Brentford

gtclaret · Post by **gtclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:18 am

Saw them on MOTD, this is the third occasion that I've seen them this season. They look a very good exiting team, with a few players that would walk into our side. Why are they able to sigh these players and we can't. Do they have wealthy backers that I'm not aware of
When I watch MOTD I cannot see any team worse or even as bad as us. Very disappointing

snapcrackleandpop · Post by **snapcrackleandpop** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:34 am

Will batter us.

gawthorpe_view · Post by **gawthorpe_view** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:41 am

snapcrackleandpop wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:34 am
Will batter us.

Certainly looks a possibility at the moment.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:50 am

https://twitter.com/SwissRamble/status/ ... 79975?s=19

This explains their finances.
Large losses overall, but just from player sales they've made £90 million over recent years.

ClaretMov · Post by **ClaretMov** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:57 am

We look like we don't belong in the premier league anymore, football and tactics one dimensional and dated, player substitutions are like for like and never to change formation,
Everyone work's us out before we kick a ball or during the game and they make changes thats something we never do, always plan A and never B or C.

We are terrible and have been for over 12 month's now and it's getting worse each week, can't win a game can't score goals, this is heading towards being an embarrassing season and probably one of our last top flight season's for a long time unless something changes

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:59 am

Two seasons ago many on here were saying exactly the same things about Sheffield united...

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:03 am

If Brentfords model is so good, with exciting players and they play a good brand of attacking football to watch, then why arent they above us....

Oh.

Must have spent 100m on fees and pay 100k a week in wages to get players to be able to pass the ball 20 yards on the floor and move into space to receive it again

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:09 am

MACCA wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:03 am
If Brentfords model is so good, with exciting players and they play a good brand of attacking football to watch, then why arent they above us....

Oh.

Must have spent 100m on fees and pay 100k a week in wages to get players to be able to pass the ball 20 yards on the floor and move into space to receive it again

Until teams like Brentford qualify for Europe and have at least six straight seasons in the Premier league then their model will never be anywhere near as successful as ours.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:14 am

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:09 am
Until teams like Brentford qualify for Europe and have at least six straight seasons in the Premier league then their model will never be anywhere near as successful as ours.

Sadly we didn't actually ever qualify for the Europa League, we played in qualifiers and come up just short.

TheFamilyCat · Post by **TheFamilyCat** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:21 am

They've only had to buy championship quality players for the last few years. They have then gelled at that level before stepping up.

They've certainly taken a lot of people by surprise this year but we are only seven games in so a long way to go.

Prime example - Toney. Some posters thought we should have signed him but would he have been ready for the PL? He's had a couple more seasons at Championship level before stepping up.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:21 am

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:14 am
Sadly we didn't actually ever qualify for the Europa League, we played in qualifiers and come up just short.

We still qualified to play in Europe. Oh well, it's very poor that some of our own "so called" supporters can't take pride in the fact that a club of our size and finances managed to play against European opposition in a proper match, not just a friendly.

Never mind. I suppose it's got to the point that nothing will change the minds of some.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:23 am

Anyway, let's get back on topic.

Brentford have a very good scouting system and they do their homework very well.
More importantly they were very much a buy to sell for lots of profit club and that enabled them to stay in the championship.

Will they be able to do the same in the PL?
That remains to be seen.

They've had a very good start to the season and it's good to see.

I'd like it if they stayed up (just not at our expense) because I'm interested to see if they can maintain this style for a few years in the PL.
Leeds are struggling in their 2nd season, whilst Bournemouth carried it in for a few years before finally going down.

I get people want to have a whinge at us for our poor start to the season, or for not making it past the qualifying stages of the Europe league, but it's tiresome now.

jedi_master · Post by **jedi_master** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:34 am

Brentford are a good example of why it is sometimes the right decision to sell your best players when at their maximum value (as we did with Keane, Gray etc which also didn’t work out too badly).

I am sure the club wishes internally that it had perhaps sold Tarky for example whilst he was pushing a £30m value. Perhaps the same with Dwight too. We will need to perhaps become more willing to part with our better players and get top dollar whilst we can to allow us to renovate our team.

NewClaret · Post by **NewClaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:34 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:23 am
Anyway, let's get back on topic.

Brentford have a very good scouting system and they do their homework very well.
More importantly they were very much a buy to sell for lots of profit club and that enabled them to stay in the championship.

Will they be able to do the same in the PL?
That remains to be seen.

They've had a very good start to the season and it's good to see.

I'd like it if they stayed up (just not at our expense) because I'm interested to see if they can maintain this style for a few years in the PL.
Leeds are struggling in their 2nd season, whilst Bournemouth carried it in for a few years before finally going down.

I get people want to have a whinge at us for our poor start to the season, or for not making it past the qualifying stages of the Europe league, but it's tiresome now.

This.

Well done Brentford, it's good to see. Remains to be seen if they can do if for 6 successive seasons.... or even the whole of this season to be honest. Remember Southampton last year?

gtclaret · Post by **gtclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:35 am

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:21 am
We still qualified to play in Europe. Oh well, it's very poor that some of our own "so called" supporters can't take pride in the fact that a club of our size and finances managed to play against European opposition in a proper match, not just a friendly.

Never mind. I suppose it's got to the point that nothing will change the minds of some.

We've had 6 seasons in the prem, and I think we've at best remained stagnant or possible gone backwards. Our style is hit and hope going forwards and often looks straight out of the lower leagues. Maxwell Cornet demonstrated what a difference a fast exciting player can make. Why after 6 years don't we have such players within various areas of our team

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:37 am

Like it or not, Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley are. West London is seen as affluent, East Lancashire the polar opposite. We are not an attractive proposition when compared to most other Premier League teams when trying to attract young players from outside of the region. There are exceptions - Andre Gray for example, but he soon moved back South once he had established himself.

Terrier · Post by **Terrier** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:40 am

Spijed, you are wasting your time, we could win the prem and some on here will just be waiting for our 1st defeat after to have a good moan, usually against our brilliant manager!

Stalbansclaret · Post by **Stalbansclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:43 am

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:14 am
Sadly we didn't actually ever qualify for the Europa League, we played in qualifiers and come up just short.

WTF !!!!!!!!!!!!

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:48 am

Stalbansclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:43 am
WTF !!!!!!!!!!!!

I enjoyed it as much as anyone, but the clue is in the name "League".

TheFamilyCat · Post by **TheFamilyCat** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:49 am

The original post said "qualify for Europe".

ClaretMov · Post by **ClaretMov** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:52 am

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:37 am
Like it or not, Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley are. West London is seen as affluent, East Lancashire the polar opposite. We are not an attractive proposition when compared to most other Premier League teams when trying to attract young players from outside of the region. There are exceptions - Andre Gray for example, but he soon moved back South once he had established himself.

Do you think Burnley player's live in East Lancashire

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:59 am

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:37 am
Like it or not, Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley are. West London is seen as affluent, East Lancashire the polar opposite. We are not an attractive proposition when compared to most other Premier League teams when trying to attract young players from outside of the region. There are exceptions - Andre Gray for example, but he soon moved back South once he had established himself.

Hi Herts, are you speaking of the football club, the fans or the places for the footballers to live while playing for Brentford? Brentford is the closest Premier League ground to where I live. Yes, there's nice places around here. There's also Hounslow and Heathrow airport and Brentford is more Hounslow than it is "affluent West London." It's not all "parks and open spaces" and nothing to compare with the Ribble Valley and all the National Parks on Burnley's "doorstep." Of course, the "bright lights" of Manchester and Cheshire are not that far away, especially if you are a footballer.

UTC

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:07 am

ClaretMov wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:52 am
Do you think Burnley player's live in East Lancashire

Fully aware that most if not all our players won't live in East Lancashire, just as most Brentford players won't live in Brentford. However, the lure of the bright lights of London will be far more appealing to younger players than the green landscape of North West England. As i said there are exceptions to the rule but in general my point stands.

And to back up my point, of our starting 11 on Saturday, 8 were born in the North of England. 2 were born overseas, 1 was born in Cambridgeshire.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:15 am

Paul Waine wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:59 am
Hi Herts, are you speaking of the football club, the fans or the places for the footballers to live while playing for Brentford? Brentford is the closest Premier League ground to where I live. Yes, there's nice places around here. There's also Hounslow and Heathrow airport and Brentford is more Hounslow than it is "affluent West London." It's not all "parks and open spaces" and nothing to compare with the Ribble Valley and all the National Parks on Burnley's "doorstep." Of course, the "bright lights" of Manchester and Cheshire are not that far away, especially if you are a footballer.

UTC

I am speaking of the general West London area. Not far from Brentford you have Chelsea, Fulham, Kensington, Knightsbridge if you want City living. I am also talking about the ability to attract young talent - where the bright lights of London's West End will be far more of a draw than the green spaces and parks you mention, especially if those younger players are originally from the London/South East region. I used to live in that area, so am fully aware of the 'delights' of Hounslow, Feltham and those areas, but that is not the point i am making.

As posted elsewhere, 8 of our starting 11 on Saturday were born in the North of England 2 overseas and 1 in Cambs. The only player i would class as young from that team is McNeil, who was born in the North West so hasn't been faced with a move north.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:18 am

gtclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:18 am
Saw them on MOTD, this is the third occasion that I've seen them this season. They look a very good exiting team, with a few players that would walk into our side. Why are they able to sigh these players and we can't. Do they have wealthy backers that I'm not aware of
When I watch MOTD I cannot see any team worse or even as bad as us. Very disappointing

It’s not rocket science to conclude 1 club is properly run the other isn’t that’s the difference top & bottom.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:19 am

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:07 am
Fully aware that most if not all our players won't live in East Lancashire, just as most Brentford players won't live in Brentford. However, the lure of the bright lights of London will be far more appealing to younger players than the green landscape of North West England. As i said there are exceptions to the rule but in general my point stands.

And to back up my point, of our starting 11 on Saturday, 8 were born in the North of England. 2 were born overseas, 1 was born in Cambridgeshire.

It's a fair point. It's why teams teams like Man City, Man Utd and Liverpool struggle so much to sign players.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:22 am

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:18 am
It’s not rocket science to conclude 1 club is properly run the other isn’t that’s the difference top & bottom.

Another little nugget to add to the fact that we didn't qualify for Europe is that we aren't a properly run club.

Shame we don't even have a proper training ground, isn't it?

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:23 am

aggi wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:19 am
It's a fair point. It's why teams teams like Man City, Man Utd and Liverpool struggle so much to sign players.

You mean the North West teams who are 3 of the biggest clubs in Europe, regularly win the league, cups and European titles, are packed with international players and pay wages of several hundred thousand pounds per week? A fair comparison with Burnley then.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:24 am

I can't say I've watched them enough to really know what their style is but I think that they're a bit more pragmatic than some think. I think they're second to us in number of long balls, have had the fewest touches and are very low on passes and shots too.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:25 am

Spijed wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:22 am
Another little nugget to add to the fact that we didn't qualify for Europe is that we aren't a properly run club.

Shame we don't even have a proper training ground, isn't it?

I’m talking currently where we are now, you bang on about the past as much as you like it doesn’t change what’s happening currently.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:27 am

Yesterday, their manager claimed they're the sort of side that never just settle for a draw.

Interesting. I wonder how long that will continue?

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:28 am

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:25 am
I’m talking currently where we are now, you bang on about the past as much as you like it doesn’t change what’s happening currently.

But to say we aren't currently a properly run club is ridiculous. What does that mean exactly?

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:29 am

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:07 am
Fully aware that most if not all our players won't live in East Lancashire, just as most Brentford players won't live in Brentford. However, the lure of the bright lights of London will be far more appealing to younger players than the green landscape of North West England. As i said there are exceptions to the rule but in general my point stands.

And to back up my point, of our starting 11 on Saturday, 8 were born in the North of England. 2 were born overseas, 1 was born in Cambridgeshire.

This is why clubs in the North East used to overpay in wages to attract certain types of players of the years, and there was even talk of one club considering relocating it's training ground to the south east and bringing the players up for match days only.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:32 am

gtclaret wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:18 am
Saw them on MOTD, this is the third occasion that I've seen them this season. They look a very good exiting team, with a few players that would walk into our side. Why are they able to sigh these players and we can't. Do they have wealthy backers that I'm not aware of
When I watch MOTD I cannot see any team worse or even as bad as us. Very disappointing

To answer the original question, it's a combination of good player sales and an owner who is willing to fund them. It's at a lower level than some of the other teams but they still owe their owner a fair chunk, about £65m at the last accounts.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:40 am

It’s a lot of debt for any club but they’re in a financial position about as bad as Bl*ckburn R*vers.

Both completely dependent on their owners continuing to service their debt.

Only difference is that one has been successful on the pitch and the other hasn’t.

ClaretMov · Post by **ClaretMov** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:43 am

aggi wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:19 am
It's a fair point. It's why teams teams like Man City, Man Utd and Liverpool struggle so much to sign players.

Targetman · Post by **Targetman** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:46 am

Quickenthetempo wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 9:48 am
I enjoyed it as much as anyone, but the clue is in the name "League".

The post did say "qualified for Europe", you were the only person who mentioned "League".

Trying to nitpick with something like that and then getting it wrong! I think that shows your true colours, and they aren't claret and blue.

ClaretMov · Post by **ClaretMov** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:46 am

Herts Clarets wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:23 am
You mean the North West teams who are 3 of the biggest clubs in Europe, regularly win the league, cups and European titles, are packed with international players and pay wages of several hundred thousand pounds per week? A fair comparison with Burnley then.

You missing your own point....your the one bringing up living area's not us when you come our with stupid quotes like "Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley"

s6t9a2f3f · Post by **s6t9a2f3f** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 11:24 am

ClaretMov wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 8:57 am
We look like we don't belong in the premier league anymore, football and tactics one dimensional and dated, player substitutions are like for like and never to change formation,
Everyone work's us out before we kick a ball or during the game and they make changes thats something we never do, always plan A and never B or C.

We are terrible and have been for over 12 month's now and it's getting worse each week, can't win a game can't score goals, this is heading towards being an embarrassing season and probably one of our last top flight season's for a long time unless something changes

Every small club eventually bows out its not personal guys, look at the "small clubs" over the years like Bournemouth, Wigan, Rovers, Bolton, Blackpool etc etc etc - some played open attractive football like Bournemouth and Blackpool and some more direct like us and Bolton. At some point you dont escape the drop, maybe its our turn ? who knows. Everyone talks about the fitness regime we have and players have to be SD fit but for the last 2 seasons our start has been pretty awful and that puts you on the backfoot in October - that doesn't help.
At least if we do drop we have a manager in place who knows the championship very well and knows how to tackle the job, the likes of Middlesbrough and Nottingham Forest and etc, etc, etc are still trying to find the key in the terms of the manager and squad to get the job done and have been trying for the last 10 years.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:07 pm

Targetman wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:46 am
The post did say "qualified for Europe", you were the only person who mentioned "League".

Trying to nitpick with something like that and then getting it wrong! I think that shows your true colours, and they aren't claret and blue.

OK. Sorry for assuming qualifying for Europe, meant Europa league, which incidentally finishing 7th gives you a chance to compete in qualifying rounds for.

Their page clearly lists qualifying rounds. https://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/f ... /2001489/2

P.s Brentford are doing superb.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:13 pm

ClaretMov wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:46 am
You missing your own point....your the one bringing up living area's not us when you come our with stupid quotes like "Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley"

"Brentford are in a much more appealing geographic location than Burnley" not quite so stupid when you take in context, which was to attract younger players who are London/South East based. Clearly if you are one of the biggest clubs in Europe and able to offer multi million pound salaries, then location becomes less of an issue.

Out of interest, how many young players from London/South East have we managed to sign in the past 5 years? As i have already said, Andre Gray was one but once he had the "popstar" girlfriend, he was off to the London area at the first opportunity.

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:13 pm

A bit early to be dismissing us and elevating Brentford, as some are on this thread.

Cornet looked like he would lift the team but also release other players (e.g. no doubling up on Dwight), we know we are capable of being more solid than we have, and Wood is a class striker who is simply out of form (tired I suspect). We have also been the better side for more than 50% of the season so far, but haven’t had the breaks (penalty decisions, worldies against us, hutting woodwork, top saves, narrow last minute offsides, mistakes etc).

Brentford look good so far but going down the list if we take their (possibly) best three players I would rather have Wood rather than Toney (unproven), Pope rather than Raya, Cornet rather than Mbeumo. I do like Toney but Wood is guaranteed 10+ goals season after season and that is rare.

They’ll stay up, but could be a Blades 2nd season syndrome team.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:14 pm

They are very like us to be fair

Consistency of how they play, but have just evolved their squad at a faster rate than we have

Lot of that is due to being in the championship, but there is no doubt that they have spotted real talent, sold at a huge profit, and then found equally good talent at a much cheaper price, and they have looked really good in the premier league, with a team of what looks like premier league players

The reason we are struggling is that we've only just started to evolve a stale squad, and we had three (or four) transfer windows when we didn't do nearly enough

Superjohnnyfrancis · Post by **Superjohnnyfrancis** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:16 pm

They have a really good scouting/analytics department, there is a video on youtube how they use data and modelling to find bargains abroad, something hopefully Burnley are integrating into their approach.

I notice Rigg has been paid off for the rest of his contract by the club recently , something was put on sky sports news page on the weekend.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:40 pm

Simon Jordan on talksport pointing out that Brentfords owner has put £200 million into the club

gandhisflipflop · Post by **gandhisflipflop** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:43 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:40 pm
Simon Jordan on talksport pointing out that Brentfords owner has put £200 million into the club

Without knowing the details, how much of that is with the new stadium?

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 1:29 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:43 pm
Without knowing the details, how much of that is with the new stadium?

https://www.stadiumdesignsummit.com/bre ... -new-year/

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 1:40 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:40 pm
Simon Jordan on talksport pointing out that Brentfords owner has put £200 million into the club

So, not exactly the fairy tale then.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 2:00 pm

Brentford….will be our first win of the season.

They will start to struggle soon, particularly when they play everyone for a second time. The overloading in attack will leave them on the end of some hidings by the end of the season.

As others have said let’s see if they can stay up this season before we add Brentford to the list of teams that are so much better than us ala Brighton, Sheff U, Leeds, Fulham etc, none of which have finished as high as 7th

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Oct 04, 2021 2:02 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Mon Oct 04, 2021 12:40 pm
Simon Jordan on talksport pointing out that Brentfords owner has put £200 million into the club

That seems to be about double what is reported elsewhere (unless he put £100m in last year which seems unlikely with the hefty player sales they had).