"FA to introduce retrospective bans for diving from next season ..."

[jdrobbo]

This was the headline, announced in 2017...

Panels of referees, former players etc, were put together, to come together following the weekend's action and discuss diving.

Danny Murphy was a panelist and he has just implied on radio that this has just been quietly faded out since the introduction of VAR, but nothing appears to be being done about it!

Any thoughts?

[fidelcastro]

He's probably right, but it's VAR that needs fading out... although I'd prefer it to be killed stone dead!

[RalphCoatesComb]

You'd have thought that the introduction of VAR would have helped stamp out this cheating.

Perhaps the bigger Clubs have players who are very good at it and don't want it stamping out.

Bring back the likes of Colin Blant and Dave Merrington. They'd sort out diving in an instant. You can dive when you're being stretchered off

[claretonthecoast1882]

Had this been done Salah would have played about 10 games a season since then.

[dsr]

The problem is that they have "abolished" it by making it legal. As the guidance to referees says, if a player is touched, however gently, than it is a foul and the player is entitled to go down; in fact the guidance goes further and says that it only becomes a foul if the player goes down.

[ten bellies]

The problem is that they have "abolished" it by making it legal. As the guidance to referees says, if a player is touched, however gently, than it is a foul and the player is entitled to go down; in fact the guidance goes further and says that it only becomes a foul if the player goes down.

And that is why the game as a contact sport is over. The endorsement of cheating by the authorities is sickening.

[Colburn_Claret]

VAR is a technology, a machine, its impossible for VAR to make a wrong decision.
It's the referees that are no bloody good, even with all the technology. Scrapping VAR would just allow referees to go back to being incompetent. It's the referees that need scrapping. A multi billion dollar industry, officiated by amateurs.
Root and branch the referee system has to go.
Any ex pro, who I think should be getting the jobs, would spot the dives, would recognise that there was no intent from Soucek, would know when a shirt pull is so a defender can feel the run of the player he's marking, rather than trying to impede the run. We need people in charge who understand the game, as well as the rules, and the present incumbents are clueless.

[Claretforever]

Seeing as the technology isn’t to the level required yet - immediate and automated - then I’d rather go back to the referee only. Goal celebrations are now dampened because of it and yes, I’d rather a referee get it slightly wrong now and again than still get it wrong but taking 2 minutes longer to do so.

[IanMcL]

Like VAR, the big clubs divers would be excused and the rest be penalised again.

Prem is fixed for the 6.

[Steve1956]

Had this been done Salah would have played about 10 games a season since then.

He really is a cheat of the worse kind

[ClaretMov]

They won't ban big name player's its more aimed at player's like Barnes you watch

[DCWat]

VAR was never going to stamp it out on its own. The element still required, when it comes to diving, is retrospective bans.

I’m fed up of the ‘if there’s contact you’re “entitled” to go down and it’s a foul’. What a load of nonsense.

There will always be coming togethers and the like. A players first thought should be to try to stay on their feet.

[bf2k]

Can you actually go accused of diving now? Managers all say if you're touched you have the right to go down. Therefore, prove someone hasn;t been touched.

Example, I don't think the Tarky/Jesus incident was a penalty. There was no way on earth that Jesus went over or was impeded at all from that touch on his heel. But he went down and in my opinion should have been penalised for diving, but that's a brave person to ban him for diving because it's so subjective.

[Colburn_Claret]

Can you actually go accused of diving now? Managers all say if you're touched you have the right to go down. Therefore, prove someone hasn;t been touched.

Example, I don't think the Tarky/Jesus incident was a penalty. There was no way on earth that Jesus went over or was impeded at all from that touch on his heel. But he went down and in my opinion should have been penalised for diving, but that's a brave person to ban him for diving because it's so subjective.

There will always be close calls that can't be proved one way or the other, but there are also blatant dives that get 'overlooked', that the vast majority of fans and pundits can see. If these blatant divers get punished it can only discourage those who are better at it. So Jesus may well have made a meal of it, but would he have done the same if he thought he'd be banned if he didn't pull it off.

[Woodleyclaret]

That play acting in the WestHam game when a players went down clutching his face was outrageous as was the now overturned red card.
Digne was play acting in Evertons recent game feigning injury
Unfortunately , a lot of Spanish players see this as part of the rules there to be exploited for their advantage
We need a clamp down as Sean has been advocating for the past few years

[chekhov]

The problem is that they have "abolished" it by making it legal. As the guidance to referees says, if a player is touched, however gently, than it is a foul and the player is entitled to go down; in fact the guidance goes further and says that it only becomes a foul if the player goes down.

Is what you say here actually true? Can you refer to the law that states this?

[chekhov]

He really is a cheat of the worse kind

You could argue, in fairness, that Barnes “bought” his penalty the other week. Although you would struggle to find anyone on here to say Barnes is a cheat of the worst kind, I really don’t see a difference between his and Salah’s successful attempts at winning penalties.

[dsr]

Is what you say here actually true? Can you refer to the law that states this?

Obviously not. Guidance isn't law.

But can you honestly say that there is any chance referees aren't being encouraged to give fouls for the slightest contact, if the "fouled" player rolls about? If you see a duck go by overhead, you don't need to see a physics explanation of how wings work to know it can fly. Refs are encouraged to give free kicks for impressive falls- we can all see it.

[chekhov]

Obviously not. Guidance isn't law.

But can you honestly say that there is any chance referees aren't being encouraged to give fouls for the slightest contact, if the "fouled" player rolls about? If you see a duck go by overhead, you don't need to see a physics explanation of how wings work to know it can fly. Refs are encouraged to give free kicks for impressive falls- we can all see it.

Sorry, I should have written guidance instead of law. Can you quote the guidance that referees are following?

[Steve1956]

You could argue, in fairness, that Barnes “bought” his penalty the other week. Although you would struggle to find anyone on here to say Barnes is a cheat of the worst kind, I really don’t see a difference between his and Salah’s successful attempts at winning penalties.

There is a difference we get a penalty every blue moon,Liverpool get them regularly due to Salah's cheating

[Woodleyclaret]

That play acting in the WestHam game when a players went down clutching his face was outrageous as was the now overturned red card.
Digne was play acting in Evertons recent game feigning injury
Unfortunately , a lot of Spanish players see this as part of the rules there to be exploited for their advantage
We need a clamp down as Sean has been advocating for the past few years

[chekhov]

There is a difference we get a penalty every blue moon,Liverpool get them regularly due to Salah's cheating

Yeah but there is another very good reason why we don’t get more penalties. It’s because we don’t have fast, skilful players running into the box.
Essentially I believe our players employ the same tactics to win fouls as every other team in the league. It’s just that we don’t spend as much time as some teams in the opposition penalty area.

[aclaretinstevenage]

A multi billion dollar industry, officiated by amateurs.

I thought the "elite group" get a salary of circa £160,000 per year?

[dsr]

Sorry, I should have written guidance instead of law. Can you quote the guidance that referees are following?

No. I don't need to, because the way referees are refereeing makes it obvious that that is how they are being told to.

[Colburn_Claret]

I thought the "elite group" get a salary of circa £160,000 per year?

Just because they are paid it doesn't stop them being amateurish. With the way the system is now, referees are their own police, and they protect themselves by defending the indefensible.
Surely for160,000 we can get better that fat Moss and Jones. Where is the accountability.

[chekhov]

No. I don't need to, because the way referees are refereeing makes it obvious that that is how they are being told to.

Okay, so you are assuming they have some guidance that states this. I can see how you would come to this conclusion based on the way fouls appear to be given for the “slightest contact”.
However. I think it would be helpful to know what the actual guidance is, if it exists at all.

[duncandisorderly]

The trouble is that 'everyone else is doing it so we will do it too' has replaced 'stop that you cheating *******' and 'get up you soft ****'.

Collectively, we (fans, players, managers, pundits, referees) have made a rod for our own backs by treating millionaire playboys like the children they are instead of the men they should be.
There's no need for them to be embarrassed by their antics as it is 'part of the game'.

[corporal jones]

On the Salah one yesterday-he clearly went down far too easily but as the laws of the game are he was pulled back before he went down (watch it again and open you eyes if you dont believe me) and therefore its a pen. Maybe thats what the ref gave irrespective of the player falling over. The pull back was a foul no question but if he carries on running and misses the chance and nothing is given for the pull back?
Please engage brain before ranting back your response. Ta.

[Steve1956]

Yeah but there is another very good reason why we don’t get more penalties. It’s because we don’t have fast, skilful players running into the box.
Essentially I believe our players employ the same tactics to win fouls as every other team in the league. It’s just that we don’t spend as much time as some teams in the opposition penalty area.

Your right chekhov..Salah is very skillful at falling over at the slightest touch to win penalties,Barnes simply hasnt the same finesse

[dsr]

Okay, so you are assuming they have some guidance that states this. I can see how you would come to this conclusion based on the way fouls appear to be given for the “slightest contact”.
However. I think it would be helpful to know what the actual guidance is, if it exists at all.

If I ever find myself on the list of people to receive elite referees' guidance, then I will let you know. I don't doubt that guidance exists - as someone posted on here a few weeks ago, refs are marked on every decision they make and do not make, and they get told their marks as well, so they know if they are pleasing the shadowy powers-that-be. The idea that they might not have any guidance is risible.

[chekhov]

If I ever find myself on the list of people to receive elite referees' guidance, then I will let you know. I don't doubt that guidance exists - as someone posted on here a few weeks ago, refs are marked on every decision they make and do not make, and they get told their marks as well, so they know if they are pleasing the shadowy powers-that-be. The idea that they might not have any guidance is risible.

Yes I’m sure you’re right, that they get guidance. Anyway, personally I have a lot of sympathy for referees. In a way they are doing an impossible job. I would be surprised if they are instructed to give free kicks if a player goes down after even a slight contact, although we see this often appears to be the case. It’s so difficult when players have made an art form of going down theatrically. A far cry from the classic dying swan impersonations we were used to seeing in the old days!

[Hibsclaret]

So would Martial be banned for diving for his pen when they already lead 7 - 0? Err no because both the ref and Var think it was a penalty because there was contact. A clearer dive you won’t see...

[tiger76]

So would Martial be banned for diving for his pen when they already lead 7 - 0? Err no because both the ref and Var think it was a penalty because there was contact. A clearer dive you won’t see...

The Martial one was embarrassing, and yet VAR somehow didn't clear it up, not as bad as Fernandes at Villa last season though, that's the worst decision I've ever seen, and yet again the VAR official didn't see fit to intervene.