Clarets Fan Survey

[MACCA]

I would guess as I dont know for sure that as Macca points out the supporters clubs are either being let down so need to sort it out at short notice or are just making sure that a ticket gets used rather than sat in someones house in Burnley

How you police people letting their mates use their points or manage situations where peoples circumstances change at short notice is not easy and will probably end up causing a lot more hassle and hard work than the small benefit it might produce.

Wr have had it ourselves, things can change massively in 3 weeks after you've booked a ticket and paid for train or coach.

We have shifted tickets on genuinely when one of party has fell ill, had too many night before, doesnt fancy it, had to work, or other priorities crop up.
He will probably flog his train and ticket for half the cost he paid 3 weeks prior.

Supporters club will try and also sell the coach seat and ticket as it means they're losing money, and/or a ticket has been wasted.

[MACCA]

And this happens every big game? Maybe fans should start staying in on a Friday night

See my post at top of this page.

However we dont get our tickets that way, theres several ways to skin a cat.

We just make sure our group get tickets regardless as whether they're liverpool fans, no season ticket, not enough points, or even banned.
We have a lad who sorts it all out, we just give him the ticket money, he does the rest.

Never missed a game anyones wanted to go on, even the closed shop that was Aberdeen.

Often in life it's who you know that helps out in situations like these.

[SalisburyClaret]

See my post at top of this page.

However we dont get our tickets that way, theres several ways to skin a cat.

We just make sure our group get tickets regardless as whether they're liverpool fans, no season ticket, not enough points, or even banned.
We have a lad who sorts it all out, we just give him the ticket money, he does the rest.

Never missed a game anyones wanted to go on, even the closed shop that was Aberdeen.

Often in life it's who you know that helps out in situations like these.

This really shows how dodgy the set-up is - someone who just has the ticket money can successfully buy for a group - regardless of the tickets going on sale on line first, having no clarets numbers and with a variety of different loyalty points. As well as potentially being banned

[Grumps]

See my post at top of this page.

However we dont get our tickets that way, theres several ways to skin a cat.

We just make sure our group get tickets regardless as whether they're liverpool fans, no season ticket, not enough points, or even banned.
We have a lad who sorts it all out, we just give him the ticket money, he does the rest.

Never missed a game anyones wanted to go on, even the closed shop that was Aberdeen.

Often in life it's who you know that helps out in situations like these.

So now we've got banned fans getting tickets.... You couldn't make it up

[Jakubclaret]

Obtaining tickets anywhere in England across the leagues for whatever games is as easy as walking across a quiet street.

[MACCA]

So now we've got banned fans getting tickets.... You couldn't make it up

Been the case for a long time, certainly way before our ticket/point system has been in place, and probably happens at most if not every club.

It's the next generation of fans I feel sorry for, its them who are potentially missing out on the bays days for a very long time.

[MACCA]

This really shows how dodgy the set-up is - someone who just has the ticket money can successfully buy for a group - regardless of the tickets going on sale on line first, having no clarets numbers and with a variety of different loyalty points. As well as potentially being banned

See above.

[ClaretAL]

It might become a thing of the past if its tied to a smart phone and QR code rather than ticket/card....

[MACCA]

It might become a thing of the past if its tied to a smart phone and QR code rather than ticket/card....

A few things,

1. That will be a while off
2. Screen shot and send to other device
3. Give someone your phone

You will never ever stop people swapping or giving away tickets, if they've not managed to it at high profiled events, they certainly wont at what can be a load of dross of a Burnley away game.

[CoolClaret]

So now we've got banned fans getting tickets.... You couldn't make it up

Yep - sad really.

I saw Andy Porter at Burton Albion and I couldn't believe what i was seeing

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Firstly it's been common knowledge for years that the supporters groups seem to get tickets in bulk and hand them out to whoever wants them regardless of how many clarets points someone has.

Secondly after the revelations on here I no longer expect grief from the usual idiots about my allegiances when it clearly doesn't matter to some who gets a ticket for Burnley games.

[Devils_Advocate]

Secondly after the revelations on here I no longer expect grief from the usual idiots about my allegiances when it clearly doesn't matter to some who gets a ticket for Burnley games.

Who do you think the Liverpool fan is that Macca's talking about

[MACCA]

Yep - sad really.

I saw Andy Porter at Burton Albion and I couldn't believe what i was seeing

I was sat in a car outside the Turf on the day the tickets went on sale for the Reading away play off game, the queues were ridiculously long.

We were opposite the Bob Lord corporate entrance, and we saw a friend who asked how many we had, we said we didn't as we had no season tickets, no points and a 3 year away game banning order from the courts and a life time ban from the Turf in the group, and the rumours are there's less than 500 left, whilst there must be over a thousand still in the queue.

He asked how many we wanted, and said leave it with me. He made a call there and then, and said I've got your tickets, i just need to wait for the sold out sign/announcement.
We waited nervously for half an hour, he went in got the tickets and came out and said there you go, his relative only worked in the club shop or ticket office

So off we trotted down to Reading, and the worst bit of it was, we were spotted and on TV at full time celebrating away, couldnt make it up.

Same happened for Charlton other season.

It happens a lot, and it's fair enough, everyone wants to watch their team, especially in the big games.

[MACCA]

Who do you think the Liverpool fan is that Macca's talking about

That's between me and Sid, he sorts the entrance out for the other clubs we go to, to watch the action...

[Grumps]

I was sat in a car outside the Turf on the day the tickets went on sale for the Reading away play off game, the queues were ridiculously long.

We were opposite the Bob Lord corporate entrance, and we saw a friend who asked how many we had, we said we didn't as we had no season tickets, no points and a 3 year away game banning order from the courts and a life time ban from the Turf in the group, and the rumours are there's less than 500 left, whilst there must be over a thousand still in the queue.

He asked how many we wanted, and said leave it with me. He made a call there and then, and said I've got your tickets, i just need to wait for the sold out sign/announcement.
We waited nervously for half an hour, he went in got the tickets and came out and said there you go, his relative only worked in the club shop or ticket office

So off we trotted down to Reading, and the worst bit of it was, we were spotted and on TV at full time celebrating away, couldnt make it up.

Same happened for Charlton other season.

It happens a lot, and it's fair enough, everyone wants to watch their team, especially in the big games.

It's not fair enough.... Its people who think it is, and brag about it where the problem is.

[duncandisorderly]

It happens a lot but it's not really 'fair enough' Macca!

I mean, it's not the crime of the century or as big a deal as some would have you believe, but it's actually the opposite of 'fair enough'.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Firstly it's been common knowledge for years that the supporters groups seem to get tickets in bulk and hand them out to whoever wants them regardless of how many clarets points someone has.

Secondly after the revelations on here I no longer expect grief from the usual idiots about my allegiances when it clearly doesn't matter to some who gets a ticket for Burnley games.

Interesting, which supporters groups are these? Any in particular?

[MACCA]

It's not fair enough.... Its people who think it is, and brag about it where the problem is.

That's true, but they probably dont care.
They will have an "I'm alright Jack" kind if attitude to it all.

Why do you think there are so many that dont want a review of the system, or think its needed?

If they think it might effect them, tet had nothing to worry about, why wouldn't they want to make it fairer to their fellow fans and the next generation?

It might be the early bird that catches the worm, but it's the 2nd mouse that gets the cheese

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Ticket fraud is easy enough to combat, but people will just trot out the usual complaints about anything where ID is suggested as a solution.
In theory the club can ask anyone for ID at a game, home or away, they've just never bothered.

The away ticket sales issues is also relatively easy to sort, but it will upset the stalwarts as always.

Same with the issue of singular seats around the ground inc JMU, that's been discussed on here before.

[MACCA]

It happens a lot but it's not really 'fair enough' Macca!

I mean, it's not the crime of the century or as big a deal as some would have you believe, but it's actually the opposite of 'fair enough'.

People dont want it changing though, it's been done to death on here.
My son wanted to go to all the big grounds for a few seasons when we got to the premier league, but he was about 10 and only had a season ticket for a few years, my option was none of us go, or just me go, he couldnt get a ticket for love nor money the legitimate way. I was told to stop crying, suck it up, it's a fair system etc etc.
I raised it several times but with no joy, seems I was banging my head against a brick wall.
So it was a case of if you cant beat them, then join them.,

He now doesnt bother at all, not even home games, the time to get him hooked passed, and now after 2 or 3 without a season ticket.
He will watch us on TV only at home if we are on, but he even refuses free tickets if a mate cant attend.

I'm sure there are other fans with similar experiences as mine, but appreciate one swallow doesn't make a summer.

[Dark Cloud]

You always seem to be getting digs in at elderly people.
Do you have a problem with people over a certain age?

Absolutely not, seeing as I am one!!!

[CoolClaret]

People dont want it changing though, it's been done to death on here.
My son wanted to go to all the big grounds for a few seasons when we got to the premier league, but he was about 10 and only had a season ticket for a few years, my option was none of us go, or just me go, he couldnt get a ticket for love nor money the legitimate way. I was told to stop crying, suck it up, it's a fair system etc etc.
I raised it several times but with no joy, seems I was banging my head against a brick wall.
So it was a case of if you cant beat them, then join them.,

He now doesnt bother at all, not even home games, the time to get him hooked passed, and now after 2 or 3 without a season ticket.
He will watch us on TV only at home if we are on, but he even refuses free tickets if a mate cant attend.

I'm sure there are other fans with similar experiences as mine, but appreciate one swallow doesn't make a summer.

One of them isn't it- you wouldn't oblige when it goes your way but would be rightfully peeved if you missed out because of it.

I think this needs a thread of it's own tbh....

[JohnMac]

People dont want it changing though, it's been done to death on here.
My son wanted to go to all the big grounds. He now doesnt bother at all, not even home games, the time to get him hooked passed.

It was probably all those hours outside a pub with a can of pop and a bag of crisps waiting for the 'grown ups' to finish their pre match ritual

[GodIsADeeJay81]

One of them isn't it- you wouldn't oblige when it goes your way but would be rightfully peeved if you missed out because of it.

I think this needs a thread of it's own tbh....

There's no point, those with 6k points aren't interested in change as a whole, they never have been.

The thing is, now we've had 5yrs in the PL, having 6k points and jealousy guarding your position at the top of the food chain is just odd.
It was understandable when the club hadn't been in the top flight for decades and those loyal 6k fans fully deserved the right to get priority for certain games, inc European games.

The club could do a 3yr rolling points tally, that way if someone stops buying season tickets, they eventually drop down the points scoring system over the course of 3yrs and this allows someone to replace them.
This caps the number of points people can accrue and allows others a reasonable chance to reach that top number.

You could also base away tickets on frequency of away tickets purchased along with overall points tally, to stop people only wanting tickets for select games.
If someone only wants to attend a couple of away games a season, they shouldn't get priority over someone who attends many more games.
The away games can be grouped by size of attraction to help facilitate this.
If you're willing to put the effort into watching us at places like Fulham, Saints, Brighton etc then it's only right you get priority at Liverpool, Utd, City etc.

In regards to ticket fraud, simple ID database with a stored image and strictly either purchase at the club in person within a certain radius or delivery by post.
No more sending a mate down with your clarets number, which will be how some people are able to gather a larger number of tickets to distribute as they see fit.
Same with people working in the ticket office sorting them out for family ahead of others.

If we use photo ID, then it can be used at turnstiles to ensure adults using the tickets are the actual ticket holder, this can also be done at away games if we have an issue of banned thugs attending games, or people using 'contacts' to pick and choose the away games they attend.
For example, if we have a photo database of all of our adult fans, club reps can monitor our fans entering at away games and ensure the attendees match the database.
Doesn't even need to be done on the day, use CCTV footage to avoid delays.
If there are rule breakers then they can be punished accordingly, especially if banned supporters/known hooligans are attending games.
The small print on tickets does state the ticket is only for the named holder, so it cant even be argued against.
The club can implement a ticket swap system for people with a Clarets number too, incase of a sudden reason for non attendance but this should be doable online, because let's be honest ringing the ticket office is usually a long winded experience.

Several clubs require people to pay a membership fee to make them eligible for matchday tickets, I'm not suggesting that, but it does show clubs trying to stop fans from other clubs trying to get into the opposing fan section to see their own team.


All of that can probably be tweaked, but it's simple enough to find solutions and integrate them.

[MACCA]

It was probably all those hours outside a pub with a can of pop and a bag of crisps waiting for the 'grown ups' to finish their pre match ritual

Isnt that the apprenticeship we all did though?

What's good for the goose is good for the gander and all that

[MACCA]

One of them isn't it- you wouldn't oblige when it goes your way but would be rightfully peeved if you missed out because of it.

I think this needs a thread of it's own tbh....

That's it, your stuck between a rock and a hard place.
You're dammed if you do, dammed if you dont.

[Jimmymaccer]

Weren’t there numerous times when the club had the opportunity to buy a block but decided not to...........why not have pre sales (didn’t they do that once?). Still use the same points basis but at least the club can gauge demand..........

[clarethomer]

There's no point, those with 6k points aren't interested in change as a whole, they never have been.

The thing is, now we've had 5yrs in the PL, having 6k points and jealousy guarding your position at the top of the food chain is just odd.
It was understandable when the club hadn't been in the top flight for decades and those loyal 6k fans fully deserved the right to get priority for certain games, inc European games.

The club could do a 3yr rolling points tally, that way if someone stops buying season tickets, they eventually drop down the points scoring system over the course of 3yrs and this allows someone to replace them.
This caps the number of points people can accrue and allows others a reasonable chance to reach that top number.

You could also base away tickets on frequency of away tickets purchased along with overall points tally, to stop people only wanting tickets for select games.
If someone only wants to attend a couple of away games a season, they shouldn't get priority over someone who attends many more games.
The away games can be grouped by size of attraction to help facilitate this.
If you're willing to put the effort into watching us at places like Fulham, Saints, Brighton etc then it's only right you get priority at Liverpool, Utd, City etc.

Several clubs require people to pay a membership fee to make them eligible for matchday tickets, I'm not suggesting that, but it does show clubs trying to stop fans from other clubs trying to get into the opposing fan section to see their own team.

All of that can probably be tweaked, but it's simple enough to find solutions and integrate them.

The current approach is not odd at all.

I have over 6k points and at 350 points a year, you can see that I haven't accumulated them over the last 5 years. In fact, it probably took me a good 12 years to build them up where I had lost loads more prior to this by allowing others to buy my tickets etc.

These points have probably put over 5k into the coffers of the club in that period excluding the stuff I have spent outside of tickets with the club.

Those fans with 6k are still loyal today and just because of our continued success, it is odd that you think their loyalty should be lessened as a result of this.

I don't get to as many away games as I would like these days because of a young family and the commitments that come along at the weekend as they get involved in clubs and activities etc.

Whilst you can say those with 6k points are causing those with less points an issue in getting tickets, I can assure you that my priority has absolutely no bearing on anyone else getting a ticket, as I don't reduce the allocation for those who want to go. However, I may want to go to the odd game and it's good to know that I can if I want to without having to worry. I think I have paid my 'entry' to the top of the foodchain which has taken years to catch up.

A 3-year rolling period would cause the same issues as the current process so not sure what the benefit of this is would be other than just annoying your most loyal customers who have commercially been supportive of the club for the longest period of time.

How do you square off the situation where you have a ST Holder of 20 years up to say 3 years ago and decided that they would just do away games losing out as they have been only accumulating just over half the points a new ST holder has in the last 3 years? If someone has put the effort in for 20+ years should they be disadvantaged because home tickets attract more points than away tickets.

I am sure you will conclude that there is no perfect system and if it was your business, you would look to make your decisions based on which customers pay the most money to you are the ones that get the benefits as a result.

I have suggested a membership scheme also as being an option and having it as a limited membership away club type so you can balance not annoying your loyal fans who have accumulated the most points.

Just have to accept that whatever happens - change/no change to the current approach you will have people upset by this.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I'm not saying their loyalty should be lessened, I'm saying there needs to be room made at the top table.

A rolling points system still rewards those who regularly attend, but also means that when people stop buying a ST for whatever reason they will drop down the chain gradually, meaning others can move up.
I did also make a suggestion based on away ticket history to help ensure people can't cherry pick certain games.

At the moment, as Macca pointed out, new fans are basically excluded or having to play catch up continuously.
There is nothing in place to hook them in.
On the plus side we rarely sell out our away allocations, but if the club started to become regular in the top 10 and have more forays into Europe or go further in Cup competitions, something needs to be done that looks at the requirements of all, not just those with 6k points.

We all love away games, but if adults can't take their kids with them then there is a liklihood they won't bother going at all.

We've all just had an enforced break from watching games, it was the perfect time to have a look at and seriously consider the points system and make changes to encourage fans to part with their money.

Same with the issue of singular seats dotted around the ground, and childless adults sitting in JMU, which is another issue some people don't want to resolve.

My local cinema chain won't let me book a seat that leaves a single seat by itself, because they try to ensure they have seats available in pairs.
Burnley doesn't do that though, they'd seemingly rather singular seats were left unsold dotted around the ground instead of trying to maximise seat sales and hook in parent and child fans etc.

[Leisure]

A rolling points system still rewards those who regularly attend, but also means that when people stop buying a ST for whatever reason they will drop down the chain gradually, meaning others can move up.

Just to correct this statement. For anyone who doesn't have a season ticket this disqualifies them from being able to use their points. To purchase a ticket using your points you have to be a season ticket holder. Non-season ticket holders can only purchase away tickets when they go on General Sale.

[The Enclosure]

If we were to change our pie supplier next season who would you recommend?.
Would love it to be Haffners if they did wrapped pies.

[MACCA]

If we were to change our pie supplier next season who would you recommend?.
Would love it to be Haffners if they did wrapped pies.

They would also get my vote, or another good local butcher's. There are plenty around here.

Someone said clayton park are decent but I've only tried one a whole back now and it wasnt very good, maybe it was just a 1 off, or theyve changed for the better

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Just to correct this statement. For anyone who doesn't have a season ticket this disqualifies them from being able to use their points. To purchase a ticket using your points you have to be a season ticket holder. Non-season ticket holders can only purchase away tickets when they go on General Sale.

Changing it to a rolling 3 Yr system allows those who've had a change in circumstances to use their points and not feel instantly excluded after years of loyally supporting the club.
There have been people on here claiming they don't feel valued by the club, chopping them off instantly won't help this feeling, whereas allowing them to use their points for a few years is a gradual change.

[MACCA]

Changing it to a rolling 3 Yr system allows those who've had a change in circumstances to use their points and not feel instantly excluded after years of loyally supporting the club.
There have been people on here claiming they don't feel valued by the club, chopping them off instantly won't help this feeling, whereas allowing them to use their points for a few years is a gradual change.

But people dont want to be a victim of change.

If it works for them, fcuk anyone else seems to be what the majority want.

It should all change soon anyway as we will soon start taking far fewer numbers away as it becomes the norm.
Sadly I think those dads and lads that were not wanted or needed a while ago have probably found other things to do, or wont go rushing back now they are wanted or needed.

[Leisure]

Changing it to a rolling 3 Yr system allows those who've had a change in circumstances to use their points and not feel instantly excluded after years of loyally supporting the club.
There have been people on here claiming they don't feel valued by the club, chopping them off instantly won't help this feeling, whereas allowing them to use their points for a few years is a gradual change.

Not sure that non-Season Ticket holders should have the same benefits as ST holders.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Not sure that non-Season Ticket holders should have the same benefits as ST holders.

They've accrued points and spent their money following the club.
If they decided to not have a season ticket for a season, in a 3yr rolling points system they'd be one step down in the chain to those who've renewed for a 3rd year.
So on and so forth if they continue to not renew.
This way they're not being instantly discarded, but they're so aware they're going to reach the point where they'd have to wait for general sale.
They'd still feel valued by the club etc, which seems to be a core issue lately.

At the moment someone can have 6k points and take a year off or 2 from having a season ticket, then decide to get one and jump straight back to the top of the queue due to their historical points tally.