Relegation fodder

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taio
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by taio » Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:43 pm

randomclaret2 wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:33 pm
The fans got behind the team well yesterday...
I didn't think the atmosphere was good and there was quite a bit of moaning and groaning around where I was sat especailly at the end.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by elwaclaret » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:16 pm

taio wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:43 pm
I didn't think the atmosphere was good and there was quite a bit of moaning and groaning around where I was sat especailly at the end.
I’d have been amazed had there not been a negative response to a 0-0 home draw with Norwich. Burnley have always performed better when a siege mentality develops… many more blatant ‘errors’ by the officials and the Turf will become an intimidating place for visitors to play again.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by bfcjg » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:22 pm

I'd play Taylor as a left sided midfielder, he can beat a man and get a cross in, move Dwight more central or up front,something has to be tried.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by s6t9a2f3f » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:49 pm

claptrappers_union wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 6:04 pm
I fancied us today, I can’t see us beating another Premier League team now if we can’t beat Norwich. They were out of their depth. Improvements needed in all positions to stay in this division. Nice while it lasted
Its a strange one really, look at Norwich, last season after 7 games 10 points - won league with 97 points a full 10 points better than 3rd place so got promoted easily really. This season 7 games and 1 point and ok yeah the top of the prem is quality but from ? 11th down there's some pretty "average" sides who on any given saturday can easily beat each other on any going day.
There are reasons but we have not evolved enough in the prem and teams now have our number, same manager, same tactics, near enough same personnel, same formation, near enough same names on the bench - there's no surprises anymore. Keep McNeill quiet and that gives you a better chance, the fly in the ointment from the Leicester match could be Cornet as he could be another creator and goal threat. The other main thing is scoring goals that seems to catch so many promoted / bottom half clubs out - Brighton last night should have been out of sight after 60 minutes, we should have been out of sight after 60 minutes at home to Brighton. Chances do seem to come along in the prem BUT you pay a much heavier price for missed chances in the prem rather than the championship.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by claretandy » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:54 pm

bfcjg wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:22 pm
I'd play Taylor as a left sided midfielder, he can beat a man and get a cross in, move Dwight more central or up front,something has to be tried.
"and can get a cross in" get a cross in where though, that's the problem.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by FCBurnley » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:55 pm

How about this team ( especially at home)

Pope
Collins Tarks Mee
Lowton Brownhill Westwood McNeil Taylor
Vydra Cornet

Just crossing to Wood at every opportunity ain’t working. McNeil is playing more and more infield and could be very dangerous behind Vydra and Cornet. At least we would go down fighting

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by FCBurnley » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:57 pm

Brentford win

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by BOYSIE31 » Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:58 pm

Yep

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Superjohnnyfrancis » Sun Oct 03, 2021 4:05 pm

bfcjg wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:22 pm
I'd play Taylor as a left sided midfielder, he can beat a man and get a cross in, move Dwight more central or up front,something has to be tried.
Honestly no, should be dropped for Pieters now, the guy cannot find a head with any of his crosses, may look the part but thats it, what does he contribute to the side? His underlapping McNeil is so predictable you could simulate it on a computer programme he does it so often, it is like watching the same crap tactics over and over again. Opposition managers must chuckle, they only have to watch one game and we are completely sussed out.

When Cornet comes back our attacks will be 100% better unless he gets it coached out of him in the meantime.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun Oct 03, 2021 4:06 pm

FCBurnley wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 3:55 pm
How about this team ( especially at home)

Pope
Collins Tarks Mee
Lowton Brownhill Westwood McNeil Taylor
Vydra Cornet

Just crossing to Wood at every opportunity ain’t working. McNeil is playing more and more infield and could be very dangerous behind Vydra and Cornet. At least we would go down fighting
So you want to drop our best striker for the new man, switch to a 3-5-2 and expect us to win?

I'll have some of what you're on

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Taffy on the wing » Sun Oct 03, 2021 4:17 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 5:26 pm
Can’t argue with this.

I am of the opinion we’ll finally succumb this season.

Like you say, we’ve been in a real rut for the best part of a year now. And still, we have no clue how to get out of it.
https://youtu.be/h0FAYXFGHfA

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Stayingup » Sun Oct 03, 2021 5:41 pm

AlargeClaret wrote:
Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:27 pm
We played with a real lack of confidence and I was amazed at the constant poor long ball in, thankless task for Wood/Jay .
McNeil constantly flatters to deceive and is very one footed . His best work is with Taylor, whom gets stick for his crossing but 1st time I’ve ever seen him sky one in the stand tbh. He’s a good defender and gets to the byline very well indeed and can deliver a cross, though admittedly rarely great accuracy . Miles better than Lowton though .We’ll need Cornet firing and hopefully Roberts will slot in .
McNeil comment is interesting. He has a super left foot but does not move the ball quick enough. He receives the ball does about 3 or 4 turns and then makes the pass he should have made to begin with. In this league the ball has to be moved quickly with precision. Bringing in Cornet, a fit Vydra, Roberts as a right wing back and possibly Cork should improve us and change the stale style that all managers now know - even Norwich were not troubled yesterday and they are not a good team

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Billy Balfour » Sun Oct 03, 2021 5:54 pm

Comeuppance for the years of virtually no investment. It was always going to take more than one transfer window to fix. All we can do is get fully behind the team and become the extra man.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Gp8419 » Sun Oct 03, 2021 10:22 pm

buzzclarets79 wrote:
Sat Oct 02, 2021 7:24 pm
And when we drop to the championship and won’t have a pot to pi** in with attendances of 10,000 you’ll be wanting these same old morons to attend.

The worst home record in history, can’t even beat Norwich, a team that’s lost all previous matches, -14 goal difference already at this stage, we never looked like scoring. Same old boring Dyche tactics.
Seems we are doomed then wow! Fine margins! I will have you 100 to the food bank that the board supports we stay up? If we go down I will stand the 100?

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:53 am

I know the white flag waving is popular among some, I just wish I could convince myself to be more negative.

With odds of 11/10 for us to be relegated widely available and with more than 1 bookie, it seems it is very easy to make a few grand. Not many banks will give you 110% interest for 7 months.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Yearofthefox » Mon Oct 04, 2021 3:23 pm

I think the strange thing is we are playing better than we did at the start of last season and possbly still creating slighty more chances.

My frustration is lack of shots from oustide the area sometimes when in shooting range.

Got to take some real points after the City game or it wont be looking good.

'If' we did go down i would still fancy us to go back up again, there is another gulf that seems to have opened up again in the championship.
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Oct 04, 2021 3:26 pm

Yearofthefox wrote:
Mon Oct 04, 2021 3:23 pm
I think the strange thing is we are playing better than we did at the start of last season and possbly still creating slighty more chances.

My frustration is lack of shots from oustide the area sometimes when in shooting range.

Got to take some real points after the City game or it wont be looking good.

'If' we did go down i would still fancy us to go back up again, there is another gulf that seems to have opened up again in the championship.
This

My only concern is that we normally win games when we play well and create chances, and we just haven't

You could make a very convincing argument that we should only have lost one game so far, and that we should be a lot further up the table

But the performance v Norwich was not as good as previous ones, and our complete haplessness in front of goal is a real concern

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by claretandy » Sun Nov 07, 2021 10:19 am

I would say it's any 3 from 7, Brentford are in free fall, from Southampton upwards will be ok. Our key games are Watford, Villa and Newcastle home and away.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by expoultryboy » Sun Nov 07, 2021 10:37 am

I think you mean 3 from 8 . Norwich , Newcastle , Watford , Leeds , Villa , Brentford , Southampton and us . It's going to get quite nervy and exciting as usual , but I'm feeling a lot more confident than i did a few weeks ago .

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by claretandy » Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:21 am

expoultryboy wrote:
Sun Nov 07, 2021 10:37 am
I think you mean 3 from 8 . Norwich , Newcastle , Watford , Leeds , Villa , Brentford , Southampton and us . It's going to get quite nervy and exciting as usual , but I'm feeling a lot more confident than i did a few weeks ago .
Southampton have enough, they've won 3 of the last 4.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by tiger76 » Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:32 am

claretandy wrote:
Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:21 am
Southampton have enough, they've won 3 of the last 4.
They have granted, but prior to that run they were winless in their first 7, I think they'll be OK, but I certainly wouldn't totally rule them out of still being dragged back into the mix.

You'd imagine it will be 3 from 8, as everybody from Leicester and above has probably got enough of a cushion already.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 07, 2021 1:06 pm

The one thing in our favour is that we've been here before many times and survive pretty comfortably in the end, even without having to use our spare games at the end of the season.
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:13 am

Having done a quick calculation we are six points down on the corresponding fixtures from last season.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:17 am

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:13 am
Having done a quick calculation we are six points down on the corresponding fixtures from last season.
Unless we sign a CM or find one in the academy that can step up I suspect this will be our last season in the prem.

We have the worst midfield in the league by some distance

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:24 am

Newcastleclaret93 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:17 am
Unless we sign a CM or find one in the academy that can step up I suspect this will be our last season in the prem.

We have the worst midfield in the league by some distance
Wouldn't we be losing virtually every game were that the case?

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:26 am

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:24 am
Wouldn't we be losing virtually every game were that the case?
You do realise our form in 2021 would have us pick up less than 30 points in a season?

Yes we do have the worst midfield in the league it has been proven this calendar year.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:52 am

No one's really arsed about last season's form now, unless you're grinding an axe.
We're scoring goals again, that's the important part and a game that maybe we would've lost, we got a draw and even then we were unlucky not to win.
This season's form is all the matters and the players are now looking like they're starting to click again, Cornet is probably a large reason why.

Ultimately I think we will be ok, even with Brownhill in CM.
He's first choice now, we won't have a youth player who can replace him, much to some people's annoyance I suspect.
Our activity in the next window will be dependant on how we are getting on, but we have a lot of work to do in regards to decisions on next summer's OOC.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Quickenthetempo » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:11 pm

We are playing better football than usual but the defence concedes for fun. We have done reasonably well against the big 6 in limiting their goal difference, but conceding an average of 2 a game to the rest of the sides is poor.

Looking at the table this morning when we have only lost 1 in 7 bears resemblance to Fulham last year. We just won't make any head way with draws unfortunately.

We might beat Spurs and things look a lot rosier. But losing the next two will give us huge problems.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Devils_Advocate » Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:16 pm

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:13 am
Having done a quick calculation we are six points down on the corresponding fixtures from last season.
Thats really worrying, if we continue to lose 6 pts per 12 games on last seasons form we will end up on 20 pts which I think would see us relegated

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Woodleyclaret » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:31 pm

Re next win v Spurs next week

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by NewClaret » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:45 pm

Despite the up turn in form, and us playing some decent football now, I do still fear for us for two reasons:

1. We are getting zero luck with decisions like yesterday. Unfairly losing our defensive rock for a game vs Spurs and failing to get a red card award are decisions that could easily cost us at the end of the season.

2. Despite not being clouted all season, we’re also not keeping clean sheets like we used to. I’d feel much more confident if we re-find that defensive solidity at some point, even if it means accepting a mor turgid style in some games.

Points aren’t enough and we lose the main catalyst of our improved performances for a couple of months next year. Alan Pace and ALK also need to pull some rabbits out of the hat to beat the drop this season.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:51 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:11 pm
We are playing better football than usual but the defence concedes for fun. We have done reasonably well against the big 6 in limiting their goal difference, but conceding an average of 2 a game to the rest of the sides is poor.

Looking at the table this morning when we have only lost 1 in 7 bears resemblance to Fulham last year. We just won't make any head way with draws unfortunately.

We might beat Spurs and things look a lot rosier. But losing the next two will give us huge problems.
The interesting thing about Fulham last year was that after they'd won at Anfield (who didn't last season?) they were on 26 points from 28 matches, level on points with Brighton and only four behind us. What killed them in the end was getting only two points from the last ten matches.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:52 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:45 pm
Despite the up turn in form, and us playing some decent football now, I do still fear for us for two reasons:

1. We are getting zero luck with decisions like yesterday. Unfairly losing our defensive rock for a game vs Spurs and failing to get a red card award are decisions that could easily cost us at the end of the season.

2. Despite not being clouted all season, we’re also not keeping clean sheets like we used to. I’d feel much more confident if we re-find that defensive solidity at some point, even if it means accepting a mor turgid style in some games.

Points aren’t enough and we lose the main catalyst of our improved performances for a couple of months next year. Alan Pace and ALK also need to pull some rabbits out of the hat to beat the drop this season.
We lose Maxwel Cornet for up to four matches.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by jojomk1 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:54 pm

The spine of our team seems much weaker than in previous seasons
And the weakness in midfield stands out
Our midfielders have not scored a goal between them so far this season - not going to check, but would have thought very few goals scored by any of them over the last few years
When they support the attacks we are regularly in real danger when teams break on us - the way Gallagher broke through to lay on the goal for Benteke being a prime example
When they defend they do so just marking space/zones and teams are able to drift in behind them so easily
Westwood is now suspended for 5 cards, everyone of them being for cheap tackles when he fails to get near the ball
Brownhill is really no better
We need pace, strength and height in this key area
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by taio » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:00 pm

jojomk1 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:54 pm
The spine of our team seems much weaker than in previous seasons
And the weakness in midfield stands out
Our midfielders have not scored a goal between them so far this season - not going to check, but would have thought very few goals scored by any of them over the last few years
When they support the attacks we are regularly in real danger when teams break on us - the way Gallagher broke through to lay on the goal for Benteke being a prime example
When they defend they do so just marking space/zones and teams are able to drift in behind them so easily
Westwood is now suspended for 5 cards, everyone of them being for cheap tackles when he fails to get near the ball
Brownhill is really no better
We need pace, strength and height in this key area
It's an area where we do need to strengthen. But Westwood has been very good for us. And it's quite remarkable that we've been able to compete in central midfield area to the extent we have given we are often outnumbered and the opposition have better individuals.
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by jrgbfc » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:02 pm

The league is incredibly strong this year. Gonna be a real dogfight down at the bottom.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Vino blanco » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:13 pm

jojomk1 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:54 pm
The spine of our team seems much weaker than in previous seasons
And the weakness in midfield stands out
Our midfielders have not scored a goal between them so far this season - not going to check, but would have thought very few goals scored by any of them over the last few years
When they support the attacks we are regularly in real danger when teams break on us - the way Gallagher broke through to lay on the goal for Benteke being a prime example
When they defend they do so just marking space/zones and teams are able to drift in behind them so easily
Westwood is now suspended for 5 cards, everyone of them being for cheap tackles when he fails to get near the ball
Brownhill is really no better
We need pace, strength and height in this key area
This is our problem in a nutshell. I’ve said it for over a year now. Our back five is as good if not better than many in the PL, our strikers Wood, Cornet, Jay, Vydra are better than most in the bottom half of our division. Our midfield options, however, our championship level at best: they do not know how to protect the defence, which we used to do superbly, and from a creativity level they are very, very poor. We will struggle against every team in the PL whilst our current midfield is playing. Take a look at the UTC ratings to see where Westwood, Brownhill, Cork are. This is the area that needs strengthening totally in January.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by NewClaret » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:15 pm

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:52 pm
We lose Maxwel Cornet for up to four matches.
Sure I read it was 7 or 8?

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:18 pm

We have had two first team starters from our last 4 transfer windows.

We desperately need at least two first team starters in the next window or it’s likely we are down
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:19 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:15 pm
Sure I read it was 7 or 8?
Yes that is correct. Potentially away for 6-7 weeks and then it just whether Dyche wants to thrown him back in straight away.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Spijed » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:21 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:15 pm
Sure I read it was 7 or 8?
It's from 9th January – 6th February 2022 and during that time we play Leeds, Leicester & Arsenal.
Chris Boden also tweeted that he could potentially join the squad before 30th Dec when we play Man U.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:22 pm

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:21 pm
It's from 9th January – 6th February 2022 and during that time we play Leeds, Leicester & Arsenal.
Chris Boden also tweeted that he could potentially join the squad before 30th Dec when we play Man U.
I’m sure there was an article recently where it said he would join the squad on 27th Dec and return 14th Feb.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Tall Paul » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:27 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:19 pm
Yes that is correct. Potentially away for 6-7 weeks and then it just whether Dyche wants to thrown him back in straight away.
AFCON runs from 9th January to 6th February. We only have 2 PL games between those dates. He could miss the 2nd January and probably 8th Feb game if his country reaches the semi final.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Quickenthetempo » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:30 pm

Newcastleclaret93 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:22 pm
I’m sure there was an article recently where it said he would join the squad on 27th Dec and return 14th Feb.
At least a couple of FA Cup weekends in that time.

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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by Quickenthetempo » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:33 pm

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:51 pm
The interesting thing about Fulham last year was that after they'd won at Anfield (who didn't last season?) they were on 26 points from 28 matches, level on points with Brighton and only four behind us. What killed them in the end was getting only two points from the last ten matches.
But they went on a decent unbeaten run for a bottom side and didn't progress as most were draws.

boatshed bill
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by boatshed bill » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:45 pm

I wouldn't say "fodder" which implies that there is no chance of staying up.
But we need some investment in January, specifically in midfield.

IanMcL
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by IanMcL » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:59 pm

Spijed wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:13 am
Having done a quick calculation we are six points down on the corresponding fixtures from last season.
Or 3 vars, depending how you measure.

EarbyClaret
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by EarbyClaret » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:20 pm

Norwich was the real disappointment. Shame Cornet missed that one. Even so if the penalty had been given (and scored) for the foul on Vydra we would be out of the relegation zone

It's going to be a scrap because there are no teams as poor as last season's. bottom three especially now that Smith has gone to Norwich

Recent performances have been generally encouraging. We need to hang in there until January and hopefully upgrade our striker and CM options

tiger76
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by tiger76 » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:37 pm

We'll know a lot more about our chances by early Jan, we face Newcastle, Watford & Villa in the run up to Xmas, and Leeds is our 1st away trip of 2022.

8/12 points minimum from those key games, and we'll be set fairly well for the 2nd half of the campaign, however if we fail to win at least a couple of those matches we'll be making life extremely difficult for ourselves in the latter part of the season.

And unlike the last couple of seasons no-one is getting cut adrift at the foot of the table, so it looks like being a battle right until the last couple of weeks, what's encouraging is we've taken points in most of the games you'd expect us too, the challenge now is turning 1 point into 3, that could make all the difference come the climax of the campaign.

LoveCurryPies
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Re: Relegation fodder

Post by LoveCurryPies » Sun Nov 21, 2021 8:39 pm

Such a negative thread and so early in the season.
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