not right in thinking that.

Can you elaborate then please.

I genuinely don't know all the facts with not watching either game. Only the little clips sky sports news have shown.

[Stayingup]

If you can’t speak freely without offending someone then maybe you need to have a little think about what you’re saying.

Jeez. Heard it all now. So many going for a medal.in the victimhood Olympics and the wallflowers cant see it. Buy themselves a box of hankies and sit in a dark room and have a good cry

[Swizzlestick]

Can you elaborate then please.

I genuinely don't know all the facts with not watching either game. Only the little clips sky sports news have shown.

PSG did not have a man sent off at any point.

[Elizabeth]

On that reasoning then that would mean nobody could say anything Riley.
I'm not perfect but surely before offering advice to anybody make sure your own house is in order

[Rumbletonk]

"Can anyone tell me how he should identify him as he doesnt know their names, and they arent wearing numbers, other than THE BLACK ONE?"

"Its NOT racist to describe the offender as the black one!

"We are telling people to call us black.. he doesnt know his name there are 6/7 coaches standing together all turkish .. 1 is to be sent off , the ref says which one THE BLACK ONE what else can he say to let the ref know?

"Why cant you describe a black man as being a black man?"

John Barnes

[Rileybobs]

Jeez. Heard it all now. So many going for a medal.in the victimhood Olympics and the wallflowers cant see it. Buy themselves a box of hankies and sit in a dark room and have a good cry

What does that even mean?

[Rileybobs]

On that reasoning then that would mean nobody could say anything Riley.
I'm not perfect but surely before offering advice to anybody make sure your own house is in order

That’s poor reasoning. I replied to a poster who claimed that “ You cannot speak freely without offending someone these days and this is really a nuisance.”

That doesn’t mean that ‘nobody can say anything’, it means that if you feel that you can’t say something without offending someone then maybe you’re saying something offensive. In which case it may be better to look at your own actions rather than dismissing other people’s reactions.

What is the meaning behind the comment about my house being in order? Have I got a history of posting offensive comments on here because I’d be interested to see examples of them? This is another example of people (you again) on here playing the man rather than the ball, and it’s one of the reasons these discussions get shut down.

[Elizabeth]

I’m not playing your game riley , I’ve said what I thought of your reply to the poster and I know your record of posting.

[dsr]

I think there is a problem with a certain type of person who thinks it's OK to refer to anyone who isn't white as "BAME". I'm not sure what the idea behind it is, but presumably it's not supposed to have the effect of assuming that if you aren't white you're just "the rest" lumped into one single who-cares-you-aren't-white group. Is it?

[Rileybobs]

I’m not playing your game riley , I’ve said what I thought of your reply to the poster and I know your record of posting.

What game? I’m literally trying to have a discussion - that you instigated! You’ve just proven my point about playing the man rather than the ball though, so thanks.

[CFS]

Closet what? Go on, say it, slander me, on here - please - make my evening.

As for your threat; anytime chump - let me know when and where yeah? I’m p1ssing myself - ‘soz hard’

Closet as in don't be shy in saying how you feel just let it out and I didn't threaten you I was merely encouraging you to come on out with your sad thoughts. When and where lol you aint jack let's get it straight pal don't be acting no tough guy.

[Eyres_11]

Closet as in don't be shy in saying how you feel just let it out and I didn't threaten you I was merely encouraging you to come on out with your sad thoughts. When and where lol you aint jack let's get it straight pal don't be acting no tough guy.

My thoughts are correct, I am afraid it is yours that are simply, well....wrong.

Apologies for the late reply, I was busy at my place of employment whilst you presumably were busy stopping people going to Blackpool whilst educating people on why we should no longer call black pudding by its name and instead refer to it as a coded number.

'you aint jack' - I didn't realise we already had some stateside fans.

If you are going to imply that I am 'something' then why not come out and say it in a public forum...

What a pillock you are, lad.

[CFS]

My thoughts are correct, I am afraid it is yours that are simply, well....wrong.

Apologies for the late reply, I was busy at my place of employment whilst you presumably were busy stopping people going to Blackpool whilst educating people on why we should no longer call black pudding by its name and instead refer to it as a coded number.

'you aint jack' - I didn't realise we already had some stateside fans.

If you are going to imply that I am 'something' then why not come out and say it in a public forum...

What a pillock you are, lad.

Once you go.......

I know she knows the rest.

[Eyres_11]

Once you go.......

I know she knows the rest.

Not a clue what you are talking about tbh. Not sure I care.

You just make sure you keep being offended by everything - you sure you aint Stan Collymore in disguise?