What style of football would you like to see?

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:42 pm

If you watch Manchester City or Barcelona, it’s all about being comfortable in possession, patient build-up through the units and plenty of passing. It can be a joy to watch.

Arsenal of old, used to be guilty of over-passing and trying to thread that needle just a little too much. I found that frustrating m to watch.

Eddie Howe’s philosophy was a good one, but I didn’t like watching it. Lots of sideways passing and far too much time spent knocking the ball around in the middle third, quite slowly (both at Burnley and Bournemouth).

The mixed football of Dyche can be a pleasure, but also frustrating. Truth be told, you often get a different combination of ‘mixed’ with each game. Keeps us on our toes.

For me, I like 442, with two attacking full backs and two wingers that beat their man, fire crossed into the box and provide constant supply for hungry forwards. I grew up watching the Manchester United side of the early 90’s. Yes they had the added class of Cantona, but how they played was quite simple but pleasing on the eye.

If you could choose a way to watch us play, what style ‘grabs you’?

J

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:45 pm

Nothing wrong with the way we play now and as Dyche said on Saturday we can't always play the way we like because of the quality of the opposition.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:50 pm

ClaretTony wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:45 pm
Nothing wrong with the way we play now and as Dyche said on Saturday we can't always play the way we like because of the quality of the opposition.

Absolutely agree, with that. It’s effective.

huw.Y.WattfromWare · Post by **huw.Y.WattfromWare** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:04 pm

They have definitely been given more freedom and that can only have come from one man.
He gets a hard time for keeping us up playing as we do but as he showed in his two full seasons in the Championship he can manage a more expansive style of play that produces goals.
I’m more than happy to leave it to SD. He hasn’t let us down yet. Saying that I’m not bothered about cups or Europe. Watching some of the worlds finest footballers 38 games a season is enough for me.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:11 pm

This has got nothing to do with our current style of play

I like how we play. More a question on what style of football do you like the best and is there a reason for it?

Papabendi · Post by **Papabendi** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:19 pm

No real qualms with the way we play other than the odd game where we do look very one dimensional and just lump it to Wood and Barnes.

As we evolve I'd like to see a bit more pace come into the team. Not pace for pace's sake but genuine athletes who fit our framework. Appreciate that will be a budget concern.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:20 pm

Papabendi wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:19 pm
No real qualms with the way we play other than the odd game where we do look very one dimensional and just lump it to Wood and Barnes.

As we evolve I'd like to see a bit more pace come into the team. Not pace for pace's sake but genuine athletes who fit our framework. Appreciate that will be a budget concern.

Couldn't agree more with that.

Jakubs Tash · Post by **Jakubs Tash** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:24 pm

If we can't play the way we played on Saturday against all opponents then it's a case of deploying different tactics and shapes against the teams we struggle to play 442 direct football against. I don't mind playing 442 football that is 'direct' and 'effective' but this clearly doesn't work against some teams so I would like to see some different things being tried - a midfield diamond, a back 5, 433 and/or 451.... there are loads of different variations that could be tried but Dyche plays the same shape in the same way no matter who the opponents are. He doesn't even try different things in friendly matches! This is my frustration at times - we are so one dimensional.

NB - this is a frustration and certainly not an attempt to have a pop at the manager.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:27 pm

Play to hurt teams. Too many times we come up against CH who will win everything in the air all day. Or CH who are comfortable doing that all day but struggle when the balls on the ground. Times when we’ve played top teams we’ve made everything too comfortable for them. It’s if at times we put so much into trying to stop the opponent, we forget about how we can exploit them.

claretburns · Post by **claretburns** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:28 pm

Everyone wants to style themselves on the Barca of old or City today, but whilst them moments they get it right it is beautiful to watch, I find 75/80% of their games extremely boring to watch.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:34 pm

claretburns wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:28 pm
Everyone wants to style themselves on the Barca of old or City today, but whilst them moments they get it right it is beautiful to watch, I find 75/80% of their games extremely boring to watch.

I think City have become very boring to watch

Redbeard · Post by **Redbeard** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:35 pm

A la Brazil 1970.

Though I know it's not going to happen.

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:40 pm

Lots of speed, lots of crosses and old fashioned wingers.

Worst thing imaginable is watching Man City and Barca style, there’s a limit to how interesting it can be to see one centre back pass it to another centre back who then returns it

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:53 pm

I like the style of play where we score lots of goals and the opposition don't.

It really doesn't matter how that's done, it's entertaining. Can anyone honestly say that the Championship year under Dyche wasn't entertaining? It was 4-4-2 all along just like now, but because the opposition was less strong we were able to execute it a lot better. I've watched some of Brighton's games when they are not playing well and their brand of football played badly, is no better than our brand of football played badly.

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:00 pm

Our football is not pretty to watch at at all. All out defence and hoof it forward is 80s lower league stuff.

The best football to watch is fast one touch attacking play like Ajax of the 70s.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:09 pm

I admire the style of City, that long sweeping hoof ball by Ederson the other night was a thing of beauty.

keith1879 · Post by **keith1879** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:12 pm

jdrobbo wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:11 pm
This has got nothing to do with our current style of play I like how we play. More a question on what style of football do you like the best and is there a reason for it?

A winning style of play. Because we win.

gandhisflipflop · Post by **gandhisflipflop** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:14 pm

If I was setting a team up, i would love to see the return of the good old fashioned libero/sweeper and play in a 5-3-2 system ustilizing wing backs. Ironically our side does have the capacity for this formation although not the management to implement it and i actually loved the way we played against palace and would like to se more of that. I like the 5-3-2 as it offers the best of everything, wing backs going forward beating men, a number 10 behind 2 strikers and technical defenders who, if need be can mix it up if short passing football wasn't working. What i find tedious to watch however is teams like Norwich attempting the Pep Guardiola style football without the players who can do it which is around 90% of teams. It just results in ridiculous defending and is shite to watch.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:19 pm

SalisburyClaret wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:40 pm
Lots of speed, lots of crosses and old fashioned wingers.

Worst thing imaginable is watching Man City and Barca style, there’s a limit to how interesting it can be to see one centre back pass it to another centre back who then returns it

Thank you!

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:21 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:14 pm
If I was setting a team up, i would love to see the return of the good old fashioned libero/sweeper and play in a 5-3-2 system ustilizing wing backs. Ironically our side does have the capacity for this formation although not the management to implement it and i actually loved the way we played against palace and would like to se more of that. I like the 5-3-2 as it offers the best of everything, wing backs going forward beating men, a number 10 behind 2 strikers and technical defenders who, if need be can mix it up if short passing football wasn't working. What i find tedious to watch however is teams like Norwich attempting the Pep Guardiola style football without the players who can do it which is around 90% of teams. It just results in ridiculous defending and is shite to watch.

Good thoughts.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:22 pm

A style where can keep hold of the ball for a bit. With a 442 in this league, when one of the midfielders gets on the ball they're almost instantly pressed and outnumbered and they either look for the long ball (or in Westwood's case he doesn't look at all), we get crowded out and lose it, or we turn back and give it to a defender to look long.

For me, the style we played in 17/18 was a joy. 3 midfielders operating in the middle gave us a real foothold even in games against the big 6. It just means we have to more patient and measured with our attacking rather than constantly trying to chuck it in behind (which does work for us sometimes).

It's true though that winning football is the best football. Nobody can accuse us of a lack of wins during 17/18.

claretburns · Post by **claretburns** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:24 pm

I think a lot of the perception comes from pundits and commentators as well. In the City v Tottenham game, for one of Gundogan's goals it was the long ball forward from Ederson, Jamie Carragher's exact words on commentary "That's not a long ball forward, that is a superb pass."

But you know for a fact if that was Pope hitting it forward for Barnes to run onto, it would be a "Long ball forward by Pope, luckily gets through to Barnes" etc.

Spike · Post by **Spike** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:26 pm

Winning football!

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:30 pm

ksrclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:22 pm
A style where can keep hold of the ball for a bit. With a 442 in this league, when one of the midfielders gets on the ball they're almost instantly pressed and outnumbered and they either look for the long ball (or in Westwood's case he doesn't look at all), we get crowded out and lose it, or we turn back and give it to a defender to look long.

For me, the style we played in 17/18 was a joy. 3 midfielders operating in the middle gave us a real foothold even in games against the big 6. It just means we have to more patient and measured with our attacking rather than constantly trying to chuck it in behind (which does work for us sometimes).

It's true though that winning football is the best football. Nobody can accuse us of a lack of wins during 17/18.

Love this. I have to say though, I thought our play in the first promotion season under Dyche was really exhilarating, with Trippier bombing on and providing brilliant ammunition for VIngs. Also the way Arfield, Jones and Marney zipped it about in midfield, was a joy.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:32 pm

we are a skillful pacey right sided winger and 1 truly pacey striker away from being a very competitive side that would comfortably finish top 10, I genuinely hate our style of play when it's Wood and Barnes up top but maybe that's because if Dwight is marked out of a game (because we have little threat from the other wing) we are forced to hoof it. Honestly, there have been games I've turned the TV off and done something else over the last couple of seasons because it's been that bad - THAT is something that Alan Pace and Co will have to address if there ambition is to be realised.

Saturday, we were brilliant.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:41 pm

jdrobbo wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:30 pm
Love this. I have to say though, I thought our play in the first promotion season under Dyche was really exhilarating, with Trippier bombing on and providing brilliant ammunition for VIngs. Also the way Arfield, Jones and Marney zipped it about in midfield, was a joy.

Agreed. Admittedly I'm not that old, but the season of 13/14 is still my clear favourite since I've been watching Burnley for all the reasons you've listed, along with the fact I had considered a 21st place finish to be a success when we started. It would take something extraordinary to knock it off top spot.

I think 442 does work really, really well in the Championship. Especially if one of the strikers is like Ings - able to drop off into midfield and then run in behind with equal success. The midfielders are that bit slower at pressing, and the defenders are that bit poorer.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:44 pm

Right_winger wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:00 pm
Our football is not pretty to watch at at all. All out defence and hoof it forward is 80s lower league stuff.

The best football to watch is fast one touch attacking play like Ajax of the 70s.

Or put another way, the best football to watch is that of a successful side that scores lots of goals.

Can you name a side that got relegated that was good to watch? Especially, one that their own fans enjoyed watching?

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:54 pm

dsr wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:44 pm
Or put another way, the best football to watch is that of a successful side that scores lots of goals.

Can you name a side that got relegated that was good to watch? Especially, one that their own fans enjoyed watching?

Yes Burnley under Coyle in our first stint in the Premier league was enjoyable to watch. Much much better than Dycheball.

gandhisflipflop · Post by **gandhisflipflop** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:55 pm

Right_winger wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:54 pm
Yes Burnley under Coyle in our first stint in the Premier league was enjoyable to watch. Much much better than Dycheball.

I hated that season getting tonked every single week.

BFCmaj · Post by **BFCmaj** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:58 pm

I say this a lot but I love watching the way we defend. We are so organised.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:58 pm

Interesting observations. The football played under Coyle in the Championship from November to May was a joy. The football played in the Premier League, with the exception of a handful of games - Sunderland, Birmingham and Hull (we were totally outplayed against Everton and United...just took our few chances and saw very little of the ball, including two missed penalties), was nowhere near as good as some of the stuff we’ve played under Dyche.

superdimitri · Post by **superdimitri** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:59 pm

I tend to enjoy the big man small man combo up front with wingers who get to the byline and fullbacks that support and cross from deep but none of the overlap or underlap business. I think we've had some great results playing two big men up top but it never has the potential that a big/small partnership.

In centre midfield I like to see some energy, good tackling and vision for a pass. Stephens hasn't been great for us but I have noticed he is decent at firing a deceptive pass at pace forward which is better than the usual crosses and passes backwards or sideways.

Been mentioned above but it's the sheer predictability of it that makes it easy for some teams, especially those that play 3 centre backs. If you mix you forward play in the air and on ground immediately you add an extra variable for opposing defender's to think about and if you come up against ones good in the air but slow you can change how you play dynamically.

One of my personal gripes with us recently is our poor holding up of the ball and poor long kicks to our strikers in general (usually Popes bad kicking). Players like Wood, Rodriguez and Barnes should all be capable of good hold up play but it's been frustrating this season because either they miss control the ball, don't receive a decent ball or miss place a simple lay off. When Vydra plays he often ends up with awkward balls in the air instead of his partner which just shows how poor our passing accuracy is.

Last game though it all came together. The centre forwards were making good runs into the channels and we're able to do exactly what they usually lack. Hopefully a sign of things to come.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:00 pm

BFCmaj wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:58 pm
I say this a lot but I love watching the way we defend. We are so organised.

I agree wholeheartedly with this and this is very much in relation to my reference of United. That side was built around their terrific back five of

Schmeical
Parker
Bruce
Pallister
Irwin

Jakubs Tash · Post by **Jakubs Tash** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:38 pm

Right_winger wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:54 pm
Yes Burnley under Coyle in our first stint in the Premier league was enjoyable to watch. Much much better than Dycheball.

Yes, I just loved getting absolutely battered off the better teams away from home and then having a soft under-belly against the poorer teams. At times, it was a joy to watch.....

gsyclaret · Post by **gsyclaret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:41 pm

Thought we were superb on Saturday and it was nice to see Dwight occasionally in the number 10 role marauding accross the pitch, more please.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:27 pm

Agree.

Top Claret · Post by **Top Claret** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:41 pm

Right_winger wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 3:54 pm
Yes Burnley under Coyle in our first stint in the Premier league was enjoyable to watch. Much much better than Dycheball.

Watching Burnley under Coyle in the Premier league was embarrassing, we were awful defencivly and way short of the mark through out.

Coyles side would not score a goal or earn a single point against Dyches Burnley

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:16 pm

They probably would, but I doubt they’d get more than the odd draw. I accept your point.

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:28 pm

Top Claret wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 5:41 pm
Watching Burnley under Coyle in the Premier league was embarrassing, we were awful defencivly and way short of the mark through out.

Coyles side would not score a goal or earn a single point against Dyches Burnley

It’s not what’s more successful but which style is better to watch and Coyles style is better than Dyche’s.

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:17 pm

Argentinian Route One

On the basis of the shortest distance to the goal from the centre circle, as practiced by Glen Little most.

Forwards and straight forward, almost Roman Road Football.

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:18 pm

'If Fosters Lager were a goal'...

"I can see the net from eer".

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:23 pm

Defenders without their glasses...

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:25 pm

Those types forced into defence at school but as an attacking force, there's the random accidental visit to hospital if you're not on your toes and quick like...

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:26 pm

The best football we played at Burnley in my lifetime was under Horseface.

It was scintillating at times. Lightning quick pass & move and hitting teams on the break.

I'd love to see that again with a bit more ability to hold possession.

But that's the stuff of dreams.

The football we play under Dyche it constantly misrepresented. We get labelled as "kick and rush" or "hoofball" but the truth is Dyche only ever tries to play one style - WINNING football.

When we could hit teams with pace on the break (his first season with Trips and Ings) we did so. We adapted massively in our first Premier League season under Dyche - just look at how improved our results were in the second half of the season compared to the first.

In the Championship season we adapted again, learning to play to the strengths of Barton and Gray to become an effective unit.

When we had Defour and a good squad we started to play more expansive and easy-on-the-eye stuff.

We've had to revert to a more basic style of play which isn't always the nicest to watch but there has only ever been ONE way of playing which Dyche has opted for: The most effective for the current team.

Playing nice football is nice. Playing winning football is better.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:32 pm

I totally agree about Coyle's promotion season. great football to watch.
shame we couldn't keep it going in the PL.

as for our current team; great when we play (or are allowed to, as SD says), but awful when we are up against it and resort to lumping it.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:34 pm

boatshed bill wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:32 pm
I totally agree about Coyle's promotion season. great football to watch.
shame we couldn't keep it going in the PL.

as for our current team; great when we play (or are allowed to, as SD says), but awful when we are up against it and resort to lumping it.

We did keep it going! That squad didn't know how to play any other way!

It's why we shipped so many bleeding goals!

what_no_pies · Post by **what_no_pies** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:37 pm

It's a funny one this. Howe's football was rubbish and Dyche's team mix it up far better and we can defend. Give me that over an Eddie Howe team passing it nowhere and being awful at defending all day long. Ask any none Burnley fan and they'd probably tell you Eddie Howe plays expansive football and that Dyche is a long ball merchant. It's an ignorant opinion but seems to be the popular one. Anyway, from extensive experience Dyche > Howe.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:37 pm

Rowls wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:34 pm
We did keep it going! That squad didn't know how to play any other way!

It's why we shipped so many bleeding goals!

Yes, I get your point.
But we weren't good enough for the PL, and it started o show, despite some good performances.

Dy1geo · Post by **Dy1geo** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:40 pm

I wasn’t old enough to remember the 70’s but we have featured on the Big Match revisited and the football we played then was in my opinion more pleasing on the eye than what we currently play. That is when the pitches cut up and tackles were flying in.

As for Dyche when we had Defour fit I think we got the balance right and some of the football we produced was good too watch.

As for style of play, someone said City were boring to watch but to me the way they played against Liverpool is the ideal style of football.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:05 pm

Dy1geo wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:40 pm
I wasn’t old enough to remember the 70’s but we have featured on the Big Match revisited and the football we played then was in my opinion more pleasing on the eye than what we currently play. That is when the pitches cut up and tackles were flying in.

Football was a better game then.