Is the Dyche/ Burnley
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
for me there is more yes for the players, pride being one, getting into the first team, player bonuses, being picked for your National team. All these contribute but the question I was trying to rationalize, was the question around where they (the fans) would like there team to be in numerous leagues.
I seriously don't believe we are playing for survival, I am confident that we will survive and therefore we are playing for other things, getting as high up the table as possible, 7th position is not out of the question, go on a second half run similar to last season for example. Yet none of these things will bring exciting football. If we were in the top six of the Championship it would, when playing similar football against teams less likely to hurt us, results would improve and being near the top brings the excitement. When I went to Wembley for the play off final that was the most exciting thing for me, better than when we won the league to go up.
I seriously don't believe we are playing for survival, I am confident that we will survive and therefore we are playing for other things, getting as high up the table as possible, 7th position is not out of the question, go on a second half run similar to last season for example. Yet none of these things will bring exciting football. If we were in the top six of the Championship it would, when playing similar football against teams less likely to hurt us, results would improve and being near the top brings the excitement. When I went to Wembley for the play off final that was the most exciting thing for me, better than when we won the league to go up.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Ah yes - that's that Sheff Utd mention again.... @Giftonsidea - what should Burnley's ambition be? Realistic like, in terms of spend capacity, size of club, attractiveness to players etc? Where would you expect the club to be, all things being equal?
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Well, Jack Cork covered the second most distance in the PL last season, so I suspect it was more recent than that.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 6:53 pmI don't wish to be over critical, but this gets my goat: "maximum effort is the minimum requirement", are we still getting this from the staff? When was the last time our pressing was shown as an example? When was the last time one of our players ran the furthest in a game (George Boyd?)?
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I’ve watched Burnley since 1991 when I was ten years old, this hoof ball is the worst style of football I have ever experienced as a burnley fan.dandeclaret wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:16 pmAh yes - that's that Sheff Utd mention again.... @Giftonsidea - what should Burnley's ambition be? Realistic like, in terms of spend capacity, size of club, attractiveness to players etc? Where would you expect the club to be, all things being equal?
I don’t really care about anything else I just want us to start playing entertaining football again.
I will be very happy when that day comes round again.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I hope so. We really do need that effort. Somehow I feel we've lost a bit of what we had a couple of seasons back. We certainly haven't improved as footballers since 7th place.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Good job you missed the eightiesGiftonsnoidea wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:19 pmI’ve watched Burnley since 1991 when I was ten years old, this hoof ball is the worst style of football I have ever experienced as a burnley fan.
I don’t really care about anything else I just want us to start playing entertaining football again.
I will be very happy when that day comes round again.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
The players have pride, they are 10th in the Premier League and looking to maintain their status as Premier League players once again - not to be underestimated. Many have pushed on to be internationals, if not regulars. That's very impressive.KateR wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:15 pmfor me there is more yes for the players, pride being one, getting into the first team, player bonuses, being picked for your National team. All these contribute but the question I was trying to rationalize, was the question around where they (the fans) would like there team to be in numerous leagues.
I seriously don't believe we are playing for survival, I am confident that we will survive and therefore we are playing for other things, getting as high up the table as possible, 7th position is not out of the question, go on a second half run similar to last season for example. Yet none of these things will bring exciting football. If we were in the top six of the Championship it would, when playing similar football against teams less likely to hurt us, results would improve and being near the top brings the excitement. When I went to Wembley for the play off final that was the most exciting thing for me, better than when we won the league to go up.
Single games are all well and good - Derby away in the Cup under Stan, Reading, Chelsea Away under Coyle and so on.... but many clubs have had those single results - I don't think they are that special. What the club is doing now is very special. Few clubs can compare - and that's why I think it's important to rationalise where all things being equal, Burnley would be in your opinion. It shines a different light on what is happening.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
And were too young to remember the Waddle season, and probably have blanked out the Cotterill era too. And to be honest, the slow, go nowhere, unfit football of Eddie Howe when at Burnley wasn't that palatable either.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Even if this mythical 'entertaining football' results in relegation from the Premier league? Would you care about that?Giftonsnoidea wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:19 pmI’ve watched Burnley since 1991 when I was ten years old, this hoof ball is the worst style of football I have ever experienced as a burnley fan.
I don’t really care about anything else I just want us to start playing entertaining football again.
I will be very happy when that day comes round again.
I honestly couldn't care less about our style of play, we defend well and make it hard for teams that have spent tens and sometimes hundreds of millions of pounds more than we have. We also have one of the best front two pairings in the Premier league as well as keeping a joint divisional high of SEVEN clean sheets!
Yeah it's proper shite watching Burnley isn't it.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Glen little in the waddle season was superb worth the admission fee just to watch him. Chris Waddle as sweeper not so muchdandeclaret wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:24 pmAnd were too young to remember the Waddle season, and probably have blanked out the Cotterill era too. And to be honest, the slow, go nowhere, unfit football of Eddie Howe when at Burnley wasn't that palatable either.
Cotterball was awful for sure, my dad stopped going because of him and he’d been a fan since the sixties.
Eddie Howe knows how to find a bargain and set up teams to attack his team here couldn’t defend for toffee, if him and Dyche got a management team together I could get behind that but that’s not going to happen.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
as much as I don't like our style of play one little bit I do believe that Dyche is still the right man for us if all we are interested in is staying in the Premier League., He is fighting with his arms tied behind his back in terms of squad quality and is a great ambassador for our club. He needs more help from the Board and the recruitment team more than anything.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
When I went to Spain many years ago, locals used to see my shirts and say.... Burnley, great team... Blacklaw, Cummings, Jimmy Mc.... the only problem was we are talking early 90’s.
We are back on the football world map....
Burnley has kudos. Burnley has knockers.... Burnley are being discussed.
Now that IS progress. Great times for the club, and I don’t think those behind it are done yet. I’ll wait patiently.
We are back on the football world map....
Burnley has kudos. Burnley has knockers.... Burnley are being discussed.
Now that IS progress. Great times for the club, and I don’t think those behind it are done yet. I’ll wait patiently.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I have that lost feeling of where you have completely misinterpreted my post, but you are not the first and wont be the lastdandeclaret wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:23 pmThe players have pride, they are 10th in the Premier League and looking to maintain their status as Premier League players once again - not to be underestimated. Many have pushed on to be internationals, if not regulars. That's very impressive.
Single games are all well and good - Derby away in the Cup under Stan, Reading, Chelsea Away under Coyle and so on.... but many clubs have had those single results - I don't think they are that special. What the club is doing now is very special. Few clubs can compare - and that's why I think it's important to rationalise where all things being equal, Burnley would be in your opinion. It shines a different light on what is happening.
They are not 10th but not going to quibble, I am happy where they are, I also think it is special and has been for a few years, however some performances are not good and while I like to spin with the best of them this is difficult to do. I am serious when I say our defense is one of the top six/seven in my opinion but midfield and attack is not, I really enjoyed watching Mee/Pope yesterday and the stats from yesterdays game were very misleading in some ways.
Single well played games are certainly important to me, even if they're not special to you they are to me, they also give me hope for future improvements.
I certainly am not in the SD out camp, in fact very opposed to that.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
We haven't improved for the last two years because we have totally failed to improve our starting 11 since that timeboatshed bill wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:21 pmI hope so. We really do need that effort. Somehow I feel we've lost a bit of what we had a couple of seasons back. We certainly haven't improved as footballers since 7th place.
Standing still in terms of first team recruitment means we are going backwards compared to other teams . Last season's position proved that and I don't see much chance of this year being any better (hopefully, no worse)
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Neither of Stokr and WBA made Europe and it was when they tried to play the same way as the top teams, that they came unstuck.
Everton has spent millions and millions, to reach the top 6 and made the bottom 3 as a consequence.
Not easy.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
The issue with recruitment is that if we are only looking at £10 - £15 million pound players who will accept £30 - £40k pw then we aren't likely to improve very much.jojomk1 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:36 pmWe haven't improved for the last two years because we have totally failed to improve our starting 11 since that time
Standing still in terms of first team recruitment means we are going backwards compared to other teams . Last season's position proved that and I don't see much chance of this year being any better (hopefully, no worse)
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
With all due respect, don't Bournemouth have a billionaire owner?Giftonsnoidea wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:11 pmI would expect both Dyche and Garlick to go in two years time when his contract is up.
Sean I’m afraid to say has run out of ideas style wise, our best midfielder has gone and the board (so far) have shown absolutely no ambition to replace the skill of Defour. Penny pinching has been our modus operandi since last season selling off assets instead of investing in the future.
If Hendrick goes we are in big trouble as we have no one to replace him. A lot of our good play has come from him and O’Neil this season.
We need someone in the mould of Chris Wilder who at least has some original ideas to at least attempt to play “some” pleasing on the eye football.
It also might be time for a Garlick to sell up or get an outside investor in who wants to keep us at this level. There’s been a lot of back sliding re: our ambition since we came seventh, like him saying staying up is all we’re planning for, very negative outlook I would say. A lot has changed in a season and half it seems.
And they are forever struggling, like us.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I am happy with him. But there are plenty of options out there.Jakubs Tash wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 12:01 pmTo all the (predictable) posters who aren't happy with Dyche, if he went today, who would you replace him with? Come on, name names...and be realistic.
Allardyce being the most obvious one.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
If being in the Prem means setting up and playing like we have done in the last few games then I'm not particularly bothered about staying up. It's soul destroying to watch.Braindead wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:26 pmEven if this mythical 'entertaining football' results in relegation from the Premier league? Would you care about that?
I honestly couldn't care less about our style of play, we defend well and make it hard for teams that have spent tens and sometimes hundreds of millions of pounds more than we have. We also have one of the best front two pairings in the Premier league as well as keeping a joint divisional high of SEVEN clean sheets!
Yeah it's proper shite watching Burnley isn't it.
Last edited by jrgbfc on Fri Dec 27, 2019 9:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I don't have a problem with us playing 'direct' football and staying-up, but why is the football so much worse than than two seasons ago? We would NEVER score that goal that we did against Everton with 20+ passes this year.
What's changed? We seem to have gone backwards
What's changed? We seem to have gone backwards
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I don't get why people think that it is only one way or the other.Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 3:18 pmI’m sure if we were playing free flowing football like Norwich and currently in the bottom 3 the posters who constantly give Dyche stick would of course be giving him their full backing and not demanding a new manager.
The core of our squad is fine. Only tweaks are needed. We can gradually progress. We don't have to ship 6 players out and bring in young prospects.
A new and 'different' right winger, right back and central midfielder would be fine!
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Some squads average age can increase at a higher rate than others though...boatshed bill wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 6:20 pmit's impossible to "rapidly age" everyone ages at the same speed...obvious!
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Of course there is!dandeclaret wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 6:57 pmBut they are playing for something. Premiership survival..... there's nothing else to play for in the league is there?
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Stoke got in Europe. They qualified from the group and got knocked out by Valencia 1-0 over two legs.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Yes we have. I have watched us go from the very top to the very bottom and back again. It was rough and the fabric of the club deteriorated and decayed, as did the team and the finances.
Our team would go and so would the finances, very quickly. Then we would be back to our minuscule turnover on a £12-£14k crowd and no big TV supplement....with no big backers.
Not a pretty sight!
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Agree, but having the advantage of eating chips on a Tuesday night outside Rotherhams and York's ground with hardcore fans.IanMcL wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:05 pmYes we have. I have watched us go from the very top to the very bottom and back again. It was rough and the fabric of the club deteriorated and decayed, as did the team and the finances.
Our team would go and so would the finances, very quickly. Then we would be back to our minuscule turnover on a £12-£14k crowd and no big TV supplement....with no big backers.
Not a pretty sight!
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Why do Stoke keep getting brought up on these types of threads??
You do realise they got shut of Pulis and went onto finish at their highest position (9th) 3 years on the trot and then a 13th place the year after (only 1 win behind Pulis best points tally)
You do realise they got shut of Pulis and went onto finish at their highest position (9th) 3 years on the trot and then a 13th place the year after (only 1 win behind Pulis best points tally)
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
We do seem to have moved from what Dyche has always referred to as mixed football, to a much more direct style of play, which isn’t great on the eye.
We can play some decent stuff and hopefully we will be getting back to that pretty quickly.
We can play some decent stuff and hopefully we will be getting back to that pretty quickly.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Really?Giftonsnoidea wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:19 pmI’ve watched Burnley since 1991 when I was ten years old, this hoof ball is the worst style of football I have ever experienced as a burnley fan.
I don’t really care about anything else I just want us to start playing entertaining football again.
I will be very happy when that day comes round again.
Cotterill in the latter 18 months? The turgid non-defending of Howe in the last 6 months?
Dande is absolutely spot on. He's honest here in that he says he wouidn't like the style (although I maintain we're direct and pragmatic rather than a hoofball team - whatever that means - and capable of playing neat tidy football as well as hitting longer percentage balls) and yet he's still saying this is the best it's been as a Burnley fan for a long time.
Even the dullest of game at this level is streets ahead of the average Championship game - don't get all rosy tinted or misty eyed avoer the brilliance of the Championship - it's a massive slog and whilst I don't doubt this side we have now would be top 3 comfortably and we'd have a lot more to cheer, the quality of a lot of the games would be worse.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Allardycecricketfieldclarets wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 8:41 pmI am happy with him. But there are plenty of options out there.
Allardyce being the most obvious one.
Oh I do hope you are attempting humour with that one CFC.
.................................
In reply to the ones who want tippy tappy ticka tacka ... how long before after getting d1cked 4-0 (or worse) each week would you be demanding Sean Dyches style of defending back... Not bloody Long I can tell you.
Last edited by Bosscat on Sat Dec 28, 2019 12:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
its great that we have reached the premier league and managed to stay there, but pointless if the best manager we've had has to continually work with little in the way of resources.
I can understand the reluctance splash out cash after the first season, but not every time.
Think about it, put pep, or klopp in charge of a club and expect them to succeed on the money we pay, just wouldn't work.
Somehow dyche is meant to work minor miracles each season, and if it looks ugly, or we lose to multi billionaire clubs, that's his fault !!
Modern football has become more about the battles in the boardrooms than on the pitch.
If we cant see how much of a talent dyche is by now, then we are clowns, and don't deserve top flight football.
Imagine if a club were prepared to lob a few million his way and allow him to do more than just shore things up every week.That hasn't happened, and we are still coping.If I were him, I would say enough is enough and go where I was more appreciated.
The fact we gave him a job and paid him well is irrelevant when the bigger picture is success for the club long term.
I can understand the reluctance splash out cash after the first season, but not every time.
Think about it, put pep, or klopp in charge of a club and expect them to succeed on the money we pay, just wouldn't work.
Somehow dyche is meant to work minor miracles each season, and if it looks ugly, or we lose to multi billionaire clubs, that's his fault !!
Modern football has become more about the battles in the boardrooms than on the pitch.
If we cant see how much of a talent dyche is by now, then we are clowns, and don't deserve top flight football.
Imagine if a club were prepared to lob a few million his way and allow him to do more than just shore things up every week.That hasn't happened, and we are still coping.If I were him, I would say enough is enough and go where I was more appreciated.
The fact we gave him a job and paid him well is irrelevant when the bigger picture is success for the club long term.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Why?
He geta results. But not at the expense of playing some good football.
Like Dyche he definitely plays to hia strengths. And would be foolish not to. But this is a man who signed the likes of Anelka, okocha, Djorkaeff etc
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Id have taken 4 at spurs...Bosscat wrote: ↑Sat Dec 28, 2019 12:45 pmAllardyce
Oh I do hope you are attempting humour with that one CFC.
.................................
In reply to the ones who want tippy tappy ticka tacka ... how long before after getting d1cked 4-0 (or worse) each week would you be demanding Sean Dyches style of defending back... Not bloody Long I can tell you.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
Not sure about that, where is the pride in time wasting from minute 1? pride in being out footballed twice a season by lower league teams? Proud about playing the worst style of play the Premier League has ever seen?
Is there really much pride in scraping survival yearly while boring millions of football fans in the process? I like the song “no1 likes us” and it’s true, why would anyone outside of Burnley like us? People are quick to cry about lack of TV games and media not obsessing over us, they can’t wait for us to disappear so they don’t have to cover our boring team.
it’s a real shame the ugly club we’ve become, we sold our soul to milk the Premier League cash cow and for what? We aren’t looking to reinvest or improve, just float around like a bad smell for as long as we linger.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I keep hearing about hoof ball & how other teams play great football yet look at the stats, most of their play is in their own half & I can think of nothing worse the tippy tap passing of 50 passes or so without the type of football that gets people on their seats which is a ball in the opponents box. We have fans on here who listen to the so called experts & ex managers who are not good enough to be a manager or keep their jobs & play football games on play station etc. Our whole strategy is to stay in the prem, it’s about massing 36/38 or the eureka of 40 points, you only have to look at Bournemouth who could not fight their way out of a paper bag & are in debt that is terrifying. Then again I wonder how many of our so called experts would still be on the Turf if we were relegated or were on before these glory years. Dyche is shaping the club bit by bit & will improve the squad with foreigners & youth but its not easy when clubs throw 100’s of millions about.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
No one is expecting us to play like Barcelona. But I don't think its unrealistic for people to question why our tactics seem to have regressed to time wasting from minute one and playing for set pieces.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
We time waste when ahead or getting a valuable point, as does every single team in footballKRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Dec 28, 2019 12:56 pmNot sure about that, where is the pride in time wasting from minute 1? pride in being out footballed twice a season by lower league teams? Proud about playing the worst style of play the Premier League has ever seen?
Is there really much pride in scraping survival yearly while boring millions of football fans in the process? I like the song “no1 likes us” and it’s true, why would anyone outside of Burnley like us? People are quick to cry about lack of TV games and media not obsessing over us, they can’t wait for us to disappear so they don’t have to cover our boring team.
it’s a real shame the ugly club we’ve become, we sold our soul to milk the Premier League cash cow and for what? We aren’t looking to reinvest or improve, just float around like a bad smell for as long as we linger.
'Is there really much point in scraping survival' are you being serious? There are 70 clubs in this country who would gladly swap places with Burnley...given the size of our town and the lack of a billionaire owner, do you expect us to be pushing for top 4?
As for the worst syle of play the Premier league has ever seen dogshit, i assume you've got some stats to back this hysteria up with?
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
We waste time from minute 1, we have the last corner of the half and we are still wasting time?Braindead wrote: ↑Sat Dec 28, 2019 1:06 pmWe time waste when ahead or getting a valuable point, as does every single team in football
'Is there really much point in scraping survival' are you being serious? There are 70 clubs in this country who would gladly swap places with Burnley...given the size of our town and the lack of a billionaire owner, do you expect us to be pushing for top 4?
As for the worst syle of play the Premier league has ever seen dogshit, i assume you've got some stats to back this hysteria up with?
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I know quite a lot of Baggies. All I speak to are happy to be watching excitement in the Championship rather than turgid football in the PL. They all also wonder why on Earth we bought JRod back. And why Vydra is nowhere to be seen. And why Chris Wood gets a game.Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:41 amHow can you guarantee that? Ridiculous comment unless you’ve personally managed to canvass the views of every single West Brom fan.
And while many of you will laugh at them, I think we can all be fairly sure they will be in the PL next season, as a well run club, playing better football than us.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
seems a bit numb headed to drool over championship football rather than a league above. I read these sorts of comments and wonder if eventually supporters will ask if they can stay put even if they finish as champions in the second tier.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
I agree. There have been many times when the hoofing it long has clearly not been working and just puts us back under pressure as the ball comes straight back at us, but Dyche never seems to change it up, just more lump it and lose it. That is very frustrating.
Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
He's up bright and early today, I've just seen him in his Range Rover. It's easy to get accustomed to PL and demand that we are as good as the very best, it just proves half of Burnley still believes in Father Christmas.
Just to tread water in this league you've got to be an olympic swimmer, any season better than 18th is a good season, if messi came to play for free for sport for two years, AFTER HE LEFT what then????????????????
It's a constantly changing talent pool year on year, age and stuff and even the top teams can't get that right all the time, that's the context of the critique, Villa, Fulham etc.
Just to tread water in this league you've got to be an olympic swimmer, any season better than 18th is a good season, if messi came to play for free for sport for two years, AFTER HE LEFT what then????????????????
It's a constantly changing talent pool year on year, age and stuff and even the top teams can't get that right all the time, that's the context of the critique, Villa, Fulham etc.
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Re: Is the Dyche/ Burnley
funny how expectations change over time and how short memories are : first couple of years after promotion, all BFC fans were just very excited and privileged to be in Prem and any result was a massive bonus whatever the performance. Ask any fan in first yr back after 3 rd promotion if they would take us being in top half at chrimbo 2019 and they would have snapped your hand off. But now a few years on, fans are expecting us to play nice progressive football and beat top 6 teams. Deluded in my view. Just like Stoke and WBA fans.
We need to replace Bob Lord with new Dyche stand whilst we have the money and he can move on in the next year or two ; at least we will have more of a legacy in addition to new Training facilities and Royal Dyche pub.
In Dyche we trust.
We need to replace Bob Lord with new Dyche stand whilst we have the money and he can move on in the next year or two ; at least we will have more of a legacy in addition to new Training facilities and Royal Dyche pub.
In Dyche we trust.
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