Worst premier league squad we've had

[bumba]

£100 million to produce the worst squad I've ever seen us have in the premier league, it's spineless, clueless and out of ideas.
Who is going to take responsibility for the squad VK or is it down to somebody else?
We are so unbalanced, we are weaker than last season despite the spend, we rarely get out of our own half, it's boring to watch, it's predictable and I never heard one fan around the ground tonight saying any good about the team.
Beyond anything else it's embarrassing right now.

[Vegas Claret]

youngest premier league squad we've ever had

[Anthonini]

Most talented squad too

[bumba]

Most talented squad too

Where's the talent?

[bumba]

youngest premier league squad we've ever had

Do we get extra points if we win with a younger team?

[Goobs]

Where's the talent?

I know we are all hurting at the moment, but that is just ridiculous there are a lot of very good VERY YOUNG players in this squad.

[DCWat]

We are two / three players away from being a decent enough side. The issue is that the two / three required are needed in key areas.

We have to give them time - my concern is a toxic atmosphere developing and that is the last thing that this young squad needs right now.

[Newcastleclaret93]

We are two / three players away from being a decent enough side. The issue is that the two / three required are needed in key areas.

We have to give them time - my concern is a toxic atmosphere developing and that is the last thing that this young squad needs right now.

Not sure I agree DC, I think we need at least 5-6 first teamers to even start competing. The whole spine of the team isn’t strong enough for this level

[Florian]

Not worst
Just not ready

[Burnley1989]

No, not at all, it’s a team full of good players, a lot will go in to have great careers. It’s just really inexperienced at the minute.

I’m as frustrated as anyone but the last thing a young team needs is grief and pressure from the fans, we’ve just got to stick with them and believe it will work out.

[Anthonini]

Where's the talent?

Muric Cork jayrod Bruun brownhill

[evensteadiereddie]

A young, talented side with bags of potential but not yet up to Prem level.
I've no doubt that in, time, with this manager, this squad and a couple of additions in key areas, we will be a very strong outfit.
Whatever happens, no matter how gruesome this season is going to be, I'd rather be in our position, looking forwards, than the likes of Sheff United, Luton and so on.
No problem with posters being critical but I think it's vital everybody at least tries to acknowledge the bigger, long-term picture.

[bumba]

We was a strong outfit last season, last season's team would of competed. There's no hiding from ripping the squad apart for players not yet good enough, there's no excuse for it. It's been a disaster.
If we have the most talented squad we've ever had in the premier league then it begs the question is it the manager?
Something isn't right because we are truly awful, no spine, no tactics, just pass between the defence lose possession and invite pressure

[bumba]

Not worst
Just not ready

Not ready when we're in the premier league is as good as not good enough

[bumba]

I know we are all hurting at the moment, but that is just ridiculous there are a lot of very good VERY YOUNG players in this squad.

A lot of clubs have very good very young players in their youth teams.
We've spent £100 million on top of what was already a good squad and we've gone worse.
If the young players arent ready to compete at this level some by the way no where near ready then we shouldn't have bought them and spent the money in areas needed.
You can't up all the prices for paying fans, spend all that money then right the season off because there 'young', if the club wanted to go down that route they should have reduced prices and told the fans so

[claretonthecoast1882]

Some really struggle grasping that last seasons team was competing in the Championship.

Leicester won 9 games all season last year in the Prem, then lost Maddison Barnes Tielemens Castagne and many more. This season they have won 13 out of 14 in the division below, it is almost like the championship isn't as tough as this division.

[bumba]

Some really struggle grasping that last seasons team was competing in the Championship.

Leicester won 9 games all season last year in the Prem, then lost Maddison Barnes Tielemens Castagne and many more. This season they have won 13 out of 14 in the division below, it is almost like the championship isn't as tough as this division.

Leicester have made some top signings and got a new manager, they'll compete better than we have next season. They'd be higher up than us now there a better team. 'team' is a keyword because we no longer are one were a bunch of young individuals that aren't willing to fight for themselves let alone there team mates

[StayingDown4Ever]

I’m as frustrated as anyone but the last thing a young team needs is grief and pressure from the fans, we’ve just got to stick with them and believe it will work out.

I think you’re right about them not needing grief and pressure and the games I’ve been on this season they haven’t received half as much as they might have deserved from the fans. Some people go mad on here for criticising players/management etc but I think it’s better fans vent their justified frustrations on forums like this than in the stands.

I admire your optimism in believing it will work out but I think that is knows as ‘a fool’s hope’.

[evensteadiereddie]

Just as a matter of interest, bumba, can you name the players who are not prepared to fight and give examples of where they've ducked out.
Not doubting you, of course, but I just see a collective weakness as opposed to lack of commitment or bottle.

[evensteadiereddie]

I think you’re right about them not needing grief and pressure and the games I’ve been on this season they haven’t received half as much as they might have deserved from the fans. Some people go mad on here for criticising players/management etc but I think it’s better fans vent their justified frustrations on forums like this than in the stands.

I admire your optimism in believing it will work out but I think that is knows as ‘a fool’s hope’.

Or having patience and the awareness that VK's plans for success will not come overnight.
The season is approaching the time when it can be written off? So?

[Florian]

Not ready when we're in the premier league is as good as not good enough

Didnt say not good enough
There is clearly talent that hasnt clicked

[Carwin261]

Talents no good without graft,where are the grafter’s in the side?

[Colburn_Claret]

It's a good squad, missing a defensive midfielder, and hurting through injuries.
The biggest problem is we aren't a team. So many broken components. I still can't get my head around only having 2 of last seasons successful team, start against Brentford.

How you create that team, with the constant changes is beyond me. Most fans don't know what we're trying to do, and the players often look the same.

[IanMcL]

Most talented squad too

The thing about talent is that it has to be seen and blend with the surrounding team elements. Then it can develop further. If the team is lacking, then the talent can be stifled.

[jlup1980]

We look a yard behind everyone we've played this season. None of the new signings have shown anything like enough to suggest they will kick on. I hope I'm wrong but it feels like we might as well have thrown £100m down the toilet. As it stands, the only player we'd make a profit on is Koleosho.

If our entire squad was available who starts? I'd argue only Berge should be anywhere near the starting 11 from the summer signings, and even he's not guaranteed. Benson and Zaroury would still be on the wings and the rest of the team picks itself.

Anyone thinking a team made up of the new signings would dominate the Championship is in la la land. Poor defending is poor defending at any level. We're slow in transition, don't appear to have a backbone and look likely to concede at will. It's incredible how far we're regressed in such a short time.

[Stayingup]

I wish our 100 million player would come to the fore right now.

[expoultryboy]

There's a lot of talent in the squad but not enough 1st eleven experience ( not jay or cork ) . Every fan knew we needed at least one ball winning defensive midfielder plus a left back . IF we get Beyer fit plus buy /loan ( Phillips needs game time ) the midfield problem , we could get out of this . Bournemouth , Sheffield and Luton won't pull away from us .

[spt_claret]

It's a much better set of players than under Coyle/Laws, by some distance, but only on paper. In practice it's equally imbalanced for almost identical reasons.
Under Coyle we had a thin central defence and a midfield that was reliant on the first string personnel to work. We also had a sub par left back something Laws actually identified, although Fox was only a slight improvement on Jordan. There's a reason Coyle hobbled Alexander, McCann and Duff as soon as we played them- it neutralised us in the middle of the pitch, we were hugely reliant on McCann's physicality and ball carrying, Alexander's nous, and Duff's physicality and mobility compared to Caldwell. We had decent attacking players but zero depth and limited quality so take out a few pieces and it fell apart.

Right now we're similar, paperthin CM and a huge reliance on the first string central defence, difference here is less the leftback is substandard and instead that he's not suited to the system as much as we need.
With Beyer and Ekdal in we would look much much better, but we would still be either a CM and LB, or 2 CMs and a style change, short of safety.

[ClaretLoup]

Leicester have made some top signings and got a new manager, they'll compete better than we have next season.

Coady would have been a good signing for us at £7.5 m
Although he seems to have been out injured for a while at the start of the season (?)

[bf2k]

£100 million to produce the worst squad I've ever seen us have in the premier league, it's spineless, clueless and out of ideas.
Who is going to take responsibility for the squad VK or is it down to somebody else?
We are so unbalanced, we are weaker than last season despite the spend, we rarely get out of our own half, it's boring to watch, it's predictable and I never heard one fan around the ground tonight saying any good about the team.
Beyond anything else it's embarrassing right now.

Sorry but that's rubbish. It is by far the worst squad we've had over the last 13 years. I'd say Coyle's squad was worse, the last relegation squad was worse. Both had aging players, limited (or no) value, legs and very limited in talent. McNeil was about our only flare player (and Blake in the Coyle era).

The club wanted to go down a model of youth (and quite rightly so IMO) and this is what VK & co have done. It will take time to get the experience in the squad/club but it will come. We couldn't sustainably go down the previous model. It didn't work with our budget. We'd have ended up with mediocre players and no value in them. See Sheff Utd. This side have value which will enable us to then bring in better players with even more value.

IT REQUIRES PATIENCE

Now, the defending for the first 2 (I didn't see the 3rd) last night is poor coaching/tactics. The players have been clearly told to stick to a zone and don't pick up. This need addressing quickly. We're also sticking with a tactic that worked in the Championship that want work in the Premier League. This slow build up from the back then quick burst forward when the opposition are out of position. Not going to work against quality and well drilled teams. However, playing in the oppositions 3rd and hitting quickly through the lines does. VK needs to learn to mix the game up and allow that freedom.

[ClaretLoup]

McNeil was about our only flare player (and Blake in the Coyle era)

Don’t agree with much of your assessment of previous regimes but I think your summation of McNeil is very good. He lit up the sky for a while then fizzled out in his last season and left us in darkness.

[Conroy92]

Posted on another thread.
There was no attempt to balance talent and experience from either the manger or the board. We decided that we could concentrate on making money from developing talent and player sales rather than looking at the bigger picture of bringing a couple of talented prospects through, balanced out with a solid squad.
We have basically ended up with a squad of potential exciting prospects and only barely a few capable players at this level.

No one is developing and being sold for big profits getting pumped each week and relegated and I seriously think a couple of these youngsters may have a job on there hands getting over a season like this.

Kompany keeps stating what a good career Trafford will have. It could go one of two ways yet, with current displays and the manager keeping him in the firing line I wouldn't be surprised if his confidence gets shot to bits and becomes unrecoverable. He could be banging back around league one in 4 seasons time because no one will be able to afford to by him as we will want a profit and well have to cut our losses.

Considering the money we have spent then yes, I think its the worst premier league squad we have had in some time.

[Conroy92]

The club wanted to go down a model of youth (and quite rightly so IMO) and this is what VK & co have done. It will take time to get the experience in the squad/club but it will come. We couldn't sustainably go down the previous model. It didn't work with our budget. We'd have ended up with mediocre players and no value in them. See Sheff Utd. This side have value which will enable us to then bring in better players with even more value.

IT REQUIRES PATIENCE

There seems to be a common theme on here that some fans think that we can both develop the players experience along with selling the same players. Pray tell me how we get any experience in this side when we have to sell a batch of the squad on relegation. Surely you can see that unless the mindset at boardroom level changes all we will do is the same again.

This magic profit everyone talks about making on player sales, I doubt they'll be much. Koleosho is the only one I think currently along with Foster you are talking about profit on. The rest closer to breakeven figures. If you don't think players like Tresor have release clauses on relegation for similar amounts to what they were brought in for I think your daft.

Any level of patience was negated when we invested 90 million into a playing staff that cant deliver on the field. We no longer can afford to be patient, we need the premier league money to reinvest and continue on this journey.

This is even before considering the shift in the market every year. It never drops only rises. 90 million spent this season could equate to 120 million spent next season.

To sell these players for the profit we need, to improve, not just to sit still, we need to stay in this league. That cant be done unless some balance between youth and development alongside stabilising and adding experience to the team. ALK and VK need to find a balance on the field for us to improve and that starts by changing things in the boardroom.

[bumba]

Didnt say not good enough
There is clearly talent that hasnt clicked

When it clicks, when it clicks, it's all we hear now since the documentary what a load of garbage. So 119 meetings in were still crap and people will be saying one more meeting then it's clicked and we'll beat everyone.
It's nonsense, last season we could see progression this season each game is a step backwards, carrying on with the same losing philosophy it's insanity

[RVclaret]

When it clicks, when it clicks, it's all we hear now since the documentary what a load of garbage. So 119 meetings in were still crap and people will be saying one more meeting then it's clicked and we'll beat everyone.
It's nonsense, last season we could see progression this season each game is a step backwards, carrying on with the same losing philosophy it's insanity

It looks like going backwards cause that’s what happens when you keep losing confidence, particularly with a young group of players. Last season we had the best players in the division and even during that ‘bedding in period’ we could grind results out because of that. This season we’re in the best league in the world and coming up against talent we simply did not see last season. You don’t get a Millwall at home on Saturday to dominate, instead it’s a very solid Crystal Palacr outfit. Confidence is massive in football and that’s why one home win this weekend could be a turning point. I’ll add that it’s not helped having our two key players unavailable in recent games either.

[bumba]

Sorry but that's rubbish. It is by far the worst squad we've had over the last 13 years. I'd say Coyle's squad was worse, the last relegation squad was worse. Both had aging players, limited (or no) value, legs and very limited in talent. McNeil was about our only flare player (and Blake in the Coyle era).

The club wanted to go down a model of youth (and quite rightly so IMO) and this is what VK & co have done. It will take time to get the experience in the squad/club but it will come. We couldn't sustainably go down the previous model. It didn't work with our budget. We'd have ended up with mediocre players and no value in them. See Sheff Utd. This side have value which will enable us to then bring in better players with even more value.

IT REQUIRES PATIENCE

Now, the defending for the first 2 (I didn't see the 3rd) last night is poor coaching/tactics. The players have been clearly told to stick to a zone and don't pick up. This need addressing quickly. We're also sticking with a tactic that worked in the Championship that want work in the Premier League. This slow build up from the back then quick burst forward when the opposition are out of position. Not going to work against quality and well drilled teams. However, playing in the oppositions 3rd and hitting quickly through the lines does. VK needs to learn to mix the game up and allow that freedom.

Coyles squad worse? Really? Individually some may have been but they played more as a team which we don't.
Narrow the strongest 11 that season against this season and I think you'd be surprised.
Jensen is a better keeper than Trafford and probably Muric.
Duff,Carlisle,Caldwell,Alexander, Elliott,Mings,Blake,Bikey all walk in to this current team.
The team that got relegated Tarkowski, Mee, Collins, McNeil, Cornet, Pope, Barnes, Westwood all walk in to this team

[Anthonini]

It's not as bad as the scoresheets make it look. Though we have to start making some tough decisions... I don't know if experiments with jayrod and Bruun Larsen are benefiting the team.

We should be using our best players. Why didn't we see Ramsey back after his good performance against United as a playmaker? He's clearly not a winger. He could do so much more damage than Rodriguez.

We have to get Beyer Berge Tresor and Amdouni carrying team as our most expensive players. Hopefully Obafemi can bring some quality up front, seems like a great player.

Until then Delcroix and Redmond can definitely add some international experience to the team. I'd also opt to choose for O'Shea over Al Dakhil. He's older stronger, Al Dakhil looks pale under pressure so far. Get some experience in that team. Play with the same 11 for a few games.

[spt_claret]

The last relegation squad was worse
.......
McNeil was about our only flare player

Disagree on both (Cornet had more flair) but flair doesn't equal quality you can be top notch but zero flair.
Weghorst as maligned as he is, is better than Jay
Wood had lost his edge and gone off the boil, and was a limited one dimensional player, but was more effective at PL level than any of our current strikers (although foster may prove better in time).
Mee is the most underrated centre back of the last 20 years even by Burnley fans, he went to a more footballing side and won their player and goal of the season and displaced the club captain.
Tarkowski isn't the ball player that Ekdal or Beyer are but is good enough at it and is strong PL defender who is a reliable goal threat.
McNeil lost his form because he was trying too hard and had so much to do both defensively and as our main creator, but was and is better than any of our current wingers as an overall package, lacks Koleoshos dribbling/pace or Benson's ranged shots but as an all round player is better.
Cornet was frail, ultra limited, we overbuilt our team around maximising his flair and threat yet lacked the players to maximise him (without a drastic style change which Dyche resisted and again we lacked somewhat). He's the closest equivalent to any current winger in style but probably a touch better.
Pope lacks either keepers ball playing but is an elite keeper when it comes to winning points and stopping goals.

Our central midfield was equivalent. Cork okay but on the decline. Brownhill still here. Westwood better than Cullen but past his best. Fullbacks the same people.

Dyches squad had a better first eleven but zero depth or alternate options. Gudmundsson being injured meant we had no real wide options. A good CM, new right winger, and a tactical tweak to maximize either Weghorst or Cornet and we'd have survived.

Currently we have far more quality attacking depth but no depth at the back and the same not quite there central midfield. We only have a better squad if you're talking depth of bodies not first 11 quality.

[bf2k]

There seems to be a common theme on here that some fans think that we can both develop the players experience along with selling the same players. Pray tell me how we get any experience in this side when we have to sell a batch of the squad on relegation. Surely you can see that unless the mindset at boardroom level changes all we will do is the same again.

This magic profit everyone talks about making on player sales, I doubt they'll be much. Koleosho is the only one I think currently along with Foster you are talking about profit on. The rest closer to breakeven figures. If you don't think players like Tresor have release clauses on relegation for similar amounts to what they were brought in for I think your daft.

Any level of patience was negated when we invested 90 million into a playing staff that cant deliver on the field. We no longer can afford to be patient, we need the premier league money to reinvest and continue on this journey.

This is even before considering the shift in the market every year. It never drops only rises. 90 million spent this season could equate to 120 million spent next season.

To sell these players for the profit we need, to improve, not just to sit still, we need to stay in this league. That cant be done unless some balance between youth and development alongside stabilising and adding experience to the team. ALK and VK need to find a balance on the field for us to improve and that starts by changing things in the boardroom.

Who says we're selling upon relegation?

However a turnover of 3 or 4 players every summer is not a bad thing, especially if those 3 or 4 players go for a NET profit. This is why I don't get the booing of McNeil. Him leaving for the fee he did allowed us, in part, to bring in the players which walked the league last season.

[CoolClaret]

Nah no chance - worst backup center halves though.

That partnership we had last night was dreadful

[bf2k]

Coyles squad worse? Really? Individually some may have been but they played more as a team which we don't.
Narrow the strongest 11 that season against this season and I think you'd be surprised.
Jensen is a better keeper than Trafford and probably Muric.
Duff,Carlisle,Caldwell,Alexander, Elliott,Mings,Blake,Bikey all walk in to this current team.
The team that got relegated Tarkowski, Mee, Collins, McNeil, Cornet, Pope, Barnes, Westwood all walk in to this team

You said squad.

However, the players you mention wouldn't fit into the style we have been clambering for for years. They were Dyche style players, not a progressive style which VK is trying to employ.

And I here £100m spent blah blah blah. Clubs are paying that (or very close) on ONE player!!! £100m is the small change of a lot of Premier League clubs now.

[RickyBobby]

Talent isn‘t just about being young and having “attacking flare”.
Ben Mee, Tarks, Pope, Barnes et al. were and are all talented footballers, and it is that kind of talent we desperately miss. Anyone who has watched football more than 5 minuets knows in a squad you need a mix of different skill sets and experience levels, which makes it even the more bonkers why in the summer we focused on basically bringing in only 1 type of player.
You can’t throw money at buying young inexperienced attacking players in the hope it will make your leadership and defensive frailties disappear.

[Conroy92]

Who says we're selling upon relegation?

However a turnover of 3 or 4 players every summer is not a bad thing, especially if those 3 or 4 players go for a NET profit. This is why I don't get the booing of McNeil. Him leaving for the fee he did allowed us, in part, to bring in the players which walked the league last season.

If were not selling i can only imagine we'll be getting another loan and loading the club with more debt then . We'll be selling, make no mistake.

[123EasyasBFC]

Were any of the signings we made this season linked to any other clubs before singing for us?

[bf2k]

If were not selling i can only imagine we'll be getting another loan and loading the club with more debt then . We'll be selling, make no mistake.

Well you obviously know more than me.

[BigChaCha]

By bf2k... And I here £100m spent blah blah blah. Clubs are paying that (or very close) on ONE player!

*hear...

That's not the point... the point is, after 100m, we are weaker at number 9, have less control, first touch and pace in attack with the loss of Tella, haven't strengthened defensive midfield, are weaker at left-back, haven't strengthened right-back, bought 2 average central defenders, are far weaker than the team at its peak last season, are far weaker in defence than last season and have built the weakest defence we have ever had in the Premier League... Oh, and we wasted 19m on a goalkeeper we didn't need!

[JohnMac]

Before experience comes inexperience and that is all it is down to at the moment.

Not just the players but the coaching staff as well and you don't win the Championship at a canter and become useless overnight because you don't know your job.

I would back our set up to come good and if it isn't this season then so be it and getting behind the team will help their confidence.

I'm as cheesed off as the next fan but this place has so many negative 'Keyboard Experts' who do nothing other than try to divide opinion for their own perverse satisfaction.

Supporting a team isn't mandatory, if it's so soul destroying and ruining your life maybe it's time to re-evaluate!

UTC

[bumba]

Before experience comes inexperience and that is all it is down to at the moment.

Not just the players but the coaching staff as well and you don't win the Championship at a canter and become useless overnight because you don't know your job.

I would back our set up to come good and if it isn't this season then so be it and getting behind the team will help their confidence.

I'm as cheesed off as the next fan but this place has so many negative 'Keyboard Experts' who do nothing other than try to divide opinion for their own perverse satisfaction.

Supporting a team isn't mandatory, if it's so soul destroying and ruining your life maybe it's time to re-evaluate!

UTC

I didn't realise supporting your club meant you couldn't have an opinion of the disastrous start to the season.
Let's all pretend it's Rosey and all the issues will go away

[JohnMac]

I didn't realise supporting your club meant you couldn't have an opinion of the disastrous start to the season.
Let's all pretend it's Rosey and all the issues will go away

I'm perfectly relaxed about the whole thing because I'm old enough to understand whining on and on will not directly affect results and performances.

Don't worry, it's not just you though.

[bumba]

I'm perfectly relaxed about the whole thing because I'm old enough to understand whining on and on will not directly affect results and performances.

Don't worry, it's not just you though.

Everybody knows it won't affect the results and performances but having a debate and talking is part of life, if we all remained silent all day and didn't discuss any issues then it would be a pretty boring world