Burnley Town Centre

[Carlos the Great]

Empty shops … empty pubs .. empty streets .. what’s gone wrong ??

[Clive 1960]

Same in nearly every town unfortunately.

[Clovius Boofus]

It's the same in most towns up and down the country.

[Suratclaret]

On line shopping
Cost of living crisis
Out of town shopping

[RammyClaret61]

On line shopping
Cost of living crisis
Out of town shopping

Greedy landlords

[Carwin261]

On line shopping
Cost of living crisis
Out of town shopping

Plenty of chavs in the coffee shops.

[Inchy]

Cash converter, charity shop, Greggs……repeat

[Steve1956]

Plenty of chavs in the coffee shops.

Genuine question ...how do they afford that shocking habit,Necasfe instant is better than the coffee they serve in these places.

[No Ney Never]

Rent and business rates are making it difficult to maintain a high street presence for many retailers in addition to the competition online.

Rent, energy costs and the rising prices are killing pubs and restaurants for those willing to pay the premium for the out of home experience. Add in the availability from supermarkets and extended licencing laws, l wouldn't like to be trying to run such a business in the current climate.

We've always thought of the town centre as a daytime retail and evening night out place, it's difficult to imagine it being anything else.
I would like to see it weather proofed and become a centre of leisure and business. Somewhere you can still drive to, but not get wet when moving around the place.
Cafés, bars, restaurants, fitness, cinema, virtual reality gaming and otherworld experiences, business suites, exhibitions, hotels, etc.

Everything doesn't have to be out of town and accessible only to those with a car if we plan it and will it to be.
We must plan for the changes and the future now to avoid ghost towns and ghettos.

[DCWat]

I don’t think that the impact of sites such as Amazon can be ignored.

I’m guilty of using Amazon, far too much. The ease of purchasing, choice and speedy deliveries make it far more convenient to order from home than it is to make a trip into the local town.

Most of the time, I’m probably overpaying for the convenience offered.

Going to town or into a City for shopping used to be a day out - nowadays les and less people seem to be doing that. Even if I do go shopping, I’ll often try but not buy and then order on line at a better price.

The fewer people using shops means that there will naturally be fewer shops able to keep going.

Then you can throw supermarkets and bargain chains into the mix and it doesn’t help smaller independents. Towns and cities will never be the same again, sadly.

[IanMcL]

Retail on site is doomed unless the offering g somehow changes. Not sure to what.

[Pickles]

vape shop, chicken shop, vape shop, chicken shop, chicken & vape shop, bookies.

[turbo5]

On a FB group I use we were discussing the decline of pubs and clubs in town since the 80's -90's. They have a similar story to the shops.
It's not down to one particular factor but a combination.
Online retail offers so much more in terms of choice and price, all from the comfort of your home.
You need a good selection of shops . No point going clothes shopping if you only have one shop to choose from.
Retailers like Amazon etc you can order anything and have it delivered the same day or the next day.
Parking charges, Traffic, poor public transport.
Supermarkets offering nearly everything in a one stop shop.
Not enough independent retailers , nearly all the shops are high street brands, selling the same merchandise in every shop wherever you go
Shopping habits change, I was brought up going into town every Saturday, it was a ritual whether it was shopping, or going out for a few drinks , something to eat , pre football game . Now I hardly ever use the town centre unless it is match day and then I only use the pubs. Occasionally I will buy the odd bit of clothing from that independent clothes shop on st James street (towards the cross keys)

There are too many fast food outlets, most offer home delivery service so you don't really need to go into town.
Even on a darker side druggies can order their drugs delivered to their door faster than the time it takes a Dominoes pizza to arrive.
Reasons to go into town no longer exists , no need to go to the bank its all online, paying bills all online,
The concept of town centres need addressing, I doubt we will ever see the return of shops as we knew them, town centre planners are just chasing a nostalgic dream its just a matter of time before more retailers go under or change their strategy from servicing town centres and concentrate on big out of town retail parks and prime location stores in big cities.
What do we have left in Burnley ? M&S, Next,Boots, River island, a small WHSmith which survives because its the PO. Then pound shops , taxi ranks, Mobile phone shops ,coffee shops, bookies, charity shops and takeaways, a few banks and building societies. It doesn't exactly entice you into town. Even the closed market hall has declined into one big takeaway. Open market long since gone.
I give it 5 years and it will be a run down boarded up ghost town. It just needs one or two of the big retailers to leave and the smaller shops will close as they won't be the footfall that they need to survive.

My view is we need a central hub, a big town square with lots of activities going on. (maybe a retractable roof for the UK weather) lots of pop up bars, shops, kiosks, street food, artisan retailers, cheese, wines, craft style retailers, have street artists, bands, open air drinking, free parking make the town centre somewhere you want to go rather than avoid.

[NewClaret]

My view is we need a central hub, a big town square with lots of activities going on. (maybe a retractable roof for the UK weather) lots of pop up bars, shops, kiosks, street food, artisan retailers, cheese, wines, craft style retailers, have street artists, bands, open air drinking, free parking make the town centre somewhere you want to go rather than avoid.

Absolutely agree. Amazon and supermarkets have killed the high street as we knew it.

Councils now need dramatic plans to transform them.

Firstly I think you need to redevelop buildings and bring people back in to live in town centres, nice public spaces and events to enjoy as you say and a refocus on entertainment - look how old shops in Manchester now have escape rooms, the cube games, electric game box, mini golf, VR experiences, axe throwing, etc, etc.

Higher quality shops/restaurants/bars are also important. There’s always a flight too quality and if you don’t deliver it, people will find it elsewhere.

[BurnleyFC]

Interest rate hikes, people struggling to afford their mortgages/rent.

[Carwin261]

Genuine question ...how do they afford that shocking habit,Necasfe instant is better than the coffee they serve in these places.

Don’t know if that was sarcastic,of a certain age ,and no money worries,was waiting for a new tyre at Kwik Fit so decided to have a coffee,and cake in Barista,cost me £6,how many cups of Nescafé ,and homemade cakes would that pay for?

[Nonayforever]

Town centers are now a thing of the past unfortunately.
To try and halt their demise is both costly and foolish.
A huge combination of factors, mainly technology progress, has contributed to every towns troubles.
The reasons for their decline can be discussed and analysed but not reversed.
Large scale demolition of retail streets being replaced by housing villages is the most efficient way of progressing and not wallowing in a decaying past.

[Claret Till I Die]

Empty shops … empty pubs .. empty streets .. what’s gone wrong ??

Thought this was an Ed Sheeran song

[ralph8]

Some people avoid the town centre these days due to being approached by what can only be seen as quite aggressive begging. I have experienced this myself outside McDonalds whilst I also believe it takes place outside M&S. Needs sorting or shopper numbers will fall further.

[Carlos the Great]

I don’t think the gangs in town centres are helping ..: oh I mean the gang of traffic wardens that are patrolling like a pack of wolves taking your registration number before you’ve got out of your car ..

[ClaretAndJew]

Is this really a big deal for people or is it because it’s no longer available you want it again?

If the majority of people wanted it, it would stay.

[Boss Hogg]

Genuine question ...how do they afford that shocking habit,Necasfe instant is better than the coffee they serve in these places.

No it isn’t better.

[jrgbfc]

Same with pubs, everybody moans when they close but people aren't prepared to support them. Like using Amazon for all your shopping and then moaning the town centre is dead.

[Steve1956]

Don’t know if that was sarcastic,of a certain age ,and no money worries,was waiting for a new tyre at Kwik Fit so decided to have a coffee,and cake in Barista,cost me £6,how many cups of Nescafé ,and homemade cakes would that pay for?

I've seen woman in their PJ'S frequenting these places,I assume they have dropped the kids off at school and are just having a brew before they climb back into bed for the rest of the day.

[Boss Hogg]

A number of reasons for this but it might help if business rates were looked at and parking charges removed. Fuel costs and parking charges v ordering online. I agree about adding entertainment so it it’s a hub you want to go to. Anti social behaviour needs dealing with too but there are no police. The last time I drove through Burnley with kids in the car two women were beating the hell out of each other and kicking each other in the headI whilst a group of drunk brain dead men looked on. Hardly enticing.

[clarethomer]

I personally think Burnley has a great opportunity to be a successful thriving centre if it wants to.

Just need to create a centre where people will want to spend time there not just money. It has the football club that brings lots of visitors to the area - shame its hotel offering is poor to support those visitors.

Its brought the cinema more centrally and seems to have a few different places you can now go and eat close by and its more accessible to the centre than the current location.

If the centre is just a place to shop it will die. Simple as.

[Clovius Boofus]

The reasons for Burney town centre's decline are manyfold, but I wouldn't include car parking charges amongst them. There's something wrong with your outlook if you can afford to drive a car costing thousands of pounds, plus insurance etc, yet freak-out at having to fork out a quid for an hour's parking.

It's only £1.60 for two hours, £2.10 for three. If you're struggling to afford a couple of quid for three hours parking, then maybe it might be a good idea to ditch the car entirely and walk.

[AlargeClaret]

Town centres, retail and pubs etc have been in an almost irreversible decline for 35+ yrs . It’s a mix of tech led shopping habits , out of town retail parks, huge workplace and family dynamic changes ,and gradual but steady change in entertainment habits/choices .
Nowt to do with politics , greedy landlords, rent ,” expensive beer “ rates etc as they’ve always been a factor .

[beddie]

Unfortunately it’s not just Burnley. There are a number of towns, city’s in the country that have been neglected for years and lack investment. I agree with the comments about business rates and parking fees. People prefer retail parks these days, plenty of free parking and usually a good choice of shops.

[davideyresleftear]

Plenty of chavs in the coffee shops.

Not doubting you at all but I would have picked chavs and coffee shops as the least likely combination

[Colburn_Claret]

Greedy landlords

Strange one this.
Darlington had a spell about 4 years ago. A lot of big shops closing up because the Landlords put the ground rent up.
Richmond have just said 4 long established businesses are closing for the same reason.
What's odd is these premises then sit empty for years, meaning the Landlords are then making Jack ****. What do they gain from it?

[Burnley Ace]

I don’t think the gangs in town centres are helping ..: oh I mean the gang of traffic wardens that are patrolling like a pack of wolves taking your registration number before you’ve got out of your car ..

Normally I think there is one maybe two on street parking wardens. Do t think that can be described as a pack of wolves!

[Belial]

Normally I think there is one maybe two on street parking wardens. Do t think that can be described as a pack of wolves!

Some big over exaggerations on this thread

Burnley is nowhere near as bad as some of the other NW towns either. Especially Lancashire, Greater Manchester and Merseyside.

Burnley as a whole has been improving over the last 15 years or so but still has issues to resolve and more can be done. I've always thought one of the big issues in Burnley is the lack of transport connections - so people are at a loss to begin with if there are limited ways in and out or public transport takes too long. There's a serious lack of good eateries in the town centre too, possibly due in part to the above. If you look at Preston (granted it's a city) - I've always thought it's a bit of a dive, but recently it's been getting a few good restaurants. Sometimes it takes one or two to come in and the rest follow.

There's a growing customer base, with the Uni expanding and more businesses moving in around the town. For me the housing and transport routes, including sustainable ones, need to keep up.

Oh...and society as a whole has become too reliant on supermarkets, so I'd be restricting anything more and promoting encouraging businesses where possible. The farmers market they have in the town centre is a start, although it's not really anything special - but then things like that are needed to make a change

[Inchy]

At least it’s not as bad as Bracknell. I stayed there for an evening before my sisters passing out parade nearly 20 years ago. It was a ghost town hovel back then. I dread to think what it’s like now

I asked the receptionist at the hotel where is good for a drink. She directed me to the train station and told me to go to Windsor, 10 miles away

[Boss Hogg]

The reasons for Burney town centre's decline are manyfold, but I wouldn't include car parking charges amongst them. There's something wrong with your outlook if you can afford to drive a car costing thousands of pounds, plus insurance etc, yet freak-out at having to fork out a quid for an hour's parking.

It's only £1.60 for two hours, £2.10 for three. If you're struggling to afford a couple of quid for three hours parking, then maybe it might be a good idea to ditch the car entirely and walk.

Don’t agree at all. Motoring costs are enough as they are. Whilst I can afford it I don’t like paying for parking. It’s certainly more attractive to go somewhere with free parking imo.

[Carwin261]

Not doubting you at all but I would have picked chavs and coffee shops as the least likely combination

Yes they’re all there in their fake designer clothes ,sitting outside in the rain for a coffee ,and a fag,St James st is the pits .

[Burnley Ace]

Don’t agree at all. Motoring costs are enough as they are. Whilst I can afford it I don’t like paying for parking. It’s certainly more attractive to go somewhere with free parking imo.

Which comparable town centre has free parking? You would pay more than £2 in petrol driving to an out of town shopping centre but dont think of it as a motoring cost think of it as a shopping cost.

[Burnley Ace]

No one has mentioned the proliferation of barbers, hairdressers, nail salons and “beauty” clinics. For a poor town there are plenty!!

[Terrier]

And yet in Skipton the place is buzzing and new pubs opening, lots of daytrippers help but can not help but think we went wrong many years ago pulling the old market hall down and taking away real character making burnley another soulless town like lots of others!

[Boss Hogg]

Which comparable town centre has free parking? You would pay more than £2 in petrol driving to an out of town shopping centre but dont think of it as a motoring cost think of it as a shopping cost.

Retail Park. Not Comparable. Alternative. You don’t know if I live nearer a retail park or a town centre.

[Rowls]

And yet in Skipton the place is buzzing and new pubs opening, lots of daytrippers help but can not help but think we went wrong many years ago pulling the old market hall down and taking away real character making burnley another soulless town like lots of others!

Spot on.

Todmorden and hebden bridge are faring much better because their architectural heritage wasn't callously and foolishly destroyed.

[Inchy]

And yet in Skipton the place is buzzing and new pubs opening, lots of daytrippers help but can not help but think we went wrong many years ago pulling the old market hall down and taking away real character making burnley another soulless town like lots of others!

You can’t compare skipton to Burnley. Skipton is self titled the gateway to the dales. Gets loads of tourists and southern softies In search of countryside

[Swizzlestick]

Rawtenstall appears to have done well for itself recently.

[DXS]

Somebody mentioned earlier about the beggars, they're everywhere even sitting outside banks making people anxious about drawing money out, then there's the unruly gangs of kids causing mayhem especially outside McDonald's, if you go anywhere near Marks and Spencers there's groups of drunks on the benches outside again can be quite intimidating, the stench of weed/skunk around town and the lunatics flying around on e-bikes and scooters causing accidents, apart from that it's not to bad

[bfcjg]

Same in Europe, lots of shops/bars etc closed in towns due to the factors here in the UK. Its a societal change in how we live as much as a financial thing. More shops offices and pubs will become homes as is actually happening in Burnley Town centre.

[4midable]

Empty shops … empty pubs .. empty streets .. what’s gone wrong ??

Its a dump

[Carwin261]

Spot on.

Todmorden and hebden bridge are faring much better because their architectural heritage wasn't callously and foolishly destroyed.

Tod ,& Hebden Bridge are a stones throw away from Greater Manchester,quirky pubs,and shops to offer,Burnley can’t compete,especially when you hear on the tv “Burnley’s a shithole and I want to go home”

[Rowls]

Tod ,& Hebden Bridge are a stones throw away from Greater Manchester,quirky pubs,and shops to offer,Burnley can’t compete,especially when you hear on the tv “Burnley’s a shithole and I want to go home”

Burnley has the exact same potential as these towns. It sits in some of the best countryside in the whole country.

The town would be significantly better off now if it hadn't desecrated it's industrial and architectural heritage in the 60s and 70s. Not much point bleating about this now but plenty of reasons to put things right and build a town that properly reflects the proud history of Burnley.

[No Ney Never]

Spot on.

Todmorden and hebden bridge are faring much better because their architectural heritage wasn't callously and foolishly destroyed.

That maybe so, but doesn't deal with what's in front of us now.
The cobbles and tram lines from the past still exist under the tarmac, surely the opportunity to exploit this would return some character. Padiham to Burnley, Colne via Nelson to Burnley, etc. Including the areas these routes pass through.
There's some fantastic architecture and stone work still in place, but not exploited, providing an as yet, untapped source of visual stimulation in the area. All is not lost.

[bfcjg]

If you Google towns with empty shops or similar you'll see that Burnley is fairing quite well. You cannot realistically compare us to Hebden Bridge ,totally different economies and infrastructure.