Really tough on the fans

bodge · Post by **bodge** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:17 pm

"Inevitable that we have two camps tonight", crosspool thinks we are in a playground tonight, dear oh dear.

dougcollins · Post by **dougcollins** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:18 pm

Wokingclaret wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:15 pm
To be fair. Cork is injured and Pieters suspenders

That's an image I don't want to see.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:19 pm

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:13 pm
Disagree. Tarks, Cork, Pieters played at Fulham. Experienced professionals.

Absolutely...As soon as the team sheet was out tonight it felt different to the Fulham game. As soon as we have neither Mee or Tarks in the back 4 and add to that missing Pieters and, as you say Cork it weakens the team by a very significant percentage. I appreciate it as a risk playing both Mee and Tarks but I think one should have been in. You don’t often get Bournemouth at home in the round before the QF of the cup.

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:19 pm

Wokingclaret wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:15 pm
To be fair. Cork is injured and Pieters suspenders

Your predictive text gives away what you’ve been browsing recently

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:20 pm

dougcollins wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:18 pm
That's an image I don't want to see.

His missus on the other hand...

Jamesy · Post by **Jamesy** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:22 pm

Mala591 wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:19 pm
Your predictive text gives away what you’ve been browsing recently

I bet it was more appealing than the match?

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:25 pm

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:22 pm
I bet it was more appealing than the match?

Yes, the next question is ‘were the suspenders for himself?’

Jamesy · Post by **Jamesy** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:29 pm

I think we should leave it right there Mala!

northeastclaret · Post by **northeastclaret** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:06 pm

When Tarks played Fulham he gave everything and was immense, but the next match he was off it and jaded , I would prefer a fresh and injured Tarks and Mee for Palace.

Targetman · Post by **Targetman** » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:11 pm

Danieljwaterhouse wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 7:50 pm
No, you play at least one of your experienced CB’s. Simple as that. Huge error by Dyche.

Not as though you haven't made any huge errors?

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:19 am

This match wasn't about seeing if the players are good enough. We know what Long can do; and if we want to see what Dunne can do, we need to see him play alongside Mee or Tarkowski. If you play the reserves en bloc, you don't get to see how well the players perform in the first team; you get to see how the reserves perform at a (slightly) higher level.

This wasn't about resting players. Ben Mee has played 8 matches in the 6 weeks of this year so far, and he is due to play 16 more in the remaining 15 weeks. That isn't beyond possibility. I know it's widely accepted that the richer the player, the less fit he is. but when I remember Graham Alexander playing 60 matches and seven or eight others playing 50+ in out play-off season, it is hard to believe that 40 is the absolute maximum for this lot.

This wasn't about protecting players from injury. Bournemouth aren't the Leeds United of the 70's. There were no tackles flying in. Fair enough. if all training is to be suspended for the rest of the season for fear of injuring someone, then I'll believe it was about protecting players. But if training is carrying on as usual, then all they need do was have one day off from training and the players could have played tonight with no significant increased risk of injury.

This team selection was about getting knocked out of the cup. There is no other reason for picking Long and Dunne together.

bfcmik · Post by **bfcmik** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:03 am

To be fair to Dyche, not that I really feel like being so, quite a few of the players last night have many PL starts/appearances to their name and the others have significant League experience either here (Long) or whilst on loan (Benson, Glennon, Dunne). The side he put out there should have, at least, been able to give it a go and shown some fight. A complete lack of any kind of on field leadership shows that Dyche does have to take his share of the blame for the showing but the players out there have to take the bigger proportion.

All of them train week in, week out, with the 1st team squad and should have been able to play in those roles quite easily given that they are repeating the same thing every day at Barnfield. Instead, we had a disorganised rabble at times instead of a defence - Long and Dunne playing separately with no understanding of where the other was, Glennon and Bardsley getting pulling inside and being way too far off overlapping players, BPF not talking to his defenders nor making any attempt to control his penalty area. A central midfield that had one player looking totally disinterested and the other not looking for the ball or running around like a headless chicken. 2 widemen who rarely looked to get past their man to the byline and too often looked to turn back towards our defenders (McNiel did have a couple of runs with no decent end product and then a single powerful run and shot when he moved inside - his one footedness is making it easier for defenders to mark him) and then we have the strikers - one so far off form he should have been in quarantine instead of playing (and I like JRod!) and the other who is too easily disheartened when things aren't going well.

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:01 am

Wellsy1882 wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:55 pm
Burnley FC is compulsary
Its just very poor to watch at the min. Something has to change. Next 3 games are key

Hence tonight's team selection, at least someone gets it

Jamesy · Post by **Jamesy** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:54 am

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:01 am
Hence tonight's team selection, at least someone gets it

Oh so let’s just not bother then.

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 am

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:54 am
Oh so let’s just not bother then.

Look, I don't give a toss about a cup competition that I wouldn't get to go and watch, even if we got to the final
I'd rather we do the best to maintain our Premier league status, so that when I can go and watch, I'll be watching the best level I can. Players like Mee and Tarks deserve a break, they also need protecting...... In my view of course, but if you'd prefer the gamble of maybe getting further in the cup, and losing our Premier league status, then so be it

Les Lawrence · Post by **Les Lawrence** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 am

Fans need to stop paying to watch any cup games at home,when we are allowed back in.Dyche doesn't give a **** about any cup including the Europa League.Get to high has we can in league,nice Brucie bonus for all

Jamesy · Post by **Jamesy** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:30 am

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 am
Look, I don't give a toss about a cup competition that I wouldn't get to go and watch, even if we got to the final
I'd rather we do the best to maintain our Premier league status, so that when I can go and watch, I'll be watching the best level I can. Players like Mee and Tarks deserve a break, they also need protecting...... In my view of course, but if you'd prefer the gamble of maybe getting further in the cup, and losing our Premier league status, then so be it

Each to their own Grumps. Premier League is obviously the be all and end all for you. Hope you are looking forward to another season of mind numbing Premier League survival football?

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:40 am

Jamesy wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:30 am
Each to their own Grumps. Premier League is obviously the be all and end all for you. Hope you are looking forward to another season of mind numbing Premier League survival football?

Not quiet how its been, I don't think 7th place is mind numbing survival, but like you say, each to their own

jojomk1 · Post by **jojomk1** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:00 am

Not read all the posts on this thread but one of my thoughts would be, as well as tough on the fans it also applies to the players
What were some of them thinking as they sat on the bench and watched that performance
I'm sure they would have wanted a good cup run far more than Dyche, and certainly the likes of Tarks and Cork who played in the last game would have wanted/expected to be out on the pitch
Last night was a tactical disaster from the manager and whilst he can maybe file it to the back of his mind I'm sure the players will feel a more personal disappointment towards him

Wellsy1882 · Post by **Wellsy1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:01 am

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 am
Look, I don't give a toss about a cup competition that I wouldn't get to go and watch, even if we got to the final
I'd rather we do the best to maintain our Premier league status, so that when I can go and watch, I'll be watching the best level I can. Players like Mee and Tarks deserve a break, they also need protecting...... In my view of course, but if you'd prefer the gamble of maybe getting further in the cup, and losing our Premier league status, then so be it

Yeah maybe at round 3
Not when your playing lower league to get in the quarters

Danieljwaterhouse · Post by **Danieljwaterhouse** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:16 am

Targetman wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:11 pm
Not as though you haven't made any huge errors?

fatboy47 · Post by **fatboy47** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:39 am

Plenty of drama queenery on offer.

Can't blame Dyche...no doubt he's been mandated to keep us in the Prem at any cost.

The problem here is the quality of the squad...a predictable result of Garlick collaring the Prem largesse for his own wallet rather than investing in the playing staff.....its also a reason why the TV companies and the PL would love to see the back of us.

jojomk1 · Post by **jojomk1** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 9:02 am

fatboy47 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:39 am
Can't blame Dyche...no doubt he's been mandated to keep us in the Prem at any cost.

The problem here is the quality of the squad...a predictable result of Garlick collaring the Prem largesse for his own wallet rather than investing in the playing staff.....its also a reason why the TV companies and the PL would love to see the back of us.

Not so says Alan, as his plans still apply even if we get relegated

As for TV and PL there may be some merit to the argument as our style does not exactly encourage the highest viewing figures from neutrals

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 9:18 am

An article appeared in The Guardian at the end of last season featuring Ben Mee, in which he highlighted the lack of depth in the Burnley squad and how at times it was hardly reassuring at certain stages of the season to look across at the bench and see it filled with young kids just learning their trade. He understood that the club was making every effort to bring in several new players to strengthen in certain areas.

In the two transfer windows that followed that article we signed just 1 player - Stephens.

No more excuses we deserve all we get really.

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 9:23 am

Espia wrote: ↑
Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:17 pm
You're obviously therefore in the camp of the FA Cup being a complete waste of time and effort if you think it right and proper that the game that could get us in the last 8 of the worlds oldest and arguably most esteemed cup competition in the footballing world should be used as an experiment to see if the youngsters are up to it. Incredible. Attitudes like that make me want to walk away from the game altogether.

No, tbh I wasn't saying that in such black and white terms, as I was as disappointed as anybody that we got knocked out so easily last night by what is nowadays actually a Championship side, despite their recent stay in the PL. I was saying that I understand Dyche's priority being the league as that ensures £120+ million of cash flowing into the club every season and secures the future of the club and no doubt his employers will probably have something to say if he doesn't prioritise that. He was juggling with a crowded fixture list, some crucial league games coming up thick and fast and a number of injuries and knocks in the squad. I would probably have picked largely the team he picked in the circumstances and they SHOULD have been good enough, but they were way off and if that doesn't tell him something, in particular about Kevin Long, then I'll be even more disappointed. I don't believe he was knowingly "experimenting" with the team. I believe he was doing pretty much the only sensible thing he could do. Any injuries to either Tarks or Mee for example, would have meant almost certain relegation.

Billy Balfour · Post by **Billy Balfour** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:11 am

Last night showed us how valuable our key players are and why we can't afford to any risk injuries to them in a FA Cup tie. They also need rest given the overcrowded fixture schedule. Dyche called this right.

ralph8 · Post by **ralph8** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:22 am

Sticking the crucial Fulham game in for next week in an already busy schedule must have made a big impact on team selection. I think we lost a few players in the earlier cup games.

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:57 am

"Last night showed us how valuable our key players are and why we can't afford to risk any injuries to them in an FA Cup tie"

Just another way of saying that our squad lacks any real depth following a succession of poor transfer windows, and when you take out those key players the cupboard is pretty much bare. As last night's game revealed.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:13 am

ralph8 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:22 am
Sticking the crucial Fulham game in for next week in an already busy schedule must have made a big impact on team selection. I think we lost a few players in the earlier cup games.

Which means we get an extra days rest over Fulham as they play Sunday, and we dont have any travel days/time.

We shall see first hand how much the extra rest has done for us compared to them.

Billy Balfour · Post by **Billy Balfour** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:26 am

kentonclaret wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:57 am
"Last night showed us how valuable our key players are and why we can't afford to risk any injuries to them in an FA Cup tie"

Just another way of saying that our squad lacks any real depth following a succession of poor transfer windows, and when you take out those key players the cupboard is pretty much bare. As last night's game revealed.

Well quite. That's the bare-bones of it.

diamondpocket · Post by **diamondpocket** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:37 am

The major defending point of Dyche is Prem survival because of the 120 million+ we get each year. Great. That's understood.
So where is that money going? Most of it on the players we have / had. Great! Is this what 120 million squid gets ya? Watching footballers struggling to pass a ball and get into a space to receive it making an odd chance here and there. It's turgid football most weeks with an odd 2nd half push, that is getting us 120 million! I can't believe it.
We can't play any of our 1st choice defenders for a QF place (one game away from Wembley against who knows another Champ side or Sheff utd or Wolves etc) and we've just given another contract to Long who we all know is never good enough (as shown last night)! Great. And we've just given new contracts/extensions to current players who are average at best and without a couple of other players, aka Tarks, Mee & Dwight, would easily take us down if they are 1st choice (Lowts, Johan, Long, Pieters).
It's not this year I'd be worried about because clearly most of the budget has already been spent on this squad coz it's here to stay. All we will do is replace like for like a Tarky replacement (no wonder out better players wanna leave if the ambition shown last night is anything to go by) and possibly Dwight. The rest are all under contract and here to stay coz who seriously wants to buy our players.

IWOODLOVETT · Post by **IWOODLOVETT** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:39 am

MACCA wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:13 am
Which means we get an extra days rest over Fulham as they play Sunday, and we dont have any travel days/time.

We shall see first hand how much the extra rest has done for us compared to them.

Trouble is Palace are much more physical side than Everton.

Ipreferaflan · Post by **Ipreferaflan** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:04 pm

Regardless of whether fans would've been at the game or not; to potentially have the opportunity of being one game away from a semi-final at Wembley should not have been sniffed at. These opportunities don't come around too often, as is evident from our record. We could have a much more capable squad next year, but you still have to rely on luck, good performances and generous draws to get to the last 8 of any competition.

Resting players makes sense, but you do it to a degree that still gives you a realistic chance of winning the game. It's obvious that in any one game, there should at least be one of either Mee or Tarkowski, especially given the lack of quality in back up and also that they've done this in previous rounds. I genuinely feel that either one of them playing last night would have been enough to win the game.

So frustrating and such a wasted opportunity.

Woodleyclaret · Post by **Woodleyclaret** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:20 pm

Stay up picking up 9 points on the next three games is our priority
I for one dont subscribe to lets go down mentality as it was better in the Championship
The only thing good was getting promoted and staying up is vital

snapcrackleandpop · Post by **snapcrackleandpop** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:20 pm

fatboy47 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 8:39 am
Plenty of drama queenery on offer.

Can't blame Dyche...no doubt he's been mandated to keep us in the Prem at any cost.

The problem here is the quality of the squad...a predictable result of Garlick collaring the Prem largesse for his own wallet rather than investing in the playing staff.....its also a reason why the TV companies and the PL would love to see the back of us.

Of course you can blame Dyche he picked the team, make 4/5 changes not 9 - 100% Dyches' fault.

Ipreferaflan · Post by **Ipreferaflan** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:43 pm

Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:20 pm
Stay up picking up 9 points on the next three games is our priority
I for one dont subscribe to lets go down mentality as it was better in the Championship
The only thing good was getting promoted and staying up is vital

It's not a choice between winning last night and winning on Saturday though!? Both are/were possible.

Ric_C · Post by **Ric_C** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:51 pm

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 am
Look, I don't give a toss about a cup competition that I wouldn't get to go and watch, even if we got to the final
I'd rather we do the best to maintain our Premier league status, so that when I can go and watch, I'll be watching the best level I can.

Exactly my sentiments. Football is a means to an end at the moment.

JTClaret · Post by **JTClaret** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:52 pm

As soon as the team sheet was announced I felt a defeat was coming, weirdly along with the poor performance.

It shows a lack of squad depth, a lack of rotation to the usual starting 11 and an inability to play against teams that are considered below us (at least in terms of the leagues).

On the plus side, even if we did do well, we couldn't go to wembley to watch, and that would be devastating.

Belial · Post by **Belial** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:57 pm

Not read most of this thread but IMO last night was a win-win situation for Sean. He picks the kids whilst resting a few. If they win....great...kids can step up and we're into the next round. If they lose, so be it, and it highlights to the new guys that we need better reinforcements

DomBFC1882 · Post by **DomBFC1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:36 pm

Belial wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:57 pm
Not read most of this thread but IMO last night was a win-win situation for Sean. He picks the kids whilst resting a few. If they win....great...kids can step up and we're into the next round. If they lose, so be it, and it highlights to the new guys that we need better reinforcements

Not win win for the fans though is it

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:55 pm

DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:36 pm
Not win win for the fans though is it

Was for me

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:16 pm

IWOODLOVETT wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:39 am
Trouble is Palace are much more physical side than Everton.

I'd rather play C Palace than Everton, and with the bonus over a days extra rest.

DomBFC1882 · Post by **DomBFC1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:16 pm

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:55 pm
Was for me

You're easily pleased then

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:25 pm

DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:16 pm
You're easily pleased then

Not really, just realistic....

DomBFC1882 · Post by **DomBFC1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:29 pm

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:25 pm
Not really, just realistic....

What makes you realistic then please elaborate?

The fact that Dyche made far too many changes unlike the Fulham game where we had a blend of younger players alongside some seasoned pros, especially in defence?

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:37 pm

DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:29 pm
What makes you reliastic then please elaborate?

The fact that Dyche made far too many changes unlike the Fulham game where we had a blend of younger players alongside some seasoned pros, especially in defence?

Realising that for the club, Premier league survival is paramount, therefore team selection was based on giving important players a rest, and protecting others who were coming back from injury, or had minor knocks.
Play the team they did, if they win all well and good, but also we can put our strongest team out in the really important games... So win win.

DomBFC1882 · Post by **DomBFC1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:41 pm

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:37 pm
Realising that for the club, Premier league survival is paramount, therefore team selection was based on giving important players a rest, and protecting others who were coming back from injury, or had minor knocks.
Play the team they did, if they win all well and good, but also we can put our strongest team out in the really important games... So win win.

If that's the case, why did mcneil play? Surely he needed a rest.

We're 8 points clear of the drop, you make it out like We're 3 points from safety. Playing Tarky alongside Long and Westwood next to Stephens wouldn't have been a killer

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:12 pm

DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:41 pm
If that's the case, why did mcneil play? Surely he needed a rest.

We're 8 points clear of the drop, you make it out like We're 3 points from safety. Playing Tarky alongside Long and Westwood next to Stephens wouldn't have been a killer

McNeil has been out injured, so hasn't played as much as those rested.
Cork has a knock, so daft risking Westwood
Lose next two games because of injuries from last night, and we wouldn't be 8 points clear.

DomBFC1882 · Post by **DomBFC1882** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:15 pm

Grumps wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:12 pm
McNeil has been out injured, so hasn't played as much as those rested.
Cork has a knock, so daft risking Westwood
Lose next two games because of injuries from last night, and we wouldn't be 8 points clear.

But we're most definitely not guaranteed to win them either. Winning breeds confidence as mentioned so i don't get last night at all. The defence yesterday is what annoyed me most. The rest of the team I can live with.

Grumps · Post by **Grumps** » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:23 pm

DomBFC1882 wrote: ↑
Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:15 pm
But we're most definitely not guaranteed to win them either. Winning breeds confidence as mentioned so i don't get last night at all. The defence yesterday is what annoyed me most. The rest of the team I can live with.

The only thing would have been to play mee or tarks, or both of them, personally iam glad he didn't, as I don't give a hoot about the FA Cup at the moment.
It's not guaranteed we win the big games coming up, but the strongest team, gives us the best chance