Mission to Burnley (including spoilers from page 9)

[Big Vinny K]

Agree
The footballing side of the story was good
But, for me, Alan Pace and his gang came over quite falsely
From the opening shot of these guys just turning up for a Sunday kick about on a local pitch when clearly none of them could even play the game
And how many of the inner sanctum are there - the scenes of meetings showed between 10 and 15 of them - are they all on the payroll?
And get rid of that childish laugh Alan
Definitely needed some more input from fans - almost like a program dedicated to Pace and Co

So you want Pace to change how he laughs ? Ok.
What does it matter whether they are on the payroll or not ? If they are then it’s safe to assume that they have a job at the club and like most people who have jobs they expect to get paid.

As for more input from the fans - no thanks. We see enough of tv channels interviewing people from Burnley on the news to try and reinforce a stereotype that does not do our town or fanbase any favours.

[vinrogue]

Outside the Longside, JHU or North Stand at the last game of the season and Pace wanders round and stops to have photos with Clarets. I stood and watched this for about 12 to 15 minutes and every fan who wanted a photo got the chance to say whatever they wanted to him. He spoke with everyone who wanted to speak to him or have a photo with him and about 5 yards away there were 2 security staff almost unseen. No film crew, just our Chairman on his own clearly enjoying chatting with supporters. After a while I thought why not, so yes I had my minute with him. It wasn't staged and it wasn't recorded on film. I like the bloke, initially I wondered who, what and why Americans would want BFC now with increasing numbers of investors I watched these 4 episodes pleased to be a lifelong Claret. UTC

[AlargeClaret]

As a Burnley fan I really enjoyed it , though defo not one for the neutrals . Our success took out much of the drama /heartache /falling outs/ departures/sackings/stress etc that can give these docs a real edge . Perhaps a broader spectrum of “ club people “ would have been good . It’s the Alan Pace show ultimately and apart from that crazy daughter he cones across really well .
A very solid 6/10

[RVclaret]

As a Burnley fan I really enjoyed it , though defo not one for the neutrals . Our success took out much of the drama /heartache /falling outs/ departures/sackings/stress etc that can give these docs a real edge . Perhaps a broader spectrum of “ club people “ would have been good . It’s the Alan Pace show ultimately and apart from that crazy daughter he cones across really well .
A very solid 6/10

Interestingly I have seen many, many comments from neutrals online saying how much they enjoyed it, as well, several of my friends who don’t support Burnley said the same. They found the boardroom insight cool and Kompany amazing. Not sure how you can judge ‘defo not one for the neutrals’.

[helmclaret]

Know quite a few fans of other clubs who enjoyed it.

A win all round.

[Spijed]

It was very good. The only bit I felt contrived was at the point where they all gathered in a store room in the restaurant where they were discussing the transfer embargo. That seemed a bit of an odd location.

[Eyesofblue2]

We had this debate on Saturday in my local and the general opinion was Wilder & Rooney

My instant reaction was that Fat Sam was the Dyche clone, but you'd think Wilder must have been in the running.

[NottsClaret]

Interestingly I have seen many, many comments from neutrals online saying how much they enjoyed it, as well, several of my friends who don’t support Burnley said the same. They found the boardroom insight cool and Kompany amazing. Not sure how you can judge ‘defo not one for the neutrals’.

Incredibly, I was talking to a B***ard mate at the weekend, he'd watched it all. No way I could do that.

He said it was a good documentary for the insights to Pace and his team, he was quite impressed with how much they genuinely cared and handled things. Obviously impressed with Kompany too.

I still loudly celebrated Hull's win, you can't be too magnanimous with that lot.

[Rileybobs]

Finished watching this last week. I really enjoyed the documentary, the religious theme was far less prominent than I expected which was welcome. Although some of the impromptu board 'meetings' were obviously staged, Alan Pace comes across as very likeable and genuine and I think his awkwardness is quite endearing.

I also found the boardroom scenes quite insightful. The main winner from this documentary though was Vinny who covers himself in glory in nearly every scene (I found the frequent F-bombing in his team talks a little unnatural). He speaks so articulately and intelligently and it's even more obvious that we have an absolute gem of a manager and one who we need to enjoy whilst he's here because he seems destined for the very top. It's clear that the directors are businessmen rather than football men and it seems like Vinny's knowledge of the game and the industry is a massive asset to the board.

I found the actual match footage to be quite limited though and felt like more time could have been spent on the key moments of the season such as the late comebacks which were featured but not in enough detail.

Overall a great watch as a BFC fan, I don't think I'd have been too interested as a fan of another team but that's not really an issue for me.

[Healeywoodclaret]

My sister wanted to show her son (ten years ) and said she thought he’d love it, but thought the dressing room language was the only thing in the documentary making it a difficult call to show children. Is it a fair comment?

Well at 11 when he goes to High School it would probably be difficult to shield him from bad language, but I appreciate her reasons for being apprehensive.

[Nori1958]

Well at 11 when he goes to High School it would probably be difficult to shield him from bad language, but I appreciate her reasons for being apprehensive.

Also if he attends games now he will hear worse

[Darnhill Claret]

Alan Pace seems very 'available to the fans' every match day.

[CrosspoolClarets]

The issue with the f-bombing isn’t that kids at school do it (which they know is naughty so it sort of self regulates), nor is it that an adult stranger on the Turf does it (they have to have a brain the size of a walnut to keep dropping f-bombs fully aware kids are listening so the child knows not to copy it).

The issue is that Vinny is their hero and when a kid hears their hero coming out with it they then feel that is ok for them to repeat. We all have our tactics for dealing with that, I’ve explained to ours that a tough dressing room is not like real life, at least not in the area we live in it isn’t because you can go a year without hearing swearing, but we all have to weigh up what’s the best approach for our own family members.

[burnleytom]

Does anyone have any idea who the other two names were (the final three) along with Kompany?

Did Nixon write something about this yesterday? Obviously don’t pay to be a member of his Patreon, but the cryptic Twitter teaser yesterday was ‘Burnley supremo boss whisper causes a stir’. Presume he was referring to this, but no idea where it might have caused ‘a stir’?

[123EasyasBFC]

Did Nixon write something about this yesterday? Obviously don’t pay to be a member of his Patreon, but the cryptic Twitter teaser yesterday was ‘Burnley supremo boss whisper causes a stir’. Presume he was referring to this, but no idea where it might have caused ‘a stir’?

All Nixons sorry was that Pace had 2 other managers that he spoke to as well as kompany, but no names are mentioned, I can’t actually believe Nixon charges people to read a story like that

[superdimitri]

My favourite bit has to be when Barnes was questioning the referee in the tunnel about being fouled.

I'm sure referees hate him.

[CharlieinNewMexico]

My favourite bit has to be when Barnes was questioning the referee in the tunnel about being fouled.

I'm sure referees hate him.

Mine too!!!

[Healeywoodclaret]

Now finished all 4 episodes, enjoyed it although being a Burnley fan helps. A City mate was raving about it to me last night but of course similar point for him with the Kompany connection/insight. Suspect non Burnley fans might find it a bit thin.

Some good behind the scenes insights and Pace comes over well, even if he gives the impression he's winging it as indeed do his other compatriots. The locals seem to be doing most of the hard graft!

The language surprised and irritated me. Vinny only seemed to start saying the f word in every sentence towards the end of last season, it felt weird and a bit contrived to me. Odd.

(Realised i said Vinny then. Pace rubbing off on me, I've always said Vincent!)

Pace calls VK Vince

[Healeywoodclaret]

Just finished it all and now feel even more comfortable about Pace etc. being at the helm. I've said on other threads that, yes, they saddled debt on the club, but I think their business acumen and progressive approach to growing the club will generate more in the long-term than Garlic would have.

As johnnyjones says above, he comes across as a thoroughly decent bloke. I loved the bit where he returned to that lady's table in the fanzone to clean it. I think he'd have done that even without the cameras there.

I think he would have too. But the woman looked silly with all the “I’ve been coming here a long time “. They always choose the most solid ones for the cameras 🫣

[corporal jones]

Definitely needed some more input from fans - almost like a program dedicated to Pace and Co

Thats what it was meant to be! It was never about Burnley FC per se, but more about that particular group of people taking over the club. Hence the title: Mission to Burnley. And lets face it, at the time of the take over and then the Dyche sacking the last thing we needed was the ill informed opinions of most of the fan base.

[FCBurnley]

Without doubt it was the Alan Pace show.

Without the promotion we were in huge trouble and if we are relegated this year we could still be in huge trouble

As a lifelong Claret I found it enjoyable but worrying in equal measures. Credit to Pace for appointing VK. Hope it wasn’t beginners look

[scouseclaret]

Watched it for a second time this week and whilst its clear that Alan Pace is a football fan who's swept along with the excitement of it all, it was the CFO who spoke the truth out loud, a couple of times saying words to the effect of "we thought this would be easy money".

For all the right words they choose, making money out of the club is the first priority of these guys. That doesn't matter in as much as doing so depends on the club being successful, which is what we all want, but it does mean that they're willing to take risks with the club that fans might not be entirely comfortable with, especially since they're doing it predominantly with other peoples' money. That's what's happening now with another huge splurge on players, predominantly debt-financed.

It seems to me that football fans have become increasingly accepting of financially-motivated owners in a way that they wouldn't have been 10 years or so ago - think of the grief that the Glazers got for doing essentially what Pace & Co are doing at Man U 20 years ago, or Hicks & Gillette at Liverpool more recently.

[Nori1958]

Watched it for a second time this week and whilst its clear that Alan Pace is a football fan who's swept along with the excitement of it all, it was the CFO who spoke the truth out loud, a couple of times saying words to the effect of "we thought this would be easy money".

For all the right words they choose, making money out of the club is the first priority of these guys. That doesn't matter in as much as doing so depends on the club being successful, which is what we all want, but it does mean that they're willing to take risks with the club that fans might not be entirely comfortable with, especially since they're doing it predominantly with other peoples' money. That's what's happening now with another huge splurge on players, predominantly debt-financed.

It seems to me that football fans have become increasingly accepting of financially-motivated owners in a way that they wouldn't have been 10 years or so ago - think of the grief that the Glazers got for doing essentially what Pace & Co are doing at Man U 20 years ago, or Hicks & Gillette at Liverpool more recently.

I think it was a sarcastic comment, not a factual one...

[scouseclaret]

I think it was a sarcastic comment, not a factual one...

Only in as much as it was never going to be "easy", but it still belies the underlying fact of the matter.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Only in as much as it was never going to be "easy", but it still belies the underlying fact of the matter.

Had he said "we are gonna make a killing" how would you have interpreted that ?

[Ric_C]

Just finished it yesterday, thought it was really good. I think we have been spoilt with all the excellent coverage throughout the season. I was more interested in watching stuff I'd not seen before such as the financial elements.

Plus I think we let Rovers of very lightly by not even mentioning the ticket fiasco. Not sure they'd have done the same.

Barnes and Vinny are absolute legends.

"Now you have the chance to win the league in the home of your enemy..."

[FCBurnley]

Amazing how quickly we can forget. It showed the league table in I think it was Sept where we were 15th position and there were a lot of worried people at the club. How easily that could have seen us drop to Div 1 with huge debts. Thankfully our brilliant manager turned it all around and the rest is history
One other comment from a Director that stuck in my mind was along the lines of “Just imagine we could have been stuck in the Championship for ever”. Shows a total lack of understanding how football in UK works and the thought of a further relegation never entered his head. Alls well that ends well I guess ( so far )

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Some clubs do spend a long time in the championship, moving neither up nor down, Birmingham being the current longest unbroken run as members with 12-13yrs, whilst Cardiff have the most championship seasons overall

[CoolClaret]

Watched it for a second time this week and whilst its clear that Alan Pace is a football fan who's swept along with the excitement of it all, it was the CFO who spoke the truth out loud, a couple of times saying words to the effect of "we thought this would be easy money".

For all the right words they choose, making money out of the club is the first priority of these guys. That doesn't matter in as much as doing so depends on the club being successful, which is what we all want, but it does mean that they're willing to take risks with the club that fans might not be entirely comfortable with, especially since they're doing it predominantly with other peoples' money. That's what's happening now with another huge splurge on players, predominantly debt-financed.

It seems to me that football fans have become increasingly accepting of financially-motivated owners in a way that they wouldn't have been 10 years or so ago - think of the grief that the Glazers got for doing essentially what Pace & Co are doing at Man U 20 years ago, or Hicks & Gillette at Liverpool more recently.

Entirely agree.

Whilst it’s working it’s great.

Thank god we struck gold with Kompany because we were proverbially up shits creek without a paddle if we got that appointment wrong.

Until we are cash healthy (which we were before the takeover) I will always remain skeptical of ALK in all honesty; a few clever PR moves such as this doc doesn’t take away from the facts that if it goes belly up, these guys aren’t personally liable as they put next to nothing of their own money in.

It’s great for now but we simply cannot afford to absorb big losses like other clubs can, they would cripple us - I will credit them though they’re clearly switched on and well connected.

The comments of 'how genuine they come across' make me laugh when they're in essence fully aware of the cameras present, even make reference and speak directly to them and even sat in on the final edit - heck every opening scene was completely and utterly contrived

Pace/ALKs game at least in my opinion, is to simply grow the valuation of the club and when they feel like they can't grow it any more then they will look to sell and make themselves a pretty penny (or should I say dollar).

We can enjoy the process of course but should always remain skeptical.

[RVclaret]

Entirely agree.

Whilst it’s working it’s great.

Thank god we struck gold with Kompany because we were proverbially up shits creek without a paddle if we got that appointment wrong.

Until we are cash healthy (which we were before the takeover) I will always remain skeptical of ALK in all honesty; a few clever PR moves such as this doc doesn’t take away from the facts that if it goes belly up, these guys aren’t personally liable as they put next to nothing of their own money in.

It’s great for now but we simply cannot afford to absorb big losses like other clubs can, they would cripple us - I will credit them though they’re clearly switched on and well connected.

The comments of 'how genuine they come across' make me laugh when they're in essence fully aware of the cameras present, even make reference and speak directly to them and even sat in on the final edit - heck every opening scene was completely and utterly contrived

Pace/ALKs game at least in my opinion, is to simply grow the valuation of the club and when they feel like they can't grow it any more then they will look to sell and make themselves a pretty penny (or should I say dollar).

We can enjoy the process of course but should always remain skeptical.

It’s all well and good being ‘cash healthy’ but there was a flip side to that which was to the detriment of the squad in the end and ironically resulted in the relegation. Also it depends what you are defining as cash healthy? There’s lots of argument in the financial/business world that having a large pot of cash lying around doing nothing is poor business management. Investing in appreciating assets (young talented players in this case) is my preferred method to grow the club.

Also not sure how scouseclaret has any clue on this ‘splurge on players’ being ‘debt fuelled’. It’s amazing how people speak so confidently and factually about something they clearly know so little about.

[Chester Perry]

Pace/ALKs game at least in my opinion, is to simply grow the valuation of the club and when they feel like they can't grow it any more then they will look to sell and make themselves a pretty penny (or should I say dollar).

There are many, who would argue with good cause, including directors of the previous regime, that that is exactly what Mike Garlick and to a lesser extent John Banaszkiewicz did under their tenure. It was done differently, but the the alleged aims appear to be similar.

It is worth noting that no owner of an English club has generated more sale profit, as a multiple of total personal investment on sale than that board under Garlick. Currently, only the Glazers stand to beat it (over a much longer period of ownership) if the sale of Manchester United goes through.

[claretonthecoast1882]

It’s all well and good being ‘cash healthy’ but there was a flip side to that which was to the detriment of the squad in the end and ironically resulted in the relegation. Also it depends what you are defining as cash healthy? There’s lots of argument in the financial/business world that having a large pot of cash lying around doing nothing is poor business management. Investing in appreciating assets (young talented players in this case) is my preferred method to grow the club.

Also not sure how scouseclaret has any clue on this ‘splurge on players’ being ‘debt fuelled’. It’s amazing how people speak so confidently and factually about something they clearly know so little about.

Some are never ever going to accept the owners.It's like the number of times you read "Pace got lucky" when it comes to appointing Kompany. You can guarantee every single pound you have that had we appointed someone else and it not worked out not one of them would simply trot out "Pace got unlucky"

They don't like the idea of an owner making money out of the club, ignoring what the previous owner did as he said he was a Burnley fan. The club was up for sale for a long enough period of time for someone born on Brunshaw Rd with deep pockets but sadly the sugar daddy owner never stepped forward.

[Winstonswhite]

Without doubt it was the Alan Pace show.

Without the promotion we were in huge trouble and if we are relegated this year we could still be in huge trouble

As a lifelong Claret I found it enjoyable but worrying in equal measures. Credit to Pace for appointing VK. Hope it wasn’t beginners look

If there had been a documentary about the 2008/9 season I'm pretty sure you would have viewed it in exactly the same way. Football clubs of our size are constantly run on the edge of a precipice. It'll never change.

[CoolClaret]

It’s all well and good being ‘cash healthy’ but there was a flip side to that which was to the detriment of the squad in the end and ironically resulted in the relegation. Also it depends what you are defining as cash healthy? There’s lots of argument in the financial/business world that having a large pot of cash lying around doing nothing is poor business management. Investing in appreciating assets (young talented players in this case) is my preferred method to grow the club.

Also not sure how scouseclaret has any clue on this ‘splurge on players’ being ‘debt fuelled’. It’s amazing how people speak so confidently and factually about something they clearly know so little about.

I don’t necessarily mean have the entirety of what we had in as dry powder and the end of Garlicks tenure was getting the club prepared for a sale.

I feel like we had a good balance around the sort of 17/18 is sort of season.

Fully agree that it’s imperative to buy saleable assets but I like a little bit for a rainy day as well -

It is worth noting that no owner of an English club has generated more sale profit, as a multiple of total personal investment on sale than that board under Garlick. Currently, only the Glazers stand to beat it (over a much longer period of ownership) if the sale of Manchester United goes through.

Yep, I was also critical of Garlick & Co who towards the end of his tenure also began to stop planning for the future and expected Dyche to work minor miracles purely for his own monetary gain.

My biggest point is I think there’s a balance to be had and I feel like right now we’re erring too much on the side of risk.

I could be wrong but that’s how I feel.

[Herts Clarets]

It’s all well and good being ‘cash healthy’ but there was a flip side to that which was to the detriment of the squad in the end and ironically resulted in the relegation. Also it depends what you are defining as cash healthy? There’s lots of argument in the financial/business world that having a large pot of cash lying around doing nothing is poor business management. Investing in appreciating assets (young talented players in this case) is my preferred method to grow the club.

I argued this very point a few years back when we were racking up profits, cash in the bank and very little investment in improving the playing side. I asked if were primarily a vehicle for cash generation to the benefit of the owner and the detriment on what i see the aims of the club to be, namely success on the playing field. Unfortunately, despite all the rhetoric of 'the board are all fans and don't pay themselves a salary", increasing his own personal wealth, regardless of the cost to the club, is exactly what the previous chairman did.

[CoolClaret]

Some are never ever going to accept the owners.It's like the number of times you read "Pace got lucky" when it comes to appointing Kompany. You can guarantee every single pound you have that had we appointed someone else and it not worked out not one of them would simply trot out "Pace got unlucky"

They don't like the idea of an owner making money out of the club, ignoring what the previous owner did as he said he was a Burnley fan. The club was up for sale for a long enough period of time for someone born on Brunshaw Rd with deep pockets but sadly the sugar daddy owner never stepped forward.

Heaven forbid I’ll always be peeved off with the manner of the sale of the club and how much money was taken out of it!

It’s also nothing to do with where someone comes from either, like not one bit.

VK appointment wasn’t luck ok I’ll concede on that -it was a good appointment (so far).

Thank goodness that Pace got that right because it could’ve been really disastrous - which is because ALKs entire strategy so far IS risk based.

You really do love to gaslight though don’t you? Can you not just articulate and respond normally, it’s quite tiresome.

[claretonthecoast1882]

Heaven forbid I’ll always be peeved off with the manner of the sale of the club and how much money was taken out of it!

It’s also nothing to do with where someone comes from either, like not one bit.

VK appointment wasn’t luck ok I’ll concede on that -it was a good appointment (so far).

Thank goodness that Pace got that right because it could’ve been really disastrous - which is because ALKs entire strategy so far IS risk based.

You really do love to gaslight though don’t you? Can you not just articulate and respond normally, it’s quite tiresome.

Apologies if you feel gaslighted. I am fairly certain I wasn't responding to you though.

I am going to guess that you have taken some of my comments to heart, stick me on your foe list then you will be ok going forward.

[TPClaret]

I don’t necessarily mean have the entirety of what we had in as dry powder and the end of Garlicks tenure was getting the club prepared for a sale.

I feel like we had a good balance around the sort of 17/18 is sort of season.

Fully agree that it’s imperative to buy saleable assets but I like a little bit for a rainy day as well -



Yep, I was also critical of Garlick & Co who towards the end of his tenure also began to stop planning for the future and expected Dyche to work minor miracles purely for his own monetary gain.

My biggest point is I think there’s a balance to be had and I feel like right now we’re erring too much on the side of risk.

I could be wrong but that’s how I feel.

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

[Herts Clarets]

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

Maybe it was hard to attract players to play for Sean Dyche rather than BFC? VK doesn't appear to have too many difficulties, though he is fishing in a very different pond to Sean.

[AlargeClaret]

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

While your points are valid per se ,we did survive another 4 seasons on mainly fresh air . Pace is gambling on a totally different strategy by bringing in young talents , paying them a lot more than they’re currently on, in the hope values will increase . It’s quite exciting and I’m v much enjoying the ride ,but wether it brings medium term success is anyone’s guess . IMO it’s not really comparable to the SD/Garlik as who can blame a manager when is Chairman gives you Dale Stevens in a transfer window ..

[CoolClaret]

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

We did start to stand still after that no doubt especially as investment was slowly cut.

17/18 wasn’t a bad window - Chris Wood, Chaz, Bardo, Lennon, Jack Cork in (amongst some other dross) - we certainly got away with that towards the end of Dyche’s tenure that’s for sure (due to the pandemic/sale of the club).

What annoys me is some of the revisionist history fans have regarding Dyche’s tenure as though we only ever played lino it up direct 442 and that we only ever signed 30 yr old jobbers.

What’s good now is that we do have a vision a plan and do have alignment throughout the club; I think that’s why last season was so successful because it was a three year plan- it wasn’t necessarily chucking **** at a wall and hoping it would stick which can be the case with clubs that have been relegated trying to immediately get back up - almost chasing their losses like a unhinged gambler.

My point is regarding all this is that I just want to be a little more cautious than we are being right now because I don’t want to end up with our club on the brink. That’s all.

[Chester Perry]

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

The club was in a very different place then, and still investing in the infrastructure for the players that so pleased Kompany when he saw it on his arrival.

There is no doubt that the current board and manager are more aggressive in the market place and with their reach, than those that came before but the foundations they are building from are somewhat different, as are their connections across the game.

2017/18 is a particularly interesting period for the club when you look back at the accounts - the spending headroom that newly promoted clubs find had disappeared as wages accelerated and amortisation leaped up. The spending of the summer of 2018 was the first one not to provide a future transfer return and the whole model effectively stalled, as off field investment was primarily about long overdue improvements in player facilities rather than those that would provide immediate revenue returns. Commercial revenues were increasing rapidly, but from a low base leaving us distant to what was actually needed. That board was also reluctant to squeeze fans on ticket pricing.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

You say we had a good balance around 17/18. But we stood still after that and never pushed on. Ultimately getting relegated. Dyche was coming out with excuse after excuse saying it was hard to attract players to the club. Hardly struggling to attract them now.

Under Garlick the club offered lower base wages but very good incentives/bonuses and that probably put some players off
Same with our relegation clauses, some players didn’t want to take a pay cut if we went down

Those things do make it harder to sign/attract players to the club.

[scouseclaret]

It’s all well and good being ‘cash healthy’ but there was a flip side to that which was to the detriment of the squad in the end and ironically resulted in the relegation. Also it depends what you are defining as cash healthy? There’s lots of argument in the financial/business world that having a large pot of cash lying around doing nothing is poor business management. Investing in appreciating assets (young talented players in this case) is my preferred method to grow the club.

Also not sure how scouseclaret has any clue on this ‘splurge on players’ being ‘debt fuelled’. It’s amazing how people speak so confidently and factually about something they clearly know so little about.

Taking the last point first, where else do you think its coming from? I've no doubt the likes of JJW and Dude Perfect are in for a few million but its looking like we'll have spent c£100m by the end of the month, before we even get talking about wages.

Yes, having huge pots of cash is poor business management and I was certainly no fan of the way Garlick/JB ran the club in their last few years - I think they behaved disgracefully and deserve a hell of a lot more criticism than they ever got. The problem is that for most businesses investment returns tend to be a bit more predictable than buying footballers, and if you're doing it with debt you're putting your business at risk.

That's not to say I don't believe in the underlying philosophy of investing in young talent - I'm as excited as anyone about all these new players and how we're going to do this season - it's just the suitability of a highly-geared business model for a football club that concerns me. And for all the fluffy (and very excellent) PR, I don't think we should forget who these guys are - professional venture capitalists who are here to make money.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Do you think we’re handing over £100 million this summer?
We aren’t, but for some reason you and others are fretting over money that will be paid from future revenue and may not even reach that full amount if clauses aren’t met in regards to player performances and league status etc

The owners are money men, this is what they do, have done for years and a number of them have been involved in football before

[Spijed]

Putting aside any views on the current chairman v Mike Garlick is our business model any different to the leveraged buyout that the Glaziers undertook at Man U.

Or are all the pros and cons pretty much the same?

[dougcollins]

As for more input from the fans - no thanks. We see enough of tv channels interviewing people from Burnley on the news to try and reinforce a stereotype that does not do our town or fanbase any favours.

Ah, the toothless wonders who hang around outside the ground, day and night, waiting to be interviewed.

[RVclaret]

Taking the last point first, where else do you think its coming from? I've no doubt the likes of JJW and Dude Perfect are in for a few million but its looking like we'll have spent c£100m by the end of the month, before we even get talking about wages.

I’ve brought this up several times on other threads but anyway… thanks to the incredible management & reduction of the wage bill last season (estimated around £30-35m), we should now be in a position where the current seasons wage bill is in the £60-70m range (adding in new players plus rises for a few others). For a start, this is £25-30m less than in the last PL season. Then, it appears commercial revenues this season should be higher than previous (W88 sponsorship amount suggested to be £8-9m + all these other partnerships being announced). I believe PL revenues inc TV money & some other bits like their deal with EA Sports should give all clubs a bit extra too this season. Therefore, total revenues should go up to an estimated £135–140m (looking at previous accounts here). Other costs are around £15-18m.

This leaves a fair chunk (£40-50m) of ‘free cash flow’ which it appears is being invested in transfers. Of course the club have brought this money forward so they have that amount now rather than in 6 -9 months, but it doesn’t appear it’s a ‘debt fuelled splurge’ and in fact projected revenues mean the current ~£80m spend (down payments will be one third - one quarter of that due to the way transfer payments are made, so around £20-25m in actual cash going out) will be covered by current season revenues.

That’s before considering there ‘may’ be other silent investors we aren’t aware of (JJ and Dude perfect have been made public for obvious reasons).

[CoolClaret]

Putting aside any views on the current chairman v Mike Garlick is our business model any different to the leveraged buyout that the Glaziers undertook at Man U.

Or are all the pros and cons pretty much the same?

It’s the exact same on a smaller scale - though you could argue ‘riskier’ because United can absorb losses due to the ginormous size of their club.

Worth noting that ALK tried to acquire Southampton before us but someone on their board veto’d their takeover attempt because they were unhappy with the prospective buyout model.

[Chester Perry]

I’ve brought this up several times on other threads but anyway… thanks to the incredible management & reduction of the wage bill last season (estimated around £30-35m), we should now be in a position where the current seasons wage bill is in the £60-70m range (adding in new players plus rises for a few others). For a start, this is £25-30m less than in the last PL season. Then, it appears commercial revenues this season should be higher than previous (W88 sponsorship amount suggested to be £8-9m + all these other partnerships being announced). I believe PL revenues inc TV money & some other bits like their deal with EA Sports should give all clubs a bit extra too this season. Therefore, total revenues should go up to an estimated £135–140m (looking at previous accounts here). Other costs are around £15-18m.

This leaves a fair chunk (£40-50m) of ‘free cash flow’ which it appears is being invested in transfers. Of course the club have brought this money forward so they have that amount now rather than in 6 -9 months, but it doesn’t appear it’s a ‘debt fuelled splurge’ and in fact projected revenues mean the current ~£80m spend (down payments will be one third - one quarter of that due to the way transfer payments are made, so around £20-25m in actual cash going out) will be covered by current season revenues.

That’s before considering there ‘may’ be other silent investors we aren’t aware of (JJ and Dude perfect have been made public for obvious reasons).

There are some unknowns to consider

- 'MTB' suggested the external loan was reduced by circa £7m to circa £33m earlier this year - has more been paid off? Where did that £7m come from - the club or the club as a result of ALK/VSL loan repayment? Why pay off a loan on apparently very favourable terms, when the summer spending was already assumed and then replace with a factoring deal and a new asset secured credit facility?

- In July, the final instalment of £21m on the initial takeover deal was paid - did ALK/VSL pay for it from their own funds (like the previous payment) or were funds loaned to them from the club?

- There has been revived talk today of buying a Belgian club, at this stage is would make more sense for ALK/VSL to use their funds for such a purpose than to repay loans to Burnley FC

- are ALK/VSL going to start taking salaries at the club or is the 'management fee' going to increase (perhaps substantially)

- has the club debt to ALK been cleared or even increased - the reasons for it are unknown.

As for there being more silent investors - I am pretty certain of that being a factual reality