Sam Allardyce is going to be happy

[aggi]

Good news

[durhamclaret]

Why is it good news? Pint bottles are smaller than regular ones, Sam will not be happy.
Just have to buy two I guess.

[BabylonClaret]

Wow. Brexit really is worth it isn't it??

[evensteadiereddie]

Mission accomplished!
That Ringo McCartney fella will be beside himself.

[kentonclaret]

The benefits of leaving Europe.

You can buy a pint of wine at the supermarket and down a yard of ale in the pub. Well done Boris!

[Rowls]

This is a thread full of sophisticated lolz.

But does anybody seriously think that the EU rules prohibiting certain bottle sizes were especially worthwhile? Who seriously thinks that selling wine in a pint sized bottle should be a prosecutable offence?

[roperclaret]

It’s ********. Wine should be sold in litre bottles. 750ml is just not enough

[RMutt]

This is a thread full of sophisticated lolz.

But does anybody seriously think that the EU rules prohibiting certain bottle sizes were especially worthwhile? Who seriously thinks that selling wine in a pint sized bottle should be a prosecutable offence?

I think you’re flogging a dead horse with this one Rowls. There’s only about five people left who think it was all a great idea.

[Rowls]

I think you’re flogging a dead horse with this one Rowls. There’s only about five people left who think it was all a great idea.

You think somebody caught selling wine in a pint bottle should be prosecuted RMutt?

Don't get the dead horse imagery? You'll need to explain it.

[RMutt]

I thought you could sell it in a pint bottle as long as the metric equivalent was also shown?
I suspect most people weren’t that bothered, particularly our younger generation.
In fact I don’t think they were that bothered about the whole thing until an allowed to be vocal minority made it an issue.

[evensteadiereddie]

Nobody actually gives a toss but the presentation of this a victory for Brexit is pretty laughable.

[Rowls]

I thought you could sell it in a pint bottle as long as the metric equivalent was also shown?
I suspect most people weren’t that bothered, particularly our younger generation.
In fact I don’t think they were that bothered about the whole thing until an allowed to be vocal minority made it an issue.

Ah, no.

That's the point.

It would appear you didn't know the facts before you posted. Wine could only be sold in the volumes approved by the EU.

[Rowls]

Nobody actually gives a toss but the presentation of this a victory for Brexit is pretty laughable.

It's entirely the other way round. The EU had dictated precisely which volumes wine could (and could not) be sold in. the reasons for this aren't apparent.

If anybody out there is vehemently in favour of only being able to sell wine in specific sized bottles appreciate bed of by the EU then now is your chance to explain why this is a worthwhile regulation.

[Rowls]

* approved of by the EU.

Damned autocorrect

[aggi]

This is a thread full of sophisticated lolz.

But does anybody seriously think that the EU rules prohibiting certain bottle sizes were especially worthwhile? Who seriously thinks that selling wine in a pint sized bottle should be a prosecutable offence?

Well the weights and measures act over here is equally (if not more) strict for a whole range of alcohol sales so someone thought it was a good idea.

[evensteadiereddie]

More to the point, is it going to make one scrap of difference to anyone?

[Rowls]

Well the weights and measures act over here is equally (if not more) strict for a whole range of alcohol sales so someone thought it was a good idea.

If you asked the general public what regulations they wanted for wine you might get things like

* Should be made from fermented grapes
* I want it to be labelled if it contains sulphites
Etc.

There's a good reason for certain regulations.

However, does anybody think "I only want it to be available in 75cl or 375ml bottles" would feature highly among public concern?

This thread is a great vehicle for anybody who cares deeply about the size of their wine bottle to defend the EU regulations but so far nobody has taken up the mantle.

[Rowls]

More to the point, is it going to make one scrap of difference to anyone?

It'll come down to consumer choice rather than EU dictat.

If there's market for it, nobody will stock them. I'd buy a pint of wine though - I usually buy it for cooking and a pint will give me enough for 2 glasses and one for the pot.

A bottle (75cl) is slightly too large and almost nobody in England stocks half bottles because they're too small.

We'll only know by looking at our supermarket aisles in 5 years time. I suspect it will be popular for reasons above.

[bfcjg]

As mentioned earlier who actually gives a flying f ? There's more important things to worry about and want changing.

[Rowls]

As mentioned earlier who actually gives a flying f ? There's more important things to worry about and want changing.

It's all to do with consumer choice.

Why shouldn't we be allowed to buy 568ml of wine?

It's simple enough to repeal.

Is nobody is prepared to defend the EU regulation? Does Alistair Campbell post on here?

Is anybody prepared to explain why only 75cl or 375ml bottles should be permitted?

[bfcjg]

Without getting into a tit for tat I love wine and have never once thought why can't I buy a pint of it.

[evensteadiereddie]

I'm not sure it matters enough to anybodyb to defend this, that or whatever.
I think this non issue, in terms of any of the damage caused by Brexit, barely registers.

[RMutt]

Ah, no.

That's the point.

It would appear you didn't know the facts before you posted. Wine could only be sold in the volumes approved by the EU.

Haha, well it looks like you’ve got me there. Although I’ll stick with the other point, only a tiny minority really cared.

[JohnMac]

It may have been passed but wether the Industry decides to pursue it is a different matter.

[Westleigh]

Probably a good way for the retailers to make a big profit,they’ll be selling pint bottles at the same price as 75cl.

[Rowls]

Haha, well it looks like you’ve got me there. Although I’ll stick with the other point, only a tiny minority really cared.

Well fair play to you.

But it isn't even a tiny majority who previously cared - it's far less than that. Nobody cared, but mainly because we didn't know.

Only last month I failed to buy a half bottle - They don't stock them. I was forced to buy more wine than I wanted.

The success or failure of this repeal of pointless EU legislation will be evident in our supermarket aisles in 5 years time.

[AmbleClaret]

The mere fact that this is being argued as a Brexit benefit just shows how little benefit there has been.Put it up there with blue passports and sovereignty.

[Rowls]

The mere fact that this is being argued as a Brexit benefit just shows how little benefit there has been.Put it up there with blue passports and sovereignty.

Who knows?

If just a fraction of the wine aisle is pint bottles in 5 years then it's effectively a multi-million pound industry created out of thin air.

The question is, do we want our regulations decided by British people or should they be written by EU dictat. Should it be British consumers who decide how much wine they'd like to buy or should somebody in Brussels decide?

We all know it's superficially petty but this is what it boils down to and it's not at all petty - it's about the fundamental nature of our democracy.

Let's be honest, nobody knew this legislation even existed until today but most tellingly nobody is defending it. Nobody at all.

This is the last call for anybody to explain why 75cl and 375ml should be the only bottle sizes available? No? Anybody? James O'Brien? Alistair Campbell?

[aggi]

If you asked the general public what regulations they wanted for wine you might get things like

* Should be made from fermented grapes
* I want it to be labelled if it contains sulphites
Etc.

There's a good reason for certain regulations.

However, does anybody think "I only want it to be available in 75cl or 375ml bottles" would feature highly among public concern?

This thread is a great vehicle for anybody who cares deeply about the size of their wine bottle to defend the EU regulations but so far nobody has taken up the mantle.

I mean, it's already legal to sell wine in 500ml bottles. Do you really think that extra 68ml is going to get all the winemakers onboard who previously opted not to sell 500ml bottles?

I imagine a few will do it as a novelty but Allardyce has probably tarnished the idea (and it's just not really worth the investment).

And, as I've said, the UK is highly prescriptive in alcohol selling measures in loads of other areas. This is just a bit of a novelty.

[aggi]

This is the last call for anybody to explain why 75cl and 375ml should be the only bottle sizes available? No? Anybody? James O'Brien? Alistair Campbell?

They're not.

[Rowls]

I mean, it's already legal to sell wine in 500ml bottles. Do you really think that extra 68ml is going to get all the winemakers onboard who previously opted not to sell 500ml bottles?

I imagine a few will do it as a novelty but Allardyce has probably tarnished the idea (and it's just not really worth the investment).

And, as I've said, the UK is highly prescriptive in alcohol selling measures in loads of other areas. This is just a bit of a novelty.

Except sparkling wine can't be sold in that volume? Do you care to explain why and defend the legislation?

And even if a 500ml is "legal" they aren't readily available.

[Rowls]

They're not.

You're right, you can't even get the half bottles unless you go somewhere huge

[Rowls]

But just for those of you who like to be partisan about these matters and who imagine I'll defend conservatives no matter what: this is a massive own goal by the gov.

Not the repeal (that's correct) but in presenting Brexit as something that allows is to drink pints of wine.

If they explain how the EU rules limited consumer choice and restricted the market they'd win widespread support. Making it all about "having a pint of wine" is the kind of thing a demented remainer would try and associate Brexit with. Alistair Campbell or James O'Brien couldn't have written a better press release.

If your original reaction to this story was "what a petty waste of time" or "bloody hell that's pathetic" then remember to check those supermarket aisles in 5 years time.

[Devils_Advocate]

Rowls argument that he should be able to find a bottle with the exact amount of wine he needs at his local shop is at the Ali G level of sophistication and stupidity.

Here is Ali G (1min40 - 2min40) talking about money denominations in the same way Rowls thinks about wine bottle capacity

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksGzn5b ... nel=ScottC

[Rowls]

Rowls argument that he should be able to find a bottle with the exact amount of wine he needs at his local shop is at the Ali G level of sophistication and stupidity.

Here is Ali G (1min40 - 2min40) talking about money denominations in the same way Rowls thinks about wine bottle capacity

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksGzn5b ... nel=ScottC

Ho ho ho Merry Christmas and Happy New Year Devils advocaat.

As usual, there's no need for me to respond sensibly to you on a "serious" issue because nobody takes you seriously. You're free to misrepresent me until your heart's content.

As I always tell you, stick to comical posts when using your novelty accounts and use a genuine username to make join in with things lol ke political chat.

You undermine your comic persona with these "serious" interjections.

[aggi]

Except sparkling wine can't be sold in that volume? Do you care to explain why and defend the legislation?

And even if a 500ml is "legal" they aren't readily available.

Is it UK legislation or EU legislation preventing that? I suspect it may be UK legislation but who knows (I'm fairly sure you don't). I would guess the EU restriction is only on the pint designation.

Of course it's legal. What a weird argument to make.

There have been legal definitions for wine measures for the past 700 years or something. It's not a new thing.

[Rowls]

Is it UK legislation or EU legislation preventing that? I suspect it may be UK legislation but who knows (I'm fairly sure you don't). I would guess the EU restriction is only on the pint designation.

Of course it's legal. What a weird argument to make.

There have been legal definitions for wine measures for the past 700 years or something. It's not a new thing.

Are you defending the EU legislation here? You think wine should only be available in volumes dictated by the EU?

Tell us why! Nobody so far is even pretending to approve of the EU regulations.

[aggi]

Is it UK legislation or EU legislation preventing that? I suspect it may be UK legislation but who knows (I'm fairly sure you don't). I would guess the EU restriction is only on the pint designation.

Of course it's legal. What a weird argument to make.

There have been legal definitions for wine measures for the past 700 years or something. It's not a new thing.

Entirely misread your response on that.

[Bosscat]

Are you defending the EU legislation here? You think wine should only be available in volumes dictated by the EU?

Tell us why! Nobody so far is even pretending to approve of the EU regulations.

Surely buying wine from EU countries would dictate wine comes in EU size bottles

[aggi]

Are you defending the EU legislation here? You think wine should only be available in volumes dictated by the EU?

Tell us why! Nobody so far is even pretending to approve of the EU regulations.

Can you point me to the EU legislation that restricts this? I've had a Google and can't find it.

Beer, cider and spirits are sold in measures based on UK legislation rather than EU so I'm curious whether wine is actually different.

[SonofPog]

I was interested in why the EU limited sizes. As I didn't know and Rowls keeps asking. One google search led me to the original EU impact assessment from 2004

https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/6555/

Here's conclusion. Its noted the wine (Glass) was limited to help reduce the relatively large shipping costs. Also unrestricted sizing was rejected (wouldn't effect pints in this case) to stop shrinkflation.

Conclusion
In the case of fixing sizes for the six sectors, the estimate of the net annual benefits
would be around €1.8bn. This is mainly due to costs saved by manufacturers on
investment, which would be required in order to produce greater variety in the sizes of
pre-packaging.

In the case of free sizes there would be net annual costs of €1.8bn, or a 3% price rise
of products sold to consumers, most of which will need to be paid by small
manufacturers in the form of new investment in flexible packaging, if there is demand
for a wider variety of sizes.

Maybe they'll be a small UK industry in producing half-pint wine. Only time will tell.

[Rowls]

Is it UK legislation or EU legislation preventing that? I suspect it may be UK legislation but who knows (I'm fairly sure you don't). I would guess the EU restriction is only on the pint designation.

Of course it's legal. What a weird argument to make.

From the BBC article:

"Currently, still wine cannot be sold in 200ml quantities and sparkling wine cannot be sold in 500ml amounts"

Care to defend this legislation? Or defend having it dictated to us by a foreign body over whom we exercised no effective democratic control whatsoever?

This will without doubt sound like a low priority to most people but it's the kind of thing the government is doing day-in and day-out. Implementing EU diktats used to be 40% of all government work.

We already had a big national debate about whether to have these everyday regulations drawn up in Brussels or Westminster and we all know how it ended.

[BabylonClaret]

This is a thread full of sophisticated lolz.

But does anybody seriously think that the EU rules prohibiting certain bottle sizes were especially worthwhile? Who seriously thinks that selling wine in a pint sized bottle should be a prosecutable offence?

Nobody cared. Because let's be honest it doesn't matter

[Rowls]

I was interested in why the EU limited sizes. As I didn't know and Rowls keeps asking. One google search led me to the original EU impact assessment from 2004

https://ec.europa.eu/docsroom/documents/6555/

Here's conclusion. Its noted the wine (Glass) was limited to help reduce the relatively large shipping costs. Also unrestricted sizing was rejected (wouldn't effect pints in this case) to stop shrinkflation.



Maybe they'll be a small UK industry in producing half-pint wine. Only time will tell.

Producing, possibly not. Bottling, perhaps.

As you say, the proof will be in our supermarket aisles I'm 5 years time.

I suspect the pints will be popular for the same reason nobody goes to the shops to buy "1.136 litres" of milk, which they don't.

[Rowls]

Nobody cared. Because let's be honest it doesn't matter

No, as already mentioned several times.

But people cared plenty enough to post about how they didn't care.

Strange world isn't it?

[Rowls]

Nobody cared. Because let's be honest it doesn't matter

And as already mentioned: if supermarket aisles have plenty of pint bottles in 5 years time it will be a multi-million pound industry conjured out of thin air.

[Rowls]

And still not a single person has defended the old EU regulations.

[aggi]

From the BBC article:

"Currently, still wine cannot be sold in 200ml quantities and sparkling wine cannot be sold in 500ml amounts"

Care to defend this legislation? Or defend having it dictated to us by a foreign body over whom we exercised no effective democratic control whatsoever?

This will without doubt sound like a low priority to most people but it's the kind of thing the government is doing day-in and day-out. Implementing EU diktats used to be 40% of all government work.

We already had a big national debate about whether to have these everyday regulations drawn up in Brussels or Westminster and we all know how it ended.

I saw that in the article but it wasn't clear whether it was down to UK or EU legislation.

I've found the EU legislation now and can see it is down to EU.

I think it is sensible having fixed sizes, particularly if it is something the sector requested (which it seems they did, including the UK who are members of the federation that requested it).

If you're part of a big trading block then it is sensible for that block to set the sizes (with input from members).

If not then the individual country can set the sizes (which will still involve people having to do the work). Realistically though they're going to follow what the rest of the market is doing rather than incur huge extra costs to go their own way (or charge a significant premium for those non-standard sizes).

I think the number of 500ml bottles of wine you see in shops shows the demand for other sizes.

[Rowls]

Surely buying wine from EU countries would dictate wine comes in EU size bottles

Hi Bosscat,

Sorry I missed this. Happy to be corrected but I think they'll be free to export it to the UK in different sized bottles but obviously that would push the price up for us.

However, we're a large market for EU wine. As the BBC article states, Churchill used to drink pints of champagne pre-EU. If pints of wine becomes a popular "thing" then EU producers will want a slice of the potential new market.

As daft as it sounds, stuff like this really matters. Think about the rebranding of pilchards as "Cornish sardines". That put their sales up something crazy like 400%. For the same product.

I can't imagine this will be popular with consumers who exclusively drink European wine. However, it might be very popular with people who drink the less fancy new world wines.

I think we could also mass import the wine. It would be cheaper to import it in larger containers and then we could bottle it ourselves into our wonderful 568ml bottles.

We'll also be able to sell new world wine in these bottles. The EU legislation applies/applied to ALL wine sold in the UK. Do Americans buy wine by the pint? If they do they'll have an advantage because they'll be ready to jump into the new market before the EU producers can as they'll have production and bottles already set up.

[dougcollins]

Ah, no.

That's the point.

It would appear you didn't know the facts before you posted. Wine could only be sold in the volumes approved by the EU.

As most of our drinkable wine came from the EU, I can't see that as being any kind of issue.

But now I can buy a pint of sh!t wine? Oh good.