So suggesting iam Trafford's dad ( not for the first time) isn't childish?
Stuey spoke more sense crushing his grapes than you two have ever done......
So suggesting iam Trafford's dad ( not for the first time) isn't childish?
KlyBfc wrote: ↑Sat Nov 25, 2023 6:39 pmTrafford 6 tries hard just not good enough for the prem
Vintinho 6 tries hard just not good enough for the prem
Taylor 6 tries hard but not enough quality
OShea 6 tries hard just not good enough for the prem
Beyer 5 tries hard just not good enough for the prem
Berge 7 mom
Brownhill 6.5 tries hard just not realistically good enough for the prem
JBG 6 6 tries hard just too old to be a winger in the prem
Koleosho 7
Amdouni 7
Jay 5 tries hard just too old for the prem
Vincent Kompany 3 tries hard to get it right just not good enough for the prem
You put a lot of work in there fella. But your scores are pretty accurate.
Spot on!watsonsclarets wrote: ↑Sat Nov 25, 2023 11:04 pmTrafford 5 - ok in the main scares the pants off defenders coming off his line I have not seen so many back slaps off defenders when a keeper comes out and Nervy punches it away.
Vitinho 5- ok in the future put one decent ball in which was not attacked
O'Shea 6- ok did ok on 1st contact. He let his man get ahead of the goal but he was the better defender. He not going to win the fans over.
Beyer 4- In possession he ok uses it well and made one decent carry- defensively very poor weak under contact - positionally quite poor partly at fault 1st goal he is a full-back at this level or at best a Right Centre back in a 3 is his best suit.
Taylor 5- Not a 90-minute performance his job is to deal with Kudos but he didn't in the end.
Gudmundsson 6- Showed bits in little pockets neat and tidy offered nothing outstidning but tracked and sat in shape.
Brownhill 6- works bloody hard but has no quality on the ball - He is not brave on the ball lacks power under contact and is not press-resistant enough to be a long-term player at this level.
Berge 8- Much better from him more consistent on both sides of the ball showed a bit of fight which has been my main worry with him - watched him 4/5 times last season he a streaky player but if he keeps that level bigger clubs may come circling
Amdouni 7- Found pockets between lines he is a breaker and has the ability to glide into position and beat his man 1v1- he can try too much at times but he got a bit of flair and caused West Ham issues with his connections. Unlucky not to score forced a save after creating his own chance.
Koleosho 7- Won the penalty and has decent burst and disguise in his running - can go both ways but currently lacks consistency which may come wants to make things happen - Ultra critical defensively let his man go a couple of times not sure if it was tactical and he tried to cheat but I suspect not given it was inconsistent.
Rodriguez 6- Worked hard not really a threat battle but up against it but held it when he could and allowed a platform.
Ramsey 5- A few nice runs but lacks polish- not convinced he was the right man to come on.
Ok, the performance was more cohesive on both sides of the ball - 1st goal was avoidable 2nd one well it was a quality ball. We still did not create enough but it was better than it had been.
We’d already made 3 subs is the very simple explanation to thisBig Vinny K wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:42 amTrafford 5 - didn’t have much to do but what still managed to make players and crowd nervous and frustrated. Why is he taking so long with almost every ball that comes to him ? I just don’t get it - it gives the opposition time to regroup, get back or decide to press us. It makes zero sense as if they are trying to break the press and get an overload it never ever works with our current full backs.
Vitinho 5 - decent game v Arsenal but back to just not being good enough for this league (same as Roberts)
O'Shea 5 - lucky that Ings was completely ineffective
Beyer 6 - played well and even though he did lose it when carrying it out in second half he was very close to beating that 3rd man and then we were away with the overload of players this brings when it works.
Taylor 7 - really good first half and decent second half too.
Guðmundsson 7 - played well like rest of midfield
Brownhill 7 - as above
Berge 8 - best player on pitch for me
Koleosho 7 - dangerous but end product still lacking. Doesn’t look like he can score too many either - which given he’s often our biggest threat is an issue.
Amdouni 7 - came too in second half especially. Unless the fitness monitor thing was saying he needed to come off I don’t get why he was subbed when he had just found a bit of confidence
Rodriguez 7 - best game for a while. But dead on his feet in last 15.
Ramsay - 6. Thought he did well.
I will never understand in a million years why we did not bring 2 of Larsen, Redmond or Obafemi on when they went in the lead. There was 7 or 8 minutes left. There is simply no explanation or sense to this.
Haha !
Agreed. I think most people are of the view that our substitutions lost us the game.Big Vinny K wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:56 amHaha !
Didn’t realise that !!
In itself probably a big mistake to not save a substitution if they took the lead - which let’s be honest is not the biggest surprise based on the season we are having.
The other problem was lack of movement ahead of him, even the defenders had the same problem when they had the ball, but the Trafford haters don't see that, all the back line were ponderous on the ball, the only option would have been a big punt upfield, but they are obviously under instructions not to do that.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 11:38 amLoads of comments about Trafford’s ‘dithering’ and him being marked down because of it. Did anyone notice the incident in the first half when Trafford was stood on the ball inviting the press from West Ham and the crowd got restless and started shouting at him to speed up. He forced a pass and he either put it out of play or put one of our players under pressure. VK was signalling to Trafford to calm down and slow down - essentially telling him to ignore the noise from the crowd.
He’s obviously told to slow down in possession and encourage the opposition to press and therefore increase our passing options. In fact, I’m almost certain that the incident resulting in our penalty started from Trafford being calm and composed in possession and playing through the press. I really don’t understand why people can’t see that this is so obviously a part of our game plan, and marking Trafford down for carrying out instructions is just bizarre.
Yes, clearly a tactic to try and draw a couple of players out of position.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 11:38 amLoads of comments about Trafford’s ‘dithering’ and him being marked down because of it. Did anyone notice the incident in the first half when Trafford was stood on the ball inviting the press from West Ham and the crowd got restless and started shouting at him to speed up. He forced a pass and he either put it out of play or put one of our players under pressure. VK was signalling to Trafford to calm down and slow down - essentially telling him to ignore the noise from the crowd.
He’s obviously told to slow down in possession and encourage the opposition to press and therefore increase our passing options. In fact, I’m almost certain that the incident resulting in our penalty started from Trafford being calm and composed in possession and playing through the press. I really don’t understand why people can’t see that this is so obviously a part of our game plan, and marking Trafford down for carrying out instructions is just bizarre.
Agree. It’s the most obvious tactical instruction there is. Proper clueless most fans.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 11:38 amLoads of comments about Trafford’s ‘dithering’ and him being marked down because of it. Did anyone notice the incident in the first half when Trafford was stood on the ball inviting the press from West Ham and the crowd got restless and started shouting at him to speed up. He forced a pass and he either put it out of play or put one of our players under pressure. VK was signalling to Trafford to calm down and slow down - essentially telling him to ignore the noise from the crowd.
He’s obviously told to slow down in possession and encourage the opposition to press and therefore increase our passing options. In fact, I’m almost certain that the incident resulting in our penalty started from Trafford being calm and composed in possession and playing through the press. I really don’t understand why people can’t see that this is so obviously a part of our game plan, and marking Trafford down for carrying out instructions is just bizarre.
Yet by a number of the comments a lot of people obviously don’t know that’s our tactic.quoonbeatz wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:10 pmYou'd have to have not watched us for 18 months to not know that's our tactic. There were plenty of times where it worked brilliantly yesterday but there were times when he was put under pressure, not by the crowd but by taking too long so that most of the outfall were cut off.
As with Muric last season, it's an experience thing and I think Trafford is getting better at it. Knowing when to speed it up and slow it down will come but he's not there yet.
When Berge and Brownhill are stood static in this position they are not looking to receive the ball and Trafford is obviously under instruction to not attempt it. The opposition want that pass because they are ready to either cut it out or pounce on the midfielder when they receive it. I’m not saying we shouldn’t try to play more directly through the lines at times, just that it’s not on Trafford that we don’t.CoolClaret wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:14 pmInviting the press is great and all but there are times where we have a better option straight out to a midfielder that I think a certain goalkeeper would have no problem with finding first time like.
Not every passage of play has to be a slow pass out right?
For sure -Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:18 pmWhen Berge and Brownhill are stood static in this position they are not looking to receive the ball and Trafford is obviously under instruction to not attempt it. The opposition want that pass because they are ready to either cut it out or pounce on the midfielder when they receive it. I’m not saying we shouldn’t try to play more directly through the lines at times, just that it’s not on Trafford that we don’t.
Oh definitely, we’re not creating enough chances. But as I stated above, I’m pretty sure our penalty, and our best move of the game when Jay slid the ball across to Amdouni started from us beating the press.CoolClaret wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:20 pmFor sure -
I just don’t think he has the passing range nor vision to make linebreaking passes like.
I understand the tactic to invite the press, though I can’t say it’s leading to many goal scoring opportunities right now.
He did miss one aerial ball by a fair distance if you remember? He wasn’t terrible yesterday but looks frightened to death and doesn’t dominate his 6 yard box.
I didn't expect a flawless performances from him. If that was the case I would have said Trafford was much better than fine. He wasn't so I think fine was a fair description.
Agreed, worked the best it has this season. I think the main example of when it wasn't as slick as it could be was was when Taylor was in acres and Trafford saw him and looked to play it, then checked back for a shorter pass, then decided to go to longer to Taylor, by which time he had a man bearing down on him and had to come all the way back.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:15 pmYet by a number of the comments a lot of people obviously don’t know that’s our tactic.
I thought we were pretty seamless at playing out from Trafford yesterday - certainly the most effective and error-free we’ve been so far this season. In fact, had the game ended in the 86th minute I’m sure we’d be seeing ratings of 7,8 and 9’s across the board rather than 4’s and 5’s
On the stats thread I observed a few weeks ago that we may do better against Palace, Sheffield, Everton, West Ham and Forest (and others I have forgotten) because they don’t press us aggressively in that area so it gives our possession chance to develop.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:15 pmYet by a number of the comments a lot of people obviously don’t know that’s our tactic.
I thought we were pretty seamless at playing out from Trafford yesterday - certainly the most effective and error-free we’ve been so far this season. In fact, had the game ended in the 86th minute I’m sure we’d be seeing ratings of 7,8 and 9’s across the board rather than 4’s and 5’s