RATE THE REF - Darren England v Birmingham City

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 7:23 pm

Please only RtR if you attended the game at Turf Moor tonight and only after the game has ended. Thank you!

Darren England (South Yorkshire) v Birmingham City

How to Score
A. Decision Making (including use of advantage) - out of 25
B. Consistency - out of 25
C. Fitness and Positioning - of 25
D. Control and Authority - out of 25

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:03 pm

A 8
B 8
C 10
D 9

MDWat · Post by **MDWat** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:09 pm

A - 5
B - 5
C - 5
D - 5

Another total and utter idiot

NL Claret · Post by **NL Claret** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:10 pm

I think Andy Hinchcliffe said the officials have had a good game, possibly based on correctly giving a goal kick instead of a corner.

Aclaret · Post by **Aclaret** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:11 pm

Blimey....where do they get them from.

claretburns · Post by **claretburns** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:12 pm

A. 8
B. 12 (Consistently bad to be fair)
C. 10
D. 5

bf2k · Post by **bf2k** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:18 pm

a - 5
b - 8
c - 10
d - 5

mkmel · Post by **mkmel** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:19 pm

What about the Birmingham free kick when their player passed to himself.
The officials all missed that

Beagle · Post by **Beagle** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:24 pm

I’m surprised how (relatively) highly people are rating his positioning, I thought it was dreadful. It’s with refs like this that you wish assistant referees were still remotely capable of doing their job.

fatboy47 · Post by **fatboy47** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:36 pm

7
8
6
6.

Utterly inept..and liners not much better.

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:40 pm

When we were in the PL I used to know that refs like Friend, Moss, Mason etc were absolute garbage, whereas now in the Championship they all just seem to be anonymous, useless t.ssers.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:45 pm

There was a ref ?
Shocker, so soft on their disgusting niggly fouls and dangerous play it was embarrassing.
4
3
4
4

MDWat · Post by **MDWat** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:57 pm

Isn’t Darren England a Premier League referee as well?

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:00 pm

MDWat wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:57 pm
Isn’t Darren England a Premier League referee as well?

Yes, Cat One

Ashingtonclaret46 · Post by **Ashingtonclaret46** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:03 pm

MDWat wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 10:57 pm
Isn’t Darren England a Premier League referee as well?

He certainly is, having refereed 34 matches in the PL including our 4-0 win at Wolves a couple of seasons ago. I thought that he was not on top of his game tonight.

Granny WeatherWax · Post by **Granny WeatherWax** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:04 pm

He looked like he had won a competition to be there tonight.

xxmunkyennuixx · Post by **xxmunkyennuixx** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:05 pm

A - 3
B - 3
C - 10
D - 3

So many mistakes. Some were minor, some were pretty major. Tell me why studs up is not a second yellow? The corner that was a goal kick? The player taking a free kick to himself? Deeney being filth? Shoves in the back allowed apart from if we do it. Absolute waste of space. The lino on the Longside saw Chong push Cork into the ref and did nothing. Any time they turn up at the Turf, they should get it at kick off. Pour derision down on them.

dougcollins · Post by **dougcollins** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:16 pm

Ashingtonclaret46 wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:03 pm
He certainly is, having refereed 34 matches in the PL including our 4-0 win at Wolves a couple of seasons ago. I thought that he was not on top of his game tonight.

As ever the master of the understatement Ashington, it speaks volumes.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:24 pm

Sorry Jdrobbo, but this feature has become a bit like rate the hemorrhoid.

Stalbansclaret · Post by **Stalbansclaret** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:24 pm

6
5
5
5

A really bad one tonight. Let a lot go but then in the second half seemed reluctant to book anyone and missed a couple of obvious yellows including one for (I think) Beyer who clattered a Birmingham player mid-park. Poor in all respects and not helped by a lino who couldn't see from 10 yards away that a Birmingham player had passed the ball to himself from a free kick .

ClaretInLeeds · Post by **ClaretInLeeds** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:27 pm

Not sure how Hannibal and Troy “Harvey” Deeney avoided red cards. Not sure how a couple of our players avoided yellows. Not sure how the officials can miss a player taking a free kick to himself. Not sure how a full compliment of referees in one division can be so inept.

3
3
3
3

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:33 pm

Started off brightly, allowing play to go on and doing so for both sides.

The turning point came when they decided to rough us up a bit - he booked two (correctly) in quick succession but thereafter his consistency, and associated decision making went out of the window.

There’s a good ref in there somewhere as he showed early on but he need to be more confident and show some backbone.

A. 11
B. 6
C. 20
D. 12

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:37 pm

Could I please reiterate my plea to ask people to read responses after posting their own marks, and also to ask for this in the OP.

Obviously a good performing ref will win high marks and a poor ref will win low marks but I can’t help thinking that the early marks have a polarising effect on opinions and we tend to snowball toward either zenith or nadir.

This lad didn’t have a great hand but he was a long way from being truly awful and, crucially, he reffed well enough to have no effect on the result.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:39 pm

Rowls wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:37 pm
Could I please reiterate my plea to ask people to read responses after posting their own marks, and also to ask for this in the OP.

Obviously a good performing ref will win high marks and a poor ref will win low marks but I can’t help thinking that the early marks have a polarising effect on opinions and we tend to snowball toward either zenith or nadir.

This lad didn’t have a great hand but he was a long way from being truly awful and, crucially, he reffed well enough to have no effect on the result.

Can’t agree with that. It’s like someone had told him that two wrongs make a right.

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:40 pm

Off topic- apologies.
4th official was female this evening, if she had to come on and take over would that of been the first female referee at this level?

It probably would of been a blessing in disguise to be fair.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:41 pm

One of the funniest refereeing performances for some time, mainly as his complete ineptitude didn't have any influence on the result. It wouldnt have been funny if he had. So many bad decisions.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:42 pm

Horrendous and dangerous performance.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:44 pm

A. 9
B. 9
C. 11
D. 11

Not helped at all by his assistants but that was another shocker of a performance from a referee

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:46 pm

Rileybobs wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:39 pm
Can’t agree with that. It’s like someone had told him that two wrongs make a right.

Well that is kinda exactly the point I was making. Thanks for agreeing.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:48 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:42 pm
Horrendous and dangerous performance.

Quite right. We mustn’t rush to hyperbole. We should amble there.

We also mustn’t make this feature a waste of our time.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:49 pm

Burnleyareback2 wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:40 pm
Off topic- apologies.
4th official was female this evening, if she had to come on and take over would that of been the first female referee at this level?

It probably would of been a blessing in disguise to be fair.

Fun fact:

She also had a man bun, which on her head is just called “a bun”.

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:59 pm

Rowls wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:49 pm
Fun fact:

She also had a man bun, which on her head is just called “a bun”.

Welcome to the 21st Century Rowls, good to see you caught up

Steve-Harpers-perm · Post by **Steve-Harpers-perm** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:02 am

Yet another clueless ref.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:02 am

Burnleyareback2 wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:59 pm
Welcome to the 21st Century Rowls, good to see you caught up

You’re right.

I should apologise. We shouldn’t joke about such things.

They was wearing a cis-bun on their head.

Clive 1960 · Post by **Clive 1960** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:26 am

Very poor referee from start to finish and he's a premier League ref .

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 1:12 am

Blind, fatherless w anker. Awful.

Beagle · Post by **Beagle** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 5:30 am

Rowls wrote: ↑
Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:02 am
You’re right.

I should apologise. We shouldn’t joke about such things.

They was wearing a cis-bun on their head.

What is (not) going on in your life that you feel the need to take over this thread before coming out with this utterly irrelevant unfunny political pish? I know you’ll love me for biting, but I do feel duty-bound to let you know just how attention-seeking and sad you come across as.

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 8:25 am

He was average to poor first half, but he did play a couple of sensible "advantages" for both sides and didnt make any massive blunders, but second half he really had a stinker and the Brum player touching the free kick twice was the (laughable!) icing on the cake.

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 8:33 am

The failure to show Hannibal a second yellow was appalling.

Luppy · Post by **Luppy** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 8:59 am

A - 7
B - 8
C - 10 - his biggest problem imo
D - 8

When your positioning is poor, the rest tends to be poor. Got a genuine feeling at times that he was simply guessing. In fairness to him, his assistants gave him no help at all!

Beagleheart · Post by **Beagleheart** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:10 am

12
12
11
10

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:18 am

15
18
10
18

I don't share the oppobrium about failing to spot who was taking the free kick. How much better would the game be if the ref spent his time closely watching the taking of free kicks? And even worse, the apparently serious suggestion that rather than looking across the line for offsides, the linesman should have been watching for who took the free kick?

I accept that some people want more free kicks in the game, starting presumably in the first minute when our goal would have been disallowed by a stricter referee. Some people want more whistle, more cards, more sendings off - for both sides, presumably. Not for me. He had his flaws but his general attitude to play (ie. let's get on with it, rather than look at me I've stopped the game again) was good.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:22 pm

I'm willing to cut the ref a good deal of slack last night. He set his stall out to be lenient, no doubt taking conditions into account, and we benefited from that fron the get go - plenty of refs would have stopped our opener at source by judging Jay's tackle on Bielik a foul. Given that we can hardly argue that Birmingham then got away with some pretty borderline challenges.

That said, the ref did lose control a bit at times and in the end he had to tie himself in knots a bit to keep all 22 players on the pitch. But again we benefited from that- Cullen might easily have received a second yellow in the second half.

I can see why he is highly rated, even if it wasn't his best night.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:28 pm

xxmunkyennuixx wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:05 pm
A - 3
B - 3
C - 10
D - 3

So many mistakes. Some were minor, some were pretty major. Tell me why studs up is not a second yellow? The corner that was a goal kick? The player taking a free kick to himself? Deeney being filth? Shoves in the back allowed apart from if we do it. Absolute waste of space. The lino on the Longside saw Chong push Cork into the ref and did nothing. Any time they turn up at the Turf, they should get it at kick off. Pour derision down on them.

1. Tell me why studs up is not a second yellow?
He won the ball tbf.

2. The corner that was a goal kick?
correct decision, it went out last off Barnes.

3. The lino on the Longside saw Chong push Cork into the ref and did nothing.
Chong was yellow carded for this.

4. Shoves in the back allowed apart from if we do it.
He let the one go which allowed us to open the scoring.

5. Deeney being filth?
Rightly yellow carded for that tackle, pretty much the same as Cullen's lunge.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:29 pm

Ashingtonclaret46 wrote: ↑
Tue Dec 27, 2022 11:03 pm
He certainly is, having refereed 34 matches in the PL including our 4-0 win at Wolves a couple of seasons ago. I thought that he was not on top of his game tonight.

He didn’t appear to get any help though from his assistants. I really hope when he and his assistants sit down today with the Assessor they are given a hard time. The standard of refereeing in the championship is dreadful.

I didn’t think it correct to score him as I watched on t.v.

CaptJohn · Post by **CaptJohn** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:43 pm

He was inept from the start but became farcical when he bottled the 2nd yellow for Hannibal, which was borderline red, and then became a laughing stock when he missed the double touch at the free kick.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:24 pm

CaptJohn wrote: ↑
Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:43 pm
He was inept from the start but became farcical when he bottled the 2nd yellow for Hannibal, which was borderline red, and then became a laughing stock when he missed the double touch at the free kick.

All referees do that. You often find that at free kicks, the ref is concentrating on what is going on in the crowded penalty area, the linesman is looking across at who is offside. Which job is so unimportant that it should be replaced by a close check to see the free kick isn't touched twice?

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Wed Dec 28, 2022 11:07 pm

dsr wrote: ↑
Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:24 pm
All referees do that. You often find that at free kicks, the ref is concentrating on what is going on in the crowded penalty area, the linesman is looking across at who is offside. Which job is so unimportant that it should be replaced by a close check to see the free kick isn't touched twice?

There are two linesmen.

Stanbill05 · Post by **Stanbill05** » Thu Dec 29, 2022 5:25 am

KRBFC wrote: ↑
Wed Dec 28, 2022 12:28 pm
1. Tell me why studs up is not a second yellow?
He won the ball tbf.

2. The corner that was a goal kick?
correct decision, it went out last off Barnes.
Ds
3. The lino on the Longside saw Chong push Cork into the ref and did nothing.
Chong was yellow carded for this.

4. Shoves in the back allowed apart from if we do it.
He let the one go which allowed us to open the scoring.

5. Deeney being filth?
Rightly yellow carded for that tackle, pretty much the same as Cullen's lunge.

Apart from the first one that's about right, you can't go through the ball with your studs up like that- definitely endangering the opponent. I can understand the ref thinking he won the ball fairly from his angle though. Deeney was right on the edge between yellow and red, it was worse than Cullens but not quite bad enough to be a definite red. Overall, I agree though, I didn't think the ref got as much wrong as these scores suggest.

Stanbill05 · Post by **Stanbill05** » Thu Dec 29, 2022 5:37 am

dsr wrote: ↑
Wed Dec 28, 2022 3:24 pm
All referees do that. You often find that at free kicks, the ref is concentrating on what is going on in the crowded penalty area, the linesman is looking across at who is offside. Which job is so unimportant that it should be replaced by a close check to see the free kick isn't touched twice?

You've lost me. To know if someone is offside, it's quite important to know exactly when the ball has been played..the linesman should definitely have the freekick taker in vision. It's not the most common "foul play" to closely look out for though, especially when there were 2 over the ball.