What a ******* shambles!

[Nori1958]

Yep, thought so.

That's just because that's the team we've just played, they're are others

[CoolClaret]

A fairly often asked question is “who is the best player you’ve seen against us in the Turf?” and the unanimous decision has mostly been Cesc Fabregas.

There’s an opposition player almost every game doing a “Cesc Fabregas” to us this season. Even Matty Cash did a “Cesc Fabregas” to us.

It’s just another indication of just how far away this lot are from being anywhere near effective at this level.

You're right - we genuinely made Cash look like Roberto Carlos - and in all honesty, Cash is a run of the mill lower-end Prem fullback (that villa will move on from this summer) - never would've caused us issues like that under the previous regime.

[ksrclaret]

That's just because that's the team we've just played, they're are others

I can think of Rice, Grealish, and Caicedo. Am I missing any?

None of those are worth more than we paid for our entire team though.

[claptrappers_union]

£19m on a kid goalkeeper
£14m on someone's brother
£15m deal triggered on (probably) Ali Dia’s cousin

[CoolClaret]

£15m deal triggered on (probably) Ali Dia’s cousin

tickled me

[boatshed bill]

I'll give you Rice.

Other than that they haven't spent massively on other players in all fairness.

Also, that's one team - no team outside the top 4 is doing that.

I wonder what their wage bill is?

[BurnleyFC]

£19m on a kid goalkeeper
£14m on someone's brother
£15m deal triggered on (probably) Ali Dia’s cousin

Brutal.

[CoolClaret]

I wonder what their wage bill is?

Wonder what ours is? Ginormous squad! Soon find out mind...

[alwaysaclaret]

The money was spent on players within our budget, both in terms of transfer fees and wages, who have the potential to develop.
I believe we will see the benefit of this strategy..... eventually.

Strange then that other teams have academies for that purpose, I've not seen any other team throwing 6,7,8 players in like lamb's to the slaughter in the way kompany has, if kompany aspires to become a top 6 side which is what he's suggested in previous interviews especially last season then he should be old enough and wise enough having mixed with the big boys at city to know that you need experience first to win games at this level, and the way to do it is to integrate 1 or 2 at a time and that only when a game is won.

[DCWat]

If playing against teams that can spend more on one player than we can our entire squad is the barometer, it’s pointless even being in this league. However, you don’t have to go too far back in our own recent history to see that a well organised, hard working team can hold their own, and more on occasion.

I certainly wasn’t expecting a win today. What I was expecting, particularly after a reasonable display away at Liverpool, was organisation, effort, commitment, an ability to adapt and try to address the blatant issues - how many times did they play a ball through to the centre that cut our midfield and defence apart?

Minimum requirement is maximum effort - I didn’t see much of that until Vitinho and Jay Rod came on. I saw more from them in the time that they were on the pitch than I saw from far too many of the starting eleven.

Royboy is correct - how have we gone from being so good to so poor, in the space of a few months. Our issues are more than facing a higher quality of opposition. If that were the case, Luton wouldn’t be putting up a far better fight than we are able to.

We really need to start seeing some positive change, not for this season (that went ages ago) but to ready us for next. Carry on like this and things could get very ugly, very quickly. We surely can’t afford anything but a promotion push, next season

[CoolClaret]

Strange then that other teams have academies for that purpose, I've not seen any other team throwing 6,7,8 players in like lamb's to the slaughter in the way kompany has, if kompany aspires to become a top 6 side which is what he's suggested in previous interviews especially last season then he should be old enough and wise enough having mixed with the big boys at city to know that you need experience first to win games at this level, and the way to do it is to integrate 1 or 2 at a time and that only when a game is won.

It is very strange - is it some sort of easy cop out for him you think? Don't perform then point to them being young and 3-5 yr in the future or whatever?

He did the same at Anderlecht whom ran out of patience year 3 into their 'project'.

[Royboyclaret]

It's been a mess.

The Premier League has players that are not only technically light years ahead of the Championship but physically a different species.

You cannot go into a season where you are unable to keep a clean sheet, the one thing Dyche made sure of is that no matter how badly we played he wanted us to still be in the game after an hour. This season we have been out of so many games in the first fifteen or twenty minutes.

A strong base and spine is absolutely essential to have any chance of being competitive, unfortunately we glected that and got caught up in the hype of what Premier League players are.

Flair players need someone to run the hard yards and do the dirty things for them, we have too many of one and too little of the other.

All obout players understanding their own particular roles..... dId Willie Morgan ever have dirty things doing for them ?

[alwaysaclaret]

If playing against teams that can spend more on one player than we can our entire squad is the barometer, it’s pointless even being in this league. However, you don’t have to go too far back in our own recent history to see that a well organised, hard working team can hold their own, and more on occasion.

I certainly wasn’t expecting a win today. What I was expecting, particularly after a reasonable display away at Liverpool, was organisation, effort, commitment, an ability to adapt and try to address the blatant issues - how many times did they play a ball through to the centre that cut our midfield and defence apart?

Minimum requirement is maximum effort - I didn’t see much of that until Vitinho and Jay Rod came on. I saw more from them in the time that they were on the pitch than I saw from far too many of the starting eleven.

Royboy is correct - how have we gone from being so good to so poor, in the space of a few months. Our issues are more than facing a higher quality of opposition. If that were the case, Luton wouldn’t be putting up a far better fight than we are able to.

We really need to start seeing some positive change, not for this season (that went ages ago) but to ready us for next. Carry on like this and things could get very ugly, very quickly. We surely can’t afford anything but a promotion push, next season

Lots are convinced we'll bounce straight back, but make no mistake, won't be as easy next time. And as some have said, will the players out on loan want to come back and go down that road for the same thing to happen again, they now already know their not good enough under this regime so I rather doubt it.

[DCWat]

Lots are convinced we'll bounce straight back, but make no mistake, won't be as easy next time. And as some have said, will the players out on loan want to come back and go down that road for the same thing to happen again, they now already know their not good enough under this regime so I rather doubt it.

I also wonder just how much fight the likes of Benson and Zaroury might have for another season in the championship, with us. That their opportunities have been so limited this season will hardly encourage them for next. It’ll take some good man management to have them fully on board.

[CoolClaret]

I also wonder just how much fight the likes of Benson and Zaroury might have for another season in the championship, with us. That their opportunities have been so limited this season will hardly encourage them for next. It’ll take some good man management to have them fully on board.

& the fans, what hope is there to give over summer? It's not like we're starting a fresh like we were in summer 2022.

[Goody1975]

All obout players understanding their own particular roles..... dId Willie Morgan ever have dirty things doing for them ?

Bit before my time but would suggest Brian O'Neill might have been someone who did the dirty things we speak of.

What would you give for him in the middle of the park today?
Well, for the ten minutes before he'd be sent off.

[Royboyclaret]

& the fans, what hope is there to give over summer? It's not like we're starting a fresh like we were in summer 2022.

We will always be there since many decades ago.

But, as DCWat points posts, important players like Benson and Zaroury need to be influential, as they should have been this season.

[Royboyclaret]

Bit before my time but would suggest Brian O'Neill might have been someone who did the dirty things we speak of.

What would you give for him in the middle of the park today?
Well, for the ten minutes before he'd be sent off.

Trust me Goody......Brian was more than capable of looking after himself !

[CoolClaret]

We will always be there since many decades ago.

But, as DCWat points posts, important players like Benson and Zaroury need to be influential, as they should have been this season.

Aye but what I'm saying there's hardly going to be a buzz of going in a new direction - poor campaigns can lead to a massive hangover into the next season; it's not like narrowly missing out and thinking 'yep next time we can stay up', it's like, 'christ, where do we go from here?'

[Royboyclaret]

Aye but what I'm saying there's hardly going to be a buzz of going in a new direction - poor campaigns can lead to a massive hangover into the next season; it's not like narrowly missing out and thinking 'yep next time we can stay up', it's like, 'christ, where do we go from here?'

Fully take your point......which is why I'm still struggling to understand this massive contrast from last season to this.

[Goody1975]

Trust me Goody......Brian was more than capable of looking after himself !

but he put in the hard yards (and tackles) to allow the flair players to flourish. We are just too meek.

We can't afford a Rodri or Rice but these type of players are vital to the success City and Arsenal will have this season.

City miss Rodri more than they miss De Bruyne, I think stats have backed that up.

[CoolClaret]

Fully take your point......which is why I'm still struggling to understand this massive contrast from last season to this.

It's a real shock - I've never seen anything quite like it whilst supporting the Clarets, well never seen anything like it in football in all honesty.

[Royboyclaret]

but he put in the hard yards (and tackles) to allow the flair players to flourish. We are just too meek.

We can't afford a Rodri or Rice but these type of players are vital to the success City and Arsenal will have this season.

City miss Rodri more than they miss De Bruyne, I think stats have backed that up.

team

All about balance, Goody

Our ''60 team was centred round Mac and Adamson in midfield, two completely different players.

[Goody1975]

team

All about balance, Goody

Our ''60 team was centred round Mac and Adamson in midfield, two completely different players.

Yes, correct. We haven't found it this season or more importantly recruited it.

The winter window was much better but too little too late and still didn't solve the issue in the middle of the park.

[Royboyclaret]

Yes, correct. We haven't found it this season or more importantly recruited it.

The winter window was much better but too little too late and still didn't solve the issue in the middle of the park.

All of which, surely, was the responsibility of one person.

An absolute waste of a special season.

[Superjohnnyfrancis]

We could lose every game from now till end of season and VK will still be in the dugout come next season, do we have such low expectations of our manager all of a sudden. It is an overused word but it is baffling.

What is the plan because I don’t see one.

[claretspice]

But at what cost? What league will we be in? We've spent BIG money on Trafford and Ramsey. They are on long contracts. The only reason I can imagine they are getting in the team is because club are desperate to flip them for profit ASAP.

This isn't pop at them for for their performances or ability, but these types of players under a good manager are blooded them into the team over time, managers send them out on loan, and before you know it, over the space of 9 months, they are starting. Like what happened with Dwight McNeil Jay Rodriguez and Michael Keane.

Players need to earn their place in the team. Muric should never have been dropped. Benson, Zaroury, Gudmundsson, Cullen, Cork, did nothing wrong… yet Ramsey was getting to the team and hasnt pulled up any trees in any of his appearances, wether they are starts or off the bench.

But a whole team of first-season Dwight McNeils isn't going to keep you in the league while it seems to me the players obviously have a mindset, play well, get a move. Rather than work hard for Burnley Football Club. Being treated as a saleable asset - and that is what was sold to them in the first place.

Look at the players who gave a **** today, Taylor, Jay and JBG. None of them were brilliant but at least I saw effort. Heck, I’d take a Matej Vydra over Amdouni any day now. At least he'd put in a shift.

Today was a dark day. I've seen some howlers at Turf Moor over the years. Sometimes you know it because the team isn't good enough, the manager got it wrong, tactics, loss of belief, poor form… but today lacked a bit of everything. As much as Dyche gets stick for his style, his players as a unit always gave 100%. I don't think I've seen that at all this season.

I honestly don't think the players care. I don't think the manager cares. I think Vincent Kompany is promoting his style of football, and what becomes of Burnley Football Club isn't his concern as long as it works for him.

The players know relegation is all but confirmed and they have downed tools ready for next season.

I have great respect for this poster but the first paragraph here is precisely the point I was making last night. It may correctly anticipate the business model. But it involves some very significant assumptions. It is perfectly possible that the club intends to hold the vast majority of these players on the basis that they represent a core which can be developed, and can therefore help establish ourselves in 2 seasons time whilst also giving us very saleable assets. I don't know either way (and this may be a criticism of the club's comms strategy) but it does strike me that a lot are jumping to the extreme negative conclusion that player value means everything and performances nothing (as though the two can ultimately be divorced in that way across a.team).

And I think the rest of that post follows from that assumption as to what the players are doing here. I didn't agree with the turnover of players last summer and i think we brought I the wrong mix of players. But we are where we are on that. I think the suggestion the players don't care or have down tooled is misplaced and confuses a team that is very low on confidence and lacking in experience and leadership and is therefore switching off far too easily. The idea that the players left over from Dyche's era put in more effort than many of those VK has signed doesnt sit comfortably with what i saw. I think the way the game panned out yesterday bears that out. In truth the first half yesterday was every bit as competitive as plenty of games we had against the top sides under Dyche. The difference was the way we capitulated in the second half.

I understand the frustration and disappointment this season - and share it. It has been a bit of a disaster, and the level of inexperience signed, and the emphasis on lightweight creative players over a strong base, has set the team up to failas AG said. But right now the club can either pull together or it can collapse. I think Kompany has got to stop setting teams up with 2 players on the pitch that do not defend (the absence of cover was exposed for each of the first 3 goals yesterday) and I think he needs to get a bit more character on the pitch too. But I think the supporters need to find a way - despite the disappointment of a disastrous season - to give the club the benefit of the doubt as to what the long term plan is. I'm not sure what the alternative is.

[Goliath]

Personally don’t think the constant criticism of individual players is helpful and it’s probably unfair. There were ironic cheers when Ramsey completed a pass in the second half, just before he went off injured. How does that help a young player?

The problem is the squad, not the individuals within it. We’ve brought in a load of young, technical footballers in the belief that they’d overcome their lack of experience of professional football and the exacting standards of the Premier League. We’ve then compounded that by leaving ourselves short in key areas.

It’s no wonder they often look naive and games get away from them quickly. There’s not enough leadership or experience on the pitch to knit consistent performances together. We therefore play in spells and never look more than 30 seconds from disaster, even when we’re having the better of the game.

I think we’ve set these lads up to fail. I suspect had some of them been brought into more balanced squads, they’d be showing their talent more consistently than they have managed for us this season.

True it doesnt help and isnt ideal but i wouldnt really criticise the fans too much for that. They have been incredibly patient for a team that have won 1 home game all season.

[burnleymik]

True it doesnt help and isnt ideal but i wouldnt really criticise the fans too much for that. They have been incredibly patient for a team that have won 1 home game all season.

This is a good point. There are not many fans bases that would still be onboard as much as ours is right now.

Let's stop this argument that it's about the PL being lightyears ahead of the Championship because in a sense the top 8 probably are, but the bottom 8, as a whole should still be competitive and fighting, even against the bigger teams.

VK has had luxuries Dyche could only have dreamed of with the financial backing and support he has had from the board.

The team selection, tactics and performances ultimately lie at his door and the fact that we don't seem to have progressed, as a unit, since last season is, again, on him.

I had big hopes for VK, think he is an incredibly intelligent bloke, but he just hasn't adapted at all. He keeps persisting with things that even Stevie Wonder can see hasn't and still won't work.

It was easy last season when it all clicked because he didn't have to adapt, he could stick solely to his principles and way of playing, but time after time this season, on games where it's clear we would struggle, he has carried on making mistake after mistake after mistake.

Recruitment. Team selection. Tactics. Getting the most out of the players on the pitch. The results. The home form of 1 win all season. It's all on VK and it really hasn't been good enough at all.

[Culmclaret]

I think we have been incredibly patient with him. Lots of slack cut in the expectation that things would get better and that even if we were relegated one could have confidence in next season. What we have had however is flatlining, bordering on deterioration, with a lack of intensity and fight which is unparalleled in my experience of watching the Clarets, with the possible exception of 85/86 and the Tommy Cavanagh reign

[BabylonClaret]

Let's be honest lads...we got promoted with a very very good Championship team with 100+ points.
The EPL is so much more demanding...our team now is akin to Ford Escorts and Vauxhall Vivas against Ferrari's and Lamborghini 's. You are just not going to get anything from the top 8.
Good performance's tho against Forest, Bournemouth,, Fulham, Palace Sheffield Utd, Luton Wolves and the like in the bottom 8...

We have definitely improved since Dyche ball, more attacking footy than ever... defensively still woeful, midfield all at sea really.
Got promoted a season too early. We have a mixed bag of good players yet to gel.
We have made some good buys and loans.
Odds massively against us but I've not given up hope yet.

This whole post is based on myth. Every point it utter rubbish.

EPL is so much more demanding?
Luton currently in 17th a point clear of 18th with a game in hand. Luton. The side that came up through the playoffs who were non league a few years ago and who were league 1 in 2020.

Definitely improved since dycheball
6 successive seasons in the pre.ier league vs the worst ever record we have had at this level

More attacking footy than ever
The worst attack in the league - lowest goals scored (and that includes putting 5 past a half arsed 10 man Sheffield) and less than our last relegation under 'Dycheball'

Good performances against Forest Biurnemouth Fulham Palace Sheff U Luton Wolves and the like
8 points from 9 games. And I would say Bournemouth and Palace were both poor. And Fulham at home was appalling.

Made some Good buys and loans
Berge, assignon, Fofana, yes. maybe O Shea and . The rest have been on the whole average to dire for what we paid.

We are abject.

[Enola Gay]

...We really need to start seeing some positive change, not for this season (that went ages ago) but to ready us for next. Carry on like this and things could get very ugly, very quickly. We surely can’t afford anything but a promotion push, next season

Absolutely this.

[IanMcL]

We need a Heaton in goal, for starters. A keeper who will dominate his back four by ensuring they do their job and know what that is. Trafford wouldn't know one end from the other. He has no presence. (Owiing to youth)

[Ric_C]

We need a Heaton in goal, for starters. A keeper who will dominate his back four by ensuring they do their job and know what that is. Trafford wouldn't know one end from the other. He has no presence. (Owiing to youth)

Everybody can see this, apart from VK it seems. It's one of the many things that are making me really question his judgement as a top manager

[IanMcL]

Everybody can see this, apart from VK it seems. It's one of the many things that are making me really question his judgement as a top manager

Sadly, ne too.
He was lucky to be able to pick up some decent players, he had witnessed first hand, for relative pennies. Coupled with the old guard and some excellent loans. We were a dazzle for much of the season (sometimes it was purgatory to watch, with a hundred passes from defender to defender)

The baby went out eith the loans snd the bathwater. Not least our Man of Bath, Ashley Barnes, whose influence in that front line, on all the youngsters, was plain to see.

As it says in the report, all the team bar one, has disappeared. The replacements had to learn. That takes time. There is no time in the Prem. That's why you start the ones who already know the moves.

This season we have signed talent without real experience and threw them all on. Different every week.

That xan only ve put down to a manager who has no fear of relegation. No one sticks to principles when they concede like we do - mostly gifts.

As for the goalkeeper. A decent young lad and athletic. Hardly a commanding Prem quality keeper and so slooowww....

He draws in a couple of theirs, which is the idea, however, he only has one outlet and he is rapidly being closed down. Pass out, pass back (only option) hoof.

Better to kick long with purpose - something else he has not yet mastered.

To not change him does neither the player nor the team, any good.

Rank poor management, for the whole season.

Improved value? Got to be joking.

[NewClaret]

Wonder what ours is? Ginormous squad! Soon find out mind...

£32m according to Spotrac (although they also think Reguilon plays for us so you have to deduct his wage). I never know how they know this stuff so its validity has to be questioned (e.g. Beyer is deffo not on £156k, for example) but it’s recognised as the most reliable salary data I think.

There’s then £4.4m on loan and we don’t know how much of that is being covered by the loaning clubs.

One things for sure, they won’t have been picking up many win bonus’ or a survival bonus.

https://www.spotrac.com/epl/burnley-fc/payroll/

[helmclaret]

I’d imagine the annual wage bill is closer to £50m.

Those figures look wrong. Beyer on £3k a week for a start…

[gandhisflipflop]

We were a Cornet sitter away from 1-1 weren't we?

Entirely different

Did you go? I did. I can assure you it was rank bad. It would have been an insult to league 2 sides

[gandhisflipflop]

It wasn’t.

Granted, it was garbage, but we had chances in that game.

You must have a short memory, it was awful.

[Claret Till I Die]

Did you go? I did. I can assure you it was rank bad. It would have been an insult to league 2 sides

Did you stay for the full game ?

[Westleigh]

but he put in the hard yards (and tackles) to allow the flair players to flourish. We are just too meek.

We can't afford a Rodri or Rice but these type of players are vital to the success City and Arsenal will have this season.

City miss Rodri more than they miss De Bruyne, I think stats have backed that up.

Where’s Colin Blant when you need him?

[gandhisflipflop]

Did you stay for the full game ?

Unfortunately

[xxmunkyennuixx]

It wasn’t a foul

Just got round to watching the lowlights again. Will always hold my hands up if I call it wrong. It was a foul, he catches Ramsey even though Ramsey has tried to avoid contact. It is the foot that didn't make contact with the ball that makes connection. If that's done to an Arsenal player, they would surround the ref and cards would definitely be shown. There would also be a response from the players in challenges.