The disappearing Keirby Roundabout

[ClaretTony]

The trees on the roundabout went some time ago, work ongoing to get rid of the whole thing today.

Keirby Roundabout.jpg (525.86 KiB) Viewed 4321 times

[Big Vinny K]

After so many years of seeing that roundabout it looks very strange these days approaching it !!

[ClaretTony]

After so many years of seeing that roundabout it looks very strange these days approaching it !!

It's looked very strange since the trees went. It's around 60 years old now.

Most of the wall gone round it today, only one lane open to traffic and a digger there. Wasn't expecting to see that today.

[claretonthecoast1882]

The disappearing Keirby would be far better

[dushanbe]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

[ŽižkovClaret]

The disappearing Keirby would be far better

BUT THEY HAVE CLEAN ROOMS!

[casualclaret]

"The disappearing Keirby would be far better."
Absolutely. In all the good things and investment in our town I'm amazed that it still stands. Complete eyesore.

[randomclaret2]

I will be amazed if traffic flow is improved once the roundabout is replaced

[Juan Tanamera]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

That could be fun when the season kicks off in what, just under 5 weeks?

[FCBurnley]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

Assume that’s the road under the Culvert ? If so it will be chaos for the City game

[ClaretAL]

"The disappearing Keirby would be far better."
Absolutely. In all the good things and investment in our town I'm amazed that it still stands. Complete eyesore.

Totally agree, and also the market hall. Why they didn't knock the market hall to facilitate the new complex on pioneer place, or create new shops is beyond me. Last time I walked through the market hall is was empty apart from fast food stalls.

[ClaretTony]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

Road scheduled to re-open next week I was told

[dushanbe]

Road scheduled to re-open next week I was told

Not sure then. I was talking to a business based down that way and they'd said the council had been in to inform them that it was at least a further six weeks. Its been making their deliveries tricky.

[Sozturf7]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

I really don't understand how an estimate of 6 weeks can change to 12 weeks. They said only blasting /painting /with minor concreting works. Perhaps your contact has it wrong, hope so it's causing problems around town.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Would be miles better to be able to turn right down Centenary Way from the Thompson Centre car park but I haven’t seen this will change. Currently to avoid gridlock in the centre up Manchester Road after a game the only option is to turn left to the roundabout and do a u-turn, which won’t now be possible.

[CoolClaret]

The disappearing Keirby would be far better

Seriously needs pulling down - along with all them horrid sort of ‘strip mall’ esque buildings around the roundabout next to frydays/keirby walk/McDonald’s

There’s some lovely old buildings in the town - shame they get shadowed out by those monstrosities

[ClaretPope]

Would be miles better to be able to turn right down Centenary Way from the Thompson Centre car park but I haven’t seen this will change. Currently to avoid gridlock in the centre up Manchester Road after a game the only option is to turn left to the roundabout and do a u-turn, which won’t now be possible.

The plan for the work round the bus station shows it is going to happen
https://burnley.gov.uk/business/economi ... wn-2-turf/

[Targetman]

"Upgrade to Manchester Road Station"

Does that mean a further upgrade to the work done a few years ago? Possibly the westbound platform?

[ChrisG]

Does anyone have a picture of the area now th roundabout had gone? I imagine it's very strange!

[Dark Cloud]

The underground car park is an archetypal 60s abomination and would be right up there on my list for demolition, but I do see that it would be almost impossible without taking out much of the shopping area which sits on top of it and that means it's never going to happen unfortunately.
As a student doing my A levels in the mid 70s I worked part time at The Kierby (74-76) and it was very busy and pretty plush. Many of the away teams used it as it was handy for the Turf and I remember once serving lunch to the entire West Ham team along with manager Ron Greenwood before knocking off and heading up to road to watch them beat us 3 hours later. I'm not sure who actually owns it now, but it wants seriously sorting out as it seems silly to spend all this money smartening up the "town to Turf" and have that sitting there.

[Guitargeorge]

"Upgrade to Manchester Road Station"

Does that mean a further upgrade to the work done a few years ago? Possibly the westbound platform?

We have had a communication from Network Rail saying that there will be some noise disruption this month, due to test boring in preparation for the installation of a bridge between the platforms. Then there is the proposed work on Manchester Rd when the proposed supermarket replaces the cinema, the replacement for which is nearing completion.

[ChrisG]

The underground car park is an archetypal 60s abomination and would be right up there on my list for demolition, but I do see that it would be almost impossible without taking out much of the shopping area which sits on top of it and that means it's never going to happen unfortunately.
As a student doing my A levels in the mid 70s I worked part time at The Kierby (74-76) and it was very busy and pretty plush. Many of the away teams used it as it was handy for the Turf and I remember once serving lunch to the entire West Ham team along with manager Ron Greenwood before knocking off and heading up to road to watch them beat us 3 hours later. I'm not sure who actually owns it now, but it wants seriously sorting out as it seems silly to spend all this money smartening up the "town to Turf" and have that sitting there.

Underground is generally the best place for a car park if you're going to have one, but only if you use the space above it. The one on Burnley is a half arsed effort that wastes a load of space and is a right balls to get too

[MrTopTier]

What are they replacing it with?

[Claret Till I Die]

I was told that the culvert is due to be closed to traffic for at least a further six weeks.

Maybe they're going to start the footways once the bridge is reopened ?

[Targetman]

We have had a communication from Network Rail saying that there will be some noise disruption this month, due to test boring in preparation for the installation of a bridge between the platforms. Then there is the proposed work on Manchester Rd when the proposed supermarket replaces the cinema, the replacement for which is nearing completion.

I see thanks for that.

I didn't know about the proposed supermarket, do you know which company this will be?

[NorthIsCool]

Maybe they're going to start the footways once the bridge is reopened ?

They've already started the pavements from Plumbe St towards town - Royal Dyche side

[Loyalclaret]

I see thanks for that.

I didn't know about the proposed supermarket, do you know which company this will be?

Lidl I believe

[Loyalclaret]

They've already started the pavements from Plumbe St towards town - Royal Dyche side

Doubt it would take long to finish the pavement on the Prinny side of the road, it's been widened considerably and has the new lampposts in place. The pavements are roughly double the size they were previously for those that haven't been down.

Like to know what will happen to the large groups of drunks who hang out down there dawn until dusk

[ClaretTony]

Does anyone have a picture of the area now th roundabout had gone? I imagine it's very strange!

Picture at top of thread is this morning

[ClaretTony]

I see thanks for that.

I didn't know about the proposed supermarket, do you know which company this will be?

Lidl where the cinema currently is

[ClaretTony]

Doubt it would take long to finish the pavement on the Prinny side of the road, it's been widened considerably and has the new lampposts in place. The pavements are roughly double the size they were previously for those that haven't been down.

Like to know what will happen to the large groups of drunks who hang out down there dawn until dusk

Very wide now outside Vintage Claret, Turf & Dyche.

[ChrisG]

Picture at top of thread is this morning

Ah, apologies, I misread the date as 10th June.

It'll certainly look a lot different round there next time I'm in the town.

[ClaretTony]

Ah, apologies, I misread the date as 10th June.

It'll certainly look a lot different round there next time I'm in the town.

I was surprised to see that this morning given that the roundabout will continue in operation for some time yet. Looks as though it will be a temporary one.

[Rowls]

Burnley town needs a long term policy of knocking down the hideous brutalist and concrete architecture and replacing them with traditionalist aesthetically pleasing designs.

The focus should be on creating buildings that have a harmonious relationship to pedestrians and buildings that inculcate pride in the town. Any style of building should be considered as long as it provides good aesthetics and town planning but traditional stone buildings reflecting the Lancashire heritage should be prioritised and considered the default.

There should be a broad long term plan that all the local political parties agreed upon to ensure that the town centre is improved in a coherent manner for generation after generation until all the concrete monstrosities have gone entirely.

[nil_desperandum]

Underground is generally the best place for a car park if you're going to have one, but only if you use the space above it. The one on Burnley is a half arsed effort that wastes a load of space and is a right balls to get too

Not sure I can agree that it's difficult to access.
It's really easy to access from St James St / the Kierby roundabout, and I would think that the majority of cars coming into Burnley centre use this roundabout. (Not so easy from Padiham I suppose with St James St being pedestrianised, but still not too bad).

[ChrisG]

Burnley town needs a long term policy of knocking down the hideous brutalist and concrete architecture and replacing them with traditionalist aesthetically pleasing designs.

The focus should be on creating buildings that have a harmonious relationship to pedestrians and buildings that inculcate pride in the town. Any style of building should be considered as long as it provides good aesthetics and town planning but traditional stone buildings reflecting the Lancashire heritage should be prioritised and considered the default.

There should be a broad long term plan that all the local political parties agreed upon to ensure that the town centre is improved in a coherent manner for generation after generation until all the concrete monstrosities have gone entirely.

I would imagine a lot of the 1960s buildings are now at the end of, or beyond their working life. The major issue is of course cost to rebuild and replace (both from a financial and carbon point of view).

Building with stone is very expensive, mainly due to the time it takes to build, and also finding skilled labour. You're also limited with the layout if it all stone due to the spans unless you start incorporating steel frames.

Glulam timber beams and stone cladding would be a good solution, as it is quicker to erect, and would still enable the local vernacular to be maintained. See Booths at Barrowford, this is a good example of a modern building in a sympathetic style.

[Rowls]

Burnley is a very small town with a centralised population.

It needs less roads going through it and more pedestrianisation.

[Rowls]

I would imagine a lot of the 1960s buildings are now at the end of, or beyond their working life. The major issue is of course cost to rebuild and replace (both from a financial and carbon point of view).

Building with stone is very expensive, mainly due to the time it takes to build, and also finding skilled labour. You're also limited with the layout if it all stone due to the spans unless you start incorporating steel frames.

Glulam timber beams and stone cladding would be a good solution, as it is quicker to erect, and would still enable the local vernacular to be maintained. See Booths at Barrowford, this is a good example of a modern building in a sympathetic style.

Yes, the cost of replacing the awful concrete buildings in one swell foop would be exorbitant. That's why a long term plan needs to be agreed so they get replaced one by one in a coherent manner.

Buildings don't have to be built with traditional methods, they only need to be built to traditional styles. There are additional costs with traditional styles and flourishes but the payback goes beyond what can be calculated on a ledger. The buildings that surround us determine things as seemingly intangible as our crime rates and our mental health.

[Cirrus_Minor]

I remember when we were kids there wasn't anywhere near as many roundabouts as there are now. Me and my mate cycled for the first time to Burnley and then we reached the Keirby roundabout from Colne Road. I went round it clockwise and my mate went round it anticlockwise and both met again at the bus station. Fortunately there was no traffic. I think about that every time I see it, so will miss it in a strange way once they remove it.

[Rowls]

Having looked up Booths at barrowford it is jaunty, asymmetric and it looks cheap and ugly.

[Rowls]

This is the kind of redevelopment Burnley needs.

[CoolClaret]

This is the kind of redevelopment Burnley needs.

Absolutely agree with that Rowls.

The library & court and surrounding buildings all needs a good clean as well - superb buildings really, shadowed by the god ugly brutalist buildings that you have referred to

[Murger]

IMG_0501.jpeg (19.76 KiB) Viewed 2491 times

Burnley is a very small town with a centralised population.

It needs less roads going through it and more pedestrianisation.

[Rowls]

IMG_0501.jpeg

Yes, that quote was clearly in my mind as I typed it.

One would assume the writers of that series of Partridge agree with my sentiments.

[Burnley Ace]

This is the kind of redevelopment Burnley needs.

Why keep harking back to building styles from centuries ago? Let’s has decent well built modern buildings.

[Rowls]

Why keep harking back to building styles from centuries ago? Let’s has decent well built modern buildings.

Because a lot of modern architecture fails to consider the massive psychological benefit of aesthetics. This isn't a "twee" thing. It's about our mental health and our welbeing.

Which of those two buildings do you think the vast majority of people prefer? The vast majority prefer the most aesthetically pleasing. This isn't something subjective. It's measurable.

By all means, different styles should be included and modern techniques should be utlised (nobody is calling for power tools to be downed in favour of armwork) but how a building interacts with people within its surroundings it absolutely paramount. Buildings have "faces" for very good reason - they aren't stand alone items existing in their own world of buildings; they are all designed for use by and for people in the world of people.

As I said in my first post,

Any style of building should be considered as long as it provides good aesthetics and town planning but traditional stone buildings reflecting the Lancashire heritage should be prioritised and considered the default.

I've very much a fan of many modern styles, particularly art deco and streamline moderne - but each and every building still needs to have an aesthetic value and offer itself on a human level to the street, its surroundings and the people who will use it. There are bad art deco buildings and there a good ones.

Take a building like Burnley central library. What does that building say? It speaks volumes of the gigantic pride the people who designed and built it had for their town. Yes, it is imposing (and not a little grandiose) but it is also warm and welcoming and has a clear relationship with its surroundings. It clearly has a "face", an entrance, two sides and a rear. Yet even the rear and sides have a clear relationship with the street and their surrounds. The viewing angles from each and every facade discourage and prevent vandalism and the building is a pleasure to view from both inside and out.

Compare it to the Keirby hotel.

[Pickles]

Pleased to hear about improvements to BMR station. It's a shame it's up that big hill, makes connections to and from the bus station a hassle but I don't see how that can be changed.

Less pleased to hear about the cinema going. It obviously must not be viable but it's disappointing Burnley won't have a cinema. Smaller towns have them but not Burnley?

More reason to go to out of town which is a shame.

[Goody1975]

Pleased to hear about improvements to BMR station. It's a shame it's up that big hill, makes connections to and from the bus station a hassle but I don't see how that can be changed.

Less pleased to hear about the cinema going. It obviously must not be viable but it's disappointing Burnley won't have a cinema. Smaller towns have them but not Burnley?

More reason to go to out of town which is a shame.

I think you misunderstand the situation, there is a new cinema being built in town that is why the current one is closing.

https://aewarchitects.com/projects/pion ... e-burnley/

[uni_queue]

New cinema is part of the Curzon redevelopment

[ChrisG]

Because a lot of modern architecture fails to consider the massive psychological benefit of aesthetics. This isn't a "twee" thing. It's about our mental health and our welbeing.

Which of those two buildings do you think the vast majority of people prefer? The vast majority prefer the most aesthetically pleasing. This isn't something subjective. It's measurable.

By all means, different styles should be included and modern techniques should be utlised (nobody is calling for power tools to be downed in favour of armwork) but how a building interacts with people within its surroundings it absolutely paramount. Buildings have "faces" for very good reason - they aren't stand alone items existing in their own world of buildings; they are all designed for use by and for people in the world of people.

As I said in my first post,



I've very much a fan of many modern styles, particularly art deco and streamline moderne - but each and every building still needs to have an aesthetic value and offer itself on a human level to the street, its surroundings and the people who will use it. There are bad art deco buildings and there a good ones.

Take a building like Burnley central library. What does that building say? It speaks volumes of the gigantic pride the people who designed and built it had for their town. Yes, it is imposing (and not a little grandiose) but it is also warm and welcoming and has a clear relationship with its surroundings. It clearly has a "face", an entrance, two sides and a rear. Yet even the rear and sides have a clear relationship with the street and their surrounds. The viewing angles from each and every facade discourage and prevent vandalism and the building is a pleasure to view from both inside and out.

Compare it to the Keirby hotel.

I do agree, I'm not a fan of identikit high streets whatsoever, there needs to be a mix of styles.

I don't necessarily agree that Victorian = good and modern = bad though. The key is building relatable, human scale buildings that are both fit for purpose and sympathetically designed. Take the Welcome Building at RHS Bridgewater; this a superb example of a new building that is architecturally stunning whilst not being imposing on the local area.

There are of course examples of good, bad, and indifferent in any architectural style, be it Georgian, Victorian, Brutalist etc. The main difference is that with older eras, all the rubbish has been pulled down already, so it appears that the particular style only has good examples.


Let's also not forget that even 'traditional' styles of building were modern at some point, and someone will have complained about them!

The real issue with any building however is maintenance, and unfortunately is where it tends to go to pot as either the whole life cycle costing hasn't been considered, or funding cuts mean that this goes by the way side.