Sacking Kompany

[Nori1958]

I’m sure at the beginning of last season if you’d have suggested that we win the championship by a good margin but the following season we struggle and get relegated most fans would have accepted that. Reality arrives and it’s “Kompany out” by many. Let’s say they sack him, whoever comes in isn’t going to get anymore out of the players we have. It’s madness complete madness to talk about sacking him. I despair sometimes. Can I suggest that those who want Kompany out go find something else to do on a Saturday.

Not just Saturday though.... The rest of the week would be great

[CoolClaret]

I’m sure at the beginning of last season if you’d have suggested that we win the championship by a good margin but the following season we struggle and get relegated most fans would have accepted that. Reality arrives and it’s “Kompany out” by many. Let’s say they sack him, whoever comes in isn’t going to get anymore out of the players we have. It’s madness complete madness to talk about sacking him. I despair sometimes. Can I suggest that those who want Kompany out go find something else to do on a Saturday.

But this is just being disingenuous and misappropriating views of some supporters.

It isn’t just ‘struggling’ - its putting up historically bad numbers.

At least acknowledge the situation for what it is right now - proper crap.

[CoolClaret]

My personal view is that (unless there are factors behind the scenes we do not know about) getting rid of Kompany now would be counter productive. This team is heavily invested in Kompany and his structures and I think it's pretty implausible that a change is going to improve matters this season. The important question is what the long term objective is - setting the club up to bounce back following likely relegation whilst remaining financially sound.

Whether Kompany is the right man for that we will know in 6 months time I think. This is doubtless a chastening experience for him and he's going to be learning a lot about himself - this is the first time he's been at the bottom in his career. It can be an experience which improves him as a manager, in which case we might as well take the benefit of the hard lessons learnt.

Undoubtedly (very expensive) mistakes were made in the summer, but whilst Kompany was the front man and presumably driving force for those mistakes, I'm not sure he takes all the blame. I have long been of the view that giving a manager, especially an inexperienced one, total control over affairs is an error and I think the Board have to own the fact that the structure appears to give Kompany exactly that sort of power. Kompany clearly needed an experienced football man pushing back on behalf of the Board on the wisdom of assembling such a callow and ill-balanced squad for a tilt at the Premier League at such great expense and with such turnover of personnel. It might be that the best outcome all round is to redress that imbalance whilst giving VK the opportunity to restore his deserved reputation as a coach and leader of elite potential. That might also set the club up better for the best case scenario that Kompany leaves in a couple of years for bigger prizes.

Totally agree with all of that Spice - the only point that I’ll add is that I wonder if the new deal or even initial deal included more control/power to VK.

One of the reasons that VK/Anderlecht reportedly parted is because they weren’t prepared to offer him the total control that he wanted…

[evensteadiereddie]

So what?
The players are mostly young and inexperienced, they will improve.
You don't fancy sticking around until then - ****, off and leave us to it.

[Newcastleclaret93]

I’m sure at the beginning of last season if you’d have suggested that we win the championship by a good margin but the following season we struggle and get relegated most fans would have accepted that. Reality arrives and it’s “Kompany out” by many. Let’s say they sack him, whoever comes in isn’t going to get anymore out of the players we have. It’s madness complete madness to talk about sacking him. I despair sometimes. Can I suggest that those who want Kompany out go find something else to do on a Saturday.

So by your logic Luton have a better squad than us?

If no other manager can physically get anything better out of this squad then we must have one of the worst squads in premier league history.

[Middle-agedClaret]

I’m not sure that sacking our manager is necessarily the way to go.
If he does leave, however, I have a suggestion for a replacement - David Blunkett.
He may not be an ex-Premier League defender - but he does know how to hold on to a lead.

[jlup1980]

Sacking VK was unthinkable in August but football is a fickle game and things can turn on their head very quickly. What we need is clarity from Alan Pace. Are we accepting relegation as being part of the long term plan? If so he needs to come out and double down on VK and tell us that he's here for the long term. At least then we know what's happening and we can give up on this season entirely.

[claretspice]

Totally agree with all of that Spice - the only point that I’ll add is that I wonder if the new deal or even initial deal included more control/power to VK.

One of the reasons that VK/Anderlecht reportedly parted is because they weren’t prepared to offer him the total control that he wanted…

That is true but I think my point is that this season might have changed even VK's outlook on that, or at least his ability to insist upon that deal. He's spent well over £100m and at present the investment strategy is looking flawed in a very high profile way. If he wants to make it as a manager, he will need to bounce back and wherever he chooses to do that, he might not have much option but to accept the need for a little less power. Similar to when Sean Dyche left Burnley having been sacked, in order to get back in at Everton he had to accept a Director of Football (which had previously been something he had resisted). So if the alternative is to leave Burnley, he might be open to a redivision of the club's internal structures.

Public failure makes the best more humble.

[Belgianclaret]

I wouldn’t sacrifice the VK playing style as yet. We’ve built our team to fit his principles just like we did last season.

We could however do with a little ‘Dychism’ to close down games and shut up shop (f.eg. bringing on Eckdal).

I use the word Dychism in the sense of prioritising results over style. It however isn’t the right term, as making timely substitutions was SD’s biggest weakness

[CoolClaret]

I’m not sure that sacking our manager is necessarily the way to go.
If he does leave, however, I have a suggestion for a replacement - David Blunkett.
He may not be an ex-Premier League defender - but he does know how to hold on to a lead.

& even a blind man on a galloping horse wouldn’t have made those subs yesterday…

[AGENT_CLARET]

We’ve spent about £80-90m in instalments. Add our income up (sky money, minor investments (circa £120-140m), parachute, this years sky, player sales and massively increased commercial income) and it’s pretty obvious we’re ok.

When the window closed we were still v active ie. £31m package agreed for maatsen etc..

Where it’d change is if we had a sustained period out of the pl which is pretty unlikely but far from guaranteed.

Okay

[CoolClaret]

That is true but I think my point is that this season might have changed even VK's outlook on that, or at least his ability to insist upon that deal. He's spent well over £100m and at present a lot of that is looking badly invested in a very high profile way. If he wants to make it as a manager, he will need to bounce back and wherever he chooses to do that, he might not have much option but to accept the need for a little less power. Similar to when Sean Dyche left Burnley having been sacked, in order to get back in at Everton he had to accept a Director of Football (which had previously been something he had resisted). So if the alternative is to leave Burnley, he might be open to a redivision of the club's internal structures.

Public failure makes the best more humble.

Not so sure tbh.

He’s very headstrong and clearly believes in himself and his abilities (as he should).

The workaholic statements and constant reiteration of those points gives me the impression he’s someone that isn’t capable of working under a DoF type.

Again, I’d like to reiterate that I wouldn’t sack him right now.

[claretspice]

Not so sure tbh.

He’s very headstrong and clearly believes in himself and his abilities (as he should).

The workaholic statements and constant reiteration of those points gives me the impression he’s someone that isn’t capable of working under a DoF type.

Again, I’d like to reiterate that I wouldn’t sack him right now.

Even Pep has worked under that sort of structure.

We'll see. But he and the club should be looking in the mirror to understand how the dynamic can be recalibrated to everyone's benefit and right now that feels like the biggest win that can be generated from a pretty difficult situation.

[jurek]

I doubt very much that another manager would be able to
get much more out of the present squad without bringing in another 2 or 3
players. Finding.getting the right players would be much of a lottery too.
So we need to stick with Kompany even if it means the almost inevitable relegation.
What happens after we get relegated is anyone's guess.

It's difficult at present because there's very little to look forward too
but we've had very little luck to date and the loss of Foster hasn't helped.
We can only hope that he comes back for the second half of the season
and that VK manages to get Zaroury and Benson back and performing
well enough to get us a few results. Alongside one or two others.

A long shot admittedly but we can but hope.

[Jamesy]

No point sacking him. I can’t see a new manager coming in and fitting all of the square pegs into round holes with this relatively inexperienced squad of similar type players.
I can’t see Pace and co. releasing any further funds either to strengthen in the areas Vincent has overlooked or bought naively.
Basically, it’s his mess and it’s up to him to sort it out. He may learn something on this journey to relegation? Like what is required to stay in the Premier League if he gets us promoted again in the 2024-25 season.

[Stayingup]

I wouldn’t sacrifice the VK playing style as yet. We’ve built our team to fit his principles just like we did last season.

We could however do with a little ‘Dychism’ to close down games and shut up shop (f.eg. bringing on Eckdal).

I use the word Dychism in the sense of prioritising results over style. It however isn’t the right term, as making timely substitutions was SD’s biggest weakness

Yesterday's loss is mostly down to the manager and his substitutions. You are correct to use Dychism, because he would have made substition(s) to protect our lead. I thought at the time the changes were strange, particularly after seeing Ekdal warming up.

[NewClaret]

Sacking VK was unthinkable in August but football is a fickle game and things can turn on their head very quickly. What we need is clarity from Alan Pace. Are we accepting relegation as being part of the long term plan? If so he needs to come out and double down on VK and tell us that he's here for the long term. At least then we know what's happening and we can give up on this season entirely.

The dreaded vote of confidence.

Pace doesn’t need to say anything at all. He doesn’t need to give us a running commentary of his thoughts.

He just needs to be working his backside off to try and help sign the players we need to strengthen.

[claretspice]

I doubt very much that another manager would be able to
get much more out of the present squad without bringing in another 2 or 3
players. Finding.getting the right players would be much of a lottery too.
So we need to stick with Kompany even if it means the almost inevitable relegation.
What happens after we get relegated is anyone's guess.

It's difficult at present because there's very little to look forward too
but we've had very little luck to date and the loss of Foster hasn't helped.
We can only hope that he comes back for the second half of the season
and that VK manages to get Zaroury and Benson back and performing
well enough to get us a few results. Alongside one or two others.

A long shot admittedly but we can but hope.

I think lack of luck is a very valid point. The fixture draw was tough, and exacerbated by the fact the Luton game was postponed. The VAR call at Forest is undoubtedly one of those sliding doors moments. The fact Foster has been unavailable, and we've had quite a number of other injuries, has been a real misfortune.

However, the injuries and Foster situation have in part betrayed the fact that we've build a squad that is lopsided, so there's an element of making your own luck about this. And the lack of leadership, experience and character in the side has been a real problem. We've made our own luck to some extent.

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

So you agree they’re playing well?

Thank the Lord.

There are one or two players playing well but that’s not exactly something to hang your hat on but there you go.