No shortage of confidence on the Grand Old Team forums

[ClaretOfMancunia]

Some right billy big ******** in this thread. They are flying to be fair so perhaps warranted!

https://www.grandoldteam.com/forum/thre ... 30.118751/

Would absolutely love to give them another drubbing at Turf. Can't say I disagree with some of their tactical assessments though!

"These are crap."

"Snakes"

"They are terrible at the back."

"Let’s put these grasses in their place."

[criminalclaret]

Two out of those quotes are correct though

[HahaYeah]

'Another team that likes to faff around with the ball, right up our street.'

My thoughts entirely.

[dougcollins]

Nothing on there I wouldn't expect.

[IPAclaret]

Hilarious how these shysters have changed their tune ... the vitriol towards Dyche and to a lesser extent McNeil up to very recently was absolutely disgraceful and typical of their self entitled 'peoples club' nonesense they spout on about.

And as for us being 'grasses' what another load of ********. They've been investigated and found guilty, plain and simple. Nothing to do with us whatsoever.

Can you imagine if this was the other way round and we'd cheated and the 'oh so special ones' everton had been relegated, we would never have heard the last of it.

It's just typical we are playing them when they've hit some form right now because despite spending a fortune over several seasons they've been garbage for ages.

They really don't deserve Dyche. Absolute whoppers.

UTC

[Swizzlestick]

About what you'd expect, confidence is high so fans start getting a bit of a swagger. Of course, a good number of those same fans were probably calling Dyche every name under the sun not so long back, but hey that's football.

[Sozturf7]

How are the mighty fallen. Please.

[Kilson810]

Grasses? Victim card always close at hand.

[dsr]

It's fairly common thing, possibly especially in Liverpool - I wouldn't know. If you see someone burning down your house and selling your wife and children into slavery, and you tell the police about it, you are a "grass" because you are supposed to be on the side of the criminal not the law.

They entirely fail to distinguish between a "grass" (who is involved with the crime but then turns his mates in) and a "witness" who is not involved but has seen it happen.

[CrosspoolClarets]

'Another team that likes to faff around with the ball, right up our street.'

My thoughts entirely.

Actually it isn’t up their street because they don’t press high.

We will have to defend well against the high ball, but we have every chance if we do.

[Vegas Claret]

if they can't be confident with the run they are on when they are playing one of the worst (in terms of results) teams then they never will be. I can't be bothered with a fake rivalry with Everton, it's just another game.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Actually it isn’t up their street because they don’t press high.

We will have to defend well against the high ball, but we have every chance if we do.

Dyche has got them mixing it up. Not everything is long balls anymore with them.

I was blown away watching them against Newcastle. They look a real strong outfit.

[TheOriginalLongsider]

Funny, as a Dyche team I loved it when teams passed it around at the back whilst we pressed.

[claretonthecoast1882]

They have rightly held the title of most toxic and odious fan base in this league for several years which is some achievement when you consider who they share a city with.

It isn't that long since death threats were issued to people like Bill Kenwright and Graeme Sharp, happily accepted Russian money and now everyone is in the wrong for them cheating.

It is sad to see what has become of what was once a proper club

[simonclaret]

It isn't that long since death threats were issued to people like Bill Kenwright and Graeme Sharp

And Benitez...

[spt_claret]

Actually it isn’t up their street because they don’t press high.

We will have to defend well against the high ball, but we have every chance if we do.

Palace didn't press high, look how that went.

I can understand a logic in going for maximum physicality to try avoid being bullied, Roberts at fullback or O'Shea moving over, Jay up top, etc. But that leaves us less ways to break down a deep defence, as we saw with palace, and Dyche has more than one way to set Everton up.
We can't try to play their game or go man for man physically, we can minimise our weaknesses there but it risks minimising our strengths too. If we're the attacking side everyone likes to call us then we have to set up to be as pacy and direct as possible and get in behind them, work on the assumption we'll have more of the ball anyway so be willing to take possession risks and focus on outscoring them, Everton might be getting solid convincing wins but it's usually with a clean sheet, concede and they struggle. Prioritize breaking their defence over neutralising their counters, as we couldn't neutralise Palace's.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Shots in that Palace game were 17-4 in our favour, so I don’t think that is the best example of how Everton’s tactics may better ours.

[spt_claret]

Shots in that Palace game were 17-4 in our favour, so I don’t think that is the best example of how Everton’s tactics may better ours.

Who won? We had plenty of shots but couldn't break them down convincingly, Dyche can set up that same way but better. We had long swathe of overly cautious overly patient play which then still resulted in two bad mistakes- it's bizarre but our costly errors are often coming from overplaying it too patiently rather than from attacks breaking down and getting countered. Likewise going all the way long from the back isn't working- Trafford's shotstopping rescued a point vs Wolves but his long kicks constantly lost the play. We're going overly short with the CBs & midfield, or overly long from the keeper, no inbetween - last season Muric & Ekdal were very good at that midrange ball which we seem to have lost. Gudmundsson's far too slow to be a winger but is one of the only midfielders who is willing & able to play an incisive attacking ball. We were crying out for more right-side pace and more mobility up front from at least the 50min mark but Kompany held out and instead subbed the two most dynamic attackers we had in Koleosho & Amdouni. We can't match the physical game AND break down a compact deep defence, we don't have players who are fast, clever, cagey, creative, AND big, strong, robust & good in the air. We can either try prop up physicality as best as possible and likely still be outmatched by neutering ourselves or we can take risks with the ball, play it forwards faster from the midfield onwards, and aim to score and rattle them so they can't just sit compact.

[Ric_C]

Scousers calling anyone else grasses must be the most ironic thing I've ever heard

[ClaretPete001]

Actually it isn’t up their street because they don’t press high.

We will have to defend well against the high ball, but we have every chance if we do.

No they compress the play with a 5 man midfield that works incredibly hard but can score goals as well.

They won't panic faced with a high press and space will be at a premium.

It nullifies pace and turns everything into a war of attrition.

I can't think of a more difficult team to play against for a passing side because there is no space to pass into and no room to stretch a defence with pacy wingers.

[equinox]

The Polish lad at the back is some player.

[AlargeClaret]

Scousers calling people grasses .

[Hapag Lloyd]

Actually it isn’t up their street because they don’t press high.

We will have to defend well against the high ball, but we have every chance if we do.

Just watching the Everton/Chelsea highlights and they are definitely employing a high press for this game.

[NewClaret]

Just watching the Everton/Chelsea highlights and they are definitely employing a high press for this game.

Yes, I noticed that. To good effect too. Will be interesting to see if Dyche sits off us, thinking he’ll be able to defend patiently and hit us on transition, or high press and cause us to make mistakes.

We’ve struggled with both approaches this year tbf and will probably be both at different points in the game.

[Goliath]

Theyl press high from goalkicks and free kicks in our own half but will drop back into their shape pretty quickly if they dont win the ball back from that initial press. Wpuld expect us to have most of the possession.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Interesting to get a few replies to my comment a few days ago that Dyche typically applies a low block rather than a high press.

I don’t think any of us would dispute that Dyche likes to keep a compact shape to try to force the long ball due to an inability of the opponent to play through his team. I didn’t see their Chelsea highlights to assess how that has evolved.

I do expect though that Doucoure and Calvert Lewin will charge around and press, but I’m not expecting the midfield of Garner, Onana, Harrison and Dwight to get drawn out when we have the ball, particularly because we are so good at working it to the dangerous wing positions. I would thus hope we’d be able to get to the half way line quite frequently.

In other words, a bit like West Ham and Palace, rather than Spurs or Chelsea who came onto us a lot more. The former’s press was much more half hearted despite Palace scoring with an error.

I think this suits us, but with their confidence where it is, they remain favourites.

[ClaretPete001]

Interesting to get a few replies to my comment a few days ago that Dyche typically applies a low block rather than a high press.

I don’t think any of us would dispute that Dyche likes to keep a compact shape to try to force the long ball due to an inability of the opponent to play through his team. I didn’t see their Chelsea highlights to assess how that has evolved.

I do expect though that Doucoure and Calvert Lewin will charge around and press, but I’m not expecting the midfield of Garner, Onana, Harrison and Dwight to get drawn out when we have the ball, particularly because we are so good at working it to the dangerous wing positions. I would thus hope we’d be able to get to the half way line quite frequently.

In other words, a bit like West Ham and Palace, rather than Spurs or Chelsea who came onto us a lot more. The former’s press was much more half hearted despite Palace scoring with an error.

I think this suits us, but with their confidence where it is, they remain favourites.

I must admit I watched the Chelsea game and although they have a vigorous Press I wouldn't say they are a team that presses high up the field as we did in the early parts of the season but maybe I missed it.

I saw a compact team with banks of four happy to cede ground and defend in their own half for long periods to good effect.

Where I disagree with you is that this suits us. I'm not sure it does because it nullifies pace and compresses space for the wingers.

I don't see Berg and Brownhill bossing the midfield against a 5 and I can't see Jay Rod having the guile to beat Tarko, Branthwaite and Co.

Luckily Branthwaite is suspended and we might get a favour from Keano. Matches often turn out quite different from what you expect and this team generally does better on grass than when you first see it on paper.

I think we will boss it and have tonnes of chances and possession but not sure we will score.

It will be an interesting game.

[ClaretPete001]

Actually, they did play a high press in the first half yesterday. Due to injuries they played a back 5, which turned into a midfield 6 and helped to press up the pitch.

Second half they completely changed tactics so fair play those who saw a high press against Chelsea were watching more closely than I was....

[Rileybobs]

Actually, they did play a high press in the first half yesterday. Due to injuries they played a back 5, which turned into a midfield 6 and helped to press up the pitch.

Second half they completely changed tactics so fair play those who saw a high press against Chelsea were watching more closely than I was....

Without wanting to appear as a tactic geek, they didn’t really have a high press. They just played a high line which squeezed the pitch. We actually had quite a lot of joy playing over the top into JBL and Odobert in the early stages. There were stages of the game when they applied more pressure on our defence and keeper but generally they were happy to get back into shape.

Of course, once they went 2-0 up they dropped back and let us have the ball and the territory and we made our usual painful attempt at breaking through.

[ClaretPete001]

Without wanting to appear as a tactic geek, they didn’t really have a high press. They just played a high line which squeezed the pitch. We actually had quite a lot of joy playing over the top into JBL and Odobert in the early stages. There were stages of the game when they applied more pressure on our defence and keeper but generally they were happy to get back into shape.

Of course, once they went 2-0 up they dropped back and let us have the ball and the territory and we made our usual painful attempt at breaking through.

Perish the thought of appearing like a tactics geek discussing tactics on a football forum.

I guess it depends how you define a high press. Having a high line and squeezing the space is to some extent a high press.

We would have some joy playing over the top to JBL and Odobert because Patterson and Mc Neil were pushing up to join the press but largely they over-powered us in the first half and pressed higher up the pitch than they usually do.

It wasn't a high press in the sense we played it at the start of the season where the whole team squeezes up to the half way line but I doubt Everton have the quality of players to do that particularly given 3 of the back four were missing.

So, fair play you could be right... but I was surprised how many players they got forward yesterday. If you look at the Keane goal they had 7 players on the edge of our box.