Let’s talk about Benson!

[Guller Bull]

Like many (I assume), I cannot get my head around what is going on with the lad. Many times early in the season we were crying out for his ability to set fire to a game but it was said he had some niggles and that’s why he wasn’t being played. Then he showed up on the bench for a bit disappeared again then there was all the transfer/ loan discussions.

Get that out of the way and he is on the bench against Liverpool and you would think at 3-1 down that a genuine game changer of his ilk would have got time on the pitch. But not a sniff, even when other players with a less obvious spark were being given minutes?

What am I missing? What’s the discussion I am not hearing?

Surely if we are not trusting his (yawn) tracking back then he should have gone somewhere in the window. If that’s not the case then he has to play a part.

I don’t live in the area so maybe I am missing some dialogue but from the outside I find it really strange that a player that lifted us so much last season is just not featuring.

[bobinho]

I couldn’t tell ya…. But a game changer at championship level is one thing, to step it up to this level may just be (like most of the others) a step too far.

I’ll be honest, I’m a little uneasy about the way some of the players from last season have been “managed” this season. I would have liked to have seen a few of them given some time on the pitch as opposed to just being discarded like it seems they have.

[RammyClaret61]

Trafford hasn’t made the step from league one, but he’s not missed a league minute.

With Benson, what’s to lose??

[Clive 1960]

obviously Vincent isn't seeing it in training for him to be selected like a couple more who hadn't featured as much as last season and have gone out on loan who were not 100 percent focused on the job in hand..

[Vegas Claret]

it looked from the outside that they tried to move him on but there were no takers at 15 million. I'm not remotely arsed if he's good enough or not, like Muric he wasn't given a chance to prove it either way and that is poor from VK imho

[Newcastleclaret93]

Given right wing has arguably been one of our more weaker positions it’s truly baffling that Benson hasn’t been given game time

No doubt VK has fallen out with him

[CryerBFC]

I think VK will admit in private he’s probably not done things as he maybe should have, but he stated at the start of the season he wasn’t going to start changing things to then change them back and he’s being stubborn in that sense.

We could make a case for Muric, Roberts, Taylor, Cullen, Cork, Benson and Zaroury. I know a couple have played bits and parts, Taylor is the only stand out who VK has had to put in with his tail between his legs.

The frustrating thing for me was that he should have given last seasons team a go. If after 5/7 games they’re showing they aren’t good enough, we could have forgiven his mass changes.

[claretonthecoast1882]

2 replies to manage to get Trafford into the thread about Benson.

Never boring is it

[Jel]

2 replies to manage to get Trafford into the thread about Benson.

Never boring is it

Valid though!

[Nori1958]

2 replies to manage to get Trafford into the thread about Benson.

Never boring is it

At least it's a thread about football some manage to get their hourly fix on non football related threads

For what it's worth I don't see Benson having the effect at this level some think he would. Last season opposition managers knew what he was going to do, so did their players, yet he scored the same goal in how many consecutive games?. I don't see the world class managers or players allowing him the same freedom in this league.

[Guller Bull]

At least it's a thread about football some manage to get their hourly fix on non football related threads

For what it's worth I don't see Benson having the effect at this level some think he would. Last season opposition managers knew what he was going to do, so did their players, yet he scored the same goal in how many consecutive games?. I don't see the world class managers or players allowing him the same freedom in this league.

I kind of get not using Plan A for a while if you don't think it's going to work but when you get to desperation stakes and B and C are drawing blanks then surely Plan A has to be reconsidered at least an ickle bit?

[bumba]

it looked from the outside that they tried to move him on but there were no takers at 15 million. I'm not remotely arsed if he's good enough or not, like Muric he wasn't given a chance to prove it either way and that is poor from VK imho

Couldn't agree more, if they didn't perform by all means leave them out but to push them aside from the start without enough time to adapt or be given a fair chance has been really poor from VK, especially when others who didn't even perform as well abroad, championship or lower get time after time to impress even when performing badly

[Bordeauxclaret]

Everything indicates a falling out in my opinion.

[Rick_Muller]

I think Benson is a victim of his own success. He did great for us last season and I feel that this season he may well have assumed he’d done enough to be starting and perhaps his attitude wasn’t right from the outset. Ultimately the better teams had the measure of him, he’s by no means a one trick pony, but he is limited in what he can offer to change a game and I think VK knows this.

Yes I have met him IRL, so I can comment on his actual attitude to certain things. No I’m not saying I’m right either, just my educated guess as to what has happened.

[daveisaclaret]

Giving big, long contract extensions to people we don't really want at the club seems to be a bit of an ALK signature move unfortunately.

I like Benson, and I think it's a shame he's not had a chance. But I do think that (with the underperformance of some of the other wingers ahead of him notwithstanding) it was probably a pretty valid call from VK that a player with his skillset and lack of physicality wasn't much of a prospect for a struggling Premier League team. What doesn't make sense is paying him a wage all season and expecting nowt in return rather than cashing in at what now seems fairly likely to be his peak career value last summer.

Maybe he comes back into the fold as the best super sub in the Championship next season and all is forgotten, but it doesn't feel too likely.

[CoolClaret]

Nothing makes sense.

You'll have those that back anything and everything the manager/club do along to tell you that he wasn't actually that good last year and we have no way of knowing if he could step up, or even make some ******** up being fake ITK, yet will vehemently defend Trafford's/Ramsey's/Amdouni's continuous selection.

Rinse repeat.

Nothing this season makes sense.

[StayingDown4Ever]

I’m sure people on here said he would be better suited to the Prem as he would be more protected by the referees.

I think he should have been given more of a chance than he’s had. In lots (most) of the games this season we’ve been losing with a good 20 minutes to go - even if not starting I don’t see why we wouldn’t give him that long to try and change a game. Leaving him on the bench and bringing defenders on when we are behind is embarrassing.

[Selby Claret]

I have to confess to some involvement in all of this

Last year I named my FPL team TWINEY DANCER and then Scott was out for months and hardly played
This year I chose FC TWENTE BENSON

Please accept my humblest apologies

[claretonthecoast1882]

I have to confess to some involvement in all of this

Last year I named my FPL team TWINEY DANCER and then Scott was out for months and hardly played
This year I chose FC TWENTE BENSON

Please accept my humblest apologies

Maybe next season name your team something to do with those at Ewood

[Spike]

Benson has got to be better than Ramsey

[Buxtonclaret]

I have to confess to some involvement in all of this

Last year I named my FPL team TWINEY DANCER and then Scott was out for months and hardly played
This year I chose FC TWENTE BENSON

Please accept my humblest apologies

Shame on you, Selby.

[JohnMcGreal]

The players we paid fairly modest fees for last season (and in some cases ended up playing really well for us) are now unplayable and unsellable.

The players we've paid pretty big fees for this season don't look good enough and we'll probably be making a loss on most of them, if we can even shift them at all.

I'm not sure what our transfer strategy is supposed to be, but I'd hope it's something like the complete opposite of this.

[Stayingup]

It seems to be obvious VK doesn't think he's good enough.

[ArmchairDetective]

I too feel a bit perplexed at the management of players from last season including Benson. It would make sense that the shirt was theirs to lose at the start of the season whilst slowly phasing in some of the newer players to strengthen.

But it's easy to say this with hindsight and without knowing what goes on at the training ground. You'd think we'd have seen more of him though and who knows, he might have helped us to a couple more points.

[BurnleyFC]

Add it to the list of baffling decisions post-promotion.

[Quickenthetempo]

Vinny will be judged by all these decisions and results of them.
At the moment, he's Burnley's worst ever manager at Premier league level, even worse than Brian Laws, which h I didn't think was possible.

Bring an experienced no.2 in Vinny to help you stop making these daft mistakes.

[Jamesy]

No, let’s talk about Vincent.

The man who we all acclaimed last season for his achievements in winning an average standard championship relatively easily.
In doing this we had two, possibly three really good loanees and several young hungry players he discovered playing in Belgium and Europe.
After a slow start to the season playing his tippy tappy possession football he stuck to his guns believing it would click, and guess what, it did. We were then beating teams for fun and were good to watch, even though we were still a bit shaky at the back and conceded some soft goals. However, this was overlooked somewhat as we were winning nearly every game.Everyone was on a high and predicting good times ahead.
Fast forward to the start of this season and two key loanees had gone back to their parent clubs for whatever reasons. By this time Vincent had appeared to sign more players than any other Burnley manager in recent history with an outlay of circa 100 million pounds. We trusted him because of what he achieved last season in assembling an almost new team after losing established pros like Pope, Mee, Tarkowski, McNiell et.al.
Again we had another slow start to the season, which to be fair we expected due to the opening fixtures. We all believed Luton and Sheffield United would be certainties for relegation and were optimistic we could make a genuine fist of staying in the Premier League or even achieving a mid table finish.
Fast forward to today, with two thirds of the season gone and nailed on for relegation. We are now asking questions about why certain players like Benson and and others haven’t figured whilst watching Kompany pick ineffectual players week in week out and we keep getting rolled over by teams who are well organised and have a proper game plan and with a stomach for the fight.
Trafford gets a lot of criticism on this board, as he is in a key position and is struggling in certain aspects of his game. If we were half way up the league he would be given a bit more slack as was allowed to Muric last season. However, we aren’t, we are likely to finish bottom, so in the be all and end all world of the Premier League he is going to keep receiving this criticism.
It is clear that Kompany underestimated the size of the task ahead of him this season. Furthermore it quickly became clear to me that even though he made all of these signings he didn’t adequately cover the spine of the team, meaning we were left weak in midfield and defence. With regard to the goalkeeper, in Kompany’s defence he paid goad money for the England Under 21’s keeper who had been receiving good praise in the media, so it was understandable that he started the season in goal. In fact many posters on this board saw this as an astute signing.
As the season has gone on and we have failed to beat or even get anything from teams we all said we needed to get points off, with two exceptions I have become increasingly concerned about Kompany’s stubbornness in changing things. Initially, I attributed this to his perceived big ego. By this I mean that he thought in his head that just like last season it would suddenly click and the media would laud him for sticking to his principles. However, as the season has rumbled on and there is now only a third of it remaining and still it hasn’t clicked. We can’t even do the basics properly despite him employing a full time set piece coach.
In a nutshell, it is Vincent’s poor signings and reluctance to change things which have ultimately led to us not being able to lay a glove on teams this season and going back down without a whimper. This is why people like the OP question certain players like Benson not starting and Trafford gets the weekly slating because we have gotten beat again and he has been poor on a cross. And they question why ineffectual players like Ramsay and Amdouni are getting a start each week and Benson is nowhere near a start.
The main person who we should be criticising or questioning week in, week out is Vincent Kompany. Sadly, he is way out of his depth.

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

Wouldn’t be surprised if he’s fallen out with at least 3 players this season after Sterling performances the last.

Muric
Benson
Zaroury ( loaned I know)


All haven’t had a sniff and said to be on their way out without hardly playing. Is quite disrespectful to say Benson isn’t good enough for this level has hasn’t hardly played bar what ten minutes?

[NewClaret]

Giving big, long contract extensions to people we don't really want at the club seems to be a bit of an ALK signature move unfortunately.

I like Benson, and I think it's a shame he's not had a chance. But I do think that (with the underperformance of some of the other wingers ahead of him notwithstanding) it was probably a pretty valid call from VK that a player with his skillset and lack of physicality wasn't much of a prospect for a struggling Premier League team. What doesn't make sense is paying him a wage all season and expecting nowt in return rather than cashing in at what now seems fairly likely to be his peak career value last summer.

Maybe he comes back into the fold as the best super sub in the Championship next season and all is forgotten, but it doesn't feel too likely.

I cannot understand how you draw a conclusion that long contract extensions are given to players we ‘don’t want at the club’. That seems a huge overreaction to me and no doubt a completely inaccurate statement given it seems he had multiple offers in January and wasn’t allowed to leave. And Kompany’s comments that he believes in him.

The way I see it:

Squads have 25 players in them. 20 make it to the bench, 16 may play a part, 11 start. It’s entirely normal for many of the 25 not to feature much, if at all, in a season. It happens at every club. That doesn’t mean clubs ‘don’t want them’. There will be no doubt they need them and internally the whole squad will be valued equally.

If you’ve listened to Kompany he’s clearly positioned it as a transitional issue with the demands of the Premier League.

I agree with your statement that Kompany has probably been right not playing him, although of course we’ll never know. But I don’t think it takes a lot of football knowledge to work out that in the Championship, with 70%+ possession every game, he spent most of his season stood on the touchline waiting to receive the ball, then either retaining possession or cutting in. He rarely took men on and whipped one in with his right and often didn’t start and was brought off the bench.

In the Prem he’d do most of his work off the ball, need to be positionally aware, spend most of his time helping out defensively, physically strong and fit, and better at counter attacks given that’s more how we play now - running the length of the pitch. I honestly don’t think a single fan could argue that description matches Benny’s attributes so when people say he’s fallen out with Kompany I honestly just wonder whether they watch the same sport as me.

That’s not to say I don’t like Benson, or want to see more of him when we’re trailing because our right side is weak and he has a goal in him. What we need though, is a right-sided Koleosho with his explosive speed and work rate to boot.

As for selling him at peak value, can you imagine the meltdown on here had they done that in summer? I think we’re absolutely right to maintain players we know can kill it in the Championship though, even if they don’t feature much in the Prem, because it’s a massive safety net.

[Nori1958]

Jamesy..... I'd check your stats about Ramsey starting every game if I was you... I think it's 4

[Jamesy]

Yes the last 3 though.

[Jamesy]

Jamesy..... I'd check your stats about Ramsey starting every game if I was you... I think it's 4

Yes I was just trying to make a point that when we see players like him and Amdouni figure and offer little to the team, he picks them again the following match.

[claptrappers_union]

We've been relegated this season (and yes, we have) purely down to VK’s team selection. As fans, we can see he's not picking the best players from his squad.

[RVclaret]

We've been relegated this season (and yes, we have) purely down to VK’s team selection. As fans, we can see he's not picking the best players from his squad.

Don’t need to speak for all of us!

[warksclaret]

Yes I was just trying to make a point that when we see players like him and Amdouni figure and offer little to the team, he picks them again the following match.

Be interesting to see if he starts when both Foster and Fofana are both fit and available.Suspect thats why he started v Liverpool. I think then Amdouini could be a good impact sub/game changer, and right now we dont have many of these

[CoolClaret]

***Jamesys content***

Agreed with a lot of this - good post, bar this part:

Trafford gets a lot of criticism on this board, as he is in a key position and is struggling in certain aspects of his game. If we were half way up the league he would be given a bit more slack as was allowed to Muric last season. However, we aren’t, we are likely to finish bottom, so in the be all and end all world of the Premier League he is going to keep receiving this criticism.
It is clear that Kompany underestimated the size of the task ahead of him this season. Furthermore it quickly became clear to me that even though he made all of these signings he didn’t adequately cover the spine of the team, meaning we were left weak in midfield and defence. With regard to the goalkeeper, in Kompany’s defence he paid goad money for the England Under 21’s keeper who had been receiving good praise in the media, so it was understandable that he started the season in goal. In fact many posters on this board saw this as an astute signing.

Traff signing is one thing - admittedly I think it was too much money moreover, it's him starting and continuing to start that doesn't make one jot of sense.

Surely if he really was his guy we could've had him last season on loan, or loan with an option to buy (I think we had more pull than L1 Bolton). Did he really do enough at Bolton to justify a PL move and a starting birth?

& what makes it even more baffling is the fact that we have literally repeated Southampton's mistake of signing a GK from the City academy that had only ever been on loan in League One and have suffered a similar fate.

There's noway that a young GK coming from L1 in a team that finished 6th btw, should dislodge the starting GK that walked the Championship and won accolades in doing so. Ever.

Not only that he was shaky in pre-season as well - dropped a clanger at Genk, lobbed from the half way line against Betis...

It's the worst and most bizarre managerial decision that I can remember at, at Burnley and it's that along with a few other things that you and others have alluded to which gives me 0 confidence with VK as our manager to be able to foster a harmonious squad over a number of seasons and be able to get results when we're not the favourites - because we will never be that in the PL.

[ksrclaret]

You expect with every manager the odd few perplexing calls (from the outside looking in), but as the season has gone on it has become increasingly difficult to reconcile the manager's decisions from last season with the manager's decisions from this season.

[claptrappers_union]

Don’t need to speak for all of us!

You disagree with that?

[Iloveyoubrady]

Bringing Ramsey into it is fair imo. Benson was clearly a far superior player at championship level - to say he is worse at premier leaague level is ridiculous. Benson was our best player last year - anyone could see his class. The way he’s been treated this year is ridiculous.

[Jamesy]

Traff signing is one thing - admittedly I think it was too much money moreover, it's him starting and continuing to start that doesn't make one jot of sense.

In reply to CoolClaret. Of course this doesn’t make sense.
The lad started the season but has struggled as many of us have seen and it’s been done to death on here.
However, the fault lies squarely with Kompany. That’s why I really believe his ego has gotten in the way of making pragmatic decisions for the good of the team. Many people think it is stubbornness, I’m not so sure.

[Jakubs Tash]

Losing at Anfield when Vitinho comes on as a winger and Benson stays on the bench. There’s absolutely zero logic in this substitution. Zero.

Something is certainly amiss in this situation. It’s definitely not just the theory that the manager thinks he isn’t up to making the step up.

[brexit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlb-Wwvllno

[jojomk1]

Simple question
If VK doesn't fancy him at this level or has had a fall out with him,
Why hasn't he just let him go either on loan or transfer as he clearly doesn't feel the need to start him
Just one of a number of baffling decisions by a manager who looks way out of his depth at this level

[RVclaret]

Bringing Ramsey into it is fair imo. Benson was clearly a far superior player at championship level - to say he is worse at premier leaague level is ridiculous. Benson was our best player last year - anyone could see his class. The way he’s been treated this year is ridiculous.

In my view, and that of many, Benson was not our best player last season.

You disagree with that?

I don’t think team selections have been that confusing or bad. Perhaps some rotation with keepers but that’s about it.

[Sleeping Cat]

Simple question
If VK doesn't fancy him at this level or has had a fall out with him,
Why hasn't he just let him go either on loan or transfer as he clearly doesn't feel the need to start him
Just one of a number of baffling decisions by a manager who looks way out of his depth at this level

This is what I found baffling about Zaroury leaving and Benson staying. Benson has hardly featured, but Zaroury was getting minutes of the bench. On the morning of deadline day I would've said Zaroury was nearer the 1st team than Benson, but it was Zaroury that left and Benson stayed. Then there was the interview re: Benson having a discussion with VK and being convinced to stay, only to be left out of the matchday squad for the next game.

I can understand Benson not being a 1st team starter, his appearances last season were split between starts and sub appearances, but he displayed last year that he is an excellent option to bring on and try and win a match.

[CoolClaret]

Losing at Anfield when Vitinho comes on as a winger and Benson stays on the bench. There’s absolutely zero logic in this substitution. Zero.

Something is certainly amiss in this situation. It’s definitely not just the theory that the manager thinks he isn’t up to making the step up.

Bang on - makes absolutely no sense whichever way it's spun. It's proper madness.

[Jamesy]

Simple question
If VK doesn't fancy him at this level or has had a fall out with him,
Why hasn't he just let him go either on loan or transfer as he clearly doesn't feel the need to start him
Just one of a number of baffling decisions by a manager who looks way out of his depth at this level

Can’t argue with this.

[BurnleyFC]

Said it more than once and I’ll say it again - Benson was our best player against Premier League Manchester United and Bournemouth in the cups last season.

Whilst it’s not definitive proof that he is Premier League quality, those writing him as not being good enough after less than a handful of opportunities is pure conjecture on their part.

[Jamesy]

In my view, and that of many, Benson was not our best player last season.


I don’t think team selections have been that confusing or bad. Perhaps some rotation with keepers but that’s about it.

Benson wasn’t our best player last season. However, when he came on I always felt something may happen. A great player to introduce with 30 mins of the game remaining.
Sometimes he was like an untrained hosepipe, other times he was curling one just inside the post or playing a lovely ball into a key area. Furthermore, he really looked like he was bursting to do well.

[StayingDown4Ever]

Wasn’t it said that Vincent had talks with Benson in January and said he was part of the plan then got him to stay?

Imagine how furious you’d be if you then saw Vitinho coming in before you.

Vincent is looking more of a mug as each week passes.

If I was Benson I’d be doing all I could to get out in the summer (assuming it’s still Vincent in charge) - I wouldn’t just want to be used to try and take the team out of the Championship only to be dumped again if we do go up.