Nottingham Forest tweet

[claptrappers_union]

Nottm Forest has requested that the VAR audio from the three key incidents be released to the public...

In my opinion, the audio should be released for all games anyway, at least made available to the club officials for clarification and education.

[spt_claret]

It’s absolutely about time clubs started being more forthright and vocal about some of the staggering decisions that are being made.

Agreed.

I know it's Forest, they're our relegation rivals, they've played financial games, they've been hypocritical given the atrocious officiating in our game vs them, but refereeing in the PL is consistently inconsistent. Consistently bad. And some referees' consistent inconsistency does, from the outside, have a pattern.

The PL is the most lucrative sports league in the entire world, money corrupts, other football leagues have had scandals involving officials, and ALL human beings are incredibly vulnerable to both conscious and unconscious biases, as well as authority/peer pressure to arrive at the incorrect answer to black-and-white, obvious, low-stakes questions. It's entirely reasonable at this point, after so many incidents for so many years, to ask questions as to whether all those biases are being accounted for and normalised out. VAR is a scapegoat to deflect the issue onto technology or the process, but the issue is human. The season pre-VAR we were adjudicated to be the 2nd biggest beneficiaries of points changes with VAR, look what changed once it came in- nothing.

Even something as simple as having referees interviewed to explain their decisions after a game would go a long way to restoring trust. There's just no accountability as it stands no matter how many mistakes are made.

[bobinho]

Jamie Carragher (the spitter) reckons this is a lack of class by forest….

How low down does a club have to be, that the likes of Carragher is looking down on them?

[pushpinpussy]

Nottm Forest has requested that the VAR audio from the three key incidents be released to the public...

In my opinion, the audio should be released for all games anyway, at least made available to the club officials for clarification and education.

and so they should. will be interesting they got robbed.

[claptrappers_union]

I watched the best bits of Mark Goldbridge's watch-a-long of the Manchester United v Coventry match on YouTube and made a great point regarding the handball.

In the Chelsea v Man City game, the ball struck Jack Grealish from 10 yards away. It deflected off his outstretched arm as he jumped defending a freekick and went out of play, and Chelsea didn't even get a corner.

-No Penalty

In the Coventry v Man Utd game the next day, Arron Wan-Bisaka handles the ball after being hit by a close-range cross after it loops over his body, and he turns towards the attacker.

-Penalty Awarded

The same competition, same round, and same venue — different outcomes with the luxury of VAR helping the officials make the correct calls

By the way, he believes both should've been penalties.

[vinrogue]

How far back in Ref blunders do we go? ROI v France for a place in the WC? 1966 ball over the line or Forest v Burnley this season? The problem in my eyes is when do we reset and how to we simplify the rules to make decisions easier e.g make offside when there is a clear gap between the two players involved be that arm head or leg, thus if there isn't a gap he is onside, if there is a gap offside.

[Rileybobs]

How far back in Ref blunders do we go? ROI v France for a place in the WC? 1966 ball over the line or Forest v Burnley this season? The problem in my eyes is when do we reset and how to we simplify the rules to make decisions easier e.g make offside when there is a clear gap between the two players involved be that arm head or leg, thus if there isn't a gap he is onside, if there is a gap offside.

The last thing we need is even more ambiguity in the laws, like the ridiculous t-shirt line for handballs. How does a clear gap work? Could a players be stood 3 yards offside with his leg extended back which overlaps with a defender leg that is extended forward? Imagine the comedy watching a VAR zoom into an image to try and find a slither of daylight between two players. What if more than 2 players are involved? Not to mention we would then need a camera at pitch level and trained to run level with the last man. It just wouldn’t work.

Next season’s changes sound encouraging by using AI to semi-automate the process. No doubt we’ll see teething problems though. We will still get the frustration of ‘level’ goals being disallowed but at least the human element will be taken out of the kick point of the ball and the line generated on the pitch.

[kentonclaret]

It is perhaps somewhat ironic, that Nottingham Forest would not even be in the Premier League were it not for Huddersfield Town being denied 2 clear penalties in their Wembley Play-Off Final.

[bumba]

I watched the best bits of Mark Goldbridge's watch-a-long of the Manchester United v Coventry match on YouTube and made a great point regarding the handball.

In the Chelsea v Man City game, the ball struck Jack Grealish from 10 yards away. It deflected off his outstretched arm as he jumped defending a freekick and went out of play, and Chelsea didn't even get a corner.

-No Penalty

In the Coventry v Man Utd game the next day, Arron Wan-Bisaka handles the ball after being hit by a close-range cross after it loops over his body, and he turns towards the attacker.

-Penalty Awarded

The same competition, same round, and same venue — different outcomes with the luxury of VAR helping the officials make the correct calls

By the way, he believes both should've been penalties.

Chelsea was a penalty but think Coventrys was harsh on Wan-Bissaka but couldn't have been happier at the time that it was given. Shame Coventry got robbed by VAR, we've nothing to fear next week

[jlup1980]

This whole affair is just unacceptable and embarrassing. I hope the officiating in their remaining games is purposely biased against them. Several clubs have had multiple shockers this season. Wolves probably lead the way but we're not far behind. It wouldn't be that bad if the three decisions were actually that bad. The first two aren't penalties. I don't know what they're moaning about. It just feels like a last throw of the dice by Forest. A desperate ploy to influence the officials in their remaining games. It's just not the way a club should act.

[Rowls]

Being able to see this sordid behaviour at a distance shows it up for what it is.

They might feel like they're doing something brave but surely 99% of fans can see how pathetic it makes Forest look.

Although I can say that I've never spouted an "anti-Burnley" conspiracy (although there certainly is a big club bias, but not because of any corruption) I do enjoy a good whinge when refereeing decisions go against us. However, I'll be doing thinking about Forest's toddlerism when we next have a decision go against us and trying not to fall into the same pettiness that they are rolling around in right now.

[Bosscat]

GLyCe4ZW0AEmCX1.jpeg (38.66 KiB) Viewed 4620 times

[Anonymous Claret]

Agreed.

I know it's Forest, they're our relegation rivals, they've played financial games, they've been hypocritical given the atrocious officiating in our game vs them, but refereeing in the PL is consistently inconsistent. Consistently bad. And some referees' consistent inconsistency does, from the outside, have a pattern.

The PL is the most lucrative sports league in the entire world, money corrupts, other football leagues have had scandals involving officials, and ALL human beings are incredibly vulnerable to both conscious and unconscious biases, as well as authority/peer pressure to arrive at the incorrect answer to black-and-white, obvious, low-stakes questions. It's entirely reasonable at this point, after so many incidents for so many years, to ask questions as to whether all those biases are being accounted for and normalised out. VAR is a scapegoat to deflect the issue onto technology or the process, but the issue is human. The season pre-VAR we were adjudicated to be the 2nd biggest beneficiaries of points changes with VAR, look what changed once it came in- nothing.

Even something as simple as having referees interviewed to explain their decisions after a game would go a long way to restoring trust. There's just no accountability as it stands no matter how many mistakes are made.

Great post. Most people seem to accept that FIFA are extremely corrupt or that there has been corruption in foreign leagues. Why do they think that both the PL as an organisation or at least some of its officials, especially referees are beyond corruption?

There are hundreds of millions if not billions of pounds at stake every season. There are lots of unscrupulous owners involved who will have trampled over countless people to achieve their power and increase their personal wealth. They will be used to getting their own way whatever it takes.

And then the people who officiate are paid peanuts in comparison. It doesn't need the whole organisation or every official to be corrupt it only needs 1 or 2 and that could make the difference to a team either staying up, winning the title or a Champions League place.

I agree that if refs are mic'd up as in rugby and they are made to face the cameras after a game and explain their decisions this would help fans trust them more.

[FCBurnley]

Maybe a name change to The Mafia League is in order

[CrosspoolClarets]

It is perhaps somewhat ironic, that Nottingham Forest would not even be in the Premier League were it not for Huddersfield Town being denied 2 clear penalties in their Wembley Play-Off Final.

And the owner then crowing about it from the City Hall balcony celebrations.

[123EasyasBFC]

Nottm Forest has requested that the VAR audio from the three key incidents be released to the public...

In my opinion, the audio should be released for all games anyway, at least made available to the club officials for clarification and education.

Released straight away to, not a month later when it has had time to be analysed and edited. It’s no coincidence that there hasn’t been a ‘match officials Mic’d up episode since the one at the end of Jan featuring the Burnley vs Luton Trafford incident

[Vegas Claret]

whoever did this deffo needs a prize
https://x.com/SSE_LTFC/status/1782504290860327273

just noticed it's Farley !

[FCBurnley]

Hope they get slapped with an extra deduction on Wednesday but no doubt it will be reduced as per Everton

[Boss Hogg]

Last throw of the dice and a pathetic attempt to influence future decisions imo. Look at the owner and his history. How far do we go back ? Do we look at all the appalling decisions that have been made this season for a number of clubs ? They benefitted from the ludicrous decision when we played them at their place.

[NewClaret]

Last throw of the dice and a pathetic attempt to influence future decisions imo. Look at the owner and his history. How far do we go back ? Do we look at all the appalling decisions that have been made this season for a number of clubs ? They benefitted from the ludicrous decision when we played them at their place.

Fairest possible outcome is to just replay this season next season with no VAR

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Forest may consider suing Sky/Gary Neville over the laters comments about Forests behaviour being like that of a Mafia gang

[Bosscat]

Forest may consider suing Sky/Gary Neville over the laters comments about Forests behaviour being like that of a Mafia gang

Oh yes please

[boatshed bill]

Yes, they may well have been robbed. But all they should expect is an apology, just like we got.

[Stproc]

Forest have a point as we know, that the officials treat the top and bottom clubs differently. We only have to look at the number of incidents involving us. I don’t think it’s corruption or cheating but it does look like institutional bias.
Forest have, however, given an abject lesson in how to go about it completely wrongly, but will it influence future on field decisions?

[claptrappers_union]

Forest have a point about about the poor decisions over the season

But questioning the integrity of one of the officials because he's apparently a Luton fan - thats out of order.

[warksclaret]

This might be a clever ploy by Forest ensuring if there are any 50/50 VAR decisions in their next 4 games, then they may get the benefit as the authorities will not want a repeat and further criticism. Forest will also know we play them in the final game, and that game could well be a decider of who goes down.

[Swizzlestick]

This might be a clever ploy by Forest ensuring if there are any 50/50 VAR decisions in their next 4 games, then they may get the benefit as the authorities will not want a repeat and further criticism. Forest will also know we play them in the final game, and that game could well be a decider of who goes down.

Or it could have the opposite effect - they've essentially accused a referee of being a cheat because of the team they support. I'm surprised how many are ok with this. Imagine a colleague being dragged through the mud like that publicly. They should have everything thrown at them. Gary Neville was absolutely correct in his summing up.

[RicardoMontalban]

This might be a clever ploy by Forest ensuring if there are any 50/50 VAR decisions in their next 4 games, then they may get the benefit as the authorities will not want a repeat and further criticism. Forest will also know we play them in the final game, and that game could well be a decider of who goes down.

Are we not in danger of overanalysing something that, in reality, was a massive strop by an oversized toddler? Imagining he’s somehow playing 4-D chess to influence refs to make bad decisions in Forest’s favour, is a little far fetched. What’s the consequence of that? The PGMOL are under enough pressure as it is, compounding it by giving some dodgy calls to a team that have effectively called them cheats? Not even Lee Mason was that incompetent.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Forest have a point about about the poor decisions over the season

But questioning the integrity of one of the officials because he's apparently a Luton fan - thats out of order.

Agree. But still far less impact than poor decisions we have had. If you look at any Forest fan’s bad decisions lists and ours, no comparison. I can easily get to 15 points affected for us, maybe more. That’s just for stuff where pundits all agree.

In terms of subconscious impact though to reflect on what other posters are writing, more likely the refs just want rid of Forest from the league. They don’t want their integrity challenging next year as well. It’ll be subconscious, but it could backfire.

[Bullabill]

Forest will also know we play them in the final game, and that game could well be a decider of who goes down.

Who told 'em?

[Vegas Claret]

Notice how Forest, the only club to employ someone to talk directly to the PGMOL (put them under pressure) are the ones claiming things are corrupt.......

[gsyclaret]

Sky sports news about to reveal latest new on this

[Bosscat]

Stuart Attewell a Notts County Fan apparently

GLydhkKXAAA1gfy.jpeg (11.15 KiB) Viewed 3078 times

[PremierLeagueClass]

David Coote, a Notts County fan that is not allowed to referee any games involving Nottingham Forest is in charge of Luton’s trip to Wolves on Saturday…

[THEWELLERNUT70]

Rumour has it the 3rd forest penalty claim's audio is mysteriously missing, this could open up a can of worms

[Bosscat]

Breaking News:

It has been revealed that Simon Hooper, the referee for Saturday’s game between Nottingham Forest and Manchester City used to own a Luton van. The Forest hierarchy are said to be furious about a clear conflict of interest and are demanding that he is replaced.

[Chester Perry]

Breaking News:

It has been revealed that Simon Hooper, the referee for Saturday’s game between Nottingham Forest and Manchester City used to own a Luton van. The Forest hierarchy are said to be furious about a clear conflict of interest and are demanding that he is replaced.

I am a little surprised that they haven't requested that the remaining Premier League fixtures be staggered to allow Mark Clattenburg take adjudicatory charge of all matches, in real time from the yacht of Evangelos Marinakis ('Amore Mio 2').

[elwaclaret]

Breaking News:

It has been revealed that Simon Hooper, the referee for Saturday’s game between Nottingham Forest and Manchester City used to own a Luton van. The Forest hierarchy are said to be furious about a clear conflict of interest and are demanding that he is replaced.

I believe Chelsea have also asked for Sunday’s referee to be challenged… while holidaying in Spain he enjoyed time at his Villa.
Bloody corruption everywhere.

[IanMcL]

Who told 'em?

Probably Captain Mainwaring let it slip.

[dsr]

Breaking News:

It has been revealed that Simon Hooper, the referee for Saturday’s game between Nottingham Forest and Manchester City used to own a Luton van. The Forest hierarchy are said to be furious about a clear conflict of interest and are demanding that he is replaced.

I think one of the linesmen is also suspect because he was once seen sucking Everton mints.

[clarethomer]

https://x.com/nffc_epl/status/178324631 ... 7GxGzXZPSg

I’ve no idea why this goal was disallowed- Atwell involved again for this.

[AlargeClaret]

I’d imagine every club in the prem could pull out a very strong 4/5 decisions that went against them . What about dodgy fouls given / not given due to blatant cheating that then lead ( or not ) to a goal ? It goes on and on . Minor errors will always happen in football and it’s what makes the game what it is . As the cliche goes “ these things even out over a season “ .

[PremierLeagueClass]

I mean, they should have twigged something wasn’t quite right with Atwell years ago after the infamous ghost goal.

[MrTopTier]

Another rumour from today doing the rounds is that they have requested that Carragher and Neville shouldn’t be at the game.

That’s something I can get behind them on

[beddie]

Forest have now accepted an offer from the PGMOL to listen to the VAR audio linked to the three penalty claims, it will be heard in private.

[Rileybobs]

https://x.com/nffc_epl/status/178324631 ... 7GxGzXZPSg

I’ve no idea why this goal was disallowed- Atwell involved again for this.

This is suspicious. Looks like Atwell is trying a bit too hard to prove that he’s not corrupt, just really bad at his job.

[clarets1978]

Forest have now accepted an offer from the PGMOL to listen to the VAR audio linked to the three penalty claims, it will be heard in private.

So when they've heard these recordings and the explanations of why they werent given, does that mean they'll apologise. I wouldnt have let them listen to anything without a retraction of that statement....If they're questioning the integrity of officials they really should resign from the league because they clearly have no trust in the way the rules are implemented in games

[Hipper]

Coventry get a penalty against Man Utd. I notice no one is complaining about this as 'big club bias'. And it was our friend Rob Jones.

I used to referee at park level and I wasn't biased. In fact I was often told this. That doesn't mean I didn't make mistakes. Of course I did and I have no obvious reason why I did in some cases. It just happened and you move on.

The idea of interrogating (because that's what it is) referees after each game is unreasonable. We don't do that to managers - VK and his baffling line ups and substitutions - or players - Muric and his cock ups. They are answerable to their employers and if you believe the whole business, or a selection of referees, are corrupt, cheats etc. why on earth do you bother watching football. You might as watch wrestling.

[Chester Perry]

While much of this attitude is known to Burnley fans it may surprise those of many other clubs - a lot of this has been know for a long time and yet this man was and is deemed fit and proper to own and be a director of football clubs by the games authorities both here and internationally - that has to change

from The Times

Evangelos Marinakis: friend to Greek ultras and scourge of referees
Nottingham Forest co-owner’s VAR fury was tame by the standards he has set at his other team, Olympiacos, in Greece, where violence and intimidation towards officials and opponents are rife
https://archive.ph/fdgCm

[Vegas Claret]