Covid-19

[Bordeauxclaret]

122k they are claiming.

Let’s hope it keeps rising.

[CombatClaret]

122k they are claiming.

Let’s hope it keeps rising.

Another day another lie.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Another day another lie.

Indeed. Only the gullible will take the number at face value.
The important thing now actual tests they are doing keeps rising.

[Spijed]

122k should mean that 122,000 blood samples were taken from people yesterday.

I doubt that's happened.

We are light years behind countries like Germany.

[evensteadiereddie]

Hancock looks and sounds like some kind of scrote standing in front of a magistrate, desperately trying to save face.
Bullcrap, bullcrap, 27,000 deaths, bullcrap, bullcrap, didn't we do well ?
Cummings is becoming a liability.

[taio]

122k should mean that 122,000 blood samples were taken from people yesterday.

I doubt that's happened.

We are light years behind countries like Germany.

Blood samples?

[Spijed]

Blood samples?

Yes, it should be swabs. But, the issue is that 122,000 samples weren't taken yesterday.

[tiger76]

I was unaware that 'lower class' people weren't allowed to play tennis in their local park. Thank you for enlightening me Martin.

I don't know what it's like nowadays,but i regularly played tennis with my sister up at Townley in my younger days,admittedly not very well,but as i recall it certainly wasn't expensive,it may even have been free,i'd definitely not consider it an elitist sport,maybe at the top level that's true,but you could apply that to most sports.

[Elizabeth]

Some of you lot are so predictable.
Here's a surprise, someone questions the figure is real then for some reason wants it to keep rising.
Well if its made up then why give it any credibility by saying you hope it keeps rising. Needs some explaining by the poster.

[taio]

Yes, it should be swabs. But, the issue is that 122,000 samples weren't taken yesterday.

The issue in my mind is the massive increase in capacity and actual testing in such a short period of time. A specific date is not that important; the direction of travel is. Are you surprised by the rapid growth?

[Spijed]

The issue in my mind is the massive increase in capacity and actual testing in such a short period of time. A specific date is not that important; the direction of travel is. Are you surprised by the rapid growth?

It's certainly impressive.

As an aside, it does hopefully put to bed the argument that footballers are going to be tested at the expense of frontline staff if those figures are anywhere near accurate.

[Grumps]

It will be interesting to see if any of the journalists, who some on here hang on every word of, question the number of tests. Or is it just those on here, who had their fingers on the keyboard at 5pm ready to type liar, liar liar..... Without any evidence

[tiger76]

It will be interesting to see if any of the journalists, who some on here hang on every word of, question the number of tests. Or is it just those on here, who had their fingers on the keyboard at 5pm ready to type liar, liar liar..... Without any evidence

Some posters whatever their political leanings offer valid criticisms,but there is a cabal,who no matter what the government does will find fault somewhere,you'd almost think they had an agenda,surely not.

[CombatClaret]

Some posters whatever their political leanings offer valid criticisms,but there is a cabal,who no matter what the government does will find fault somewhere,you'd almost think they had an agenda,surely not.

Regardless of party I respect the truth, and agreeing to send a test in the mail at some point is not a test carried out.

Without any evidence

Except sources from a highly respected 100+ year old medical journal.

Hancock being questioned and keeps passing it off 'I don't recognize it', classic non-denial denial.

[Elizabeth]

It's a good point tiger. I think I've managed to differentiate so that I can give the valid criticisms the right level of respect.
The others? They are easy to pick out, they come on in quick succession, keep their posts to hardly more than a sentence, then blow kisses to each other

[Bordeauxclaret]

Some of you lot are so predictable.
Here's a surprise, someone questions the figure is real then for some reason wants it to keep rising.
Well if its made up then why give it any credibility by saying you hope it keeps rising. Needs some explaining by the poster.

You can’t understand why it needs to keep rising?
Are you under the impression that once it gets to 100k it’s job done?

[Elizabeth]

I'll give you some credit, you spotted yourself

[taio]

They haven't even come close, they just moved the goal posts.

"Previously, a test would be counted once the sample had been processed in laboratories. But this definition has been changed in the last few days, a senior source told HSJ...

HSJ understands that up to 50,000 of the tests that will be reported as having taken place on 30 April will actually represent the mailing or the agreeing to mail a home testing kit."

It has just been confirmed that the above is wrong. The method and definition for counting hasn't changed.

[Damo]

More good journalism from the Gaurdian and this guy is a disgrace and should lose his job.

Corruption and immoral practices is rife in big business, industry and politics and regardless of whether you are a leftish NHS worker or some Tory party donor we the people should support the exposure of it and not stand for it

I doubt we'll see the usual suspects who like to pull apart any Gaurdian investigation into the govt and its supporters show the same concern about ever detail of this article but not to worry

I've had a go at some of the articles youve shared recently Damo but on this im in total agreement and think it is good to highlight stories like this

Glad you agree mate.
On the flip side, I wonder what reaction I would have had to that post if the link was from the daily mail
(Not a dig at you. You seem to take each post on merit)

[Grumps]

Regardless of party I respect the truth, and agreeing to send a test in the mail at some point is not a test carried out.



Except sources from a highly respected 100+ year old medical journal.

Hancock being questioned and keeps passing it off 'I don't recognize it', classic non-denial denial.

The counting rules yesterday were the same as they were a week ago
So if you believe the results when they were low, you've also have to believe them when they are higher than you would like.

[CombatClaret]

It has just been confirmed that the above is wrong. The method and definition for counting hasn't changed.

The mail out kits have only come into play recently so they will have agreed on how they're counted with their inception, that's how they can say the counting 'hasn't changed' with a straight face.

This was predicted as soon as they opened up the testing to the wider care worker community a week or so ago and low and behold it's how they got to their magic number

“They had to get the permanent secretary at DHSC (Chris Wormald) to agree to a change in the counting process.
“We’re now counting a home test as tests which have been sent to people’s homes.”

Regardless a test in the mail is not one carried out.

[Damo]

For some people, hitting the target of 100k tests per day isnt the issue. If they tested every single person in the country every day, they would still find something to get angry about.
It's not about people or this virus, it's about the crusade of whatever moonbat political party the blindly follow.

[CombatClaret]

For some people, hitting the target of 100k tests per day isnt the issue. If they tested every single person in the country every day, they would still find something to get angry about.
It's not about people or this virus, it's about the crusade of whatever moonbat political party the blindly follow.

Yesterday from the PM it was 'We locked down earlier in our curve than Italy, France, Spain' - that wasn't true
Today from the Health Secretary 'we've carried out 122k test' - That's isn't true either

Who's the person blindly following here?

[taio]

The mail out kits have only come into play recently so they will have agreed on how they're counted with their inception, that's how they can say the counting 'hasn't changed' with a straight face.

This was predicted as soon as they opened up the testing to the wider care worker community a week or so ago and low and behold it's how they got to their magic number

“They had to get the permanent secretary at DHSC (Chris Wormald) to agree to a change in the counting process.
“We’re now counting a home test as tests which have been sent to people’s homes.”

Regardless a test in the mail is not one carried out.

You said they have moved the goal posts - they haven't. It doesn't really matter whether it's 82k or 122k tests - the important thing is, and I'm sure we can agree on, there's been a tremendous effort by everyone involved to expand to such an extent in the last weeks. Perhaps we should settle on the mid point at around 100k tests! Obviously it means little if this is not, in the first instance, sustained and then expanded further.

[Tall Paul]

They have moved the goalposts. The target wasn't 100k tests, it was 100k people. They tested 73k people yesterday.

Evidence:

[Blackrod]

Looks like our death toll could surpass Italy’s which would makes us the 2nd worst hit country in the World so far for fatalities. Another 6,000 plus new cases too. Did we lock down soon enough ? Should we have let all these flights in with no checks or quarantine at this end ?

[tiger76]

It's a good point tiger. I think I've managed to differentiate so that I can give the valid criticisms the right level of respect.
The others? They are easy to pick out, they come on in quick succession, keep their posts to hardly more than a sentence, then blow kisses to each other

Yes and many only post on certain threads funny that,look i'm definitely not zealously defending the government,if i think they deserve criticising' i'll criticise them,but some comments are just churlish,surely the fact that testing is rapidly increasing should be applauded,but some won't admit that they're wrong,are the government massaging the figures probably,all government's do that regardless of colour,it's happened for hundreds of years.

[CombatClaret]

You said they have moved the goal posts - they haven't. It doesn't really matter whether it's 82k or 122k tests - the important thing is, and I'm sure we can agree on, there's been a tremendous effort by everyone involved to expand to such an extent in the last weeks. Perhaps we should settle on the mid point at around 100k tests! Obviously it means little if this is not, in the first instance, sustained and then expanded further.

By adding the home & satellite tests to the program and counting test differently: a test 'carried out' on the day you mail them, is moving the goal posts.
100k was always just a random arbitrary number, yesterday it was about 53k people tested, not sure it that includes tests mailed. Either way it's no where near enough to get us out of this mess.

[taio]

They have moved the goalposts. The target wasn't 100k tests, it was 100k people. They tested 73k people yesterday.

Evidence:

So an absolute minimum of 73k people - great progress.

[Bordeauxclaret]

I'll give you some credit, you spotted yourself

Dear oh dear.

[Tall Paul]

So an absolute minimum of 73k people - great progress.

Yes, it's good progress, but they've undeniably failed to hit their self-imposed target by a long way.

[taio]

By adding the home & satellite tests to the program and counting test differently: a test 'carried out' on the day you mail them, is moving the goal posts.
100k was always just a random arbitrary number, yesterday it was about 53k people tested, not sure it that includes tests mailed. Either way it's no where near enough to get us out of this mess.

That's why testing will hopefully ramp up further over the coming weeks. Again direction of travel is most important. Whatever figure people choose to believe 73k, 122k or somewhere in between it's still an impressive effort this month from all those people who will have worked tirelessly to get to this point. I pay tribute to all those who gave operationally made it happen.

[NewClaret]

The issue in my mind is the massive increase in capacity and actual testing in such a short period of time. A specific date is not that important; the direction of travel is. Are you surprised by the rapid growth?

Not at all inconceivable that the preparatory work to design and implement the infrastructure took time, after which it could scale quickly.

[taio]

Yes, it's good progress, but they've undeniably failed to hit their self-imposed target by a long way.

It's not undeniable. It's the sort of thing people will have to agree to disagree on and instead focus on sustaining and expanding. It was only a goal, not a promise, that will have helped bring organisations together and gather lots of momentum.

[Devils_Advocate]

Glad you agree mate.
On the flip side, I wonder what reaction I would have had to that post if the link was from the daily mail
(Not a dig at you. You seem to take each post on merit)

Its a good and fair point you raise

[Elizabeth]

When pressed your responses underwhelm. If you want to continue I will point out how your post I highlighted demonstrates the lack of depth in your arguments.
I was expecting you to say you were being sarcastic in that post but you missed that train

[Spijed]

That's why testing will hopefully ramp up further over the coming weeks. Again direction of travel is most important. Whatever figure people choose to believe 73k, 122k or somewhere in between it's still an impressive effort this month from all those people who will have worked tirelessly to get to this point. I pay tribute to all those who gave operationally made it happen.

But you always get the feeling that the government is playing catch-up when they have looked at what other countries have done.

Sadly, it's why we may end up with a far higher mortality rate than other countries in Europe. We seem to be too obsessed with our own views on how to handle this rather than looking at other nations.

[Elizabeth]

The comparison of mortality rates with other countries will be looked at a long way into the future, along with all the factors that lead to the deaths in each country.
I think its as foolhardy to be talking in terms of some league table as it is to ignore comparing total deaths in the UK during this period to a similar period before the virus struck ie excess deaths

[taio]

But you always get the feeling that the government is playing catch-up when they have looked at what other countries have done.

Sadly, it's why we may end up with a far higher mortality rate than other countries in Europe. We seem to be too obsessed with our own views on how to handle this rather than looking at other nations.

We won't know for ages about accurate mortality rates so best to wait - counting of deaths is all over the show. In time we will be clear what the UK did well and where they could have done much better. Both aspects are inevitable and lessons will be learned. I prefer to look at the here and now - like the recent great effort on testing - and the future because that's what's needed to manage the pandemic.

[Tall Paul]

It's not undeniable. It's the sort of thing people will have to agree to disagree on and instead focus on sustaining and expanding. It was only a goal, not a promise, that will have helped bring organisations together and gather lots of momentum.

Of course it's undeniable, it's a matter of fact that the target was 100k people tested per day and a matter of fact that they haven't hit that target.

I suppose that they've failed to hit it by a long way is a matter of opinion, but I think it's pretty hard to argue that 73% of the target is close, and that's before you factor in that the sample size of just one day is far too small to say it's hit 73k people per day.

[taio]

Of course it's undeniable, it's a matter of fact that the target was 100k people tested per day and a matter of fact that they haven't hit that target.

I suppose that they've failed to hit it by a long way is a matter of opinion, but I think it's pretty hard to argue that 73% of the target is close, and that's before you factor in that the sample size of just one day is far too small to say it's hit 73k people per day.

Even if you just consider the 73k or 73% figure I wouldn't regard that as missing it by a long way. And neither would I think so if over 100,000 people are tested in just a few days. The person responsible for setting the aim said this: "I’m now setting the goal of 100,000 tests per day by the end of this month. That is the goal and I’m determined we’ll get there.”

[Holtyclaret]

Regardless of party I respect the truth, and agreeing to send a test in the mail at some point is not a test

That’s isn’t what was said. It was physically putting the test to a courier for delivery not ‘agreeing to a post a test’. It’s their physical process of the test, it could be counted when it’s received back, same difference but the agreed count is the day it’s posted.

Why knock what has been a huge achievement and effort? Capacity will continue to grow, weeks before its required in phase two, the test and contact trace bit (in conjunction with the nearly ready app.).

This business/industry mix in this country unfortunately didn’t include a lot of lab facilities (1000 per day?) unlike other countries but within two months can process over 120,000 tests per day. WOW! Not only for now, midway through the first wave of this Pandemic but in place now for contact tracing, subsequent waves and future pandemics.

Some will always find gloom I guess, each to their own.

[Damo]

Yesterday from the PM it was 'We locked down earlier in our curve than Italy, France, Spain' - that wasn't true
Today from the Health Secretary 'we've carried out 122k test' - That's isn't true either

Who's the person blindly following here?

I couldnt care less if they hit the 100k target. That was kind of my point.
I've had 3 different emails. One from my employer, one from the contractor my employer services and one from the government inviting me and my family to take a test.
I wont be doing as none of us are displaying symptoms.
My point was that you, and other people (look at tall Paul's post just after yours for example) that are hanging on every single word, hoping they can pull efforts apart with nonsense.
The government have got loads of things wrong in this pandemic. Not locking down early enough, leaving borders open and not testing enough people early on in the pandemic. Its tragic when people are still foaming at the mouth when they start to get things right
Thankfully we dont have the sort of government you would have liked, to find out how blindly you would have defended them if they were in the grip of this situation.
But we can take posters reactions to things like anti semitism, hanging around with terrorists etc to guage what the reaction might have been like

[randomclaret2]

Lets face it, the vocal group of UTC experts would have made a better job of this Coronavirus business than the government has.Why the powers that be havent mined the depths of knowledge on here is beyond me. Maybe its a question that will be asked when the whole thing is over and a calm rational review can take place.

[Tall Paul]

My point was that you, and other people (look at tall Paul's post just after yours for example) that are hanging on every single word, hoping they can pull efforts apart with nonsense

Which bit was nonsense?

[claretandy]

Can you imagine what the absolute melts on this thread would be saying if the Government had closed the borders.

[NewClaret]

Lets face it, the vocal group of UTC experts would have made a better job of this Coronavirus business than the government has.Why the powers that be havent mined the depths of knowledge on here is beyond me. Maybe its a question that will be asked when the whole thing is over and a calm rational review can take place.

[martin_p]

It's not undeniable. It's the sort of thing people will have to agree to disagree on and instead focus on sustaining and expanding. It was only a goal, not a promise, that will have helped bring organisations together and gather lots of momentum.

It’s undeniable from the governments own figures. They promised to test 100k people per day by the end of the month and their own figures show they tested circa 73k.

This is one of the problems with this (and the previous) Tory governments, an obsession with putting out arbitrary targets to placate the public. It was madness to target 100k, or any target, by the end of the month. Had they said we’ll be in a position to seriously ramp up test numbers by the end of the month instead of plucking a headline grabbing figure out of thin air then no one would have batted an eyelid at the progress that has been made. As it is they have had to lie, or if I’m being charitable bend the truth, to make it look like they’ve hit the target and left themselves open to criticism. They did the same with net migration, you’d have thought they’d learnt their lesson.

[martin_p]

I couldnt care less if they hit the 100k target. That was kind of my point.
I've had 3 different emails. One from my employer, one from the contractor my employer services and one from the government inviting me and my family to take a test.
I wont be doing as none of us are displaying symptoms.
My point was that you, and other people (look at tall Paul's post just after yours for example) that are hanging on every single word, hoping they can pull efforts apart with nonsense.
The government have got loads of things wrong in this pandemic. Not locking down early enough, leaving borders open and not testing enough people early on in the pandemic. Its tragic when people are still foaming at the mouth when they start to get things right
Thankfully we dont have the sort of government you would have liked, to find out how blindly you would have defended them if they were in the grip of this situation.
But we can take posters reactions to things like anti semitism, hanging around with terrorists etc to guage what the reaction might have been like

A government that doesn’t consistently lie is my minimum requirement.

[martin_p]

Tennis - just not played very much in the country but certainly not elitist...most tennis courts are free but still empty and it costs virtually nothing for a racket.

In terms of golf that’s just simply not true. A pretty ignorant comment really. It’s a sport played by all ages and it’s particularly good for keeping older people physically and mentally agile. You can get a concession membership for OAPs at many courses and the cost per week is hardly anything and many people play 3 or 4 times a week with a round taking 4 hours and they then often mix socially afterwards.
Have a walk round any municipal golf course and you will see just how busy they are and how many “working class” people play it.

And how much do golf clubs cost. How many people of inner city estates do you see on your average course?