Covid-19

[Gordaleman]

We don't panic about flu because it's not got an estimated IFR of 1%. If you can find me a government document or health secretary saying that a "reasonable worst case scenario" is 500,000 deaths for a flu season, let me know.

Or in your case because you're determined to ignore the science.

Panic, by the way, will do no good but lumping all concerns or action to mitigate the issue into the same category as 'panic' is idiotic.

And it's "annually", by the way. If you're going to use the word "exaggerate" in your response, I've given you the correct spelling of that, too.

That's it, if you want to bring a couple of typos into the discussion then I don't want to discuss the subject with you any more.

And before you come back and say that's the easy way out, it's not. I just don't like sarcasm being used in a serious discussion.

[thatdberight]

That's it, if you want to bring a couple of typos into the discussion then I don't want to discuss the subject with you any more.

And before you come back and say that's the easy way out, it's not. I just don't like sarcasm being used in a serious discussion.

That's the easy way out.

[Gordaleman]

That's the easy way out.

My last word on the subject.

I had an appointment this morning at Burnley General. The surgeon I spoke with said he believed that there had been a massive overreaction to Covid-19 and although he told me that the 'Trust' had instituted a policy of not shaking hands with patients, he gave me a good hand shake on my way out.

I also had a prescription to pick up at my local pharmacy and the pharmacist said exactly what I've been saying about Flu. "Why are people so concerned when we already have a virus that kills thousands every winter, but we don't appear concerned about that at all. Crazy in my opinion."

Two professionals with identical views.

[Clarinetclaret]

My last word on the subject.

I had an appointment this morning at Burnley General. The surgeon I spoke with said he believed that there had been a massive overreaction to Covid-19 and although he told me that the 'Trust' had instituted a policy of not shaking hands with patients, he gave me a good hand shake on my way out.

I also had a prescription to pick up at my local pharmacy and the pharmacist said exactly what I've been saying about Flu. "Why are people so concerned when we already have a virus that kills thousands every winter, but we don't appear concerned about that at all. Crazy in my opinion."

Two professionals with identical views.

Ah maybe COBRA should have talked to these experts rather than the amateurs they must be consulting with.
I'm pretty sure that they've consulted with people who are at the top in the medical and science professions. But I'll sleep easy knowing that you, a chemist and a doctor at Burnley General obviously know better than all the experts who the government talk to.
It may well die down but they are obviously prepared for the worse.
Oh and you're making yourself look a real Wally. A pharmacist at the chemist!

[Gordaleman]

Ah maybe COBRA should have talked to these experts rather than the amateurs they must be consulting with.
I'm pretty sure that they've consulted with people who are at the top in the medical and science professions. But I'll sleep easy knowing that you, a chemist and a doctor at Burnley General obviously know better than all the experts who the government talk to.
It may well die down but they are obviously prepared for the worse.
Oh and you're making yourself look a real Wally. A pharmacist at the chemist!

You panic pal, I'm sure it will do the world of good. Not. Panic is spreading 1,000 times faster than the virus. Don't go to the Spurs match will you? You'll probably have a heart attack by half time thinking about what MIGHT happen in the second half.

You're another that needs a nuclear bunker. Get yourself in there and never, ever come back out into this grossly infected world.

The rest of us will just get on with our lives thank you.

[thatdberight]

The head of the World Health Organization (WHO), Dr Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, says the new coronavirus "is a unique virus with unique features".

"This virus is not influenza. We have never before seen a pathogen that can transfer between individuals [so easily]."

"Containment of Covid-19 must remain the top priority for all countries," he says, adding that governments have "no choice but to act now".

Later, having spoken to an unnamed pharmacist in Burnley, Dr. Ghebreyesus added, "Actually, no. Scrap all that. I was talking through my arse. It's no worse than stubbing your toe to be honest."

[mdd2]

I assume Gordaleman saw a physician rather than a surgeon as the latter operate or decide not to and are not normally consulted on pneumonia, alveolitis or ARDS except the ENT surgeons who often do tracheostomies for patients on long term life support.
Most certainly a surgical opinion on Covid-19 would be about as much use as a virologist view on key hole surgery.

[Lowbankclaret]

The pattern of data I have observed in the previous countries is you get little spikes like the 13 Sunday. Then a few days low numbers like we see today 5, probably similar tomorrow and the next. Then you get another spike like a 20, then back to single figures for a few days. Building bigger in each phase.
Except for Singapore! Of course.

Let’s see how our country goes, but the genie is definitely out of the bottle.

[Zlatan]

It is getting serious now.

We’re off out shopping in a bit, going to stock up on plenty of the basics - rice; pasta; milk; flour; frozen veg etc and not forgetting emergency supplies of water. Our 10 litre bottle of hand sanitizer arrived today, so we’re stocked up with that. I’m so glad I’ve had my finger on the pulse of this...

Anyone else going to stock up or is it just me?

[ecc]

Let's hope it is overreaction. There are enough people dying already.

[Lowbankclaret]

It is getting serious now.

We’re off out shopping in a bit, going to stock up on plenty of the basics - rice; pasta; milk; flour; frozen veg etc and not forgetting emergency supplies of water. Our 10 litre bottle of hand sanitizer arrived today, so we’re stocked up with that. I’m so glad I’ve had my finger on the pulse of this...

Anyone else going to stock up or is it just me?

Did mine Friday .
Don’t need to go to a supermarket or butchers for 2 months, apart from perishables!!

If your looking for bargains on large bulk items, try farm foods.

Two bulk washing liquids £20, similar for dishwasher tabs.

12 tins of chopped Toms or plum toms, £3:60 per 12.

[Jakubclaret]

It is getting serious now.

We’re off out shopping in a bit, going to stock up on plenty of the basics - rice; pasta; milk; flour; frozen veg etc and not forgetting emergency supplies of water. Our 10 litre bottle of hand sanitizer arrived today, so we’re stocked up with that. I’m so glad I’ve had my finger on the pulse of this...

Anyone else going to stock up or is it just me?

Surprised anybody's buying in any emergency supplies, post brexit was the time we was supposed to be all on rations reminiscent to a wartime era.

[Zlatan]

Now up to 39 in the UK

[ClaretAndJew]

39 whole people?

We are absolutely doomed.

[Gordaleman]

Dr Tedros's main advice was that each country had to look at their own situation as there was no one-way-fits-all means of tackling the outbreak.
"Each country must have its own approach but it must start with containment," he said.

This was a "unique virus with unique features" and the WHO would have expected wide contagion by now, but containment measures have appeared to work, the doctor said.

Of the 62 countries reporting cases of infection, 38 of them had 10 or fewer, he added.

"Around eight countries have not reported new cases for two weeks and have been able to contain the outbreak," he said. China had also shown containment was possible even in countries with a large number of cases.

[thatdberight]

There is no way this is serious enough to fundamentally disrupt the food supply chain.

[Lowbankclaret]

Dr Tedros's main advice was that each country had to look at their own situation as there was no one-way-fits-all means of tackling the outbreak.
"Each country must have its own approach but it must start with containment," he said.

This was a "unique virus with unique features" and the WHO would have expected wide contagion by now, but containment measures have appeared to work, the doctor said.

Of the 62 countries reporting cases of infection, 38 of them had 10 or fewer, he added.

"Around eight countries have not reported new cases for two weeks and have been able to contain the outbreak," he said. China had also shown containment was possible even in countries with a large number of cases.

I would disagree that containment is working, I suggest the evidence is it does not work. It’s not going to work here either.
Plus they know it, that’s why they are saying we need to prepare for stage two.

Of the 62 countries , remember 8 days ago it was only 28 countries.

[Dark Cloud]

The media just love a story like this. It sells papers, gets people glued to news channels and just like celebrity deaths and other natural disasters, it's the lifeblood of their industry and keeps them in a job. They'll be meeting in the daily mail editor's office ass we speak, dreaming up the next sensational headline. (Or we could simply all die. In which case, "bye")

[thatdberight]

The media just love a story like this. It sells papers, gets people glued to news channels and just like celebrity deaths and other natural disasters, it's the lifeblood of their industry and keeps them in a job. They'll be meeting in the daily mail editor's office ass we speak, dreaming up the next sensational headline. (Or we could simply all die. In which case, "bye")

Every office has one.

[Clarinetclaret]

You panic pal, I'm sure it will do the world of good. Not. Panic is spreading 1,000 times faster than the virus. Don't go to the Spurs match will you? You'll probably have a heart attack by half time thinking about what MIGHT happen in the second half.

You're another that needs a nuclear bunker. Get yourself in there and never, ever come back out into this grossly infected world.

The rest of us will just get on with our lives thank you.

I think you've got me wrong. Im certainly not panicking or staying in or going out in a mask. I was just ridiculing you and your observations comparing it to flu and going on about the local chemist being the expert.
Im pretty sure that countries aren't holding emergency meetings, banning large gatherings, closing schools etc etc for nothing.
I'm also pretty sure that a COBRA meeting has never been called about flu. The powers that be and that includes the World Health Organisation have come out and said it's a serious threat.
I think I'll take more notice of them than your local chemist!
Even if it is a overreaction I think it's better than the alternative and countries doing nothing.
Maybe you need to speak to Boris Johnson and co and tell them they need to speak to your chemist friend Haha.!

[Paul Waine]

Trains quieter in and out of London today, though I can't put a figure on how much quieter. I travelled in after 9:30 and got the 8pm train home.

Someone sat beside me travelling in this morning, coughing and spluttering into his beard. Another person sat beside me on the way home this evening, again, cough, cough, cough, until eventually he moved to an empty seat opposite.

I've got to get through the week in good health. I'm skiing next week... in Austria.

[Gordaleman]

I would disagree that containment is working, I suggest the evidence is it does not work. It’s not going to work here either.
Plus they know it, that’s why they are saying we need to prepare for stage two.

Of the 62 countries , remember 8 days ago it was only 28 countries.

So now YOU know better than the experts eh? Hypocrite.

[thatdberight]

So now YOU know better than the experts eh? Hypocrite.

last
/lɑːst/
adjective

coming after all others in time or order; final.

[Gordaleman]

I think you've got me wrong. Im certainly not panicking or staying in or going out in a mask. I was just ridiculing you and your observations comparing it to flu and going on about the local chemist being the expert.
Im pretty sure that countries aren't holding emergency meetings, banning large gatherings, closing schools etc etc for nothing.
I'm also pretty sure that a COBRA meeting has never been called about flu. The powers that be and that includes the World Health Organisation have come out and said it's a serious threat.
I think I'll take more notice of them than your local chemist!
Even if it is a overreaction I think it's better than the alternative and countries doing nothing.
Maybe you need to speak to Boris Johnson and co and tell them they need to speak to your chemist friend Haha.!

Of course it's a serious threat. I've said so in my posts. That doesn't mean people have to over react.

Tell me what our wonderful government has done so far? They've wheeled out Boris Johnson (Far too late.) who just says 'Wash your hands." I'm sure that that on it's own will work wonders.

You like your experts, well listen to them. They are saying that it's being contained in most parts of the world.

[AndrewJB]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... -pandemic/

This is how our government is treating the problem. It may or may not be really serious, but on no account can we be seen to be working alongside our EU neighbours, because that will give off the wrong signals. How childish can you get?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... fears.html

I picked rightwing news outlets to illustrate that it's real.

[thatdberight]

....on no account can we be seen to be working alongside our EU neighbours, because that will give off the wrong signals...

It's valid to posit that this clearly shows downsides of not working with our neighbours in the way we have. But your caricature of the reasons for it isn't remotely backed up by the articles.

[AndrewJB]

It's valid to posit that this clearly shows downsides of not working with our neighbours in the way we have. But your caricature of the reasons for it isn't remotely backed up by the articles.

The organisations I quoted back Johnson, and have done for a long time. It's unsurprising that my take is different - though if you have your own reason why we shouldn't work with the EU on this, that could be interesting, To me it's a no brainer that we work with our closest neighbours on illness. here's a leftwing version of it if you need one. But you already undersatand the need to work together: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... fears.html

[Jakubclaret]

My last word on the subject.

I had an appointment this morning at Burnley General. The surgeon I spoke with said he believed that there had been a massive overreaction to Covid-19 and although he told me that the 'Trust' had instituted a policy of not shaking hands with patients, he gave me a good hand shake on my way out.

I also had a prescription to pick up at my local pharmacy and the pharmacist said exactly what I've been saying about Flu. "Why are people so concerned when we already have a virus that kills thousands every winter, but we don't appear concerned about that at all. Crazy in my opinion."

Two professionals with identical views.

Other professionals will be saying the opposite though, it’s divisive, I’d separate flu from this if you can, it doesn’t detract nor diminish this particular threat just because something else is deadlier, it’s far too early to be 100% about this Covid - 19, the flu comparison mantra isn’t that persuasive.

[SGr]

The Boden quote on twitter earlier says it all. Editors forcing journos into slipping talk of Coronavirus into every conversation, because it inevitably gets clicks. Don't be surprised when certain large investors are revealed to have profited largely from shorts on airline and travel company stocks as well.

The hysteria I'm seeing with regard to this outbreak is incredibly disproportionate.

[dsr]

The organisations I quoted back Johnson, and have done for a long time. It's unsurprising that my take is different - though if you have your own reason why we shouldn't work with the EU on this, that could be interesting, To me it's a no brainer that we work with our closest neighbours on illness. here's a leftwing version of it if you need one. But you already undersatand the need to work together: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... fears.html

Definitely a good idea to work together. And obviously if you want to put an anti-UK government slant on it, you would say "why on earth wouldn't we sign up to continued membership of various EU agencies as part of the trade agreement"?

Except, what has it to do with trade? Whether we sign up to medical agencies is entriely dependent on whether we want to be in and whether the agencies want to have us. If both sides feel there are medical benefits, then we join; if either side feels that there are no medical benefits (mutually or unilaterally), then we don't join. But if one side feels we can only join depending on the number of grommets and widgets we can buy or sell from each other, then that side is playing fast and loose with healthcare because public health should never be made dependent on trade arrangements.

So which side wants to link it with trade agreements?

[AndrewJB]

Definitely a good idea to work together. And obviously if you want to put an anti-UK government slant on it, you would say "why on earth wouldn't we sign up to continued membership of various EU agencies as part of the trade agreement"?

Except, what has it to do with trade? Whether we sign up to medical agencies is entriely dependent on whether we want to be in and whether the agencies want to have us. If both sides feel there are medical benefits, then we join; if either side feels that there are no medical benefits (mutually or unilaterally), then we don't join. But if one side feels we can only join depending on the number of grommets and widgets we can buy or sell from each other, then that side is playing fast and loose with healthcare because public health should never be made dependent on trade arrangements.

So which side wants to link it with trade agreements?

The anti-U.K. element to this comes down to the Johnson government withholding cooperation in this crucial area as a negotiating tactic in a trade negotiation. Number 10 told Hancock he couldn’t go. Not the EU disinviting him. That is putting trade before British lives.

[Paul Waine]

6 deaths reported in Seattle area, Washington State. Report on CNBC and much of other US press.

[Stayingup]

BBC is certainly doing its best to spread panic. I just listened to Radio 4. We all know we and the authorities have to be vigilant but the way the BBC is going on we should be shutting down the country. My colleague in China has said that they have the spread under control now and manufacturing is back to normal. But of course he will get the news from the 'Government' channels' !!!

[Bullabill]

I'm still waiting for the Y2Kbug!

[Spijed]

The Boden quote on twitter earlier says it all. Editors forcing journos into slipping talk of Coronavirus into every conversation, because it inevitably gets clicks. Don't be surprised when certain large investors are revealed to have profited largely from shorts on airline and travel company stocks as well.

The hysteria I'm seeing with regard to this outbreak is incredibly disproportionate.

Its starting to get a bit silly now and people need to calm down.

[Zlatan]

Genuine question - new chap started in my office yesterday - he's just flown in from China. As far as we know he's not had any quarantine or checks done on him at the airport or since he arrived. Was I wrong to not shake his hand?

[Gordaleman]

Speaking at the COVID-19 media briefing, the Director-General emphasized that the virus is capable of community transmission but can be contained with the right measures.


World Health Organization (WHO)
✔
@WHO
· 20h
Replying to @WHO and 2 others
"We are in unchartered territory. We have never before seen a respiratory pathogen that is capable of community transmission, but which can also be contained with the right measures"-@DrTedros #COVID19 #coronavirus


World Health Organization (WHO)
✔
@WHO
"If this [#COVID19] was an influenza epidemic, we would have expected to see widespread community transmission across the globe by now, and efforts to slow it down or contain it would not be feasible"-@DrTedros #coronavirus

161
3:39 PM - Mar 2, 2020


In other words, the World Heath Orgaisation thinks Flu is worse than Covid-19 because Flu can't be contained and Covid-19 can.

[Stayingup]

BBC correspondent has twice just called it a disease? Really is it? I though it was a virus.

[bfcjg]

Lets get real, when all this is over we will still only be 11 miles as the crow flies from the biggest ever plague pit the world has ever know, Blackburn, we have survived that for centuries we will keep surviving.

[dsr]

The anti-U.K. element to this comes down to the Johnson government withholding cooperation in this crucial area as a negotiating tactic in a trade negotiation. Number 10 told Hancock he couldn’t go. Not the EU disinviting him. That is putting trade before British lives.

That's exactly where your point of view differes from mine. Three stage process:

1. Suggestion is mnade to stay in this European Health Agency.
2. EU says "only if it's part of trade negotiations".
3. UK says "no, it's not a trade issue".

And you say that the first obstacle to membership has been put into lace by the UK - that is not because it's true, but because you're very much pro-EU and anti-Boris Johnson. The EU is the body that wants to link membership with trade talks, so if you want to condemn somebody for linking this crucial negotiation with trade talks, it's the EU that you need to condemn. At least in part.

[Clarets4me]

Just a thought, people are talking about playing EPL fixtures in empty stadiums, while meanwhile, around 2,000,000 people are crammed together using the London Tube system every-day .......

[elwaclaret]

I feel safer knowing the WHO are on top of it

They can see for miles and miles and can go anywhere

[mdd2]

Now 51 cases and counting
I wonder when the season will be suspended?
Before the end of March or April?

[evensteadiereddie]

Ah well, at least the kids are alright....

[AndrewJB]

That's exactly where your point of view differes from mine. Three stage process:

1. Suggestion is mnade to stay in this European Health Agency.
2. EU says "only if it's part of trade negotiations".
3. UK says "no, it's not a trade issue".

And you say that the first obstacle to membership has been put into lace by the UK - that is not because it's true, but because you're very much pro-EU and anti-Boris Johnson. The EU is the body that wants to link membership with trade talks, so if you want to condemn somebody for linking this crucial negotiation with trade talks, it's the EU that you need to condemn. At least in part.

We are leaving the Early Warning and Response System due to Johnson's instructions, and not because we've been told to leave:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/po ... demns-no10

There's no anti or pro anything from me. I didn't make Johnson take this decision. I'm just commenting on how stupid and childish it is.

[thatdberight]

We are leaving the Early Warning and Response System due to Johnson's instructions, and not because we've been told to leave:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/po ... demns-no10

There's no anti or pro anything from me. I didn't make Johnson take this decision. I'm just commenting on how stupid and childish it is.

It's your view that there's a health system of which we could be a member, where membership comes with no disbenefits and which the EU will not make part of the overall trade negotiation and we've decided to leave it on a whim.

I think that's unlikely. I've not been in the room any more than you have so my view is no more definite than yours but just in case you thought that your way of reading it is the only one; it's not.

That doesn't mean I think it's a good decision or outcome, wherever it came from.

[Zlatan]

can I request that we keep this thread to mass panic and disinformation about a virus and not Brexit, thanks

[UpTheClaretsFCBK]

Myself and my wife live in Thailand and we've both been in self quarantine for a week. We definitely don't have the virus but its been nice to have a few days together

[thatdberight]

Myself and my wife live in Thailand and we've both been in self quarantine for a week. We definitely don't have the virus but its been nice to have a few days together

Now my wife will be panicking...

[Dark Cloud]

There is no way this is serious enough to fundamentally disrupt the food supply chain.

Unless people fall for the media frenzy and panic.....Mmmmm!