I’m so sick of Kompany

[123EasyasBFC]

I think there are more we've made profits on. Pope for one. But we have made good buys who have been value for money like Tarkowski and Mee and in fact we could have cashed in on Tarkowski. Not many of the current squad meet those criterion. Not yet anyway.

No I know we have made profit on other players, this was just a list of our most expensive signings

[Newcastleclaret93]

The Southampton team doesn’t have more premier league experience than Norwich in it

Southampton are third in the championship for premier league experience. With over 100apps more than Norwich

Leicester are top by a mile. Leeds and Southampton are the closest to each other.

[123EasyasBFC]

Southampton are third in the championship for premier league experience. With over 100apps more than Norwich

Leicester are top by a mile. Leeds and Southampton are the closest to each other.

Are you going off appearances or amount of seasons spent in the premier league because I would argue Norwich with Gunn, Stacey, Duffy, Gibson, Hanley, McLean and Barnes have a lot more experience in the premier league than the Southampton squad does

[Newcastleclaret93]

Are you going off appearances or amount of seasons spent in the premier league because I would argue Norwich with Gunn, Stacey, Duffy, Gibson, Hanley, McLean and Barnes have a lot more experience in the premier league than the Southampton squad does

Appearances.

Realistically only Barnes and Duffy regular played in the prem out of that list (that’s not the right McLean that lad from what I can tell hasn’t played in the prem). I believe only them two have above 50 apps in the premier league.

Southampton have the following with over 70 apps at premier league level and nearly all of them regularly play this season:

McCarthy
Walker pieters
Jack Stephens
Bednerak
Armstrong
Fraser
(Special mention Brooks with over 60).
Armstrong
Adams

Then they also have 6 players with 30 or more apps.

[warksclaret]

For me he has been appalling. Coaching, set plays,defending,subs, team selection, man management,transfers, creating smoke screens at post match interviews to avoid the real issues, freezing out of players,underestimating the PL, player discipline (is it 7 red cards now). How has he survived. Even if we come straight back, will he have learned anything.AS a benchmark Edwards of Luton has got them to 25 Points (level with Forest), spent just £23m, and have a fighting chance of staying up. The guy has got off likely. We have been beaten twice by Bournemouth, Palace, Everton (3 times). We dont deserve to be playing PL football next year

[123EasyasBFC]

Appearances.

Realistically only Barnes and Duffy regular played in the prem out of that list (that’s not the right McLean that lad from what I can tell hasn’t played in the prem). I believe only them two have above 50 apps in the premier league.

Southampton have the following with over 70 apps at premier league level and nearly all of them regularly play this season:

McCarthy
Walker pieters
Jack Stephens
Bednerak
Armstrong
Fraser
(Special mention Brooks with over 60).
Armstrong
Adams

Then they also have 6 players with 30 or more apps.

Kenny McLean?

Hanley, Gibson and Stacey have as much experience as stephens, Adam Armstrong, McCarthy doesn’t play for them.

We have options on brownhill and JBG, nothing to say we won’t offer Taylor a new deal that’s 3 straight away who could stay next season then you have Redmond with lots of experience, Berge if he stays and then the players who have the last 12 months

[123EasyasBFC]

This has gone off on a massive tangent like the threads do but ultimately the experienced players obviously had an impact last season like you’d expect them to do but I really can’t get on bored with the idea that it was dyche ethos and imprint that is the main element without giving kompany the credit. Next season shouldn’t determine whether kompany gets credit for last season. Kompany and co rightly should be criticised for this season and he is the luckiest manager in the league to still be in a job

[ClaretLoup]

I find myself in broad agreement with WarksClaret. Oddly we have only been doubled by the top four (so far) but our undoing has been the three doubles mentioned by Warks, six games where we only managed one goal and conceded 12. It was imperative not to lose against teams like Palace and Everton but the reality was they had to do very little to beat us and there were red cards in two of those games. Six draws vs Everton Cherries and Palace would have seen us on 25 points and Everton and Palace just one or two points away.

Kompany has been unable to galvanise the team defensively in key matches and too many times we have been powder puff up front as well.

[Cooclaret]

You have to be kidding, your putting last seasons promotion on dyches ethos? Key players last season muric, Beyer, Maatsen, Cullen, brownhill, benson and Barnes. I understand you aren’t a fan of kompany but you cannot think last season was down to the existing players ethos, cork and roberts barely featured under dyche in his last season

To be fair, ethos and culture affect the players away from the games mostly. The 90 minutes played is down to the current manager. You can safely say that the work rate is no where near a Dyche team.

So yeah I can see Newcastle’s point! The training ground, the staff, the day in day out business as usual could well be still Dycheish. Add to that established players such as Cork and Taylor driving the changing room and it’s a valid thought process.

[123EasyasBFC]

To be fair, ethos and culture affect the players away from the games mostly. The 90 minutes played is down to the current manager. You can safely say that the work rate is no where near a Dyche team.

So yeah I can see Newcastle’s point! The training ground, the staff, the day in day out business as usual could well be still Dycheish. Add to that established players such as Cork and Taylor driving the changing room and it’s a valid thought process.

I don’t think work rate is a problem at all, I would imagine running stats aren’t much different and it’s not a lack of effort, especially not in last 5 games, we just aren’t good enough at the back and clinical enough up top.

I certainly wouldn’t put Taylor as driving the dressing room, one of the quieter senior players

[Cooclaret]

Even if next season doesn’t work that has nothing to do with dyche imprint

Peacock-Farrell - never played under dyche
Roberts - dyche preferred lowton
Lowton - left and went to Huddersfield
Taylor.- correct will of been good around the squad last season
Cork - didn’t feature for dyche for a good part of 18 months
Brownhill - played in a completely different position last season to dyche
JBG - had he best season for a long time last season injury record wise
Barnes - from MTB clear the impact he had at the club
Jay Rod - another good pro to have

That’s 8 players at the club day in day out from the dyche error, we signed 17 players, last season was a fresh start you have to give kompany the credit for that

So who out of the new players, came in and told JRod, Brownhill, Cork, Taylor, JBG etc where to stick their noses/ideas as they’re doing their way?!

Nine years leaves an imprint across the whole club, not just the playing staff but everyone, and everything.

I wouldn’t be surprised to start hearing about the players disagreements with the coaching staff/methods soon.

[123EasyasBFC]

I find myself in broad agreement with WarksClaret. Oddly we have only been doubled by the top four (so far) but our undoing has been the three doubles mentioned by Warks, six games where we only managed one goal and conceded 12. It was imperative not to lose against teams like Palace and Everton but the reality was they had to do very little to beat us and there were red cards in two of those games. Six draws vs Everton Cherries and Palace would have seen us on 25 points and Everton and Palace just one or two points away.

Kompany has been unable to galvanise the team defensively in key matches and too many times we have been powder puff up front as well.

The lack of draws has been a massive issue, one thing we managed last season was to get draws all be it in a lower division

[Cooclaret]

I don’t think work rate is a problem at all, I would imagine running stats aren’t much different and it’s not a lack of effort, especially not in last 5 games, we just aren’t good enough at the back and clinical enough up top.

I certainly wouldn’t put Taylor as driving the dressing room, one of the quieter senior players

Quiet is an underrated value. There’s a place for all kinds of leadership in a high performance group.

Like all stats, they say what you want them to say, and can be made to support almost all arguments.

[123EasyasBFC]

So who out of the new players, came in and told JRod, Brownhill, Cork, Taylor, JBG etc where to stick their noses/ideas as they’re doing their way?!

Nine years leaves an imprint across the whole club, not just the playing staff but everyone, and everything.

I wouldn’t be surprised to start hearing about the players disagreements with the coaching staff/methods soon.

Where an earth are you getting that the new players would tell senior places to stick their ideas, the point was as a collective 17 new players with 8 existing players and whole new coaching staff clearly created an ethos and mentality which helped by not losing games.

There’s already been plenty of rumours regarding unrest at the club

[Cooclaret]

I’m gonna only comment after we lose and demand the manager gets sacked, if we play well or get a positive result I won’t comment.

Easy this being a fan lark eh, only support when we don’t lose otherwise it’s burn everything to the ground and sack everyone!

Hard to comment consistently when you get banned for starting a Dyche out post way back in September/October…

[123EasyasBFC]

Quiet is an underrated value. There’s a place for all kinds of leadership in a high performance group.

Like all stats, they say what you want them to say, and can be made to support almost all arguments.

I just find it crazy how suddenly because this season has been as bad as it has people suddenly think last season was down to what dyche created and the players that stayed

[Cooclaret]

Where an earth are you getting that the new players would tell senior places to stick their ideas, the point was as a collective 17 new players with 8 existing players and whole new coaching staff clearly created an ethos and mentality which helped by not losing games.

There’s already been plenty of rumours regarding unrest at the club

That’s my point, none bar Cullen potentially could come in and start telling the senior pros what to do etc.

They don’t have any credit to spend in that regards. Those senior pros that owed the best parts of their careers and fortunes to Dyche will have been managed in his image and it would be incredibly naive to think that that didn’t rub off into their profession.

I think VK got lucky last year, he brought in some brilliant championship players, but they only worked because of the culture Dyche built.

Unrest is one thing, but the minute certain pros go, or sign elsewhere, I think the rumours become facts!

[123EasyasBFC]

That’s my point, none bar Cullen potentially could come in and start telling the senior pros what to do etc.

They don’t have any credit to spend in that regards. Those senior pros that owed the best parts of their careers and fortunes to Dyche will have been managed in his image and it would be incredibly naive to think that that didn’t rub off into their profession.

I think VK got lucky last year, he brought in some brilliant championship players, but they only worked because of the culture Dyche built.

Unrest is one thing, but the minute certain pros go, or sign elsewhere, I think the rumours become facts!

What an earth are you on about, kompany came in and clearly built his own ethos and togetherness. Where an earth are you you going with new players coming in and telling senior players what to do, what club would that happen in. You are arguing with yourself about that one.

It’s common knowledge that roberts didn’t get along with the dyche style. Cork and jay rod the relationship between the coaching staff and players disappeared in the last season. Jay Rod and Steve stone didn’t see eye to eye at all.

Kompany spent best part of 10 years at the highest performance level you can with top class infer-structure, I’m sure when kompany arrived and he spoke to the leadership group about ethos and mentality they came together as a collective, blending the old and new.

Taking parts of what dyche did at the club doesn’t mean dyche should take any form of credit for 100 points and winning the league

[Vegas Claret]

Southampton are third in the championship for premier league experience. With over 100apps more than Norwich

Leicester are top by a mile. Leeds and Southampton are the closest to each other.

what website are you looking at for this info ? I'd be interested in browsing !

[ksrclaret]

Just watching the highlights back now on MOTD and we are just an absolute car crash of a team. The players just cannot play like the manager asks, whatever that actually is. Every game is littered with tens and tens of errors. The manager's judgement is appalling.

[DCWat]

What Dyche did so well with us was to understand what he had available to him, identify and use those strengths to our advantage. Perhaps most of all, a positive result was the aim, sometimes at the expense of style.

Despite countless errors in possession, week after week of defensive mistakes, down right poor defending, overplaying, little in the way of chance creation, we’ve continued to persevere with an approach that simply isn’t yielding results.

Kompany has a plan of how he wants to play, I get that, and a part of me commends him for sticking by his principles. At the end of the day though, it’s a results business, there are bigger things as stake than just a relegation.

Today’s result was so, so predictable.

From before last season ended, we have royally ****** things up. We had months longer than most teams to begin our planning and recruitment.

How poor we have been this season will see most of those that we’ve spent a lot of money on, falling in value, not increasing as the model expects and requires.

Serious questions need to be asked, not just of Kompany and his team, but of the board. Their trust everything that Kompany does and wants approach shows a huge level of naivety and shows exactly why we need a football person on the board, alongside a manager that can learn to be pragmatic.

I hope that Kompany has learned and is continuing to learn, but there are still too many worrying signs to suggest that this might not be the case.

We have a massive summer ahead of us. Mistakes like last summer and I worry where it might leave the club.

[Carlos the Great]

The problem with people suggesting Kompany is learning is if you asked Kompany …he has nothing to learn,,, but it’s the players who need to learn .. He always says we are a young team of players and seems to exonerate himself from this learning curve giving himself almost God like status

[CoolClaret]

The problem with people suggesting Kompany is learning is if you asked Kompany …he has nothing to learn,,, but it’s the players who need to learn .. He always says we are a young team of players and seems to exonerate himself from this learning curve giving himself almost God like status

It is a bit of a cop out isn't it? Like, they're your players VK and your big signings have not paid off one jot.

You're not gonna get a good ROI but I'm damn sure we could have signed one or two players north of 25 that have notched up 250+ appearances in the top leagues in Europe, wages included for the outlay of a Ramsey/Traff/Amdouni/Tresor.

[Vim Fuego]

Kompany has had a shocker this season. So many strange and/or poor decisions. This relegation is on him. We had a great chance to consolidate at this level on the back of last season and we could not have got it more wrong in so many ways

How can he not see things that to most of us are obvious ?

He is not learning at all. He has just looked stubborn

[nyclaret]

It may sound harsh but I honestly couldn’t care less if we win every single game. He’s not a manager I want anywhere near this club

Such an embarrassing comment.

[Dark Cloud]

He looked every bit a genius this time last season, especially when it came to blending experienced Dyche signings with new unheralded players from lower leagues abroad. Unfortunately he's taken that "model" too far and got the balance all wrong and the much greater rigours of the PL have come to bite him in the backside big style. He's then made strange decisions regarding tactics, selection, formation and most baffling of all substitutions which have all highlighted his naivety and shortcomings, including a degree of arrogance and stubbornness. I'd definitely stick with him despite this as he's our best chance in the championship, but he's definitely got to evolve as a manager.

[Marvins Van]

I like him.

[Cooclaret]

I like him. Hard not to.

But I think CoolClaret has it on the nose; he would be better suited to a director of football role.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Such an embarrassing comment.

I find the people that defend VK more embarrassing tbh.

He’s a joke

[BigJay]

Its very concerning to say the least. The failure to build on last seasons success, a very poor summer transfer window, VKs stubbornness, and inability to make the necessary player changes and in-game tactics...all very worrying. The naivety isn't just with Kompany, it's our board who gave him fake god-like status after last season. We're now facing almost certain relegation, yet another mass clear out and more uncertainty whether we'll be good enough to get back up next season. VKs slowness to adapt and his game management are highly questionable and extremely frustrating. He will get another shot in the championship next season, but if we have a poor start and are well off the pace by Xmas, then it will be time for him to go. I too, am fed up of his post match press conferences and baffling in game tactics, but we will stick with him I think.

[jojomk1]

The naivety isn't just with Kompany, it's our board who gave him fake god-like status after last season.

As they did with Dyche when they first came into the club
Always remember one of the first statements from Pace that he wanted Dyche to stay at the club for 25 years - he later reduced that to 10 years in another interview

After last season Kompany knew he had Pace in his pocket and then baffled him further with science resulting in approval from AP to throw away circa £100m and a good chance of staying up this year

[Hibsclaret]

As one of Dyche’s biggest fans I watched the game on a stream yesterday and thought I would rather watch a team play with 63% possession than his team with 37% irrespective of the result. Everton were turgid in the first half and were gifted a goal. We were much better than them until the mistake which was a shame for the guy that helps us play in our expansive style.

Other factors in the game were that we had players playing out of position but are a much younger team with a higher ceiling. This to me is more progressive even if we have to go down to come back up, There is no doubt Kompany has made mistakes but if he learns from them we have a lot to look forward to and I’d much rather compete with teams without relying solely on mistakes from the opposition and set pieces.

[ClaretDiver]

For me, the crux of the issue is Trafford and what was in his contract, seems suss that after so many games he is suddenly dropped for Muric….I believe he was forced to use Trafford and that is what screwed us

[MDWat]

What is 'the bigger picture'?

I thought it was staying in The Premier League. What is bigger then that (apart from staying in existence)?

Consistently playing in the Premier League.

There’s a lot of people suggesting that the players we’ve signed aren’t upgrades without any actual like for like comparison. If these players go into the Championship next season and don’t tear it up, then there’s a fair argument to be had. It’s comparison apples and donuts. Last season’s side could have got 50 points this season. They could have got 5. We’ll never know.

[quoonbeatz]

I do genuinely believe that last season was purely down to the ethos Dyche has imbedded in the key players in the squad.

This next season will be a true indicator. It may sound harsh but I honestly couldn’t care less if we win every single game. He’s not a manager I want anywhere near this club

"You eat pieces of sh¡t for breakfast?!"

[warksclaret]

For me, the crux of the issue is Trafford and what was in his contract, seems suss that after so many games he is suddenly dropped for Muric….I believe he was forced to use Trafford and that is what screwed us

You may have something there-time will tell. However if VK and the Board agreed to something on these lines, for a GK with no PL experience then they go down even further in my estimation.

[JR1882]

For me he has been appalling. Coaching, set plays,defending,subs, team selection, man management,transfers, creating smoke screens at post match interviews to avoid the real issues, freezing out of players,underestimating the PL, player discipline (is it 7 red cards now). How has he survived. Even if we come straight back, will he have learned anything.AS a benchmark Edwards of Luton has got them to 25 Points (level with Forest), spent just £23m, and have a fighting chance of staying up. The guy has got off likely. We have been beaten twice by Bournemouth, Palace, Everton (3 times). We dont deserve to be playing PL football next year

Good summary really - VK is getting away with murder still being in this job. It’s imperative he gets off to a strong start next year or the tide may well turn. He won’t be afforded the patience he got last season, mine has well and truly expired as I’m sure many others has.

[Clovius Boofus]

This next season will be a true indicator. It may sound harsh but I honestly couldn’t care less if we win every single game. He’s not a manager I want anywhere near this club

You're all over this thread spouting your highly predictable tripe, but there was hardly a peep out of you for a couple of weeks when we hit a bit of decent form. You were the same under Dyche, and it will be no different when VK leaves and the next manager comes in.

There's constructive criticism to be found on this thread, however it's a pity that we have to scroll through your persistent claptrap in order to find it.

[JohnMcGreal]

you don't get over 100 points in the Championship if you are a bad manager or are you suggesting a 46 game season was down to luck ?

He might not have made 100 points but didn't Roy Keane have a similarly impressive Championship title win in his first season as a manager in England? That season at Sunderland turned out to be the high water mark of his career. He's probably spent more years as a full time pundit than he has as a manager now.

It's an interesting comparison really as both Keane and Kompany were captains of multi PL title winning teams in Manchester, huge personalities and PL legends. Both had very impressive first seasons in the Championship that ended with title wins.

Keane's career petered out from there and I hope that's were the similarities end.

[daveisaclaret]

I'm still surprised by the number of people who want to retain Kompany but let him go if we have a poor start next season. This summer is going to have as much turnover as the previous two because that's what he believes in and Pace is in lockstep behind him. If it goes as badly as last summer not only is it dangerous for the club, it's something a change of manager won't be able to rectify quickly.

[getbennyon]

The damage has been done.

The financial ramifications from this season's disastrous campaign have not even remotely been felt yet...

[CoolClaret]

You're all over this thread spouting your highly predictable tripe, but there was hardly a peep out of you for a couple of weeks when we hit a bit of decent form. You were the same under Dyche, and it will be no different when VK leaves and the next manager comes in.

There's constructive criticism to be found on this thread, however it's a pity that we have to scroll through your persistent claptrap in order to find it.

Agreed.

I thought he was one that got banned but nah, one loss and he's in posting all night about how VK is the worst thing to ever happen to the club.

Tiresome.

[claptrappers_union]

He's used Burnley to showcase his style of play to the detriment of our position.

Throughout the season, he put specific individuals before the good of the club, which is a business decision and not a footballing decision. Now individual errors are costing us points and the attention is diverted onto them when it's been him all along.

What a mess.

[Colburn_Claret]

We could have played well and been relegated anyway.
There have been plenty of errors, the only criticism I'd throw at Kompany is stubbornness. He's changed things too late throughout the season, and during matches.
We also haven't had a scent of luck all season, be it fixture list, injuries, VAR.
I honestly believe we have a better squad now than when we last went down, and the blocks are in place for us to push onwards and upwards. That wasn't the case last time, we were in danger of free fall.

VK will learn from this season, and I can't wait for next season. I just wish this one was over already.

UTC

[Clovius Boofus]

The damage has been done.

The financial ramifications from this season's disastrous campaign have not even remotely been felt yet...

TBF, the financial ramifications started well before VK walked through the door.

[warksclaret]

He might not have made 100 points but didn't Roy Keane have a similarly impressive Championship title win in his first season as a manager in England? That season at Sunderland turned out to be the high water mark of his career. He's probably spent more years as a full time pundit than he has as a manager now.

It's an interesting comparison really as both Keane and Kompany were captains of multi PL title winning teams in Manchester, huge personalities and PL legends. Both had very impressive first seasons in the Championship that ended with title wins.

Keane's career petered out from there and I hope that's were the similarities end.

Very good observation JM. I am in the camp that thinks VK's pride, after a fantastic season last year, may not recover to deliver another outstanding season, and he may have lost the trust and belief of the players that remain. Plus he appears to be surrounded by yes men. Who else would player Foster on the wing and not be challenged, when we have bucket loads of wide men, and we needed literally 6 wins to stay up. He has both Fofana AND Foster fit , whats wrong in playing both in a good old fashioned 442 or failing that in a 4411 with Foster getting the previous Amdouini role. It served SD well for 5 or 6 seasons.In the build up do both Bellamy and Jackson not say "I feel we would be more dangerous keeping Odobert wide, and having a go with Foster/Fofana pressing Tarks and Braithwaite". I think if we collapse in the next 6 games or so the Board need to make a decision at season end before we dig ourselves a bigger hole. One indication of morale in the camp is whether Taylor or Brownhill want to stay. I guess we will soon find out

[Clovius Boofus]

I thought our setup was working until moments before HT. We were by far the most threatening team on the pitch.

[Clovius Boofus]

And it couldn't have come at a worse time - the home support was on their backs.

[taio]

We were the better side in first half. Muric's huge error obviously changed the game, not helped by O'Shea that followed.

[Elizabeth]

A self inflicted body blow and wasted opportunity yesterday but I'm sticking with supporting the manager for continuity reasons .He's performed as poorly this season as any Burnley manager I can remember in my 60+ years of being a Claret fan and I completely understand so many wanting him sacked.